I Feel Awful

[TrailerManNJ]

Been on the hunt for a private party Prius for sale on Craigslist for a while now. Almost all of the crooked dealers in my area clog the site with their junky, auction crap inventory, and most of them even stoop so low to make it appear as they're private sellers. Anywho...

I FINALLY spotted a jewel in the rough that was located 2 states away from me, about a 3 hour drive in each direction. As I have numerous medical issues, I really didn't want to drive that far on a lark. So I tried something different. I paid for a company called Lemon Squad to visit the owner and have one of their ASE certified mechanics inspect the vehicle. According to the car's owner, he replaced the hybrid battery about 30,000 miles ago, but only with a remanufactured unit, not a new OEM battery. This gave me great pause, so I asked if he was flexible on the price. He said he was, even though he was asking $5,900.

Lemon Squad goes out there today to inspect the car, and sends me their report a few hours later, with TONS of photos, data, etc. I thought they did a great job, and the car checked out fine aside from a few minor cosmetic issues. Then I checked their "True Market Value Assessment" of what the mechanic felt the vehicle was worth, and it said $5,935...only $35 more than what the seller was asking. This was either the world's biggest coincidence, or I was being hoodwinked, so I decided to do some research.

Went to the Edmund's website, as well as KBB, since both offer free private party sale values. Both sites spit out similar numbers...a 2007 Prius with 195,000 miles in fair/good condition goes for between $3,800 and $4,500. 

So I send the seller my offer, along with the pricing data, and also pointed out the cosmetic issues the mechanic photographed, as well as mentioning the lack of a new OEM battery. Lot's of risk with the car. I offered $4,300...which was on the higher end of the pricing data I found online. Seemed fair.

An hour later I get a curt reply from the owner; "Well, looks like we won't make a deal. Hope you find what you're looking for." No back & forth. No haggling. Nothing.

I feel god-awful. Not only because I might've passed on a good car, but maybe I was wrong in my approach? Did I offend the owner?

I told him he's free to ask whatever he wishes for his car, but that doesn't mean it's actually worth that much! 

Do any of you think I lowballed him? I was only going by the pricing data I found online, all from reputable websites.

Curious as to what you guys think...

 

[PeterPiper]

I don't think you "lowballed" anyone.
I think you offered what it was worth to you based on your research. It's the sellers option to accept or decline your offer, and he/she did just that.
No harm, no foul. If you still want the car.....make another higher offer.
Keeping in mind the car "could" be junk......you never really know until it's too late with used cars.

I once offered a 1984 300zx for sale for over $5000 and was offered that.
However, I found that the car had a small head gasket leak AFTER listing it and so I declined the sale.
Friends said I was nuts.......but I strongly believe in "Do unto others"...and Karma.

Maybe the seller found a major problem? Who knows?

 

[bullfrog]

Used car prices have gone up drastically and Toyotas especially. If it was a one owner car with complete service records in good condition even with an aftermarket rebuilt battery it should go at least another 100,000 miles on average. Finding a used car you can get a 100,000 miles out of for less than $5,000 is rare in today's market unless you do your own work and find good cheap parts. Before Covid inflated prices you could do that for as little as $2.500. I looked at a 2006 Toyota Camry previously owned and bought in southern Arizona, with full factory service records that looked new with less than !00,000 miles on it this week for $7,400. That is $2,400 dollars more that it would have sold for before Covid caused delays in getting new cars. Finding a truly good used car that will go 100,000 miles for less than $5,000 is probably low balling in today's market in my opinion although I would not buy a Prius with almost 200,000 miles and an aftermarket battery even at a fair price as it is too close to getting worn out in my opinion and they are expensive to repair unlike the Camry. You may have had to spend much more on the Prius over the next 5 years (20,000 miles a year) in addition to what you paid for it. If buying that Prius I would have wanted all factory parts and less than 120,000 miles and probably would have offered $5,000.

 

[hugemoth]

A few weeks ago I was contacted by the dealer where I bought a new 2018 Versa in 2018. They offered to buy it for $65 less than I paid for it. 31000 miles on the clock. Now is a bad time to be car shopping.

