Prices for used vans have skyrocketed! Any ideas for buying a used TALL VAN for less?

[Catalyst1]

Look for used vans at nursing homes. Bought mine for 1500. It has 47000 miles on it. Transmission was bad(1500 $) but I got a relatively new van for 3000.

I actually know a guy who bought a Sprinter that had been converted to an RV. It had only 32K miles on it. He ripped out the conversion and made it into a work truck because he is tall and does construction. Go figure.

 

[magentawave]

It might be worth looking at a cutaway box van. They have the same cab, chassis and engine and some have the same length box as an extended van. Some are longer. The box is wider and taller than the back of a van and best of all, the walls are flat and the corners are square. Doors and windows can be where you want them and most have access between the cab and the box. The prices are often similar to a same size van but you get 2-3 times as much cubic space.. A personal prejudice would be not to buy something that had had a reefer in it do to concerns about moisture and mold. I think step vans are very much worth looking at too.

I have many times considered a used box van. You’re right that the build would be easier with those vertical walls. Downside is that I would probably get half the gas mileage in a box van vs a newer van.

 

[magentawave]

Add a high roof to your Sienna! It's a more reliable vehicle than the vans you are looking at.

You certainly have the skills to do it, but it would be easy even if you didn't. The simplest way would probably be a curved plywood shell, with an external coat of fiberglass and paint.

Just a thought...

No doubt a Toyota is way more reliable than any of the tall vans, but more room in a big tall van means permanent bed, shower and that big garage under the bed.

 

[magentawave]

I have a boat to sell first and when I do I’ll either buy a new tall van and start building immediately or hit the road in my already converted super cool sienna. We shall see...

 

[MGfromBC]

Some more of my thoughts on a box van They are intended as both a contribution for others and maybe I can get some thoughts for myself. Yes, they probably use more fuel than a standard van but I'm not sure it would be that much. So far I have narrowed my search to cut-away vans that I have only looked at on line. Other than the box, they are essentially the same van. The back is the same length as an extended van at 12 feet. Those I've looked at seem to only be slightly wider and higher than a standard van.

I decided long ago that standing in a van is highly over-rated. Once you stand up, there's really no place to go. My plan, and I've heard that others do this, is to get a very cozy office or board-room type chair that can move freely, be leaned back and be locked in position. They have arm rests and head rests and I'm sitting in one right now. My intention is to build all counters and such at regular table or dest height rather counter height.

Once a standard height van is well insulated there isn't really going to be more than 48 inches between the floor and ceiling. I'd have to lower the chair. I don't need to stand up inside but another 6-12 inches would make a huge difference in real and perceived space.

Another feature is the lower, van type floor, rather than a raised floor like many truck boxes have. Yes, the wheel wells will intrude inside the box, but the centre of gravity and wind resistance would be lower. They also have access between the cab and box. Even though the box is lower than on a truck, unless you want to truly 4x4 there seems to be room underneath to mount a few things like maybe a metal box with a heater in it, propane tank, tool box, etc.

All contributions accepted.

MG

 

[rruff]

I decided long ago that standing in a van is highly over-rated. Once you stand up, there's really no place to go. My plan, and I've heard that others do this, is to get a very cozy office or board-room type chair that can move freely, be leaned back and be locked in position. They have arm rests and head rests and I'm sitting in one right now. My intention is to build all counters and such at regular table or dest height rather counter height.

I agree that standing is overrated, but being able to sit up straight and comfortably is important. I've never seen someone use a chair like that in a small space, but it seems workable if you have a 2' corridor.

 

[MGfromBC]

Yeah, sitting up straight is important. In my Sportage the seat behind the driver seat is the living/dining/kitchen. Once I push the driver's seat forward and tilt the seat-back forward, I have a lot of room. I can sit back and put one leg up on top of the other for example. I can also stick both legs between the front seats and cross them. The point being that I have options and don't feel restricted. I can sit properly and yet reach everything in the car. The bed extends from behind where the right front seat used to be to the back of the car. When I stick the bedding and mattress in the back my wooden bed platform is my table, kitchen, desk. I'd really like a bit more room though.

MG

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

I decided long ago that standing in a van is highly over-rated.

I agree that standing is overrated

Unless you are an older male with an enlarged prostate. Standing helps empty the bladder. Old knees don't handle kneeling.

 

[Dingfelder]

Of the three major brands, Ford's production has been the most disrupted. As a result, prices of used Transits are crazy high. I don't think prices will drop back to normal until after production volumes have replenished dealer inventory, which is coming off of a historically unprecedented low level. There's a lot of pent up demand. My crystal ball predicts used prices will remain high for all of 2022.

