Ultra-Capacity Lithium Batteries
- Thread starter RVTravel
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As long as the box has a direct connection from the battery posts to the external posts, no electronics in between,
which this example does,
then **any** charge sources that works on a bare battery
will work clipped onto the box's posts.
which this example does,
then **any** charge sources that works on a bare battery
will work clipped onto the box's posts.
What do you mean by "house power"?hausmutti said:
If you mean "shore" alternating power, 110-120AC in NA, aka grid or mains power, obviously that requires a suitable shore charger.
Charging from the vehicle circuit should never be done from the ciggy port, and for a big battery like this, only while the engine's running.
I just read were people are having lots of problems with Lithium batteries and cold damaging them just another thing to be aware of...
Now the battery I wish were available here in north america are Lead Crystal® battery we are so behind the times and battery technology here as with so many other things.
Now the battery I wish were available here in north america are Lead Crystal® battery we are so behind the times and battery technology here as with so many other things.
No, "lead crystal" as sold in Australia and South Africa seem to just be a marketing scam, just another AGM.
If anyone is looking to introduce them to the US market, only way to get credibility is to be transparent as to the actual Chinese manufacturer, publish **full** specifications as the top reputable AGM vendors do.
And send out a few free sets to skeptical trusted forum experts to test over five years of abuse.
If anyone is looking to introduce them to the US market, only way to get credibility is to be transparent as to the actual Chinese manufacturer, publish **full** specifications as the top reputable AGM vendors do.
And send out a few free sets to skeptical trusted forum experts to test over five years of abuse.
The people "having lots of problems" with Lithium batteries
are those not purchasing quality systems fully protected by an integrated BMS
or trying a DIY setup without doing enough learning and research first.
Temperature issues would be one of the first things you learn in any thread going into tech details on how to care for them.
are those not purchasing quality systems fully protected by an integrated BMS
or trying a DIY setup without doing enough learning and research first.
Temperature issues would be one of the first things you learn in any thread going into tech details on how to care for them.
Better to read the detailed spec sheet available for every battery worth considering.
Remember "lithium" doesn't have any specific meaning, covers dozens of different chemistries each different.
For LFP in general, storage is fine below freezing, as is discharging, but way less efficient.
I would bring mine up to 40°F before charging, that gets very dicey much below 32.
I have ordered custom silicon heating pads depending on the enclosure, insulated of course, they include a top-temp cutoff, and thermostats are part of any decent BMS / DIY protective setup.
Remember "lithium" doesn't have any specific meaning, covers dozens of different chemistries each different.
For LFP in general, storage is fine below freezing, as is discharging, but way less efficient.
I would bring mine up to 40°F before charging, that gets very dicey much below 32.
I have ordered custom silicon heating pads depending on the enclosure, insulated of course, they include a top-temp cutoff, and thermostats are part of any decent BMS / DIY protective setup.
Guy using EV battery packs for House use on a boat.
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195778
Note I'm not recommending this except for wealthy mad scientist types
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195778
Note I'm not recommending this except for wealthy mad scientist types
Good intro to testing capacity, just USB based though, @5V
https://boingboing.net/2018/02/01/testing-usb-battery-pack-capac.html/amp
https://boingboing.net/2018/02/01/testing-usb-battery-pack-capac.html/amp
My drop in 100 Ah LiFePo system has been running flawlessly for a while now. I only started with a 100 Ah due to costs and wanted to be sure I didn't blow it up, and if I did I am only out 1 battery. This is how I personally addressed the freezing and voltage problems and it has worked very well for me.
I have the house battery, a 100 amp Trojan, running all the original RV stuff, the vent fans, lights, water pump, propane fridge, etc. That one is connected to the tow vehicle alternator when driving and the converter when plugged in. I have a 160 watt panel charging this system, which works as nothing is high draw. I have a 100 watt portable that can add to this if needed (or shade)
I have the 100 Ah LiFePo running the 1000 watt pure sine inverter, this setup is solely charged by the sun, it charges my ebike battery (600 watt charger), 600 watt microwave, induction hotplate (set to half power works great 900 watts), 12v freezer, 12V TV & blu ray player, cell & wifi boosters, high power laptop. I have 915 Watts of panels charging this system plus another 160 watt portable if needed. This battery is located within the cabin which I generally keep at least to 50°F. If I do ever encounter a time when the battery will be exposed to freezing temps, I can set the solar controller to off until I warm up the battery (cabin). This system is generally fully charged by 10am in the wintertime.
I have actually found that the single drop in 100 Ah LiFePo battery is enough for my needs, I just do all the high power stuff during the day where the solar is actually powering the inverter not the battery. It took me about a month to get the bulk/absorb/float settings right to maintain the battery charge just right, the controller (Victron) I use allows for adjustment to the 0.01 volt, which I found is needed for getting LiFePo just right as the difference between 20% full and 80% full is very small in volts. If anyone needs more detail on that I can post another time.
I would love to have a 2nd LiFePo just as convenience, but do not need it.
One BIG advantage I found from the LiFePo over the lead acid is the standing and loaded voltages are higher, much less sag under heavy loads, higher voltages under heavy loads means less amps being used (Watts = Volts x Amps). This allows my inverter to put out more power before tripping (I have ran it continuously at 1100 watts before) and the battery seems to drain much less quickly like a Lead Acid under heavy loads.
Now after all of that, I am very happy with lithium, but it is not ready for the average person yet, I had to carefully monitor and tweak the voltages every day to get it right. If you are a bit of an electronics geek it will work for you.
BTW my entire solar/LiFePo setup cost about $3000, my rig $3800, and another $1200 in accessories, so about $8000 (into the 5th wheel) I have the perfect rig for me with all conveniences of home. As has said by several other people, with solar get as much as you can afford the first time, it improves your quality of life a lot. #1 is the ability to microwave ramen on demand
I have the house battery, a 100 amp Trojan, running all the original RV stuff, the vent fans, lights, water pump, propane fridge, etc. That one is connected to the tow vehicle alternator when driving and the converter when plugged in. I have a 160 watt panel charging this system, which works as nothing is high draw. I have a 100 watt portable that can add to this if needed (or shade)
I have the 100 Ah LiFePo running the 1000 watt pure sine inverter, this setup is solely charged by the sun, it charges my ebike battery (600 watt charger), 600 watt microwave, induction hotplate (set to half power works great 900 watts), 12v freezer, 12V TV & blu ray player, cell & wifi boosters, high power laptop. I have 915 Watts of panels charging this system plus another 160 watt portable if needed. This battery is located within the cabin which I generally keep at least to 50°F. If I do ever encounter a time when the battery will be exposed to freezing temps, I can set the solar controller to off until I warm up the battery (cabin). This system is generally fully charged by 10am in the wintertime.
I have actually found that the single drop in 100 Ah LiFePo battery is enough for my needs, I just do all the high power stuff during the day where the solar is actually powering the inverter not the battery. It took me about a month to get the bulk/absorb/float settings right to maintain the battery charge just right, the controller (Victron) I use allows for adjustment to the 0.01 volt, which I found is needed for getting LiFePo just right as the difference between 20% full and 80% full is very small in volts. If anyone needs more detail on that I can post another time.
I would love to have a 2nd LiFePo just as convenience, but do not need it.
One BIG advantage I found from the LiFePo over the lead acid is the standing and loaded voltages are higher, much less sag under heavy loads, higher voltages under heavy loads means less amps being used (Watts = Volts x Amps). This allows my inverter to put out more power before tripping (I have ran it continuously at 1100 watts before) and the battery seems to drain much less quickly like a Lead Acid under heavy loads.
Now after all of that, I am very happy with lithium, but it is not ready for the average person yet, I had to carefully monitor and tweak the voltages every day to get it right. If you are a bit of an electronics geek it will work for you.
BTW my entire solar/LiFePo setup cost about $3000, my rig $3800, and another $1200 in accessories, so about $8000 (into the 5th wheel) I have the perfect rig for me with all conveniences of home. As has said by several other people, with solar get as much as you can afford the first time, it improves your quality of life a lot. #1 is the ability to microwave ramen on demand
Yes, this type of DIY setup using proven OTS components that suit your specific needs is IMO the way to get good value for money.Itripper said:
The all-in-one light and portable powerpacks sold commercially
the main subject of this thread
are a good choice only for people that have very light AH per day needs,
understand the hard data about their real-life usage,
and are willing to pay a lot of extra money for the packaged convenience.
Unfortunately too many people think the slick-marketing vendor can somehow fit a lot of stored power into a little box they'll be able to slide into a bag and recharge while sitting in Starbucks for an hour.
Such a system is in fact possible with say a 60lb backpack, but it's a DIY project, not available as an all-in-one product.
And the charging amp rate may blow the fuse at the coffee shop - awkward!
ltripper, what battery is your drop-in?
Everwin, doesn't seem to be available at the moment?
Please track cycle lifetime if you can.
I've heard good things about Battle Born for drop-in.
I don't see how anyone can sell these as automotive, if the internal BMS isolates while the alt is pumping amps kablouey there goes the diode pack…
Please track cycle lifetime if you can.
I've heard good things about Battle Born for drop-in.
I don't see how anyone can sell these as automotive, if the internal BMS isolates while the alt is pumping amps kablouey there goes the diode pack…
Back to the little powerpacks that give maybe ~20AH in a box costing hundreds:
Nowhere near good value for most people's needs.
For apples to apples, AH at 12V usage is the best way to compare.
"Smaller" systems, might as well use a jumpstarter powerpack if all you need is to supplement your screen device's battery. These things are often not enough for a fan and lights for 24 hours.
A pair of Deka at well under $1/AH is the touchstone.
Biggest Achilles' heel is LiPo or NMC chemistry, maybe 300-500 cycles, less if allowed to fully deplete. Replaceable batts readily available at reasonable prices from a variety of third party sources would help
But as long as there's enough of a market out there of clueless buyers why would the manufacturer do that?
Putting a unit together yourself in a Pelican style box, picking the combination of batteries, mains charger, SC, inverter, ports and meter that suits *your* needs
will be much better value and last longer.
Nowhere near good value for most people's needs.
For apples to apples, AH at 12V usage is the best way to compare.
"Smaller" systems, might as well use a jumpstarter powerpack if all you need is to supplement your screen device's battery. These things are often not enough for a fan and lights for 24 hours.
A pair of Deka at well under $1/AH is the touchstone.
Biggest Achilles' heel is LiPo or NMC chemistry, maybe 300-500 cycles, less if allowed to fully deplete. Replaceable batts readily available at reasonable prices from a variety of third party sources would help
But as long as there's enough of a market out there of clueless buyers why would the manufacturer do that?
Putting a unit together yourself in a Pelican style box, picking the combination of batteries, mains charger, SC, inverter, ports and meter that suits *your* needs
will be much better value and last longer.
AsphaltGypsy
Active member
all of this talk about batteries, ah, electricity, amps, panels, monitors, etc....i get that it all becomes "free" energy after installing it, etc....but then you have to monitor all that, replace parts, move panels around, etc....
Soooooo much to take in. too much actually. When it comes to this stuff i feel very inadequate!
will all that whining being said....
for those of us, (basically ME), if i am living out of my car, (KIA Soul), would not something like a Suaoki 150 wh solar generator work for me? it looks very easy to set up, (plug in ready) and well worth the $140 for the stress free and i do mean stress free for me use of being able to charge my laptop, phone, tablet, and anything i would use on the plug in outlet.
I also get that a lot of this stuff is hit and miss and what works for you, yada yada, but try to see it through my eyes please. My ineptitude for anything electric demands that i find something that is "ready" to go and requires the barest minimum of knowledge to work.
what say ya'll?
AG
Soooooo much to take in. too much actually. When it comes to this stuff i feel very inadequate!
will all that whining being said....
for those of us, (basically ME), if i am living out of my car, (KIA Soul), would not something like a Suaoki 150 wh solar generator work for me? it looks very easy to set up, (plug in ready) and well worth the $140 for the stress free and i do mean stress free for me use of being able to charge my laptop, phone, tablet, and anything i would use on the plug in outlet.
I also get that a lot of this stuff is hit and miss and what works for you, yada yada, but try to see it through my eyes please. My ineptitude for anything electric demands that i find something that is "ready" to go and requires the barest minimum of knowledge to work.
what say ya'll?
AG
