Time to start Buying Stuff

[Matt71]

Ok, so we started off planning to buy a high-top cargo van, but people were telling me I needed to go bigger if my wife and I both needed to live out of it for a year. So we started considering shuttle busses, but my wife insist on it having a co-pilot seat which means finding an affordable shuttle bus in good shape is more difficult.

Now here we are ready to buy something and one of our day-to-day cars is on its way out, so we're thinking buying a shuttle bus might not be the most economical way to get back and forth to work for the next 8 months before we're on the road. So we're reconsidering buying a van and a 6 x 12 trailer instead. That way we have the space we need and the convenience of a reasonable sized vehicle. 

What's a good plan of action for two-people living out of a cargo van and a 6x12 trailer?
What size van will be need? Will an E-250 be enough to tow the trailer?
Which should we set up to sleep in?
Which should we add our solar set-up to?
Should we live out of both or live out of one and use the other for storage?

Should be consider getting something other than a van, like a hybrid SUV that gets better gas milage than a van, but can still tow a trailer? Or will we regret losing the openness of a van?

Any opinions are welcome

,Matt & Janet

 

[Almost There]

You  probably don't need a full 6 x 12 cargo trailer, even with 2 people and all their stuff!

I have a 6 x 10 and I can tell you that it has more than enough room for anything you'd like to bring with you. Heck, I'm planning on using mine for moving all my worldly goods across the continent when the time comes.

It's impossible to tell whether an E250 will tow the trailer unless you know something about the specific van because depending on the year, size of engine and drive train, the towing capacity varies greatly. It will also depend on the trailer you buy, they vary greatly in how well they tow, tongue weight and of course how much stuff you cram in there!

If you really don't think you can minimize your 'stuff' enough so that both of you fit in a full size cargo van then have something to tow is definitely the way to go.

You might start with writing down exactly what it is that you want to take with you and how much space it takes up and what it weighs. Don't forget to include whatever you're going to pack it in.

Two sleeping in a van means definitely that the bed will have to take up much of the rear of the van leaving precious little room for storage except for under the bed which can be awkward to access. This will leave you room enough for a porta potti and a small clothing closet as well as whatever storage you have in the upper section of the van if you get a high top. How much room will depend on what high top you end up with.

Everything else will have to go somewhere else!

Personally I wouldn't go with an SUV, tow capacity is limited which limits how much stuff you can carry and you'd have to be packing most of it in the SUV so that you have living space in the trailer.

 

[masterplumber]

I can only speak from my and my wife's experience. I can tell you we've owned several different "campers" over the years - everything from a class C to travel trailers, to pickup campers. Our 6x12 v nose cargo trailer is the most comfortable and best laid out by far, and it is the smallest with the exception of my old beloved 4 wheel popup camper. We definitely don't get in each others way as much, and with the bed long ways we don't have to crawl over each other to get out and take care of business (crawling over each other may be romantic at times, but not when you need to go, now!) our trailer only weighs 3000 lbs loaded, but some do weigh a little more. Still, even if it were 4000 lbs most any larger SUV would pull it. I would still go with a van though. That way you have room for all your stuff - think of it as your rolling closet/storage shed. I pull mine with a full size diesel truck because I carry all my tools all the time.When I hook up the trailer it doesn't even notice it, and my mileage doesn't change either. The only draw back is if you're not comfortable towing. I tow trailers probably 10,000 to 12,000 miles per year, so it doesn't bother me, and like most things in life, the more you do it, the more comfortable it becomes. Personally, I think it's a great plan.

 

[akrvbob]

I also think it's a great plan!! But, since it's the plan I went with I may be biased!!

I would for sure go with the 6x12! Here are my first thoughts but of course that;s all they are, they may be terrible for you guys!

Since you are going to be carrying a big printer and lots of photo gear, I'd think about making the trailer the bedroom and office/den/rec room. Make the van the kitchen/bathroom so you can cook and go the bathroom while you are driving. It would also give you seperate areas for when you need privacy, and that's one thing couples in a van often miss. You can go and work in the trailer while she is in the van cooking or reading or working on crafts (crotchet, right). That way you aren't in each others faces all the time.

If the trailer is the office, put the solar on it with the big battery bank and put one battery in the van and charge it off the alternator.

That's just one idea--the bottom line is you will have so much room that you can make it exactly what will work great for you guys!!
Bob

 

[Matt71]

I also think it's a great plan!! But, since it's the plan I went with I may be biased!!

I would for sure go with the 6x12! Here are my first thoughts but of course that;s all they are, they may be terrible for you guys!

Since you are going to be carrying a big printer and lots of photo gear, I'd think about making the trailer the bedroom and office/den/rec room. Make the van the kitchen/bathroom so you can cook and go the bathroom while you are driving. It would also give you seperate areas for when you need privacy, and that's one thing couples in a van often miss. You can go and work in the trailer while she is in the van cooking or reading or working on crafts (crotchet, right). That way you aren't in each others faces all the time.

If the trailer is the office, put the solar on it with the big battery bank and put one battery in the van and charge it off the alternator.

That's just one idea--the bottom line is you will have so much room that you can make it exactly what will work great for you guys!!
Bob

That was exactly what I was thinking.
I was also thinking that having all of the food in the van would mean we'd always have food with us when we're doing the tourist thing while leaving the trailer at our camp site.

And on the subject to the battery bank, I noticed last night that the T105 batteries on Amazon have doubled in price since I checked them last.  For the price of 4 225Ah 6V batteries I can now get 3 125Ah 12V AGM batteries and not have to worry about venting. I think I might be able to get 6 170Ah 6V batteries from Costco for less though/ I will have to double check on those.

Going to check out some trailers at a local RV dealer tomorrow. I like the Titan Stealth Wedge trailers and they're under $3000 brad new.

 

[Matt71]

THIS is what we're looking at getting

Anyone know what the actual inside dimensions are?
Does the 6x12 include the wedge part?
It says the height is 6', but I'm not sure if that is ceiling height or roof height.

Also, is the Pewter finish andy different than the white finish for keeping the heat out?

 

[masterplumber]

My 6x12 measures 69 1/2 inches inside with 1/4'' paneling. the weird measurement is it's about 11'8'' to the start of the V. The V or wedge on mine is 3', but those vary from trailer to trailer. I've seen 1' deep ones, and 5' deep ones, and everything in between. Generally from what I've seen is the trailer called out measurements are the outside of the walls. So a 6' wide is 6' on the outside. The 6' tall is also the height of the walls, so it depends upon the shape of the ceiling. With mine it has an arched ceiling, so it's 6'4'' in the center. If it were flat roofed it would be less than 6' tall inside due to the plywood floor and the ceiling framing. I think the only way to tell if a given trailer is tall enough, is to stand inside of us. If your buying new most manufactures will make the walls taller in 6'' increments, for a fee of course.

 

[Matt71]

The one we're looking at is a flat top, but as long as it's more than 5' 8" we'll be good - we're short.
I did some looking and I think the wedge on the Stealth Titan SE is 24" on the 6' wide versions and 30" on the 7' wide versions.

 

[Matt71]

We went to the RV dealer the other day to look at some trailers and were pretty pleased with what we'd be able to do with one. We are leaning towards getting a 7'x14' trailer instead of the 6x12. The dealer pointed out that the 14' models have the double axle which means less wobble if there are two people inside on opposite ends. The 14' models also have breaks which he advised is the safest bet for a long trip.

They will also do a lot of the alterations for us, like adding a window. I'm really leary of cutting into the outside of the trailer, so I think it'll be work the couple hundred bucks to have them do it.

 

[Bdog1]

My first one I took out the side cargo door and installed an RV door. That also required a step well. The next one I got smart and special ordered it that way.

Windows arn't too bad. Add square tube to frame it out and cut the skin last.

 

[akrvbob]

I bought my trailer from these guys and I'm very happy with it.
http://www.trailersplus.com/

A friend bought an 8x18 and he had them insulate it, add windows, a ladder rack for his 500 watts of solar and vents and it was $10,000. I just say that to give you a comparison. If they are nearby, I'd take in your quote and see if they won't beat it. They do give a cash discount. Here is a post on my friends man cave:
http://www.cheaprvliving.com/blog/cargo-trailer-man-cave-2/

Bob

 

[masterplumber]

Brakes shouldn't even be a second thought, even if you go single axle I'd order them with the trailer. Tandem axles do tow nicer, but are heavier, just a matter of what's the highest priority. The 7x14 will give you more room, and the bed can be sideways if you want. But it will be harder to see around if you're not used to towing. Not nearly as bad as an 8' wide though. My last work trailer was a 7x14 tandem axle, and now that I'm back to being self employed I sure wish I hadn't sold it. since you're starting to narrow your choices down, I would get out the blue tape and start laying out some different sizes on the living room floor, and then tape out the major things like bed and stuff and see which size seems to fit the best. If you have a good dealer that knows he's going to get a sale, maybe go there with the tape and actually tape out bed etc... in a couple trailer.
Windows aren't difficult at all, but if you're not comfortable then it's definitely worth ordering them already done, and it will save you time on you build. I would have done that if I had bought new.

 

[Canine]

Having towed trailers for years, I'd go for slightly longer and narrower in lieu of wider and shorter. (Maybe I'm just thinking that I'd like to be longer and narrower instead of like I am, wide and short...)

It does make seeing behind a lot easier and you don't have to have huge mirrors or extensions to check backwards. Course nowadays you can get a wireless back up or rear view camera...

Do follow others advice on laying everything out, getting the double axle and brakes and maybe a tad over 72 inches as you are probably going to want to insulate both the floor and the ceiling...watch what kind of trailer axles, what capacity, what kind of rims (capacity, 14, 15 or 16 inch). Most trailers are 15 inch with ST tires which are specially made for trailers, like handling the scrubbing when twin axles turn corners. They all are speed rated though so don't fly down the road. Have them cut in your windows, vent and a side entry door if it doesn't have one. They will also wire it.

What else... I thought you are making a good decision to use a van and trailer. You can park the trailer in your spot and still get around... Lots more tires to care for though and hard to park unless a large area. When you go to gas up you'll need to plan your exit swing. A lot of people pull in just fine then they have trouble getting out due to the layout of the pumps or getting boxed in...

What about a box van?

Let us know!

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

The 14' models also have breaks which he advised is the safest bet for a long trip.

It ain't just that they're safer, brakes are legally REQUIRED in a lot of states on any trailer over a certain weight - this tends to vary, 3,000 lbs in some states, 2,000 lbs in others.

BTW, do some research on trailer tires.  It seems like damn near all of them come from China these days, and the vast majority are crap.  I've seen them referred to as "China Bombs" in the mainstream rv forums.

From what I can tell, a brand called Maxxis is currently highly thought of.

Regards
John

Here you go http://www.towshop.com/trailer_supplemental_braking_laws.htm

 

[Matt71]

These are the 7' x 14' models we're looking at

2013 Stealth Titan SE 714 
This one is $3795 and has a 30" Flat Top Wedge which will give us a little extra space, but we'll have to add a ceiling vent while the others already have one.

2015 Stealth Titan SE 714
This one is $4495 has a vent, but no wedge

We'll probably go with the 2013 just for the price and have them install a Fantasticvent, but we're open to outside input.

 

[masterplumber]

I would definitely go for the 2013. I would go in with cash and start at $3000. You might not get it quite that cheap, but it looks new so they've been sitting on it a while. The roof vent is already framed in - the picture of the ceiling framing is what they are showing. So it really wouldn't be difficult to install your own if you wanted to save that cost. Ah, nothing like a blank slate to start the creative juices flowing! BTW, besides the little bit of extra interior room, I've noticed my V nose tows easier than when I used to borrow my buddy's same size trailer without a V. No scientific data, but I think they cut through the wind better even behind a bulky tow vehicle. I know you've put a ton of time into figuring out your needs - it will be interesting to see what you do with it.

 

[akrvbob]

I'm with Masterplumber, that seems like a really good deal to me! Man, I could live like a king in there

Get a 1 ton van with a big engine, that baby is going to be heavy by the time you are done. I don't see a weight for the trailer, I'd be curious to know what it was.
Bob

 

[SoulRaven]

I have a few questions. Is the stated size the box size or overall size? Is the wedge counted into the length dimension?

 

[Matt71]

It has 3500# Drop Spring Axles
7000# GVWR

The dimensions are for the outside of the walls.
The wedge is not counted in the 14'

 

[offroad]

Watching your plans closely. Modeling for a couples needs is very different than a single person.

The one ton van to pull (aka 350 aka 3500) engine van is the largest size gasoline powered engine sized van. Very wise to consider that. Those size vehicles are much more competitive-available to buy. At least with my shopping on eBay and autottader.

Your double axle trailer choice is also inherently safer. You will eventually want wheels and tires that use a standard vehicle tire for less expensive support.