Off topic posts split from "How do u live on $700/month, truly?"

[scaredycat72]

Planning for the later years is something EVERY one needs to do no matter what life they are living.
Those who do not are likely to wish they had, no matter whether they were working at a regular job or not. I don't think it is something specific to nomads.

And there's also the fact that you can plan all you want and it may not turn out to be what you planned for. I had a friend who worked for Enron for 25 years, good pay, great pension plan, great stock investments in the company, all great plans for retirement. Well, you know what happened to Enron and the people who worked there. All that was gone.

Plans are good and necessary but perhaps even more important is to be flexible and able to adapt to changing circumstances and land on your feet when something unexpected happens.

I think everyone would benefit from planning but I believe it's even more so for nomads who are choosing to limit their income so they can be as free as possible now. Because of their low wages, their social security is going to be low and it would be smart for them to think about how they're going to survive. People who aren't nomads working here and there will generally receive more SS income. The average SS benefit for people working full-time is $1,500-$1,600. This actually enough to live off of if you own your home or your in income based or income restricted apartments. $700-$800 is hard to live off of.

While plans can definitely not work out, there's a big difference between doing what I can to set myself up for success and doing nothing, guaranteeing a challenging financial situation in my future.

Everyone can be flexible and adaptable when they're young or in good health. It's a lot more challenging when you're older or have medical issues. Especially since most people don't eat well and don't exercise, their bodies and minds are just not going to work as great in their 50s to 80s as it did in their 20s and 30s. There's a reason society is set up for people to work when they're young and retire when they're older. Doing the opposite is going to be rough.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

.....Anyway, I see hope for the future from young people refusing to work for low wages and organizing for union membership.

The problem is that for the younger generations it is not their grandfather's workplace any more. Unless they have a non-transferrable or difficult to automate skill they are competing against a machine or worker in India or Bangladesh that can live very comfortably on $700/month. COVID driven 'work from home' movement will accelerate this.

Your value to an employer is based on how expensive you are to replace.

 

[D'L]

I think everyone would benefit from planning but I believe it's even more so for nomads who are choosing to limit their income so they can be as free as possible now. Because of their low wages, their social security is going to be low and it would be smart for them to think about how they're going to survive. People who aren't nomads working here and there will generally receive more SS income. The average SS benefit for people working full-time is $1,500-$1,600. This actually enough to live off of if you own your home or your in income based or income restricted apartments. $700-$800 is hard to live off of.

While plans can definitely not work out, there's a big difference between doing what I can to set myself up for success and doing nothing, guaranteeing a challenging financial situation in my future.

Everyone can be flexible and adaptable when they're young or in good health. It's a lot more challenging when you're older or have medical issues. Especially since most people don't eat well and don't exercise, their bodies and minds are just not going to work as great in their 50s to 80s as it did in their 20s and 30s. There's a reason society is set up for people to work when they're young and retire when they're older. Doing the opposite is going to be rough.

You are right about all of this.

It is definitely harder for a lot of people to be flexible and adaptable as they get older. I think I managed to forget that, because I would qualify as "older" and I am very flexible and adaptable, know how to land well on my feet. BUT, I have been that way my whole life. Have always lived that way, although not as an actual nomad. I have not had a home and a steady job in the same place for years and years as many older people have had. It is easier for me.

Ditto for living on very little....having done it all my adult life I am very comfortable with it. Although I do not live on $800 a month, I live on less than anyone else I know does and pretty much always have. I have done that in order to save money for various purposes, medical needs (I have never had insurance), and etc, but mostly to save up and invest so I would have something when I got older and SSI wouldn't pay me enough to live on. Not the easiest strategy but it does work. Barring catastrophic events, of course.

 

[D'L]

The problem is that for the younger generations it is not their grandfather's workplace any more. Unless they have a non-transferrable or difficult to automate skill they are competing against a machine or worker in India or Bangladesh that can live very comfortably on $700/month. COVID driven 'work from home' movement will accelerate this.

Your value to an employer is based on how expensive you are to replace.

So true.
My father's idea was you go to school, get the degree(s) and then you get a really good job. That sure worked for him. But even by the time I was college age it was no longer really true, and it has become less true over the years since then. I feel pretty bad for young people today because even a career that looks great when you start out in school can be completely gone -- or completely different --by the time you actually get your degree. That was not true in my father's time.

 

[user 22017]

The problem is that for the younger generations it is not their grandfather's workplace...

