Poop on public lands

[Van Man Dave]

:s
We hear a lot of stories of people trashing public lands, dumping trash, sewage etc.....  I have witnessed this first hand in many places. 

What I also see is an insane amount of livestock manure scattered around as well. There is a huge amount of grazing leases allowed on public lands, therefore a lot of poop! 

Do you all see this as well? I’m talking Colorado, Utah, New mexico, Arizona public lands. There sure seems to be a lot more livestock waste around than human waste in the areas we frequent.

 

[Freelander]

I agree I used to haul cow poop into my garden by the pickup load.

NOTE: When shovel Cow Poop its best to keep your mouth shut, you never know which way the wind is blowing.

 

[Freelander]

Of course I'm not so worried about poop as I am trash, poop will break down, but trash is forever.

When I was hauling in Cow Poop from the stock yards to spread in my garden, I had to go back and pick up the trash that was mixed in with it.

 

[Freelander]

Back when I was still gardening and raising Chickens, I would clean out the Chicken Coop every fall and dump the chicken litter in my Tomato beds, sometimes it would be several inches deep, but it makes nice tomatoes the next year.

 

[bullfrog]

Hopefully we will soon educate people about the effects of what we do on the environment and begin to limit the amount of cattle production before we eat our selves out of a home! You can easily burn up a garden with chicken manures. Horse manure can be used to keep water pipes and lines from freezing. Dairy farms are using manure to generate methane to power their operations. There are lots of better ways of dealing with trash and manure than simply dumping it on the ground.

 

[Freelander]

If the cows are free range, it's a more natural environment than those raised in a feed lot.

I was at an Egg Farm years ago in Southern Missouri, and the Chicken Poop was 3 or 4 feet deep under the pens, the smell was so bad you had to mask a respirator just to collect the eggs. When I was raising Chickens if my coop every started to smell it was to clean it out.

I had a poop board under the roost cover with wood shaving to help dry out the litter, there was never any problems with smell.

 

[bullfrog]

Cattle production is one of the main causes of the imbalance of gases in our atmosphere. Nothing natural about the huge number cattle we have brought about through our breeding and production programs.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

Cattle production is one of the main causes of the imbalance of gases in our atmosphere. Nothing natural about the huge number cattle we have brought about through our breeding and production programs.

The biggest amounts of garbage that I see comeS from discarded fast food chain wrappers, however blaming them is like blaming cattle producers for green house gasses, the problem lies with the consumers.

 

[nature lover]

I ready do the fast food thing but when I do I say only one napkin please. If you don’t they give you ten or more. Think about the millions of clusters daily. What a waste. Sorry if I went off the poop post.

 

[Freelander]

The question is "Does a Bear poop in the woods"?

 

[BelgianPup]

Bottom line: Poop breaks down. Plastic doesn't.

Ranchers rent BLM land for about $1.35 per head per acre (cow + calf). Don't like it? Tough.

Humans have been digging cat holes for at least 100,000 years, maybe twice that. Mankind and Earth have survived the process.

I really do have to shake my head at the expectations of some people, both in person and online. Their assumptions in demanding Absolute Perfection in All Things is both hilarious and intensely irritating. Are they actually thinking any of this through? Of course not. They do a bit of short-term, knee-jerk thinking, make an instant decision, and immediately think it should be the Law.

For instance: human feces. Americans worship flush toilets. They're easy, you push the handle and forget about it. Out of sight, out of mind.

But once you get out of reach of toilets, these people start gibbering in panic.
* If you store it in plastic bags, it's going to stink.
* You aren't supposed to bury it.
* You aren't supposed to put it in a large metal waste bin.
* You aren't supposed to put it in an outdoor trash can by the gas pumps.
* You aren't supposed to save it up and take it to the local dump (a large hole in the ground).
* If you take a week's worth to a rest area and dump it in the toilet, you'll probably overload it and clog the flusher (and then burn rubber leaving).

