Skyrocketing fuel costs have van lifers concerned. Here are 5 reasons why this may be the BEST thing to happen to your van life dream.

[John in Montreal]

Gas prices are rigged by collusion between the oil companies.

 

[gizmotron]

Gas prices are rigged by collusion between the oil companies.

There is enough contradictory evidence to prove otherwise. But proving it would not be nice. So I support your life experience here in the very safe to be a nomad space. It's best to think about your mantra and dwell in a state of happy bliss. I know this first hand because I do this every day. It works perfectly. You see I act as my own moderator when I see or hear opinions that only look nice. I always remember the great words of Frank Burns from the TV show M*A*S*H; "It's nice to be nice to the nice." Now see how it works. You can project all you want on the oil companies and it acts as a release. In fact you can do that for everything. It's the very best way to stay in a condition of blissful happiness. Have a nice day.

 

[John in Montreal]

Gasoline futures contracts are trading at around $3.25 a gallon. But most of the oil we consume is bought and sold privately. It is never offered for sale on the commodities exchange. Which limits supply and makes this pricing system fraudulent.

 

[John in Montreal]

Suppose I have a building with 10 vacant apartments. So I invite potential tenants to bid in an auction. The highest bidder offers $2000 a month and gets an apartment. Then I list all the other apartments at that same price.

Oil and gasoline futures works the same way. China imports most of their oil via private agreements they make with producer states. They buy a little bit on the commodities exchange where surpluses are sold back and forth. But oil companies engage in collusion to price all of their gasoline at the futures price.

 

[gizmotron]

Yes, the principle of supply and demand is indeed unfair. The people that run things should step in and give us everything that we need. I know that would feel good. Feeling good is what I'm all about. In fact the oil companies are nice. Everyone is nice. It's nice how informed you are. Thanks for telling us.

 

[John in Montreal]

Yes, the principle of supply and demand is indeed unfair. The people that run things should step in and give us everything that we need. I know that would feel good. Feeling good is what I'm all about. In fact the oil companies are nice. Everyone is nice. It's nice how informed you are. Thanks for telling us.

Never said that that's called a straw man. But you said you had contradictory evidence that oil companies do not engage in collusion so let's hear it.

 

[John in Montreal]

the principle of supply and demand doesn't work in this case because the market where oil prices are decreed only handles a small amount of oil.

 

[user 22017]

This article offers three theories for the spike in gasoline prices:

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2022/02/why-gas-got-so-expensive/622887/

 

[gizmotron]

the principle of supply and demand doesn't work in this case because the market where oil prices are decreed only handles a small amount of oil.

The USA changed everything under deregulation and unbridled exploration and fracking. And the price dropped because the supply was local, cheaper, and plentiful. So was the cheaper available oil responsible for the rest of the world that all of a sudden had a surplus of the stuff? The evidence is in a politician that succeeded in winning office with the power to do exactly what he promised he would do in having a war with the oil industry. Now to keep things nice and happy and smile faces around here you can go outside of this forum discussion and find where those promises where made if you want to see it. I suggest that you research the "green new deal" stuff. That's something being presented by very happy people that know what is best for everyone else. The point of discussion here is about the existing rising costs and how it effects van life and the cost increases in traveling. The point is to figure out how to stay in one basic area until these costs come back down. For me that would be warm in winter and cool in summer. People that know why all this is happening are just interested in one of two things. Some want to be informed and right. Others want to know how to vote the next time. Then there are the people that want to change other people's minds. Facts are used by both types of people. But not being happy has a tendency to take discussions off topic. I'm a believer in supply side economics. But it's too deep a topic for people just interested in themselves and how to get by. You must first take care of yourself. This nomad lifestyle is the motivation of two primary causes. One is in doing it to break away from a self imposed expectation that has no end reward. The other is pure economical necessity. People are resilient. They can adjust until it gets to the point of breaking. If the purpose of defeating gas is saving the planet then I can see the suffering and live with it. If the purpose is to exploit others and create a new 1% class then I can see that too. If you want to find the real truth, make sure that you really want to find it. Before the lifestyle of the nomads is going to be accepted widely it must still go through the phase and hardships of not being accepted or understood. I suggest happiness and being nice. No matter what is discussed about gas prices, nobody will change anything.

 

[John in Montreal]

There is a commodities exchange where traders buy and sell futures contracts for oil and gasoline and other byproducts. But most large oil companies produce their own oil, refine it themselves and sell it thru their own branded gas stations. So that product is never offered for sale in the futures markets where the price is negotiated.

 

[Catalyst1]

If you're referring to my post about upcoming food shortages and how one might want to think about that before they become serious and one is out of options, why would you want to silence this idea?

Tiggy, I agree that we don't need to dwell in fear. Personally, I think that in order to save the planet from becoming uninhabitable we need to return to a simpler life. This includes living in close community, growing more of what we eat, using bicycles and horses to get around, spending more time listening to each other and less time playing video games. It means that we recognize at a societal level that driving around in a fancy car or truck and living in a huge house does not signify success. It signifies that you bought into corporate advertising. If we live close to what we eat, we won't need fertilizer from Russia. The animals should provide more than enough, not to mention that we waste human waste by flushing it into our waterways. The faster we make these changes, the faster the earth will return to what it once was--a lush, rich place that had everything we needed to live happily.

 

[gizmotron]

There is a commodities exchange where traders buy and sell futures contracts for oil and gasoline and other byproducts. But most large oil companies produce their own oil, refine it themselves and sell it thru their own branded gas stations. So that product is never offered for sale in the futures markets where the price is negotiated.

We went from being an exporter of oil to being an importer. Everyone knows by now that we in the USA were importing oil from Russia up until last week.

