Jumped into the "stealth" van life and am mostly disalusioned

[Patrick46]

Also check out marinas. You woud be suprised how many have RV hookups.

THIS ^^^ is a phoenominal idea...as there are ALOT of marinas in the Bay and surrounding areas. Sausalito, Richmond, South Fran....there are lots of marinas around there, and these are usually pretty quiet places. And don't settle on just one....move around a bit a check out others and find one that fits all your personal criteria.

Do you have a job that keeps you in this specific city?

I DO know what you mean about health clubs being 'germ fests', but shower shoes help ALOT, and here again....check out as many as you reasonably can until you find the one that fits.

An Astro IS a small van...maybe you need something a bit bigger?? Perhaps, one with it's own bathroom...like a small Class B or C RV.

I think a Dolphin would be perfect for you. Good gas economy, fully self contained (with it's own bathroom), a kitchen, a dinette, roomy enough to stand and walk around in, and there'd be enough room for these hobbys of yours too. Plus, it wouldn't cost you an arm or a leg either.


hope this gives you some ideas of what available out there to make your journey more comfortable.

oh....and one other thing.....maybe this 'lifestyle' isn't right for you.(there...I said it!) You just gotta want it bad enough.


Good Luck and All the Best!! (please keep us posted.)

 

[Kevin H]

Jack - I did not see if you are interested in traveling or being somewhat static. If you are OK with being a bit static, check with any rv park or campground. Most are usually looking for what are called "work campers".

These are people living in RVs, vans etc and they work for a nominal number of hours in turn for a space in the park and frequently minimal pay. If you go to a RV park, that guy driving the golf cart escorting you to your site is most likely a work camper spending a few months at that park. Often the ladies working the check in counter are the partners of the guy in the golf cart.

RV parks are great neighborhoods. Everyone has a common interest - their lifestyle. They all understand what your lifestyle is about and many have been, or are, in your situation, whatever that may be. The social opportunities abound to the point that you may find yourself needing less interaction!

We have been living full time in our RV for almost 7 years. We do not have a home base. Our RV is our home. We almost never boondock but we have spent a few nights at Walmart or Home Depot.

RV parks are inherently safe. You almost never hear of any theft and no-one is going to roust you. Nearly all have shower/restrooms. Quality can vary but I can count on one hand those that were below OK.

There is a lot of short term work available for those wanting to do something. As for us, we just finished our second summer working in Yellowstone. We are traveling a bit to visit familly and then will head to southwest Texas to volunteer at a state park for the second time. For work information check into www.workamper.com/‎. This is basically a clearning house of jobs all over the country for transient types like us.

There is no right nor wrong way to this lifestyle. It is so unique that it is understandable that it may take a while for you to find what works for you. The beauty is that if one thing does not work, this lifestyle perfectly lends itself to trying something else.

Good Luck and keep us posted

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

I ran into these same sort of things.

I found opening the van, organising or working on wiring is good to do at the park or at one of those self serve car wash. No one looks twice when you unload stuff at the vacuums. Regular cars are doing the same.

I also hung a sheet like a curtain in the back so if i open the back door for propane or tools under my bed, the bed and interior is hidden from view. People expect to see tools nd bins in cargo vans.

---

Also, it seems silly but my enjoyment went way up when i added a rolling office chair..since i cant stand it made life way easier. Its basically there at the door, and i pivot and scoot all around the van from it. Not sure on your layout but this works with bed in back conversions.

Im also starting to say **** it and relax in my spots more. I used to worry and move all the time but that didnt kerp people from throwing me out, so i just staying all day if i want and let wwhatever happen, happen. I think someone who sees you 3 times a week thinks you are always there anyway.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

Another reason a bigger/cargo van may work better for you is having the space for insulation. When you add 3 or 4 inches of foam insulation its going to reduce the noise you hear from outside. The area I live in is a big city but its not as densely populated as SF. If you could find quieter side streets (away from private residences) to park on it may alleviate some of your concerns of door knocking. Adding the insulation would mean a quieter interior and make street parking more viable... at least to me. You could also drive a short distance away from the busy area of the city to find quieter places to park.

