Ultra-Capacity Lithium Batteries
- Thread starter RVTravel
- Start date
Help Support Van Living Forum:
Yes, the key is where does the power come from every day? that battery's just intermediate storage.
Actually, if you use that G word we'll assume you have solar **panels**.
Enough of those and nice weather you'll be fine.
Or a fair bit of driving daily, or a little genny.
The included mains charger takes nearly overnight. Experimentation is required how to speed that up, in theory an hour in a coffee shop could do it.
Actually, if you use that G word we'll assume you have solar **panels**.
Enough of those and nice weather you'll be fine.
Or a fair bit of driving daily, or a little genny.
The included mains charger takes nearly overnight. Experimentation is required how to speed that up, in theory an hour in a coffee shop could do it.
AsphaltGypsy
Active member
RVTravel said:
ty for the reply...but what does that mean? "recharge rate"
=)
AsphaltGypsy
Active member
John61CT said:
ty John for the reply,....when you say that battery's just intermediate storage...are you referring to my car battery? if so, would i just plug this up when i am driving and recharge it that way?
not sure what you mean by "if you use the G word we'll assume you have solar "panels"...i have no solar panels. i have nothing except a car battery that i am hoping can provide what i need since i will be living out of the car. what is a "little genny"?
AG =)
Charging rate is amps, higher means shorter time required.
All the loads you mention are devices with batts need recharging. You're talking about charging one big one in order to do the little ones.
Yes some sort of connection to your car charge circuit while driving should work, but research needed for details.
Gennie = generator, real meaning is fueled, spin, make a noise. These powerpacks just store energy, don't produce any.
All the loads you mention are devices with batts need recharging. You're talking about charging one big one in order to do the little ones.
Yes some sort of connection to your car charge circuit while driving should work, but research needed for details.
Gennie = generator, real meaning is fueled, spin, make a noise. These powerpacks just store energy, don't produce any.
For the 150 wh suaoki, a 60 watt light bulb (or other load) would run for a little over 2 hours before it is drained. To get the suaoki lithium battery charged back up will take 8 hours on a wall socket (probably fastest) and probably longer on 12 volts. As long as you are okay with that, it is worth trying.
jonyjoe303
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 18, 2017
- Messages
- 689
- Reaction score
- 94
suaoki 150 from my reading of the website is a 11.1 volt 13.5 ah batterypack. Thats not a bad deal for 150, compared to a goal zero 400 which is an 11.1 volt 38ah powerpack but cost 700 dollars.
13.5 ah will last a while, but the 8 hour charge rate will be horrendous. But you can't hurry the small lithium powerpacks. They all require slow charge rates. At high charge rates the battery will reach 12.6 volts too quickly and stop charging, never giving the unit a full charge.
I like lithium because what you see is what you get. You always going to get the 13.5 ah, whether you charge it all the time or leave it at 100 percent or 0 percent for several days or weeks. They are very forgiving. The only thing that could be better would be if it had an actual percentage reading instead of just indicator light but for 150 dollars they had to save costs in some areas.
For a small car the small size of the unit will be handy. It has better capacity then those cheaper but larger/heavier 18ah (lead acid) jumpers. 18 ah lead acid has actual capacity of only 9 ah.
The smallest lithium batterypack I have is 33ah but sometimes I could see the uses for something smaller that I can just throw in a backpack and take it with me.
13.5 ah will last a while, but the 8 hour charge rate will be horrendous. But you can't hurry the small lithium powerpacks. They all require slow charge rates. At high charge rates the battery will reach 12.6 volts too quickly and stop charging, never giving the unit a full charge.
I like lithium because what you see is what you get. You always going to get the 13.5 ah, whether you charge it all the time or leave it at 100 percent or 0 percent for several days or weeks. They are very forgiving. The only thing that could be better would be if it had an actual percentage reading instead of just indicator light but for 150 dollars they had to save costs in some areas.
For a small car the small size of the unit will be handy. It has better capacity then those cheaper but larger/heavier 18ah (lead acid) jumpers. 18 ah lead acid has actual capacity of only 9 ah.
The smallest lithium batterypack I have is 33ah but sometimes I could see the uses for something smaller that I can just throw in a backpack and take it with me.
- Joined
- Dec 12, 2010
- Messages
- 7,706
- Reaction score
- 56
I’ve never done this before, but I’m going to start now. I’ve said this too many times, now I’m going to start taking actions.
If you don’t have the time/patience/ability to answer simple solar questions in a simple, complete way DO NOT ANSWER THEM. I’m not blaming you, it just isn’t a skill set you have, you have many other great skills. Use your skills where they help others, not where they hurt others.
I deleted 2 posts that were all technically correct but were just 100% gibberish to anybody who wasn’t an expert in solar.
If you don’t have the time/patience/ability to answer simple solar questions in a simple, complete way DO NOT ANSWER THEM. I’m not blaming you, it just isn’t a skill set you have, you have many other great skills. Use your skills where they help others, not where they hurt others.