 

[John in Montreal]

Increased USA oil production can bring down the price. But I'm talking about how prices are set. There is a commodities exchange where people buy and sell futures contracts. But most of what we use does not go through that market. So this pricing mechanism is fraudulent.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

There is a commodities exchange where traders buy and sell futures contracts for oil and gasoline and other byproducts. But most large oil companies produce their own oil, refine it themselves and sell it thru their own branded gas stations.

Not true. Refineries sell gas to all brands. In Minnesota almost all gasoline (98%) comes from two refineries in state. They get their oil from Canada (80-90%) and the rest from North Dakota. You can watch the tanker trucks go from one brand to the next delivering gas.

So that product is never offered for sale in the futures markets where the price is negotiated.

All oil contracts are tied to one of three indices:
1. West Texas Intermediate
2. Brent Crude Index
3. OPEC Basket
The contracts fluctuate based on one or more of these.

This includes living in close community, growing more of what we eat, using bicycles and horses to get around,

Spoken by someone who has never grown a lot of what he eats. Or lived in a culture where transportation is slow, cumbersome, and expensive.
Farm kids have always migrated to cities to dull, repetitive jobs in factories because it is easier than farming.

It means that we recognize at a societal level that driving around in a fancy car or truck and living in a huge house does not signify success. It signifies that you bought into corporate advertising.

Sumer, 3000 BC; marker of wealth and status was a big mansion and fancy horses pulling a big chariot. Human nature, has nothing to do with corporate advertising.

 

[user 22017]

Farm kids have always migrated to cities to dull, repetitive jobs in factories because it is easier than farming.
Human nature, has nothing to do with corporate advertising.

I doubt that is the only reason many migrate to the cities. There is more to do in cities. And not everyone wants to farm. Some want to become engineers, computer scientists, nurses, flight attendants, etc.

Re advertising, one job of advertising is to convince people that they need things... that they don't.

 

[John in Montreal]

All oil contracts are tied to one of three indices:
1. West Texas Intermediate
2. Brent Crude Index
3. OPEC Basket
The contracts fluctuate based on one or more of these.

Except oil companies produce their own oil. They don't always buy oil from other producers.

Trading oil futures on the commodities exchange is needed for liquidity. So importers can purchase additional oil on short notice and producers can sell a surplus.

But most of our gasoline comes from vertically organized multinational companies that have their own oil fields, their own tankers, their own refineries and their own branded gas stations and do not need the commodities exchange to bring the bulk of their product to market.

So to say the price of gasoline is determined by supply and demand is dishonest and erroneous. The price of gasoline is set by individual producers and the absence of price competition points to collusion.

 

[Sky]

Suppose I have a building with 10 vacant apartments. So I invite potential tenants to bid in an auction. The highest bidder offers $2000 a month and gets an apartment. Then I list all the other apartments at that same price.

Oil and gasoline futures works the same way. China imports most of their oil via private agreements they make with producer states. They buy a little bit on the commodities exchange where surpluses are sold back and forth. But oil companies engage in collusion to price all of their gasoline at the futures price.

Interesting discussion and I remember pre-covid when demand was reducing that they oil producers actually reduced production.

 

[Sky]

Tell it to skilled craftsman in the construction industry, known for it being "feast or famine." There are so many speculators in the building & housing industry right now that it's almost becoming a bubble. Supply is out supporting demand. I blame the war on fossil fuel for cutting domestic supply. It's nothing but a red herring blaming it on the speculators. The actual amount of barrels of oil produced in America is down and has been from the first day that the new regime took office. Speculators know what short supply means. You can try to show me I'm being dishonest. Just saying it does not make it so. The truth is that production is down because it's the wish of the government right now. The market reaction is after the fact. Watch how a building industry bubble will cave in the housing market. So many will be out of work. All that is going to happen is another recession. You add recession to inflation and wide spread unemployment and you have a perfect storm. It's just the kind of crisis that some people in the government pray will come true. I just don't expect the gas market to do any kind of correction any time soon. It's still headed upward as the administration goes begging OPEC, Iran, and Venezuela to sell them more oil since cutting off Russia. So forget it if domestic supply will be allowed to increase. There's too much invested in saving the planet from an inert clear vapor that has very little capability in causing a green house effect. Clouds do way more to cause temperature increases. But clouds don't have a lobby in the stock market. People crack me up.

Interesting discussion and I remember pre-covid when demand was reducing that they oil producers actually reduced production.

I was not professing any great wisdom on the matter here just mentioning an observation. Mans manipulation and greed has been going on for so long I do not even try to enter a pissing contest about it as I am simple and therefore attribute most to just plain, greed.

 

[gizmotron]

Go ahead now, just substitute OIL SOURCES and/or ENVIRONMENTAL HARM for the BLANKET.

It has nothing to do with where the oil comes from. It's all about the price at the pump. It's just not high enough yet to save the planet from a successful hoax. There is no way that carbon dioxide gas will ever cause global warming. If it gets strong enough to do that then we will all be dead from carbon dioxide poisonings. Confirmation bias is the downfall of real scientific research. But I for one love how nice and friendly it is to pretend that junk science is real. There's a mask being worn and demanded for decades in all this. It will be fun to watch people and how nice they will be if they discover it was all a scam. So, the price must go higher.

 

[SusanB]

I'm not in the least bit interested in transferring money from my pocket into yours. LOL

Check this out: https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/03/shell-earnings-q4-2021.html

Additionally, U.S. companies didn’t invest in infrastructure so consequently we don’t produce light, sweet crude for our own factories on the East Coast and then we have to import it.

Compare the $/barrel in the past when prices went up, the prices today are much higher in proportion to the $/barrel.

But we still export to the high paying foreign buyers.