Bear Pepper Spray

[Optimistic Paranoid]

By now, you probably have seen Bob's blog post where he recommends pepper spray over firearms.

I certainly don't have the credentials or experience to argue with Bob about this.  However, while doing my own research on this subject, I ran across something very interesting that you should know if you carry bear spray.

If you use pepper spray on an aggressive bear, and he leaves, but comes back a little later, the pepper spray may have NO EFFECT on him the second time around.  My source for this information is a book called BACKCOUNTRY BEAR BASICS. 

Hopefully, this link will take you to the online sample page that discusses this:  https://books.google.com/books?id=Y...Yg#v=onepage&q=bear spray second dose&f=false

The part about pepper spray misused as a bear repellant, but actually being a bear attractant, was also very interesting.

I think that carrying pepper spray - as Bob advises - is clearly a good idea.  But I think you need to understand it's limits and have a Plan B as well.

I watched a series of three National Geographic television shows devoted to bears - one each to black, brown, and polar bears.  They didn't discuss self-defense against bears, or pepper spray vs firearms or anything like that.  But in several shots, you could clearly see that the bear expert narrating the shows had a shotgun attached to his pack.  I'm pretty sure that was HIS Plan B.

Regards
John

 

[mockturtle]

I just returned from Alaska and there were plenty of detailed instructions everywhere about dealing with bears. Bear spray wasn't even mentioned. I do carry bear spray when hiking but more for aggressive dogs than for bears, where it may be of little tactical value. It may be useful against aggressive two-legged critters, though.....

 

[Gary68]

make noise,hang a couple of those little cat bells on your pack,talk

the close encounters i have had(black bear,lion,bobcat and the worst of all,skunk) have been from me being quiet and surprising them

if you turn around and a big brown is charging,well,big gun,play dead,im going for the eyes,my worst nightmare right there not much you can do against 1500 lbs of bear

 

[highdesertranger]

I am surprised nobody posted this.

ha ha have a great day.  highdesertranger

 

[Van-Tramp]

Nothing wrong with carrying bear spray and I understand it is quite effective in "30-feet or less" range... as long as the wind is in your favor. I have been carrying some while here in AK, but it is a secondary weapon with my primary still strapped on my belt or slung over my shoulder. It reaches further out than 30 feet and a breeze has minimal effect on it and is perfectly legal to use on the animal more prone to attack me; humans.

Remember, carrying and/or using bear spray on a human, even in self defense, is a violation of federal law. Using my S&W is not.

This is how I go kayaking in AK: 

12g with slugs.

Nothing more effective at stopping bears and moose

 

[highdesertranger]

nice what's in the scabbard? type? highdesertranger

 

[66788]

Hopefully not "your" moose.

 

[Van-Tramp]

Just a Mossberg 500 clone (Maverick 88) with 5 slugs up the tube.

I just read Bob's post and I only want to mention that his advocating his own personal use of "warning shots" may not be best to follow. Bob is a big boy and likely knows the laws, but the general public does not so allow me; Warning shots are ILLEGAL in just about every state. The law is clear that if you could use a warning shot then you were not in enough danger to fire the gun at all. Either shoot to kill or do not shoot at all. Or, at the very least, take your warning shot and when the Ranger/LEO comes to interview you make sure you say that you were shooting to kill (not warning shot) and you may go home that night, not to jail.

 

[akrvbob]

I won't fire a warning shot. I'll be taking target practice which is legal nearly everywhere in the NF except a few specific places and I never camp or walk in those places. The biggies for no shooting are near a campground or other human development or across a waterway or road.

It'll be pure chance there happened to be a coyote around when I started practicing.
Bob

 

[highdesertranger]

I love the model 500. I got mine when they were 159 bucks new. it's my go to field gun because I don't care if I scratch it. as for firing warning shots I have done it once. on a ladies(Glenna) property in Oregon where I prospect. she has an uppity doe that has attacked her a few times she had to beat it off with a stick. well so I had gone to bed my dog sleeps with me and I sleep outside as much as possible. so I was dozing off when my dog jump out of bed and ran to the opposite side of my truck, I heard a ruckus and he came back whining. I thought great what's out there so I got up grabbed my .357 that I keep handy and walked to the front of my truck. I looked on the other side and there she was, just staring at me. I had forgotten all about that crazy doe. I just saw any old doe, I kinda of chuckled about my dog being a sissy. I though to myself that I would just walk out in front of my truck she will see me as a threat and take off. well guess what she came right at me. put her head down like a ram, so I fired into the ground right in front of her which by this time was about 2 feet from me. she made a quick right turn and took off. I could have slapped her on the butt as she went by. when I told Glenna the next day she said I should have shot her. I would have done her a favor. I have never looked a Bambi's mom in the same way since. highdesertranger

 

[Almost There]

How come every thread we have to do with any kind of safety issue devolves in to a gun thread!