I deleted 2 posts that were all technically correct but were just 100% gibberish to anybody who wasn’t an expert in solar.
- Joined
- Dec 12, 2010
- Messages
- 7,706
- Reaction score
- 56
AsphaltGypsy, there are two questions you have to answer about electricity if you are going to live in a car:
1) How will I get or create electricity?
2) How will I store that electricity so I can use it?
The so-called solar “generators” use that word that makes you think they creat electricity, but they do not. They do not create any at all. They are just a battery storage device with a deceptive name. Once you’ve drained it once, you have to find your own way to recharge it.
That’s the all-important question, how will you create electricity and put it into your battery for later use? A solar generator lies, it doesn’t create electricity.
Here is how you can create electricity:
1) Charge from the alternator while your car is driving. This is an excellent system, we recommend you do this!! But, what happens if you don’t drive much? You run out of electricity.
2) Solar panels. This is an even better system, free power from the sun forever!! But what about when it rains a lot and you don’t see the sun? You run out of electricity.
3) Carry a generator and run it to craft electricity. Excellent system! But, it burns gas, you have to carry gas in the car, you have to change oil, you have to repair it, you have to listen to it drone on and on.
4) Carry your “generator” into a place where you can plug it in (like Starbucks) and stay there for 8 hours while it recharges. This strikes me as a terrible idea that isn’t at all practical.
The best way is with a combination of 1 and 2 above (charging from the car and from solar) each will cover the others weaknesses. If you can afford it, add a generator and you are all set, all bases covered!!
Then you have to get a battery to save that power. That’s where the (not a real) “solar generator” comes in. But it’s really just a small, expensive batttery and you would be better off with a real battery for less money.
We what we are telling you is to ask the important question first, how will you create electricity, and once you answer that adding a battery storage is easy.
I recommend a $200, 120-watt folding suitcase solar panel from Amazon, and a $120 battery from walmart, batteries plus bulbs or Sams Club.
And you’re good to go.
Check out this video, it offers a much lower cost option for car dwellers with very simple needs:
1) How will I get or create electricity?
2) How will I store that electricity so I can use it?
The so-called solar “generators” use that word that makes you think they creat electricity, but they do not. They do not create any at all. They are just a battery storage device with a deceptive name. Once you’ve drained it once, you have to find your own way to recharge it.
That’s the all-important question, how will you create electricity and put it into your battery for later use? A solar generator lies, it doesn’t create electricity.
Here is how you can create electricity:
1) Charge from the alternator while your car is driving. This is an excellent system, we recommend you do this!! But, what happens if you don’t drive much? You run out of electricity.
2) Solar panels. This is an even better system, free power from the sun forever!! But what about when it rains a lot and you don’t see the sun? You run out of electricity.
3) Carry a generator and run it to craft electricity. Excellent system! But, it burns gas, you have to carry gas in the car, you have to change oil, you have to repair it, you have to listen to it drone on and on.
4) Carry your “generator” into a place where you can plug it in (like Starbucks) and stay there for 8 hours while it recharges. This strikes me as a terrible idea that isn’t at all practical.
The best way is with a combination of 1 and 2 above (charging from the car and from solar) each will cover the others weaknesses. If you can afford it, add a generator and you are all set, all bases covered!!
Then you have to get a battery to save that power. That’s where the (not a real) “solar generator” comes in. But it’s really just a small, expensive batttery and you would be better off with a real battery for less money.
We what we are telling you is to ask the important question first, how will you create electricity, and once you answer that adding a battery storage is easy.
I recommend a $200, 120-watt folding suitcase solar panel from Amazon, and a $120 battery from walmart, batteries plus bulbs or Sams Club.
And you’re good to go.
Check out this video, it offers a much lower cost option for car dwellers with very simple needs:
Headache
Well-known member
akrvbob said:
A small one like the Poweradd that I have takes less than 3 hours but Bob is making very valid and important points. Using these types of power storage are an expensive and inefficient way to have available power.
Think about it this way; you are buying and using a battery in a cool looking box, to store power you got from another battery(if it's your car you charged from), to charge other batteries. That doesn't even make sense to do!
Mathematically it makes no sense either.
I have no idea how long it takes for the videos to be edited but Bob and Jim in Denver did a seminar at the RTR about these. Mine is on display on the table.
It was very convenient in an urban area but out here it is much more cost effective and efficient to set up a small solar system than to use these boxes.
AsphaltGypsy
Active member
akrvbob said:
Thank you so much for the easy to understand information. I went to your posted video and have decided to go with the solar panels and battery storage pack all for under $90. I believe this will suffice till i can get a better understanding on the whole solar power concept and a larger vehicle down the road. I hope to be able to attend the next RTR or hook up with some of the "tribe" from here to get help on that when needed. I am going to do a trial run with everything down to SoCal to see my son, once i get the "built bed" in my car within the next couple of weeks.
Just one more thing, for a lot of us that come to this forum, it is a tremendous help/advantage to have all this knowledge/experience readily available! I just wanted you to know that if you started this in the beginning with the idea of helping others, you have more than reached/surpassed your goal! I for one absolutely love this site! I hope to be able to interact/use it for along time to come.