They know the problems they face and have opted to change the system that created the problems. I wish them well. They only have to look at climate change, our wars/invasions and their inability to live as their grandparents did to know how badly my generation screwed things up for them.

The wage stagnation was allowed to happen by our elected officials from both parties over decades (globalization, austerity, neoliberalism, corporatism and laissez-faire economic policies that led to union busting and the loss of benefits for workers).

It was achieved through the political power of corporations. They legislated to their advantage, knowing it would crush the workers. It can be undone through legislation.

This page at EPI explains it better.

 

[towboater]

As a parent we want our kids to do better than we did. So we sometimes imply that if they don’t get a degree they are failures. So they get a degree thinking with their heart and not their head and are upset when they can’t get that dream job in a field that has limited turnover and possibly lower pay. For some it is better to get a trade than a degree. I believe that annual salaries for tradesmen on average will surpass that of those with bachelor degrees. That was not the case in years past. But, when u look at a 65 year old banker and then look at the 65 year old tradesman the banker usually looks younger. Just my observations and what the hell do I know? Best wishes

 

[SLB_SA]

The article People Who Work After Retiring Enjoy Better Health, According to National Study by the American Psychological Association suggests that there may be benefits to working after retirement.

There's a reason society is set up for people to work when they're young and retire when they're older. Doing the opposite is going to be rough.

Does "doing the opposite" mean retiring when you are young and working when you are older? If I could "retire" starting at 26 and start working at 90, that would sound great to me; how could I have pulled this off? Instead I am draining my retirement account in order to help support two of my (adult) kids and to delay taking social security benefits until age 70 (& I'm older than Bob). My account is draining fast but my SS should cover all of my needs for the rest of my life.

 

[SLB_SA]

"For 2022, the primary insurance amount for people receiving the Social Security special minimum benefit ranges $45.50 for someone with 11 years of coverage to $950.80 for workers with 30 years of coverage. The maximum corresponding family benefit ranges from $69.40 to $1,427.90." Here 2022 Minimum Social Security Benefit is the link. If a person with 30 years of work history and a FRA of 66 waited until age 70 to collect her/his benefit, this would yield 1.32 x $950.80 = $ 1225.05. If a person with 30 years of work history and a FRA of 67 waited until age 70 to collect her/his benefit, this would yield 1.24 x $950.80 = $1179.00. If a person worked at a (very) low paying job from age 18 to age 48, "retired" at 48, bummed around Europe or South America or Asia until age 70 and showed up in the US in 2022, s/he would get about $1225/month in SS, far more than $700/month proposed in the title here.

 

[SLB_SA]

If you were born in 1952, "retired" at age 18 (or age 0), survived until age 40 (odd jobs in Malaysia?), started working in the US at 40 and quit working at 70, and started taking SS in 2022 at age 70, you would be receiving at least $1225/month in SS benefits. I have friends who as undergraduates took a "sabbatical" year bumming around Europe, Asia or South America but none who did this for 22 years (from 18 to 40). If only I could go back and relive my life.

 

[RoamerRV428]

no one really wants older workers. They want them gonzo mostly. a few rare industries need the major experienced and braniacs etc. but mostly, regular ol' corp business, they f up the ins. cost group for companies and medical leaves and all that stuff that screw companies out of their profits. Youngers are the best profit by far to take on. more agism is gonna hit also in how ins. and other issues are slamming the economy and changing policies now and demands on workers. Unless one is super kinda more special in a way can an older person kinda get 'a good payin' job' to make up for all those years not contributing to SS I would think. I don't think yrs at a fast food burger place is gonna wham up anyone's SS high in a shorter amt of time.

Plus omg if I did nothing for 20 plus years but have fun, how in the hell could I go to work around age 40-45? I know I couldn't do it HAHA

 

[bullfrog]

Many people in this country work for years doing jobs like teaching, nursing, military service, government social services, law enforcement that make them feel good because they are trying to improve people’s lives for very little financial reward and very little support in the last few decades. That has caused the best ones to find other careers or to retire/drop out of the job market as quickly as possible causing the critics claims to become true in many cases. That needs to change or we will continue to see more and more harder to solve problems as this country sinks back into a third world country and many end up nomads on the road.

 

[bullfrog]

I did military service for 7 years, got out and went to college and taught school 12 years the worked in school transportation for 10 years. By doing many other jobs at the same time I managed to raise a family and build equity to a point that when my youngest child went to college, I was bankrupt and inflation had overtaken my ability to pay my mortgage payments almost. I was able to sell the house and use the equity to buy my retirement at age 53 which I did. I bought an old motorhome and my wife and I started our life on the road. Health insurance has been the biggest problem, finding a job has been no problem even at 70 years old. The last 15 years have been the best of our lives.

