“Not for hire”?

[Bobhdus]

So I have an old 74 GMC Value Van, and I’m getting info on insurance. $28 a month with cheapest, and $80 for commercial (I have a Locksmith business). I was mostly gonna use this for recreational stuff but considered keeping a key machine and a few tools stashed in it within the kitchenette/ bed stuff that I plan on installing in it. So, what is the meaning and the significance with the “not for hire” stickers some have on theirs? Should I have one? Do I need a log book? Even with my current cargo van I use with my business, it’s mostly for personal use and everything within is mine, I don’t haul others property or people. Anyone know anything about this “not for hire sticker” and when it’s necessary to have it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Pineapple]

In my understanding is that anything with a weight or combined weight of 10,000 lbs or more, must have a DOT number. In our business we use Ford f 350s to tow a 24 ft gooseneck trailer from state to state. This trailer only carries our equipment and not goods for sale. We have the “not for hire” on our vehicles and we must stop at weigh stations and our drivers must keep a log book when they are on the road. We also have a 11 passenger van that transports 6 employees and their luggage but the van has the back seat removed to allow for luggage, and is not required to have a DOT number.

Every state is different so be sure to check, DOT is not a fun entity to deal with or encounter.

 

[Canine]

You don't need a DOT number if you aren't using the truck for business. A DOT number would be needed if the vehicle was a Geo Metro and hauling hazardous materials. I don't remember all the rules for a number, but it doesn't apply to you.

I'm unsure about the "Not for Hire" thing. I'm not sure it has any legal meaning. It could stop people from asking you, "Hey, can you move this for me?" It might be a variation of the bumper sticker that says:

Yes, this is my truck.
No, I will not help you move.

You don't need a log book, but a daily journal of the cool stuff you see along the way would be cool.

 

[speedhighway46]

Check with your state licensing authority on specific requirements; they vary greatly from state to state.

I have a Peterbilt semi tractor I have converted to personal use by adding a 16’ dry box on the back and converting it to living quarters. It weights 24,000 pounds. It is not in commercial service; it is not a commercial vehicle any longer; I do not stop at weigh stations; I don’t have any stickers on it; no DOT is required. But, this is the way Michigan does it.

If your key shop now is just a hobby, and you don’t file a business tax return, then your activity is not a business, and carrying a key machine and other tools are just your personal property like clean underwear and a toothbrush.

Don’t try to make your vehicle more than it really is; it will cost you more money and you’ll regret it in the long run.

 

[Txjaybird]

If your key shop now is just a hobby, and you don’t file a business tax return, then your activity is not a business, and carrying a key machine and other tools are just your personal property like clean underwear and a toothbrush.

Don’t try to make your vehicle more than it really is; it will cost you more money and you’ll regret it in the  long run.

 Hi SH46

Thank you for this post.

I miss the Thank You Button.  I wonder if it will ever be reinstated?

JewellAnn

 

[tx2sturgis]

If your van is not for hire, the vehicle doesn't haul property or people for compensation across state lines, (interstate commerce) or any amount of haz-mat anywhere, and has never been registered to do so, then it is non-commercial as far as Federal DOT is concerned and it is not subject to Federal DOT rules.

Some owners put these 'Not for Hire' (or 'Non-Commercial') stickers on larger 'RV' conversions, buses, classic (privately owned) trucks, etc, just to provide a sense of seperation (once the registration has been changed) from Federal and State regulations, and the officers they might encounter.

As far as I know, you are not required to put 'Not for Hire' on your van, unless the state you are registered in, for some reason, requires it.

 

[speedhighway46]

Be careful advising others based upon “what you believe . . .”

Example: “Not for hire” stickers; from my memory from what others have experienced and expressed here on CRVL:

1> Some states require the stickers to separate visually trucks privately owned and not in commercial service from vehicles owned by a company or corporation which are in commercial service (ie: “for hire”).

2> Some states do not require it.

3> If you put a “not for hire” sticker on a vehicle registered in a state which does not require a sticker, and you pass a weigh station without stopping, one member here stated the LEOs took out after him because they thought the sticker was the DOT number and was trying to blow past the weigh station.

As I said in a previous post, don’t put anything on your vehicle (not for hire sticker; decoration or wording on the door which could be mistaken for a company logo; etc) which your state does not require.

Check the laws in your state for what you are required to do. Do it . . . exactly.

Two more comments:

1> Making a commercial-type vehicle (like mine) into a privately owned and operated one is a huge gray area. That involves licensing, insurance, and driving one without a CDL. If you are going to do this, work through the process one step at a time and do what is required in your state.

2> I have owned my Peterbilt Motorhome for eight years; it was a vehicle in commercial service when I bought it. In these eight years I have had interaction with Michigan Motor Carrier Enforcement officers only two times, both on local Interstates. The first, the officer pulled me over and walked up to my door. I rolled my window down and before I could speak, he said, “Don’t worry, you didn’t do anything wrong, I just wanted to look at your cool truck!” I said, “In that case, let’s go in the back, I’ll make us some coffee and show you around!” That’s what we did.

The second time, the LEO pulled up to my left rear corner as we were going down the Interstate. For several miles he held that position; I assume running my plate. When it came back as a privately owned, non-commercial vehicle registered as a Motorhome, he pulled even to my door, smiled and waved, and then took off.

All of this has been based upon my experience . . .

 

[tx2sturgis]

Be careful advising others based upon “what you believe . . .”

Example: “Not for hire” stickers; from my memory from what others have experienced and expressed here on CRVL:

1> Some states require the stickers to separate visually trucks privately owned and not in commercial service from vehicles owned by a company or corporation which are in commercial service (ie: “for hire”).

2> Some states do not require it.

Yes, we agree, as I said, some states might require it, based on the home state registration. That's for the owner to research and make the right decision. Since the original post contains no information about which state he is in, up to this point, we are directing this information to the OP and anyone else who is, or might be, crossing state lines, and of course, bypassing weigh and check stations.

But no federal law requires a sticker like that. There are some instances where state-owned vehicles in government service will display these stickers for the benefit of the local authorities. 

But my post supplements yours, and does not dispute your information.

 

[Bobhdus]

My address is Liberty Missouri (where Jesse James did the infamous daylight bank robbery). I just got the stepvan to the shop that’s gonna do the clutch. Wanted to get all the “not for hire” and title/ insurance questions out of they way so I pick the best route. The title considers it a “pickup”. I’m awaiting quotes on Commercial insurance from my broker.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[tx2sturgis]

Now we can narrow our focus to MoDOT.

I find nothing in the state's online regulations requiring you to place a 'Not For Hire' sticker on the vehicle. 

You could call your local or regional MoDOT office and get it right from the horses mouth, so to speak.

For your vehicle, I would not attach anything that makes a statement about commercial service, one way or another, UNLESS they tell you at MoDOT that it needs one.

 

[Bobhdus]

Thank you and to everyone else thank you as well. It’s greatly appreciated!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro