will the explosion of full time Vandwellers that the life will be more costly.

[JDub]

We've certainly got folks living in makeshift arrangements around the county but it's hard to tell how many or if the number is increasing due to the really dense growth around here that pretty much obscures most boltholes and camps that are even a hundred feet into the woodline. You would have to actually go down that little dirt road or grass track to see what's down there. Not recommended. Folks like their privacy out there.

Besides the numerous fishing and hunting camps that dot the area (almost everyone has access to one) - a hunting club can get a lease to a hundred acres or more (I've seen 600 acres) of scrubland and slash pine plantations for a very reasonable cost - $1200 - $2500 a year. Sometimes the lease includes a falling down old house to serve as the bunkhouse. Paper and pulp is big here so there are thousands of acres in tree farms that aren't ready to harvest yet, so the owners get a little extra cash by leasing tracts to hunters.

There's not much the county regulates or even has the manpower to enforce a lot of statutes so "see no evil" is the byline here. Problem for van dwellers and those without access to electricity is the blistering, miasmic hot and humid summers here... Feels like you're drowning in a boiling water bath for months on end. The nicest times are Mar-May and late Sep-Nov. Winter's aren't bad but they tend to be cold and wet interspersed with patches of really nice weather in between. If you don't have AC here in the summer you have a good chance at dying.

The city I live in strictly regulates all overnight vehicle living outside of the C of E campgrounds (even mobile homes aren't allowed and the old ones can't be replaced as they fall apart) and being a small town, someone from out of town living in their vehicle would stand out like that sore thumb and the police would be knocking on their window. There are no services for transients anyway - most head for the big cities so we don't really have a homeless issue either. LOTS of drugs though like everywhere...

Cheers

 

[ChileSauceCritic]

Maybe there will be increased traffic or pressure for parking in the coastal or other "nice" areas, however for the majority of the country that isn't so scenic or mild in temps, I doubt you will notice much of a change. Between all of the tractor-trailers parked at night on the on and off ramps, in the big dirt parking lots beside gas stations and in larger commercial shopping lots, it would be hard to notice a few more vans/vehicles.

The other factor is the continual "easy-in/easy out" of the lifestyle. There's no way to make an accurate count of new vs quitting vehicle dwellers. I can say that over the 5 years that I have been aware of YT videos on the topic, I've lost track of many content creators. Whether they have quit or just burned out IDK but they are gone. There's always new ones to take their place but that's part of the "easy-in/easy out".

Any big change in the economy, a la 2007-2008 recession/depression will force more people into vehicles. If the current national government does something to "stabilize" or put a floor under incomes then likely people won't stay in vehicles due to the discomfort factor of doing so.

  Well as far as the youtubers go I notice the ones who seem to have the most followers(and thus the most ad money) in the quickest amount of time tend to be the younger prettiest solo females or  attractive couples in the fanciest rigs their duel income money could buy, the exception being people who love the life and don't care if they only have 5 followers and their channels grew more slowly.  many of the ones that have not updated in years on YouTube  are still on twitter and Instagram and still on the road. But yes the only way to stim the flow of new vandwellers would be to actually create and mandate low income homes and apartments across the country close to or lower than the cost of living in a van, especially for those who have gotten used to the freedom, I don't see that happening as for many you would have to make owning a house cheap enough for the average person to be able to own a home AND travel when they want to.

 

[user 37446]

Aww, say it isn't so! You mean that some content creators are wearing provocative clothing, taking suggestive poses and such just for views? Really!

 

[Tony's Dream]

I always seem to be behind the trends. When we reached that point in life when we could own an RV, it seemed like every where we went was over crowded with RVs. When we had the funds to travel and stay at nice hotels, 10,000 people were already there. Now I want to be a nomad traveler.....and all the places are filling up fast.

 

[ChileSauceCritic]

Aww, say it isn't so! You mean that some content creators are wearing provocative clothing, taking suggestive poses and such just for views? Really!

  I don't think they all do it for the views I know a few women who just dress that way all the time, but yes it does help the algorithms pick up on them. Below is one of my favorites but she does not have the followers that the youtubers I mentioned have, but what can I say I have a type lol

[video=youtube]

 

[crofter]

...The city I live in strictly regulates all overnight vehicle living outside of the C of E campgrounds (even mobile homes aren't allowed...

What city is that?

Maybe they are calling the mobile homes "manufactured housing" If they really outlawed mobile homes what would they use to expand their schools when overcrowding happens?

Exclusionary zoning has been succesfully challenged through legal processes. 
-crofter

 

[JDub]

It's my town - in the AL Black Belt. That ordnance has been in effect for years. No mobile homes. The ones that were in place were grandfathered but as they fall apart they can't be replaced. I have an entire empty 9 acre lot across the main road that used to be a trailer park. Nothing there now but the pads - it's where I walk my dog everyday. I've thought how much a group of nomads would love to be able to use the site. I'll post a pic manana.

We don't worry about expanding our schools because the student base (and the town population) has been shrinking for years... We closed one of our 2 town elementary schools 2 years ago and are about to consolidate the middle school with the remaining one, and the county district has closed 1 of it's schools and are about to close another... Depopulation is what's going on here. The next county over is bigger than mine and has only 9000 people in it. We've dropped to under 19,000 from the 25K who lived here when we moved here...

Cheers.

 

[ChileSauceCritic]

Many small towns are doing that in an attempt to change their reputation but that only works for small towns that are right outside of a major city small towns out in the middle of nowhere that do that are just killing their town quicker, unless they go the "resort town" route but you have already said your town officials have no interest in the bar's and other entertainment venues that would make that work.

 

[JDub]

They want to encourage the "right kind" of entertainment - things like jazz festivals, high brow art shows, obscure folk music, hip plays, etc - you know, the stuff 90% of folks who live here aren't interested in. Others would have to drive an hour to get here. Once again, catering to a tiny (very exclusive) and wealthy audience - Oh! By the way, they don't want to pay for it either - they want someone else to. We're pretty much at a dead stop!

 

[crofter]

If you already own the property, you could research fair housing groups in your state, and try to get a variance for your property. A variance does not overturn the ordinance, but would change the situation where you are being prevented from gainfully using your property in its previous permitted use. 

The issue is a private property right as well as a fair housing right. If you are able to get renters in there, will also generate revenue for the town from property taxes and sales taxes.

A bargaining point could be age and type of the rigs, landscaping or fencing, etc.
-crofter

 

[ChileSauceCritic]

They want to encourage the "right kind" of entertainment - things like jazz festivals, high brow art shows, obscure folk music, hip plays, etc  - you know, the stuff 90% of folks who live here aren't interested in. Others would have to drive an hour to get here. Once again, catering to a tiny (very exclusive) and wealthy audience - Oh! By the way,  they don't want to pay for it either - they want someone else to. We're pretty much at a dead stop!

  :angel: Yep that would actually work IF YOUR TOWN WAS Just OUTSIDE OF THE CITY LIMETS OF A MAJOR CITY!!!!
I've seen it happen in little towns just outside of Dallas and Austin they attract hipsters who think it's quaint and artsy. 

 

[JDub]

  :angel: Yep that would actually work IF YOUR TOWN WAS Just OUTSIDE OF THE CITY LIMETS OF A MAJOR CITY!!!!
I've seen it happen in little towns just outside of Dallas and Austin they attract hipsters who think it's quaint and artsy. 

Maybe our isolation is a GOOD thing then! Here are some pix of the former trailer park across the main road from my street. It was at its height (I'm told) THE place to go for anything sold by uhhhhhh.... let's say self employed street level independent pharmaceutical salesmen. It was the main reason the city passed the very strict ordinance's against mobile homes it has now. Apparently when it was closed the high crime rate in the neighborhood (it's very middle class S&B and across the street from our elementary school) dropped to a virtual zero and has stayed that way....

It's also a shame though. The site has about 50 hardpads and although the above ground meters and such are destroyed, they are plumbed and wired for electric, gas, and water. It's about 1 minute from our nicest CoE park. A well managed snowbird type long term stay camp would do very well there. I doubt it will ever be used for such again though. It was responsible for a large percentage of the service calls our PD got every month back then (about 15 years ago) and the folks in the neighborhood would be strongly against it opening again.

Cheers

 

[maki2]

RVIA tags have been around for quite a few years now, at least since the late 1970s as I had one on a motorhome of that vintage. That also means you can a quire ond ast an RV junkyard if you feel it is going to make a dfifference i. Your avceptance. It iscreally all about the insurance coveraged at the RV parks thinking that if there is one on your RV then at least the electrical, pllumbing and propane work was done to industry standards. Given how many times such things were not done well in a factory adnd were done with cheap components that may have failed and were then given a DIY makeover it is certainly no gaurantee the RV is safe. Go to most any RV forum dedicated to different RV brands and there are many topics devoted to making repairs to electricasl, plumbing. Propane and apliances including stoves, AC and furnaces as well as water heaters. It is delusional to think a tiny placard fixed to the vehicle means it is safe to others in an RV park. But that is all the insurance companies have to rely on as there are no required inspections regarding components.

It is what it is, just one of those things from the insurance industry underwriters combined with NIMBY

 

[ChileSauceCritic]

Maybe our isolation is a GOOD thing then!   Here are some pix of the former trailer park across the main road from my street. It was at its height (I'm told) THE place to go for anything sold by uhhhhhh.... let's say self employed street level independent pharmaceutical salesmen. It was the main reason the city passed the very strict ordinance's against mobile homes it has now. Apparently when it was closed the high crime rate in the neighborhood (it's very middle class S&B and across the street from our elementary school) dropped to a virtual zero and has stayed that way....

It's also a shame though. The site has about 50 hardpads and although the above ground meters and such are destroyed, they are plumbed and wired for electric, gas, and water. It's about 1 minute from our nicest CoE park. A well managed snowbird type long term stay camp would do very well there. I doubt it will ever be used for such again though. It was responsible for a large percentage of the service calls our PD got every month back then (about 15 years ago) and the folks in the neighborhood would be strongly against it opening again.