Thank you so much to you and to everyone who helps "us" out~! We couldn't do it without ya'll.
AG
I'm with Bob on this.
Except I would say I consider it criminal that these various companies call a small-battery-with-an-inverter-packed-in-a-fancy-cheap-case a "generator". They generate nothing but profit for those companies.
Except I would say I consider it criminal that these various companies call a small-battery-with-an-inverter-packed-in-a-fancy-cheap-case a "generator". They generate nothing but profit for those companies.
EWT is the battery manufacturer, I recently ordered another one from the manufacturer direct via Alibaba, they sell the 100 AH lithium shipped for under $500. I noticed Renogy is now selling what appears to be the identical battery just rebadged for $1000 now. The company is www.ewtbattery.com. I ordered a 2nd lithium from that company and is right now on its way via FedEx.John61CT said:
Also Victron updated their solar controller software to now let you program it to stop charging at a specified temperature which is great for lithiums, I have mine set to stop charging when it drops to 35 degrees.
So far my EWT lithium has been performing well, I did however have to bump up the Bulk and float voltages to higher than expected to actually get full capacity out of the battery (14.20 and 13.40 when being heavily used)
BTW I don't think the company likes sending a single battery out, they marked mine as a "sample".
Itripper said:
Interesting - I'll be interested in the long-term experience, which I suspect will be good.
For what it's worth, my experience with Chinese manufacturers has been that they likely were thinking to help their customer avoid import duties by marking the shipment as a "sample" - implying that there wasn't an underlying transaction involved or that it was for research/testing purposes as a precursor to more significant orders. I wouldn't worry about their not liking a single unit order - if they didn't like it, they wouldn't have transacted with you!
Peterson
Kodiak owner, about limited energy storage, aircon example https://vanlivingforum.com/showthread.php?pid=385169#pid385169
ISAWHIM
Member
The best storage capacity for power is Lithium batteries, but that is a vague answer. There are two styles of Lithium storage designs, fast-drain low-capacity and slow-drain high-capacity. There is honestly no in-between, in design. For "living" and "solar storage", you DO NOT WANT the ones with high-capacity, as they are all low-drain designs. (Lower amps and peaks, because higher will make them explode and catch fire.)
There is a standard battery that almost every professional and consumer device sort-of depends on, for these high-drain storage. They are called, 18650 batteries. That is what is in almost every laptop battery and electric vehicle and all the new "power walls" and "portable solar generators". Though, most portable solar generators are nothing more than a single laptop battery with about 2-4 hours of modest power in them.
All Tesla power-banks use nothing more than a bunch of 18650 batteries. Every single one of them.
There is no real "ultra capacity"... If they are the "high capacity", with the low discharge rates, it will only be good for powering phones and small USB things, or led-lights... etc... If it is powering something like a fridge or a high-amp device, then it is just marketing hype for the standard lithium batteries, which they may have used to replace the old versions of lithium batteries. EG, they finally started using 18650's in stead of cheap LiPo plastic-bag batteries, or they stopped using SLA's. (Often found in UPS devices and cheap solar "generators".)
There is a standard battery that almost every professional and consumer device sort-of depends on, for these high-drain storage. They are called, 18650 batteries. That is what is in almost every laptop battery and electric vehicle and all the new "power walls" and "portable solar generators". Though, most portable solar generators are nothing more than a single laptop battery with about 2-4 hours of modest power in them.
All Tesla power-banks use nothing more than a bunch of 18650 batteries. Every single one of them.
There is no real "ultra capacity"... If they are the "high capacity", with the low discharge rates, it will only be good for powering phones and small USB things, or led-lights... etc... If it is powering something like a fridge or a high-amp device, then it is just marketing hype for the standard lithium batteries, which they may have used to replace the old versions of lithium batteries. EG, they finally started using 18650's in stead of cheap LiPo plastic-bag batteries, or they stopped using SLA's. (Often found in UPS devices and cheap solar "generators".)
LFP is the only lithium chemistry safe and long-lived enough to be worth considering for mobile House bank usage.ISAWHIM said:
That is why no EV packs are worth messing around with for that use case.
> There is no real "ultra capacity"
Compared to the ones you can slip in your pocket, even a portable 40AH unit can be called Ultra. That is the meaning used here.
Real House banks for dwellers are not going to be human-portable for most members here.
Yes, LiFePO4 should be the only battery used in your rig. The 18650s are considerably more dangerous as far as fire danger; I charge my ebike batteries outside or in a big metal pot in case the catch on fire, many ebikers with high power packs do this.
Yes considering since I want to be on BLM land/disperse camping and house battery will not last. I like the ones that can be charged while driving, and compact panels. Small space so need to pack well.
I have looked at Goal Zero, Suoaki and others, just wanted to know what others thought that are already on road, I have FHU till fall.
Thank you
I have looked at Goal Zero, Suoaki and others, just wanted to know what others thought that are already on road, I have FHU till fall.
Thank you