 

[txmnjim]

i would offer $5,000 if you want it. sounds like a good car but i am also hesitant on vehicles
with 195,000 miles. did you see how long the ad had been up on CL? if he had just posted it
then that is another reason he's not ready to start bartering yet. as an example, i picked up a
2007 Ford focus wagon last year for $2,000 and only 111,000 miles and its still going well. you
need to make a counter offer asap if you want it...good luck!

 

[RoamerRV428]

you are fine cause it isn't about 'true value on the market wtih reports and all' right now

it is what is a buyer willing to sell it for and what is a person willing to pay for it depending on how bad they want LOL

used cars are higher priced now, not a doubt cause inventory is leaving right now, no big used flush of used cars are gonna be out there, manufacturers are way behind on new vehicles to hit the market and more

so if you think you can just chat back a tad higher offer cause Lemon Squad said it was a nice vehicle when they viewed it, then yea.....just think and maybe offer a tad higher.....again IF YOU want this thing

wishing you the best and ya did nothing wrong at all, in fact you did good but the buyer has the pull on it all at all times so never doubt you in this

 

[john*thomas]

Rather than look at something like online pricing I would look to see what cars that are similar are actually selling for. Prices are up. You can search "sold" cars on eBay. Go to cars.com and see what they are listed for.

We have a 10 year old car my wife bought new that our daughter has taken to college. I was just curious and looked up what they were selling for and it's higher than what they were selling for 2-3 years ago.

 

[TrailerManNJ]

Thanks for the insight and words of encouragement, folks...it is GREATLY, GREATLY appreciated. Hopefully I'm not coming across as a soft yellow sissy who cries over a used car, because trust me, I am NOT that kind of guy at all lol. 

I was just let down on a few fronts: losing out on a possibly decent car, upsetting someone unintentionally, springing for the expensive mechanic inspection...all for naught, etc.

Based on the data I had (mechanic report & online pricing) I offered what I felt was fair, if the seller sees it differently he's free to do so.

As everyone here has mentioned, it is surely a sellers market now for used cars. Which makes me wonder if that's why Lemon Squad's vehicle price assessment was so out of whack with KBB & Edmund's...as both were considerably lower. Were they factoring in the current demand? I just found it HIGHLY suspicious/coincidental that their price assessment came in only $35 higher than what the seller was asking.

As we're all fellow nomads here, I know most of you can understand why this is a critical step in my journey. If the average person buys a used car and it breaks down, they might miss a day or two of work, maybe have to take an Uber or bus to get around while their car is fixed, etc. But when you LIVE in your car (as I will be), it is imperative to buy the best you can within your means, because if it goes kaput, you no longer have a home!

Btw, if anyone was wondering, aside from the vehicle price assessment issue (which the jury is still out on), Lemon Squad seemed to do an impeccable job on inspecting the vehicle. Mechanic took about 50 photos of the entire car: under the hood, the undercarriage, interior, exterior, trunk, and so on. Gave it a test drive, and had a checklist of about 100 different items he tested/inspected. I got the mechanic's report a couple of hours later where all of the good & bad were highlighted. It was a bit pricey at $200, and there are cheaper places I might try next time, though overall I was very impressed by the service.

Back to the drawing board!

 

[RoamerRV428]

yea your Lemon sounded great but that coulda been that money to offer more on the car but then you would not have seen 'all the good' they showed you on that car and so on and so on LOL

thing is if ONE wants a specific thing and gets great info on it......then what is a $500 or $700 more over, say 5 years of use and good times....a dollar can seem important and it is but at what longer term use cost?

you weren't whining, you are trying to find the best deal that suits you and I get it for sure on it all

 

[TrailerManNJ]

You're right, penny wise & dollar foolish is never a good way to live life. I certainly could've put that money towards the car, but on the flip side, there isn't a chance in hell that I WASN'T going to have someone inspect a vehicle that was located 2 states away, and was being sold on Craigslist.

 

[john*thomas]

$200 seems like a pretty good deal to me considering the amount of effort they put into it and what you saved not taking a 6 hour round trip.

 

[TrailerManNJ]

It is indeed a good deal, and I was quite satisfied with the service...aside from their questionable vehicle price assessment.

There are a bunch of these places though. I might try Aim Certify next time, as their price is only $129. https://www.aimcertify.com/

In the past I've paid local mechanics $50-$100 to do the same thing, but most of these guys are so busy they'd LOSE money if they had to leave their shop for an hour or two to do an inspection at this price. And what if the car is far away?