All right, Mr. and Ms. Perfect, JUST WHAT IS YOUR PLAN? Yes, I know you're quick to tell everyone else what they shouldn't do. What are you doing with it?

 

[bullfrog]

The BLM has decided in long term stay areas. They also set limits on the number of cattle allowed per leased acre. Enforcement is starting to become more the issue as current rules and regulations are beginning to be enforced. Basically because of over use and the drought people are realizing they will have to change the way they treat public land whether it is cattle or campers. RVs, boats and river runners have for years used holding tanks that can be dumped into public sewer systems or approved septic systems. In the late 1800s horse manure in larger cities was a huge problem, not so much today. I think everyone should be prepared to make changes in the way we do things. Biggest mistake most people make is thinking change won’t happen. There are people starting to use new and old technology to solve the perceived problem and eventually it will become a real problem and get addressed, maybe not in our lifetime but maybe tomorrow but you need to be prepared to modify your beliefs and behavior to make things better for everyone. There are not too many problems that can’t be eventually solved or eliminated over time.

 

[bullfrog]

Just so people know most boat pump outs and boat prep areas have special port-a-potty dump and clean out stations as well as restrooms. Just ask if you don’t know where they are if you are in the Glen Canyon National Recreation Area. Things changed here a while back and I wouldn’t be surprised to see them change elsewhere in the future. With the price of water and the cost of fuel to haul it fewer cattle will be on public land this year I would imagine. Drought may make grazing impossible in the future. Maybe climate change can be reversed and we will get enough rain to graze in the future, who knows?

 

[crofter]

In the modern times, cat holes are more suited to remote areas with light use. In a wet climate, the cat hole can stink for a long time.

BLM LTVAs want black tanks, or require you to camp near the vault toilet.

Throwing wrapped sewage into a landfill is like being a resident in a care facility. It is accepted practice and happens every day. But not allowed at LTVAs.

Wasting water to process and transport sewage is a waste, IMHO.
-crofter

 

[Freelander]

What every happened to time when everybody had an Outhouse behind the house?

Just toss in a little lime once in a while and it takes care of itself.

Have we gone down that far?

 

[Freelander]

I used to work at a Landfill, and when it came time to dig out the track on the Bulldozer, I could spot a dirty diaper from have way across the pit.

We had some REALLY nasty stuff in the pile from time to time.

 

[crofter]

What every happened to time when everybody had an Outhouse behind the house?

Just toss in a little lime once in a while and it takes care of itself.

Have we gone down that far?

I agree with dry sewage handling. According to CDC, seven diseases are transmitted in sewage including cholera and typhoid fever. So the dry handling does need to handle the disease killing part, possibly through heating during the composting process. Here is an article on compost toilets application. According to the article, one type will last 15 years, and is in use at Smith Rock SP in Oregon.
-crofter

https://insidescience.org/news/inside-controversial-world-composting-toilets

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/publications/books/housing/cha10.htm

 

[Freelander]

When I was in the Army we had those Field Latrines with the cut off 55 gal drum.

Every couple of days somebody would slide the barrel from under the hole, pour in a few gallons of Diesel fuel and light it off.

I have a friend who was in Iraq in the Nat Guard, and was on Latrine duty where they did burn the waste, now it seems the VA is concerned about the smoke that came from the fire than the human waste.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

What every happened to time when everybody had an Outhouse behind the house? . . .

The times . . . they are a changin'

Pit toilets have been outlawed in many places because it was found that they contaminate the groundwater.  And many feces borne diseases can survive for years.

Sh!t    Many popular climbing, backpacking and rafting areas are now requiring you to 'pack it out' (e.g. Shasta Trinity NF).

My cracked, cloudy crystal ball predicts that the LTVA rules will soon cover most public lands: either you have approved waste storage in your camper or you can only camp near supplied waste storage sites.

 

[Freelander]

I remember a few years ago Oklahoma was suing Arkansas because of the run off from the Chicken farms, Oklahoma claimed the runoff was contaminating the rivers in eastern OK.