For those of you that carry . . . what would you do

[Spaceman Spiff]

There seems to be a misconception that the only reason to carry a gun is because one is afraid.  No-one I know that carry a gun (and I know a lot of people who carry) do so because they are scared.  They, like me, carry a gun because it is a tool that has been useful in the past and some situations would be difficult or dangerous to deal with if the tool isn't handy.

 -- Spiff

 

[XFILE36]

I agree with you both. I don't like to think about it, but I know if I'm going to carry, I've got to be prepared to shoot.

However, I've watched some videos of women in vans who carry less lethal weapons and have mentally and physically practiced what to do in those situations.

I do plan to have a gun with me, but I'll also have a baseball bat, a knife, and maybe some other types of weapons as well. My fear of something like a bat is that I won't have the physical strength to hit someone hard enough but I can always use two fingers to pull the trigger...

Yes, and you can use keys and thumbs to poke their eyes out too.  Like your name.

 

[XFILE36]

Something I haven't seen here is you can use a laser light and temporarily blind them for a few minutes while you escape, so I have been told by an old-timer.  I have them for my cat as entertainment (shining on the floor ONLY.)  You aren't supposed to look into the light for possible visual damage, but in a worst case scenario, carry one on your key-chain or hanging nearby.

Also, I have been told that using something like wasp spray could get you in trouble (bear spray?) legally because that is not what it is designed to be used for.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Also, I have been told that using something like wasp spray could get you in trouble (bear spray?) legally because that is not what it is designed to be used for.

Argh!  Wasp Spray for self defense!

We've had this discussion here before.  IT DOESN'T WORK!

See:

https://vanlivingforum.com/Thread-Wasp-Spray-for-Self-Defense?highlight=wasp+spray

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Something I haven't seen here is you can use a laser light and temporarily blind them for a few minutes while you escape, so I have been told by an old-timer.

Couple of points here:

1:  It is possible that some cheap, imported lasers MAY exceed the safety limits set by the FDA, which means that you may actually do permanent damage.  Which is fine if they really were dangerous. See:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/can-a-pocket-laser-damage/

2:  In my training, I was taught that if I used pepper spray on somebody and blinded him temporarily, and he fell down a flight of stairs and broke his neck, or stumbled into traffic and got hit by a bus, he was just as dead as if I whipped out a gun and shot him.  More importantly, I would be just as legally liable as if I had whipped out a gun and shot him.

I imagine the same would be true if blinding someone with a laser.

So "less lethal" force needs to be used with thought and discretion.

 

[XFILE36]

Hepcat,

I cannot reply to you for some reason.  I hope you read this.  Your post with the lethal force meter is blurry.  Can you provide a link to it please?

 

[XFILE36]

Argh!  Wasp Spray for self defense!

We've had this discussion here before.  IT DOESN'T WORK!

See:

https://vanlivingforum.com/Thread-Wasp-Spray-for-Self-Defense?highlight=wasp+spray

Thanks!  And what about bear spray, both legal and real-life ramifications?  i.e. does it work on humans?

 

[XFILE36]

Couple of points here:

1:  It is possible that some cheap, imported lasers MAY exceed the safety limits set by the FDA, which means that you may actually do permanent damage.  Which is fine if they really were dangerous. See:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/can-a-pocket-laser-damage/

2:  In my training, I was taught that if I used pepper spray on somebody and blinded him temporarily, and he fell down a flight of stairs and broke his neck, or stumbled into traffic and got hit by a bus, he was just as dead as if I whipped out a gun and shot him.  More importantly, I would be just as legally liable as if I had whipped out a gun and shot him.

I imagine the same would be true if blinding someone with a laser.

So "less lethal" force needs to be used with thought and discretion.

So would YOU just lethally shoot someone??

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Under the right circumstances, sure.  This may sound flippant, but I'm prepared to explain anyone's death, except my own.

Getting back to the pepper spray example . . .

When it first came out, some cops were misusing it.  (NOT COP BASHING, BOB, JUST DISCUSSING HISTORY)

Some restaurant would complain about the homeless hanging out near their entrance, panhandling, and some beat cop would give them a quick spray and tell them to move along and not come back.

Nowadays, if a cop uses pepper spray on somebody, regulations require them to take them into custody and get them properly decontaminated.  And they'd be required to file a report on it's use and why they used it.  As it should be.

Now lets use you as an example.  If you're walking down the street near a construction site, and some hard hats start making lewd comments, you might well feel the pigs deserved a face full of pepper spray.  But legally, it would be a really bad idea.

I'm just saying that the use of "less lethal force" requires reasoned judgement.  You might have to justify it to a jury.

 

[hepcat]

Hepcat,

I cannot reply to you for some reason.  I hope you read this.  Your post with the lethal force meter is blurry.  Can you provide a link to it please?

The original is not the highest quality graphic, but here it is in it's original location:

http://blogs.twincities.com/usualsuspects/files/2014/09/forcecontinuum.jpg

 

[slynne]

If this has been mentioned previously, please forgive me. Isn't one advantage to a van that if someone is trying to break in, one option is to just drive away? If you are in a place with people, you can count on the criminal to not want to draw attention to themselves too so honking the horn while you are driving away works too.

 

[XFILE36]

If this has been mentioned previously, please forgive me. Isn't one advantage to a van that if someone is trying to break in, one option is to just drive away? If you are in a place with people, you can count on the criminal to not want to draw attention to themselves too so honking the horn while you are driving away works too.

slynne,

I agree!  I thought the easiest thing would be READY with a weapon VERY NEAR to jump in seat with keys, start, honk and go!

 

[Ballenxj]

Isn't one advantage to a van that if someone is trying to break in, one option is to just drive away? 

That would be the best option, but that little Devil perched on my shoulder keeps whispering in my ear, RUN OVER THEM!
Damn tempting too, but naw. Hmm.

 

[lenny flank]

Lenny flank the simple truth is it is dangerous or deadly

I stopped reading after this.
No, it is not "dangerous or deadly". You probably have a better chance of winning the lottery than you do of being killed by a stranger who breaks into your van.

 

[Let live RV ing]

I would click the alarm on the key chain,if you have it. Activate lights. Sound whistle or air horn. The person most likely thinks vehicle is empty and you will scare them. Announcing yourself may be bad depending on your voice and if you a female or male, you better sound intimidating.

Using a fire arm is a last resort and must be in unavoidable danger, if you can start the rig and get away, you should. Laws are tough and liability is too. You may want to have insurance for your firearm, some out there offers legal expenses and protects you if you have to shot someone. It may save you from being in jail. I don't know if I would know the right statement to give if I just shot someone?

 

[akrvbob]

Thread closed.