As to cleanliness of gyms etc having a wash basin/sink in your van (again bigger van would be helpful here) might go along way to solving this issue. Heat up water and wash your face/hair in sink and use a washcloth or wet wipes for other areas. Once a week use the gym shower with shower shoes. That might things more tolerable... depending on your personal cleanliness needs.

I also think adding a rolling office chair is a great idea, but you need a big enough van to do it in.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

I second the bigger van thing if you are doing this all the time. My situation for the last six years is that I live in NZ 7 to 8 months and in Canada full time in my Van for 4 to 5 months. I own a van in NZ but also live in a house. My converted van here is a Toyota townace which is roughly the size of an Astro or a little smaller I have owned it for 16 years.. I have been out in it for several weeks at a time and I guess I could live in it full time if I didn't have to work but I don't think I would find it easy even in a moderate climate like NZ. However in my Kurbmaster which has a living space of only 6x10 I could easily and comfortably full time in. the big difference to me is that I can STAND UP in it, sling a hammock, wash and go to the bathroom.

 

[Possum]

Hi Jack Grit, I too had some illusions of easy transitions into living in the van....but, like you and many others here , it was a scary start ! I have been fulltimin' now for the last six month's. Started out parking at wal-mart, which worked ok other than the usual "noise " issues.since I am currently working in the same town I had to stay close.i lucked out and found a person who let's me stay in there extended back yard now until I leave for quartzsite in Dec. I am leaving my current job to find one in the campground industry....ALot more friendly to the van dwelling lifestyle. AS bad as it was starting out, it was/is definitely worth the "learning curve"...I won't go back to sticks/bricks! HANG IN THERE!!!!!

 

[Jack Grit]

“here are a few options. Most good spots are in southern California. Arizona and Nevada. If you have another area where you'd like to go let me know and I'll see if I can come up with something.“
Thanks so much for all the links. I checked them out. Lots of alternatives out there. The area I am most interested in for now ( and likely for quite a while) is the bay area – in specifics the east bay. The north bay as well but I spend less time there.

“Some here will, already are, going to blame you for not falling in line and saying this is the greatest thing since sliced bread.”
What drew me to this site was the honesty I perceived in Bob and in turn others on this forum. I think it would be doing a great disservice to potential newbies to fail to show as many sides as possible to this lifestyle.

“not to sugar coat ones experiences”
Exactly. I realize there are ego's and agendas to deal with as well as the reality that humans don’t particularly like to appear “weak” and most don’t like to appear “negative”. For me it's all about truth and reality. If truth, from all sides about this lifestyle isn’t a part of the forums what's the point?

“...real post... Don't stop, let us know how you are doing.”
Will do.

“Are you aware of the MeetUp groups? The link is to the Bay Area MeetUps. “
Thanks. I will look into these.

“ I did not see if you are interested in traveling or being somewhat static.”
Somewhat static for now but may be more flexible in the future.

“If you are OK with being a bit static, check with any rv park or campground.”
I'll check in my area but I am pretty sure there isn’t anything close to where I want to be geographically.

“The beauty is that if one thing does not work, this lifestyle perfectly lends itself to trying something else”
I agree. That's one reason I chose to give it a shot. It's a bit different from packing all of ones belongings and moving to Rome or North Korea.

“Good Luck and keep us posted. We've got your back!!”
Will do and thanks.

“Also check out marinas. You woud be suprised how many have RV hookups.“
I think this is a great idea. The bay area can be pricy as most of you know. Maybe there are some reasonable spots.

“Dolphin would be perfect for you.”
I love the 22r's. I really like Dolphins. I have owned one for periodic week-end trips. I would have tried another one but it was obviously not the right choice for stealth and what I planned to do here in the bay area.