 

[RoamerRV428]

come on all
it is not logical that most can survive EVER NOW on increasing prices we are seeing other 'than taking free crap' thru ALL being offered out there. From govt IF you qualify and thru family/friends or charities or free food banks or whatever.....from dumpster diving to 'relying on others' to make your way....yes WE ALL can do it, but who are ya to accept? or need it in full life ya know. Massive gray areas. Money is key in life for all........agree or not it is what it is IF YOU require a way forward as you need ya know.

Our entire human existence is based on $$. Profit loss and that is never gonna change ever. Well not while I am alive!

Just tons of gray area in our chat on this obviously LOL

Roadkill food, a joke but for some as they can, right now, yes but in the end that goes bye bye also and 'way far' as a reliable actual food source unless one is 'that vulture' from sky high seeing ALL the food on the roads 'that didn't make it. and stop competing with wild life that eats just that HAHA you are taking food also from nature, as if the critters in nature don't have enough BS from humanity to deal with,

No use trying to pretend ever, 700 IN REAL life thru cost increases as we ALL seen now thru this past covid life exchange is skyrocketing and even a $1k ain't gonna be easy.

we all got 'what if scenarios' but those are few and far between who can just survive on that.

scary times are coming and those that can, will.
Many will suffer massively as we know it is happening out there right now.

So agree with Bullfrog, who are you and can you 'for and just how long???' so stop pretending all that some type of 700 will be the norm and be all end all for all to enjoy life ya know well I feel that way and even 1k will be tight for SO many yet there are exceptions thru age and health and more, but to say LIFE IS CHEAP AND OK on a 0 dollar use is just OH so wrong.

world is cash point blank and while SO many of us despise it....it is our reality point blank.

OK just chat from me, not saying this suits all ever but lets 'be a tad real' here for the masses!

 

[Morgana]

lets 'be a tad real' here

Agree wholeheartedly -- also (as Roamer and others said) that there are grey areas and 1000 details that can vary from person to person (so we shouldn't assume too much just from a short post).

Would love to see this thread stay focused -- like the last few posts have thankfully brought us back to -- on real-life personal observations and experiences, rather than unsupported fantasies and theories. Cuz for a lot of people, this is real now. And sending someone off on a wild goose chase is not doing them a favor.

(And I can testify that wild-hair fantasies are not "better than nothing," they're a time/energy/morale suck that a desperate person can't afford. Yes, you have to explore options and take risks, but you have to choose them carefully and not just grasp at straws.)

Just in case anyone listening in right now really IS trying to get by on $700 (or thinks they might have to soon) I just want to say (1) take all the help you can get -- and if there's anything you need to apply for, apply sooner rather than later because it can take a while to go through -- and (2) good luck!

 

[RoamerRV428]

Would love to see this thread stay focused -- like the last few posts have thankfully brought us back to -- on real-life personal observations and experiences, rather than unsupported fantasies and theories. Cuz for a lot of people, this is real now. And sending someone off on a wild goose chase is not doing them a favor.

good luck!

good luck is WHAT we all need in this massively current changing environment time as it is slapping us dead on. With more of this social services and 'those free' thing are gonna disappear as they are doing right now so.

but SO MANY shades of gray on 'our opinons and how we can maybe life or are foreced to live' and our mental status on 'who we are' comes into play but I know one thing, even though it 'won't ever buy happiness or health to live another day' in its simplest form, MONEY can buy our life survival absolutely --so less is not great for the masses in what their circumstances are and it so off balance, so right life is on this planet as we 'have progressed' and YET so much have never elvolved truly for all mankind.
It is reality, face or not against ones life and who we are but masses are showing point blank there is no' cheap azz money intake' to make it all rosey and the best life forward OR WE would not ever have our 'help millions on free govt programs.' Don't joke this off for a few will never pretend against the big reality as it gets worse and it is right now.....this is ME sayin' this LOL

again JUST a chat here, not sayin' this or that but an opinion by my me thru MY life and what I see, many will have mileage that varies here

there will never be a reward IF ONE is forced forward to survive IF that is never their intention in life as 'being a wanderer' and wanting this lifestyle. Many survive daily on 0....yet we feel IF they can or would 'concede to think like' us...then they got it rosey on less............just a massive sad jump in blanket statement BS ya know? Again just me and personal chat here

