Do You Think The Govt. Will Eventually Try And Squeeze Out Boondocking Life?

[outdoorcamogirl]

I have read some articles online and seen some videos online about the "Powers That Be" trying to control ones ability to quit the rat race and live the free life boondocking whether it is in a car, van or RV- Right now I still have a home base, small business but I boondock regularly around the state. I am considering maybe one day being on the road full time and want to educate myself from others that are actually LIVING the life full time. Do you think that there is the handwriting on the wall that the Government will at some time crack down completely on those of us that try and live free on the road by regulating and enforcing places to park and live??

 

[rvwandering]

This question has been asked many times over the years of the forum's existence. While there have been some changes recently such as areas closed to boondocking because of overuse I don't think it will ever be completely closed down. As I travel around the country I find many boondocking spots and small free campgrounds that get very little use. The western US, especially near big cities, is facing problems because of the number of people using public land but the rest of the country isn't facing that type of use.

 

[outdoorcamogirl]

OK thanks for the input....I realize this has been a periodic topic of discussion but since things are constantly changing I was wondering if there were any new developments. Thankfully I live in the southwest....so whatever I end up doing will revolve mostly around the western US.

 

[MrNoodly]

I'm not going to harsh my mellow worrying about it.

 

[WanderingRose]

I do think that where large numbers of folks living in vehicles congregate, particularly in cities, there are more restrictions coming.

And anyplace where privileges are abused, that invites restrictions and limitations.

I think it’s incumbent upon all of we roamers and wanderers, full or part time, to be respectful and aware of how what we do may impact others, and act accordingly.

 

[speedhighway46]

However, because society always degrades in the direction of the lowest common denominator, in the end the few will ruin it for the many; and that’s why rules and restrictions are put in place.

Just my opinion . . .

 

[Elbear1]

Theyre shutting down blm sites literally as i type on south side of zion and selling it to private company. The owner of which has been around on 4 wheeler running us off amd putting up private property signs.

 

[VanForNow]

Large areas of National Forest land used to be open to dispersed camping, meaning you could camp anywhere you found a space.

Recently, however, the trend has been for the NFS to limit camping to "designated campsites," marked by posts or rocks with numbers on them. This trend has reduced the number of available campsites for small and medium-sized rigs, as the designated campsites often mark spaces where 30-40 ft. Class As can fit., thereby elininating spots where we little guys can fit easily. So this is a negative trend. :-(

 

[orangeclouds]

In a capitalist society where income inequality is at historical highs (and getting worse every passing moment) and more and more honest hard working people are forced onto the streets or into their vehicles, I'm of the opinion they can try as they may, but there wont be anything that they can do.

The thing that gives folks living like this by choice a bad reputation is people who leave trash and poop at their spot. If we follow leave no trace principles we should be fine. It's sad so many people don't.

 

[Almost There]

Large areas of National Forest land used to be open to dispersed camping, meaning you could camp anywhere you found a space.

Recently, however, the trend has been for the NFS to limit camping to "designated campsites," marked by posts or rocks with numbers on them. This trend has reduced the number of available campsites for small and medium-sized rigs,  as the designated campsites often mark spaces where 30-40 ft. Class As can fit., thereby elininating spots where we little guys can fit easily. So this is a negative trend. :-(

This is not a new thing. Actually, you never could just go camp anywhere you found a space.

The NF maps show which roads you are allowed to camp on and it's been a long time policy that you are supposed to use existing campsites, not make new ones (camp wherever you want). Whether they were numbered or not doesn't make bit of difference.

Every few years a new map comes out and some roads are eliminated for camping and some are opened up for camping. Also just because a road is marked that it's ok to camp within a certain distance from the road doesn't mean that there are campsites there.

And the larger sites that will accommodate the larger rigs will also accommodate the smaller rigs, they don't tell you you can't camp there unless you  have a big rig!

Have areas been closed, yes, certainly. But the areas that are being closed are being done so because of high overuse and problems. Take the areas south of Cottonwood for example, in both the Prescott and Coconino NFs. First the rangers closed off areas where camping had expanded over the years way past the written 300' off the designated road limit. So the same number of campers proceeded to crowd in to the area that was left rather than finding a new area to camp in. Then it also became a popular area for RVs to go when they had to leave the Thousand Trails RV park in the area. Add in a bunch of homeless people who were supposedly given tents and camping supplies by one of the area churches and you have a really bad overcrowding situation happening. The whole area has been shut down for a period of 2 years and with damned good reason. There's still lots of camping in the area just not where the land needs time to recover. The rangers essentially had to force a disbursement on the campers because they wouldn't let well enough alone. I quit going to the area because there was just too many campers there. If I wanted to be that close to my neighbors I would go to an RV park...

There are millions of acres of NF and BLM land open and available for public use. The mandate is first to protect the land and the ecology, second is to allow public use of the land. When the public overuses and disuses an area then it is responsible governing to limit use!

As to the OP question, no, I don't think there is nor will be handwriting on the wall. In the greater scheme of things, us full-time nomads are such a small percentage of the population that we hardly matter.

That said, it is incumbent on all of us  to be a good steward of the land and resources.

 

[outdoorcamogirl]

Thanks everyone for the great input!
I agree that we must leave it cleaner than we found it...and it is those that don't that ruin it for the rest of us....and give the mobile community a bad name...

 

[travelaround]

No I don't think the government is against nomadic Americans. I think it will become more mainstream and accepted and that localities will make accommodations for us to attract us to their communities as a way to bolster their local economies.

 

[maki2]

While you fear that the government is going to outlaw boondocking you are not looking at the cause, you are only seeing reactions. Presently and increasingly, the federal courts are telling towns that have harassment campaigns aimed at the homeless that the municipalities have to provide housing or else shut up and quit harassing people for being homeless and quit punishing them for sleeping in cars and tents until they do have a plan in place to house them.