“I found opening the van, organizing or working on wiring is good to do at the park or at one of those self serve car wash. “
This is an excellent tactic. I will be implementing it.

“I used to worry and move all the time but that didnt kerp people from throwing me out, so i just staying all day if i want and let whatever happen, happen.”
For me it is of little consequence if I get thrown out of a place. The thing that bothers me is the possibility of getting popped by some overzealous cop and eventually banned from a city or county. This happened to an acquaintance of mine and now he is homeless, pulling a cart...it's a real shame to see. The authorities impounded his full size stand up Chevy conversion van. First time was a warning. The 2nd ticket was $500.00. After that they impounded it again and he just gave up.

Unity Gain
Good points.

“However in my Kurbmaster which has a living space of only 6x10 “
My rig came with metal shelves and drawers which cut down space a good bit. I'm still weighing whether I should pull them out for something different but they seem quite functional for this experimental phase.

Thanks again for all the support, ideas and advice. I appreciate it big time.

~J Grit

 

[TheMadTitan]

It's been awhile since I was in the bay area, and checking out google maps I can see how few options there are as far as truck stops go. That does change things quite a bit. Most places, even major cities, have at least a few on the periphery.

As for the metal shelves and drawers I pulled mine and gave them to a friend with a business. You could probably sell them cheap on Craigslist, or you may even be able to trade them to a shop for some free work on your van if they do road service. Mine was from a phone/internet provider, but my friend plans to use them for her pool cleaning business. Lots of people can make use of them, and as I recall they're pretty expensive.

With everything removed we had enough room to put in a full size queen mattress to use temporarily until we get our foam matt and really start the build in earnest. Our racks were vertical and there was a lot of wasted space behind them.

 

[rvwandering]

Jack - sorry, I don't know of any good spots around the east and north bay but if you find any please post them here. Thanks!

 

[Terry]

Good for you. You seem to be well on your way to figuring things out. Well able to accept advice, even when it may not sound like advice. I still have no idea what I'm going to do so I decided to do nothing for now. May change my mind in the next 15 minutes but I have things that keep me from doing anything very quick so I, for the time being, have a safety mechanism to keep me from messing up too bad. Hope you get things working to suit your needs. I know I'll get things figured out someday so there's no real worry that I will meet disaster any time soon.

 

[TALLMAN]

Back in 2000 was single and thinking of RVing full time in a 26 foot holiday rambler, was too lonely.

 

[cerenatee]

Hi, I haven't read all the responses to your post - still in process - but I wanted to post a link to another van-dweller who was having trouble sleeping. His mind was driving him nuts and he made the decision not to worry until he had something to worry about. Here's his post concerning that issue:

http://waynewirs.com/2013/the-stealth-sleeping-situation/

As far as the shower, I use to get dressed 5 days a week after the gym for work and I don't think anyone thought it was weird/strange. I just wore shower shoes and went about my business.

When I'm out of town - I'm not full-time yet - I hang at one of the small parks in the area. I don't know if you can do that but it works great for me. Especially if I park in an out of the way part of the parking lot, away from the playground.

This life teaches us to worry and stress over every little possibility. At some point, I just had to give it to God, do the right thing, and keep it moving. Hope you get more comfortable over time.

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

I started listening to relaxing meditation music while trying to sleep, it gives my brain something calm to focus on than the sounds outside..i suffered bad hypnic jerk (that jerking awake with racing heart) when i was sick and this really helped

 

[Jack Grit]

Some of you asked for an update so here we go. I think living stealth in a small van in the Bay Area is a very hard thing to do. If one has a lot of friends and or family it could help dramatically.

The two biggest issues I had and or have are 1: Unease parking stealth. 2: Not enough room to continue my hobbies 3: Feeling uncomfortable showering/cleaning up at a gym.