I know what you're going through, I feel your pain. I started actively searching for a new Transit in Nov of 2019. I even tried to place a custom order from the factory, but the dealer said it probably wouldn't get built. By Jun 2020, I still hadn't found one, so when I came across a Sprinter equipped the way I wanted, I jumped on it.

Consider a passenger van. There is a little less competition for them, so prices might be slightly lower. They also sell less quickly, which gives you a little more time to act. As an aside, I'll make the case that passenger vans make better conversions than cargo vans unless you have serious construction skills or are going to put a lot of money into the conversion.

One last thing: looking at the bare walls of the cargo van, the Promaster is built more flimsy than the Transit or Sprinter.

I wish you the best of luck in your shopping!

Would you please expand upon why you believe passenger vans make better conversions than cargo vans? I had always assumed the opposite.

 

[afblangley]

Would you please expand upon why you believe passenger vans make better conversions than cargo vans? I had always assumed the opposite.

Passenger vans have OEM wall, ceiling, and flooring that are better than most DIY. For example, my wall panels are moulded to the contours of the windows giving it a nicely finished look. Ditto with the well fitted ceiling. Passenger vans have rear HVAC ducting so temperature is easily moderated. There are usually niceties like power outlets, speakers and cup holders about the cabin. And lastly, there are windows, which aid drivability and make a small space feel larger.

There are a lot of steps involved in camper van conversion, starting with a passenger van eliminates the grunt work which allows the owner to focus on the things that will impact functionality (ie. bed, plumbing, storage, electrical). For those that have both skill and time (or money) a cargo van is a blank slate and has much greater flexibility. But for those that want to get on the road quickly or have limited construction ability, but still want something that looks nice, a passenger van has the heavy lifting done for you.

 

[Dingfelder]

Passenger vans have OEM wall, ceiling, and flooring that are better than most DIY. For example, my wall panels are moulded to the contours of the windows giving it a nicely finished look. Ditto with the well fitted ceiling. Passenger vans have rear HVAC ducting so temperature is easily moderated. There are usually niceties like power outlets, speakers and cup holders about the cabin. And lastly, there are windows, which aid drivability and make a small space feel larger.

There are a lot of steps involved in camper van conversion, starting with a passenger van eliminates the grunt work which allows the owner to focus on the things that will impact functionality (ie. bed, plumbing, storage, electrical). For those that have both skill and time (or money) a cargo van is a blank slate and has much greater flexibility. But for those that want to get on the road quickly or have limited construction ability, but still want something that looks nice, a passenger van has the heavy lifting done for you.

Okay thank you. I think of cold weather, so for me extra windows are a minus rather than a plus. And the insulation is not enough, though light insulation is a blessing in hot weather. I agree that getting on the road quickly would be easier with a van that is already meant for passengers. Appreciate the feedback.

 

[rruff]

Okay thank you. I think of cold weather, so for me extra windows are a minus rather than a plus. And the insulation is not enough, though light insulation is a blessing in hot weather. I agree that getting on the road quickly would be easier with a van that is already meant for passengers. Appreciate the feedback.

IMO windows are even more annoying in sunny and hot places... sun cooks the inside. A good insulated shell with minimal windows is best for me. I camp in the boonies and spend days outside, though.

 

[cdwhit]

…
Consider a passenger van.…. As an aside, I'll make the case that passenger vans make better conversions than cargo vans unless you have serious construction skills or are going to put a lot of money into the conversion.

I’m just curious why you think a passenger van would be better. Like the OP, I’m still looking for a van, but I have been skipping most passenger vans for several reason. All the windows make it harder to insulate, need some kind of covering for privacy, make stealth camping more difficult, and make it easier to break into the van. The seats need removed and disposed of, which is extra work, and leaves holes in the floor to be patched. Most passenger vans I’ve seen have coverings on the side, which they tell me aren’t well insulated, so would need removed and insulation installed, and I’m not sure, but I’m guessing would be more to dispose of with the seats. Also, while I do see more passenger vans available, and some do have a little better pricing, high or even medium roof passenger vans are rare unless it’s a wheelchair van, which I have been warned away from.

What are the advantages to a passenger van over a cargo van? Aside from a little more available and possibly a little better price?

 

[tradesman]

Passenger vans give you lots of options for seeing out and many times ventilation. It is simple to either tint the windows or paint them to block out people looking in and you can insulate just as easily as a standard cargo van. You can't screw into the panels of a cargo van any more than you can't screw into the windows. The benefit as mentioned before is the trim packages usually already there. I've converted a few vans both cargo and passenger, and many of the multi curved surfaces are difficult to finish off nicely. If you have the plastic pieces already there you can either use them as templates, a form, or cover/paint them or just put them back in with little modification. Removing the seats isn't that difficult and many times gives you pre-mounted threaded inserts to attach your own build. Most vans don't have much insulation behind those plastic side panels you mentioned, but again not that hard to remove (you'll probably want a cabinet there anyways).