The natural federal lands are getting overused because of the policies in the cities that are driving people to have to go out of those lands and live in their vehicles because there is a lack of affordable housing. The place to reduce the harmful impact of overuse of the wild lands is not out there on the BLM land, it is in the towns and cities where affordable housing has become nearly unobtainable.

 

[Gypsy Freedom]

I do think that where large numbers of folks living in vehicles congregate, particularly in cities, there are more restrictions coming.

And anyplace where privileges are abused, that invites restrictions and limitations.

I think it’s incumbent upon all of we roamers and wanderers, full or part time, to be respectful and aware of how what we do may impact others, and act accordingly.

wanderingrose hit the nail on the head, could not have said it better myself

Theyre shutting down blm sites literally as i type on south side of zion and selling it to private company. The owner of which has been around on 4 wheeler running us off amd putting up private property signs.

can you provide a credible source documenting this. BLM is generally not in the business of selling land. the are times they swap land locked blm or forest service land for other more accessible to the public plots. they do offer exclusive use leases, or is it possible the area you mention has always been private and just that trespassing had been tolerated in the past. i see this all over. places "we" used to camp getting shut down.

i would be interested to read up on any links or documentation you have on the infered public land sale you mention

Large areas of National Forest land used to be open to dispersed camping, meaning you could camp anywhere you found a space.

Recently, however, the trend has been for the NFS to limit camping to "designated campsites," marked by posts or rocks with numbers on them. This trend has reduced the number of available campsites for small and medium-sized rigs, as the designated campsites often mark spaces where 30-40 ft. Class As can fit., thereby elininating spots where we little guys can fit easily. So this is a negative trend. :-(

this is only happening in highly used areas, not out in the 99.99% of the rest of the public lands

This is not a new thing. Actually, you never could just go camp anywhere you found a space.

The NF maps show which roads you are allowed to camp on and it's been a long time policy that you are supposed to use existing campsites, not make new ones (camp wherever you want). Whether they were numbered or not doesn't make bit of difference.

Every few years a new map comes out and some roads are eliminated for camping and some are opened up for camping. Also just because a road is marked that it's ok to camp within a certain distance from the road doesn't mean that there are campsites there.

this type of thing is independent of and different in many of the public lands. i have been in national forests (in the last year) that the printed dispersed camping rules allowed you to drive off the existing road up to 200 ft to set up camp. other than to camp, you could only drive on designated roads and most national forests publish MVUM (motor vehicle use maaps) and they are the law. does not matter how well used a dirt road it. if it is not on the map you cant go down it.

the tillamook state forest has designated dispersed camping. this is where there are marked sites you have to be in. but you can also "camp where ever" as long as you follow the rest of the rules. one of those rules is not camping withing a certain distance of establisted campsites, trail heads or parks.

while each agency and even each district within agency's have different rules. some of which guide where you can and cant do the dispersed camping. there are an unlimited number of places that within just a few rules like not parking/camping in a sesitive meadow, you can pretty much set up camp out in the woods where you want.

you really cant make blanket statements about dispersed camping. when you get into a new area, you need to do the leg work and find out what is legit where you are.

 

[1shemp]

The more people using the National Forest will require more rules to prevent damage from overuse.I do expect that the 14 day limit will be reduced to 7 days or less sooner rather than later.Supposedly the NF is for recreation,not living on.

 

[RoamerRV428]

like Mr Noodly I ain't worrying over it.
future generations will have to deal with more troubles than I will see in my lifetime
everything changes....the world will do just that as time marches over all of us

 

[Qxxx]

There are millions of acres of NF and BLM land open and available for public use. 

Actually, there are hundreds of millions of acres of BLM and NF lands. 247M BLM and 188M NF.

Lots of good comments here. But there is too much the sky-is-falling commentary out there in general. There are "local" problems away from the cities, and big problems with homeless "near" the cities, but we are basically part of the RV community, and it's a $100 Billion business with 8-million RVs, many of which are retirees traveling full-time and they are mostly who you find in boondocking areas. There are also 40-million people who go camping every year in the US, mostly in NF areas.

CRVL people are a tiny tiny tiny drop in the bucket. 

So depending on how and where you live, you're either part of (a) the messy problem near the cities, or (b) living with the RVers away from the cities. It's your choice, (a) or (b). No one is going to kill a $100 Billion a year business because of a few extra van life people here and there.

 

[Qxxx]

 as time marches over all of us

Oof, let's hear it for fatalism. After reading that, maybe I'll just stay home, be a couch potato, drink beer, and watch sports on TV like the typical retired male.

Not hardly, not this puppy.

 

[maki2]

you are correct in that the actual count of CRVL people is small out there on the southwest BLM land in the winter months. But the overall count of people living in RVs and vans on the BLM land in the winter is huge. Retirees do it and so do people who live in the northern states where they live and work in the summer but then take the winter off to head south. There is also an influx of nomadic construction workers who don't have work in the cold north areas during the winter. So they head south and stay in RVs and vans while they work construction in the warmer southern climates.

 

[Qxxx]

"But the overall count of people living in RVs and vans on the BLM land in the winter is huge. Retirees do it".

I said that. Also, as indicated, the vast majority of boondockers are people in "regular" RVs, and the number in vans is small in comparison. Except for a lot of yuppie-types nowadays in those "big" vans that cost $100K. And counting the nomadic construction workers, all 3 groups are fine upstanding tax payers, and the gobmint isn't gonna shut that down. For any reason.

We're talking about real $$$$, $100-billion and more. And how much do you think 40-milllion campers pump into the economy every year. They are probably 98% people with regular jobs and living in S&B.

I think people here just don't understand the scale of things.