As for # 1 I have found two places where I feel very comfortable. They are both with friends and family. Although it is basically on the street in front of their houses, I feel as though I am imposing a bit. I s'pose that goes with the territory, especially with extended periods of time. I try and help with small chores and that helps ease the somewhat guilty feelings I experience. I don't feel as though I can go on “forever” staying in these two spots. What happens after I leave these is anyone’s guess.

2: I found that I am able to continue with a few of my hobbies. I would love to have more space to do the things I do. This is an issue that only a much bigger space would resolve.

3: I am a bit more comfortable doing this but do not like it at all. I am a private person and showering in a public space regularly just isn’t for me. It is what it is and I gotta deal with it. I shower much less often than I did before I made the decision to van dwell. My self image has suffered somewhat because I feel much less presentable to the world. If I were boon-docking I would be fine with the amount of showering I do.

Conclusion. Everyone is different and has different needs. For people with little to no hobbies, no problem with showering in a public gym and no problems with stealth parking in a major metropolitan area, this lifestyle could be perfect. For others it may be problematic.

Any follow-up comments are more than welcome.

J Grit

 

[Lifemagician]

I shower much less often than I did before I made the decision to van dwell. My self image has suffered somewhat because I feel much less presentable to the world.

Daily showers have never been part of my routine. It was not the done thing where I was brought up. Now I find that for those in-between shower days, there are baby wipes. Some are even flushable. I could not travel/live in my van without them. Before going to bed. On waking. On hot sweatty days or after an activity, baby wipes make me feel fresh and clean.

Have you read Bob's book. It is available as an ebook for 'peanuts' (complete with a generic kindle). He tackles this problem in a most practical way.

Lifey

 

[Blue]

Jack, it took me 6 months to "adjust" to life on my own with no family around, I put the quotes around adjust because that twinge of unease never really went away, I just got more used to it.

City dwelling is the hardest especially if your not completely stealthed. That's when you gotta park on the shady side of the tracks and you quickly realize when people who are not living but surviving day by day all around you, if you look like a victim or worse act like a victim you are going to become a victim.
.
Side note: my first night cardwelling: car broke down on Alameda across from LA county jail, mechanic wouldn't open till the next day. Knew union station was bad and just across the freeway. Door locks didn't work in the old Volkswagen thing so before I went to sleep I duct taped a steak knife I had in the back seat to my hand. Sure enough around 3:30 AM I wake up hearing that old door latch pop, I bring the knife up fast, almost stabbing myself with it. An old junkie falls backward away from my door on to the ground thinking I was going to stab him, he's saying "sorry sorry was just lookin for a place to sleep sorry" I knew it was bullshit and told him to get lost. Don't know what I would have done if he had a gun or if he wasn't trying to sneak in but rush me with his own knife or club. And yeah couldent sleep in a car for years after that.(PS learned later 3:00am is when the jail releases inmates and everyone in that area avoids being outdoors when it let's out)

To me that is why it's extremely important to be invisible. I don't want to park in that area and the alternative is risking police harassment and tickets if my van dwelling stealth kung fu is not good. I think that's why boondocking is more common in van dwellers, but then if your going solo the isolation and lonelyness factor creeps up on you. Eventually I found comfort either in the sticks or in the city, most things became predictable if not controllable and now I yearn for that lifestyle again... but its not for everyone in fact I think you need a hint of antisocial personality to feel the freedom is worth the sacrifice... unless you have a dedicated and proven partner to lean on. And maybe its just not worth all the hassle and adjustment for you, maybe you need a different path, only you can decide that though.

 

[akrvbob]

My first 6 years of vandwelling were all in a city so I can totally relate to what you are going through. I hated my first few months of living in a van, and then winter got here and it was one of the coldest we had in a while!!

After awhile vandwelling changed me: as societies stress fell away I relaxed and became delighted with living in a van. I fell so deeply in love with it that I never plan to live in a house again.