 

[Dingfelder]

As a parent we want our kids to do better than we did. So we sometimes imply that if they don’t get a degree they are failures. So they get a degree thinking with their heart and not their head and are upset when they can’t get that dream job in a field that has limited turnover and possibly lower pay. For some it is better to get a trade than a degree. I believe that annual salaries for tradesmen on average will surpass that of those with bachelor degrees. That was not the case in years past. But, when u look at a 65 year old banker and then look at the 65 year old tradesman the banker usually looks younger. Just my observations and what the hell do I know? Best wishes

Oh yeah, both physical and truly(not fake dramatic) mental stress rips the bottom out of people's physical and emotional/mental health and lets them plunge down into an endless well that can drown them. Living low accelerates aging dramatically. You can crisply determine longevity by zipcode.

And then there's the grotesqueries of imagining why that could possibly be so ... the fear and dashed hopes and continually recurring thwartings that impact the heart and that we are never supposed to admit take a toll on us. Until they do and we are not ever have supposed to have said.

 

[bullfrog]

My family has been in Eastern Kentucky for many generations and managed to live long lives. I knew and had meaningful conversations with my great grandfather. My grandfathers were born in the late eighteen hundreds and had families before, through and during the Great Depression. Jesse Stuart wrote several books which are about the hollows and situations they, my parents and I grew up in. Every Christmas my grandfather who worked for the C&O railroad gave everyone an orange. It seems a lot of Christmas times the only present he and his children would get was an orange that the conductor on the C&O train would give them on Christmas Day as the train slowly made it’s way up the hollow. Anyone that has lived in pretty much complete poverty as they did learns to do the best they can and survive on what they have. $700 isn’t a lot or even enough in most cases but if it is all you have you need to make it work till you can do better and survive after all there are apparently a lot of people out there living on the streets with less. Hopefully this thread will shed some of the light of hope that it is possible to find a way to a better life through living simply in the cheapest car/van/RV, working and eventually saving. Until your basic needs are met use all the organizations like Homes On Wheels, community shelters, government assistance, and increase your knowledge and skills to better yourself. Bob Wells saw a long time ago a way to make it work and has passed on what he could and we should to. Working on line, coolworks.com and the increasing government aid have all made it easier if you just keep at it. The reason for this forum is to help educate those that need or want to try this lifestyle.

 

[jaye]

$950.80 is the minimum Social Security payment with 30 years of qualified

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE.

I am 62 and have worked since I was 15. My monthly SS amount will be just over $780 before they take out Medicare when the time comes.

 

[RoamerRV428]

$950.80 is the minimum Social Security payment with 30 years of qualified

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE.

I am 62 and have worked since I was 15. My monthly SS amount will be just over $780 before they take out Medicare when the time comes.

I think was based off one being a state employee and what issues they are hit with literally. I think it was never meant as 'real SS' for those others. My hubbys SS is well near 2K at 65 and I kinda got what he was saying...........be aware of 'who you are in what career' you did in life?? my daugher told me 'states vary on this also' so..... cause my kiddo who is 17 wants to be a teacher and when I read that post about NO SS and basically reduced to nothing I quizzed her and she 'knew it' and I was like, WOW cause I never knew it! NOW I AM gonna check more and find ways for her to counter act what we need when older in the ol' savings acct for WHY teachers are not receiving, but she also said that teachers 'do not contribute' funds to this pension so??? so not clear on it all but bet your bottom dollar I am gonna look into it now.

I got educated on something I need to know to help her in a career path I have 0 clue on...I think great info hit me on this one The post helped this ol' gal here to check out a future for my kiddo! LOL

 

[bullfrog]

If you Goggle search “what is the lowest amount of social security” you will see several references to “$950.80 with 30 years coverage”. If you worked a year and didn’t make the minimum amount required for coverage or worked without you or your employer paying into social security you don’t get a year of coverage. Many people learn too late they worked jobs that do not participate in Social Security or failed to meet Social Security requirements for coverage unfortunately. Some teachers and railroad employees legally do not have to participate. Independent contractors and “cash” paid employees especially ones that get unclaimed “tips” may not illegally. There is a lot of illegal activity that occurs just because people aren’t aware or don’t want to be aware of Social Security laws and regulations. I once had to actually get a state board of labor involved to resolve a dispute with an employer that said he was paying required Social Security payments that didn’t. I didn’t find that out until I checked with Social Security about my benefits getting ready to retire!