Your Opinion on Roadtreks?
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BigT
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California prices on the Roadtrek are nuts! I recently found a 2005 170 with 107K miles, in perfect (looking) condition, but the dealer wants $46,000! :s
And I'd be willing to bet that price doesn't include tax and dealer doc fees. By the time you get it home you've spent over $50,000 for a 12 year old camper!
I could buy it right now, but for that kind of money, I want something much newer or with less miles.
Great looking rig. A bit cramped, but nice looking.
And I'd be willing to bet that price doesn't include tax and dealer doc fees. By the time you get it home you've spent over $50,000 for a 12 year old camper!
I could buy it right now, but for that kind of money, I want something much newer or with less miles.
Great looking rig. A bit cramped, but nice looking.
lterry
Well-known member
Wanderer said:
A good used RT doesn't have to cost 9K. Mine 1990 was $2500. A friend just bought her 1995 RT for $2800. It appears my fully-loaded RT was cheaper than your empty van at its lowest, and I didn't have the bother of outfitting it with stove, storage, bed etc. (a good thing since I'm not too handy at that kind of thing).
A deal can be found on RTs--it just takes perseverance.
Bast and Big T,
My friend and I found our RTs on Craigslist, you have to just be willing to search outside of your local area. Actually, it's probably best to search in the south, even southeast. People seem to be letting them go for less there and more importantly they're southern vehicles (no salt on the roads to rust the underneath). Just do a vehicle check to see if it's always been in the south (as well as having a mechanic checking it out). I've had mine over a year now and trans and engine is still running strong, and I've driven it all over the state of Florida and the 1800 mile trip to Arizona - my only fixes have been three valves in the "coach" portion. I found mine after a two-month search, and my friend found her van after about six months. Also, you might want to keep your options open to the possibility of a Pleasureway. I understand the older models are quite comparable to the RTs.
BigT
Well-known member
Bast said:
Try RVTrader.com http://www.rvtrader.com
I just found a 2003 Roadtrek 170 in SoCal, w/130,000 miles for $22,500 OBO. That's $23,500 less than the 2005 RT 170 I mentioned 4 posts above this one, and the '05's price didn't include tax and fees.
If you factor in the tax, DMV and what the dealer in Rocklin, Ca. called "miscellaneous fees", it's more like a $28,000 savings. :s
It's really disgusting how greedy some dealers can be.
B and C
Well-known member
Obviously I like Roadtreks, I have one, albeit it's a 2000 200 Versatile.
I chose the 200 versatile because of ALL the storage space. It's amazing how much stuff I carry(waaay too much stuff). I have not seen any class B or B+'s with this much storage. The versatile comes with 4 seats up front so the sitting area (with the seats turned around) seems spacious and the second row seats make a good footrest when the front seats are reclined. The Popular only has three seats but the front feels a little closed in with the additional storage behind the driver's seat. They have mirrors on the interior doors and cabinets to help with the spacious feeling. The isle is 30 inches wide so if you're not too wide, it is plenty. My DW and I can pass in the walkway even though we have to turn sideways to do it. Roadtreks are also built with marine plywood, much better than any class C and most other class B's. It is a lot narrower than a C too at only 77 inches wide. I have been pretty deep in the woods (in probably more ways than one) on some really narrow rutted roads. The dropped floor pan does nothing to take away from ground clearance as it is above the driveshaft. We have spent two days inside in Colorado during a snowstorm and didn't kill each other.
Those that do not like them probably haven't spent much time in one.
It took me almost a year to find the exact layout that I wanted (at a price I could afford) and I was searching the entire Southern states. The one I finally found was in my own backyard so to speak (30 miles away). I was prepared to fly anywhere to look at a promising one. Buy a roundtrip ticket and if you buy it, drive it home and forget about the return ticket. Part of the cost. The 170's and 190's are nice but they don't have near the storage of the 200's. Besides, there are two of us. If it were just me a 170 may work but I think I would rather have the 190.
I don't know if this has been post but a place to look is http://www.roadtrekchapter.org/roadtreks-for-sale
I chose the 200 versatile because of ALL the storage space. It's amazing how much stuff I carry(waaay too much stuff). I have not seen any class B or B+'s with this much storage. The versatile comes with 4 seats up front so the sitting area (with the seats turned around) seems spacious and the second row seats make a good footrest when the front seats are reclined. The Popular only has three seats but the front feels a little closed in with the additional storage behind the driver's seat. They have mirrors on the interior doors and cabinets to help with the spacious feeling. The isle is 30 inches wide so if you're not too wide, it is plenty. My DW and I can pass in the walkway even though we have to turn sideways to do it. Roadtreks are also built with marine plywood, much better than any class C and most other class B's. It is a lot narrower than a C too at only 77 inches wide. I have been pretty deep in the woods (in probably more ways than one) on some really narrow rutted roads. The dropped floor pan does nothing to take away from ground clearance as it is above the driveshaft. We have spent two days inside in Colorado during a snowstorm and didn't kill each other.