I think these services are worth every penny, if for whatever reason a person cannot physically go and see a car. Plus, they're trained mechanics, which most people are not. At the very least you'll get a solid opinion whether the car is a lemon or not.

Some of these places have very scattered reviews, so research and choosing the right company is key.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

I think you low balled him, not that that matters, he was asking almost 6,000, you offered him a bit over 4000, that is almost 30% less, you low balled him, when he suggested sharpening your pencil a bit you told him his car and his assessment on it’s value were flawed, then came here to complain and got emotional about a car negotiation. He didn’t close the deal down, he was just starting the haggling process. The deal is always in play as long as the conversation is ongoing. He may not want to deal with you anymore but you could start up the conversation again by asking him what he hoped to get for it or what would be his bottom line. Get to know this person and give them the benefit of the doubt that they are a trustworthy individual trying to sell a car unless they give you reason to beleive otherwise not everyone is not out to get you, most people are straight up.

 

[TrailerManNJ]

You're entitled to your opinion, that's cool. But let me ask you...

Suppose you were interested in a vehicle where the owner was asking $10,000. So you go online, do your research on KBB, NADA, Edmund's, etc., and all of the pricing data says it actually goes for $4,000 to $5,000. Why would you offer anything over that?

According to the pricing data that came up, his Prius was worth between $3,600 to $4,400...and I offered him almost the highest number in that range, $4,300.

I currently live in a small house. I could decide to sell it and ask for $1,000,000. But it's only worth about a 3rd of that. How many buyers do you think will offer me the million...or even anything much higher than the three and change it's worth?

Haggling is one thing, but a seller who ignores data & reality is quite another.

 

[wayne49]

A mechanic would not necessarily know the current market values for vehicles. Does not need to know such info to maintain and repair a vehicle.

A mechanic may know current market values, if they dabble in buying vehicles then fixing them up for resale.

 

[TrailerManNJ]

I agree with you. I didn't get my pricing from the mechanic, but instead, KBB, NADA and a few other websites. All of which are the gold standard when it comes to vehicle pricing, and have been used for years.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

You're entitled to your opinion, that's cool. But let me ask you...

Suppose you were interested in a vehicle where the owner was asking $10,000. So you go online, do your research on KBB, NADA, Edmund's, etc., and all of the pricing data says it actually goes for $4,000 to $5,000. Why would you offer anything over that?

According to the pricing data that came up, his Prius was worth between $3,600 to $4,400...and I offered him almost the highest number in that range, $4,300.

I currently live in a small house. I could decide to sell it and ask for $1,000,000. But it's only worth about a 3rd of that. How many buyers do you think will offer me the million...or even anything much higher than the three and change it's worth?

Haggling is one thing, but a seller who ignores data & reality is quite another.

I am not questioning your research or the value of this particular vehicle, I am only stating that offering 30% less is lowballing and suggesting that you keep the conversation going even if that means offering him 4301, if you are interested in buying this vehicle, seeing that you are already into it for 200, I assume you are interested so keep talking instead of walking away in a huff making assumptions about this persons reality. He wants 5900 where he got that number who knows, you offered 4300 based on some value website, that is only 1600 keeping you from owning this vehicle and him selling it. I am sure you can both compromise the question is how much. If you both call each other names no one gets what they want. The website doesn’t mention a new battery, how much is that worth? Are the tires new? Is the timing belt done ? If it has one? Where was it driven in Arizona or Michigan? Good luck,

 

[flying kurbmaster]

By the way there are a lot of reasons to pay more for your house, most houses in my area are going above rated value. Availability, location, condition, feel, kitchen, bathroom, septic tank, water quality.....neighbours...roof... windows...foundation...

 

[txmnjim]

As we're all fellow nomads here, I know most of you can understand why this is a critical step in my journey. If the average person buys a used car and it breaks down, they might miss a day or two of work, maybe have to take an Uber or bus to get around while their car is fixed, etc. But when you LIVE in your car (as I will be), it is imperative to buy the best you can within your means, because if it goes kaput, you no longer have a home!

which is why i have decided a trailer, TrailerManNJ, is the best way to go. in a few years i will find a Casita or Scamp and that will be home.

 

[highdesertranger]

Right now the price guides are pretty useless. Used vehicle prices are way up. Highdesertranger