I've given that a lot of thought trying to understand what happened and here is what I've concluded:
Every second of our life society teaches and molds us into being something we are not: wage slaves. When you move into a van, you are breaking against all that training and brainwashing and it makes you VERY uncomfortable. You only have two choices to make the discomfort end, give into the change or move out of a van. I gave into the change. Nothing changed on the outside very much, I did kept working at the same job the whole 6 years so on the outside the only thing that changed was where I lived. But on the inside all the unwritten rules of society dropped away one by one.

I can't easily explain that, but let me ask you one question, if you don't smell, and you don't have any obvious dirt on you, what difference does it make if you aren't 100% meticulously clean? There is only one reason you care, society has trained you every minute of your life you must be totally clean at all times just in case you have to go to the hospital.

What would your life be like if you didn't have societies unwritten rules controlling every tiny aspect of your life? If you keep living in your van, you are probably going to find out!

P.S. let me give you a hint, it's wonderful!!
P.S.S let me warn you though, for awhile you are going to feel worse because you are losing your security blanket
Bob

 

[WheelEstate USA]

Howdy Jack, back in Nov you said you've been vandwelling for several months..what's the count now??

At any rate, I gotta tip my hat to ya. I've heard the Bay area ain't a cakewalk.
Shoot, I guess sports, the navy, and nekid parties on the beach sorta left me with no shame when it comes to a shared shower room, LOL (gotta have shower shoes tho). Oh hell, let's face it, doesn't take much for me to shuck my duds anyhoo, LOL.

Seriously, I can see lots of challenges to vandwelling, especially in cities. It is totally doable once ya get over a couple humps tho. I've known several who do or have done city stealth for long periods while working.

On the other side...I certainly have seen that not everyone is ok with the same things. You might find vandwelling more appealing at another point in life when you don't have to make a "public appearance" daily....out on the road.
Whatever makes you happy is the way for you to live it.

Bob...LOL at the term "security blanket", but true.

 

[Blue]

Yeah the security blanket is an apt description, havent really thought of it like that before just kind of a nagging unease.

Regarding showers: I love the "rinse-less wash" you can get at REI, it smells like baby oil but it really does work and way better than moist toweletts. (this is kinda gross but...) If I go three days without a shower I can start getting a heat rash depending on how much I've been sweating, the 4 squirts of rinse-less wash once a day keeps me fully clean (if smelling like a baby oil factory). Though they may not be absolutely necessary I do yearn for the showers, I'm building a propane heated one that will pop out of the side of my van now. I figure that I go a few days without, then pick a secluded location (back of an industreal park after dusk etc) then shower and bolt. They also have rinse-less wash shampoo but though I still have a thick head of hair I can grow I've found going bald is just easyer, once every month I buzzer then shave the head, no shampooing or time spent combing or brushing... fast, easy.

Regarding hobbies... I have em too, found that most of the time I can rent space as needed, if I want to do ceramics I rent the wheel and the studio and pay baking fees (something I do every few months when I get the urge) I also like painting and found I can register for a day class and even get free materials depending on where I go. Dont know what your into but you might look into doing a few things like that, or learn new hobbies that dont take up as much space.

 

[WheelEstate USA]

I was just thinking of a fellow we met in Nevada who lived in a truck with a small topper. He usually slept on BLM at the edge of town and everyday he parked at Walmart and climbed into the topper till sundown, and back to BLM. Same thing everyday for the last few years...no trips, no nothing.

He didn't seem like a very happy guy, not unfriendly, but not really interested in talking much. Nobody seemed to dislike him in anyway, but he was an odd duck.
I'm not knocking him, but he makes my point here.

I'm telling this story because I think Van/RVdwellers need to have activities outside or life can be very boring....a person becomes complacent about everything after a while.
Ya gotta have things to do that ya like...go, see things...meet new people.
Keep life interesting and some of the less desirable aspects of your lifestyle sorta fade into the background.
As much as I love our RV life, there just happens to be a few things I dislike also. The good outweighs the bad by far in this case.

Well, I just hope you find your middle ground and what makes you happy...whatever it is.