Just asking!

Bear spray, bear bells, air horn, dog dish, barking dog recordings, a real live dog, heck even paying attention to your surroundings whether it's in town or out in the wilds are all effective ways that could be put on the discussion table.

I'm sure with all the collective imagination here there are more.

I'm Canadian, we don't carry guns.....

 

[mockturtle]

Remember, carrying and/or using bear spray on a human, even in self defense, is a violation of federal law. Using my S&W is not.

Yes, I know.  And I find it both ironic and idiotic that it's legal for me to shoot someone dead with my revolver in self defense but not to disable them for half an hour with pepper spray.

 

[BigT]

I'm Canadian, we don't carry guns.....

I'm a "Kalifornian".  I don't dare carry a gun. 

 

[LeeRevell]

I'm a "Kalifornian".  I don't dare carry a gun. 

We Floridians can protect ourselves.  But states differ, so I do have to be careful when traveling.  I used to carry a small can of pepper spray, but it went bad - the one time I tried to use it, the stuff barely came out as a brown gooey mess.  My .45 pistol is much more reliable.  Only ever had to pull it once, and did not have to shoot.
Bear spray, as said earlier, is a two-edged sword.  Being an "Area Effect Weapon" it can be as dangerous to the user as to the goblin.
I went through the "Gas Chamber" on Gitmo in the Navy - do NOT want to relive that.......    :blush:   

Basically, using ANY weapon brings with it a great responsibility.  And we must be sure to do no harm to innocents around us and beyond the goblin.

 

[WriterMs]

Well, I'm learning a lot about the legal implications of using various deterrents -- on this thread and another couple on the forum.

What I remember from another discussion is that bear spray is illegal to use on humans but if you by a mace that is FOR use against humans you are ok?

Very good points were made about using anything that makes a cloud when you are inside your van. Hadn't thought of it but great point. I have the cheapo wasp spray at my bedside when camping -- but someone pointed out on another thread that using wasp spray on a human is a felony? The wasp spray shoots a long stream so can be used at a distance, it is cheap enough to practice with, and it would not leave a cloud in the van if an intruder were just outside or coming in. But now I wonder about it's use? Although if someone was frightening me enough to use the wasp spray, I think I'd not worry about the legal issues and use it.

For bears and from living 10 years in Montana, I know to make noise when I hike and the recommended ways to move to try to get out of an attack. I have never carried bear spray, but think I will do so next time in griz country.

 

[Van-Tramp]

WriterMs,

No, pepper spray (human vs human) is still illegal [to use, not sell] in the majority of states. Pretty much, and as sad as this sounds, the only tool permitted by law to protect yourself in human vs human attacks across all 50 states is a gun. Anything else (taser, spray, bat, knife, etc) and you risk being arrested, jailed, fined, etc for defending yourself. You should research your state laws before deciding on which tool you want for protection.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

1: How come every thread we have to do with any kind of safety issue devolves in to a gun thread!

1: Just asking!



2: I'm Canadian, we don't carry guns.....

1: Uhmm, because carrying a gun is the single most effective tool for personal safety there is?

2: Don‘t carry guns?  Hell, the wanna-be Englishmen running your country won't even let you carry sharpened sticks!

"Good God!  Let the peasants have arms? Good God! What an idea!"

Regards
John

 

[LeeRevell]

1: Uhmm, because carrying a gun is the single most effective tool for personal safety there is?

2: Don‘t carry guns?  Hell, the wanna-be Englishmen running your country won't even let you carry sharpened sticks!

"Good God!  Let the peasants have arms? Good God! What an idea!"

Regards
John

Reminds me of the old joke.....
First Lord:  "The peasants are revolting!"
Second Lord:  "Yes, but they are attacking us too!"    

Many of us believe whole-heartedly in the God-given Right to Self Defense, but the various stupid laws make it difficult to do so without becoming a criminal ourselves!  Utterly mindboggling.  The ONLY reason we can still generally use a gun is due to the various Gun Owners' Rights groups, like the NRA and GOA.  Had they not been guarding our Second Amendment right, it would have been long since pilfered and taken away too.  But when it is YOUR life or the life of your loved ones on the line, you do what you must, the law be damned. 
"Better to be tried by twelve than carried by six!"  

 

[Almost There]

Okay, let me try this another way!

For those of us for whom carrying a gun is either illegal or undesirable, let's take a good look at alternative means of safety.

If carrying a gun is off the table, what else is effective in specific situations?

 

[Gary68]

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