Cheers

just north of my city are 2 towns like that, they were farming/ranching towns up until the mid - late 60's  mostly agroculture with a bunch of trailer parks where mostly farm workers lived then in the late 60's the farms and ranches were not big enough to compete with the new fangled competition from corporate farms, so those farm either shut down or barely held on for the next 30+ years so for most of my life those towns were run down farms and trailer parks with all the stereotypes that people think of when you say the word "trailerPark" then in the late 90's and early 2000's the kids and grandkids of those farmers started selling that land to developers and overnight those towns became mostly gated communities and 500K homes,  and most of the trailer parks are gone because laws got passed where trailers could not be replaced the few that are left are privately owned so they were fully grandfathered but they are strict about what TYPE of mobile homes you can have there now(the kind that look like real houses except for being long and narrow).   

 So anyone under 35 won't remember when those towns were where you went to either get high or get laid.  now they are towns that you bust your ass at work hoping to someday afford to move there.

 

[WayOutWest]

Are you ignoring court decisions like Appeals court panel ends L.A. ban on homeless living in vehicles that might prevent cities from restricting overnight parking?

If you look at the details on this and similar court cases, you'll find that the ruling doesn't prohibit cities from passing any laws at all on living in vehicles, what the ruling does say is that cities cannot enact total and complete "bans" on sleeping in a vehicle.
So, a city could still do what LA did after the ruling, which is to create certain zones where sleeping in a vehicle is allowed, and other zones where it's not allowed. Or, a city could choose to limit the length of time someone could sleep in a vehicle either in the city as a whole, or in any one place.
My understanding of the ruling was that, among other things, the court sees the need to protect the ability of a traveler to pull over and sleep in their vehicle...safety alone clarifies the need to be able to do this.
But there's a difference between pulling over to sleep in your vehicle for a night while traveling, and pulling up and occupying the same parking spot on a city street for months or years at a time.
The space in between those two situations is where IMO there is room to develop regulations.

 

[SLB_SA]

I have not driven on I80 west of SLC in a year or two but I assume that the signs encouraging tired drivers to pull over and rest are still in place; the Utah policy certainly supports your comments about safety being a driving factor.  If you watch videos by "German in Venice" about the homeless in LA and by "Invisible People" on the homeless everywhere, you see (mostly) tents, etc and (some) broken down RVs and other vehicles.  To where will cities like LA tow these broken down vehicles?  From Nomadland (the book), we learned that Linda used to be a alcoholic.  How many of the "actual" homeless will get over their addictions, earn some money and become "houseless" nomads?  (I don't recall the details of Linda's story; I'm not saying that she was ever homeless.)

You said "But there's a difference between pulling over to sleep in your vehicle for a night while traveling, and pulling up and occupying the same parking spot on a city street for months or years at a time."  I completely agree.  For some current or future nomads, money is not a big problem.  For others, it is a huge issue and they might be one major vehicle breakdown or medical crisis away from being ("actually") homeless, maybe in LA.  At some point, the problem will become so big that society cannot ignore it.  At that point, I think offering long term parking to nomads might be the preferred alternative.  Who knows?

 

[ChileSauceCritic]

If you look at the details on this and similar court cases, you'll find that the ruling doesn't prohibit cities from passing any laws at all on living in vehicles, what the ruling does say is that cities cannot enact total and complete "bans" on sleeping in a vehicle.
So, a city could still do what LA did after the ruling, which is to create certain zones where sleeping in a vehicle is allowed, and other zones where it's not allowed.  Or, a city could choose to limit the length of time someone could sleep in a vehicle either in the city as a whole, or in any one place. 
My understanding of the ruling was that, among other things,  the court sees the need to protect the ability of a traveler to pull over and sleep in their vehicle...safety alone clarifies the need to be able to do this. 
But there's a difference between pulling over to sleep in your vehicle for a night while traveling, and pulling up and occupying the same parking spot on a city street for months or years at a time. 
The space in between those two situations is where IMO there is room to develop regulations.

  I can see that, like only allowing overnight parking in industrial area's as every city in America has burnt out old factories and warehouses with big parking lots, in the rust belt there are whole neighborhoods abandoned for decades as the greedy corporations have moved most of our manufacturing jobs overseas  lol. 

[img=550x300]https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ab/2c/88/ab2c88f310797ae166015acba20ed963.jpg[/img]

 they could allow vandwellers on streets like these with no penalty.

 

[SLB_SA]

I was just reading this old (2019) blog The dark side of #vanlife and thought it might fit here.

 

[JDub]

Looks like a LOT of folks have the same idea - Get an RV and skedaddle for safety (wonder where they'll all go?). Hmmm, maybe I should just stay put now if everyone else is headed for Nomadland! The link title is self explanatory.

Cheer!

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/rv-boom-rolls-2021-record-breaking-sales-expected

 

[jacqueg]

Well, I dunno. they sure didn't show up at Mecca (Quartzsite) this year!