 

[CosmickGold]

Well, I got mine for next to nothing by using magic. You can read my story about it at https://real-magic.net/event2.html

 

[afblangley]

All the windows make it harder to insulate, need some kind of covering for privacy, make stealth camping more difficult, and make it easier to break into the van.

Glass has a lower thermal conductivity than steel. If equally insulated, glass should modulate temperature better than the steel that surrounds it.

Privacy is an issue that can be addressed on a temporary basis using removable insulated window covers or by permanently installing insulative material over the windows.

The side windows of vans is not the weakest link for break ins. It is much easier to jimmy a lock, or break the driver or passenger window to access the door lock.

I don't know what stealth means. Most folks don't pay us no mind unless we give them a reason to. Window vans are a lot less frightening than cargo vans. No one looks at a window van and wonders if anyone's inside it.

The seats need removed and disposed of, which is extra work, and leaves holes in the floor to be patched. Most passenger vans I’ve seen have coverings on the side, which they tell me aren’t well insulated, so would need removed and insulation installed, and I’m not sure, but I’m guessing would be more to dispose of with the seats.

If you're looking to get down to the bare metal walls, then passenger vans are certainly more work. I'm suggesting that in many cases that's unnecessary. I don't know about all vans, but the Transit and Sprinter have seats that are quickly and easily removable by the simple pull of a latch. Undesired seats can be sold for hundreds of dollars per row.

The OEM seat mounts in the floor are useful. They can be used as attachment points for furniture that will be installed in the buildout. If more flexibility is desired, they can be used to attach sheets of plywood, creating a new (and well insulated) floor. My van floor was a composite material covered with vinyl. I laid plywood overtop, covering all the seat mounts except a cutout preserving the ability to add/remove the second row of seats at will.

The uncovered walls of cargo vans require immediate attention since they are ugly and can get uncomfortably cold/hot to the touch. While there is no insulation in the walls of most passenger vans, the interior coverings are aesthetically tolerable and pleasing to the touch. Insulation is a good thing, but it is not a replacement for mechanical manipulation (ie. heater, fan, AC). With adequate mechanicals, I have not found myself wanting for insulation. If I ever need to get behind the OEM panels for some reason, I will probably stuff in Thinsulate before reinstalling the OEM panels. I could not make wall coverings that look as good as the factory panels.

Here's an example of a well done buildout using a passenger van:

Also, while I do see more passenger vans available, and some do have a little better pricing, high or even medium roof passenger vans are rare unless it’s a wheelchair van, which I have been warned away from.

The Sprinter and Transit are the only two OEM hightop passenger vans. So there are relatively few on the market. And the Transit has only been around for 7 years here in the US.

No question it's a hot market right now, there's also no doubt it won't last forever. So it really boils down to what matters more: your money or your time? Spend more money now or wait and hit the road later.

 

[Debrajoy54]

These mini van fiberglass roof toppers look pretty sweet. - it would really add vertical space to your Sienna. If I were going the mini van route I'd probably be going down this route until prices on bigger vans have dropped - a LOT.

http://fiberine.com/GVMR/Mini_Van_Tops.html
Cheers

The problem for these high tops for me, is that they do Honda odysseys, 4th edition and newer mine is a 2003 and they don't make one for that! I'm a 67-year-old female so there is no putting one on myself LOL! I really need one because of the condition of my back but I will use my Odyssey no matter what! My motto is, Everyone needs to have a van of some kind!

 

[dhuff]

The Sprinter and Transit are the only two OEM hightop passenger vans. So there are relatively few on the market. And the Transit has only been around for 7 years here in the US.

Well, no...the RAM Promaster also has OEM hightop models. RAM has been selling these since the 2014 model year, and their 2023 models will have a "super" hightop avail with 86" (7ft 2in) of interior height to go with the regular hightop at 77".

 

[afblangley]

Well, no...the RAM Promaster also has OEM hightop models. RAM has been selling these since the 2014 model year, and their 2023 models will have a "super" hightop avail with 86" (7ft 2in) of interior height to go with the regular hightop at 77".

Well, no... Re-read my statement, it was correct.
The Promaster has only been available as a cargo van and for 2022, as a crew van. For completeness, the recently discontinued Nissan NV was available in passenger and cargo variants, though the former only as a low roof.

 

[dhuff]

Well, no... Re-read my statement, it was correct.
The Promaster has only been available as a cargo van and for 2022, as a crew van. For completeness, the recently discontinued Nissan NV was available in passenger and cargo variants, though the former only as a low roof.

I found photos on-line of RAM Promaster Window Vans going back to 2015. Or were you speaking of completely kitted out passenger vans ? (and even the window vans were avail with rows of passenger seats installed from various dealers or third party outfitters).