Those that do not like them probably haven't spent much time in one. It took me almost a year to find the exact layout that I wanted (at a price I could afford) and I was searching the entire Southern states. The one I finally found was in my own backyard so to speak (30 miles away). I was prepared to fly anywhere to look at a promising one. Buy a roundtrip ticket and if you buy it, drive it home and forget about the return ticket. Part of the cost. The 170's and 190's are nice but they don't have near the storage of the 200's. Besides, there are two of us. If it were just me a 170 may work but I think I would rather have the 190.
I don't know if this has been post but a place to look is http://www.roadtrekchapter.org/roadtreks-for-sale
BigT
Well-known member
B and C said:
Thanks for explaining the difference between the Popular and the Versatile. I've probably heard both names, I know I've heard the word "Popular" before, but somehow I never put it together that there were two different models.
I didn't know there was a model with four front seats, I've only seen the three seater with the oddly placed storage/cabinet behind the driver's seat.
Being single as I am, I always figured I'd take the third seat out and toss it to increase the space up front.
What I like about the 170, in theory at least (having never owned one), is that it's built on a 3/4 ton chassis instead of a 1 ton chassis like the 190 and 210.
I figured/hoped that would result in slightly better fuel economy. Maybe I'm wrong.
I also like that it's no bigger than an ordinary passenger van, and so that much easier to park/maneuver.
My work often involves driving 45' Google coaches, so I'm not intimidated by the extra length, I just like my personal vehicles to be as compact but functional as possible.
hepcat
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In the past ten years, I've had a '94 Airstream B-190, an '01 Born Free 23RK, and now a '95 Coachmen B19. I don't live in my van, but I spend as much as a couple of months out of the year traveling in it. I've looked at a LOT of vans over the years, and my experience with these three has been extensive.
What you buy should depend on your needs... not your percieved needs, but your actual needs. For example, the Airstream B-190 had a LOT of "wasted space" by an unusable shower/tub/bath, was top heavy and wallowed in turns and in the wind, and was pretty dark inside. It had a 460 in it and was VERY heavy. It got less than 10mpg. The Born Free was larger, of course, and not a "stealth camper" in any sense of the word... but was VERY comfortable. It had the V10 and got about 10 mpg. The Coachmen is on the e250 chassis. It has a toilet inside, but no shower. The rear of the van is a dinette which I use for storage which is VERY useful. It has an outside shower should I need it; I've never used it. It has a 351 V8 rather than the Triton and gets a solid 14mpg. It's on the e250 chassis and is relatively light and airy inside. It isn't top-heavy like the Airstream and doesn't wallow.
Folks look at the Roadtrek with it's three or four seats up-front and center-table and decide that would be wonderful for entertaining friends. They look at the full bath and think about how nice it would be to shower in the morning. The reality for most folks is that they seldom, if ever, entertain IN their van... and that shower stall often gets filled with hanging clothes and other storage items, never to be used as a shower. Those extra seats take up valuable room and cause other actual necessities to be crammed into a much smaller and less-accessible space. As someone mentioned earlier, the floor pan shower drain just lowers the clearance of the van without adding much value. Remember that your van only carries about 10gals of fresh water, and has about the same for the gray tank. If you shower, even doing a Navy shower, you'll end up needing to dump your gray water almost daily. An on-board bath with shower just isn't as practical as it looks at first blush; and there's almost always a truck stop, municipal swimming pool, or campground shower nearby that you can get to when you need one. Absent that, a solar shower is a good accessory, but I've never needed one.
I've found that unless you're a smaller than average AND a particularly lithe individual, overhead bunks are best used either for childrens' accomodations, or in my case, storage. A long side-couch makes for the most comfortable bed for me in a van. At 6'5" I still hang over the Coachmen's couch-bed, but it's do-able. The rear dinette area makes great extra seating for two, and I've carried as many as seven adults in the van when using it as the Family Truckster, but for extended trips with the dogs, I take the cushions out, and the last 4' of van turns into storage for the dogs' crate, tools, a folding bike, bottled water, and other necessities that there's just no other place for on extended trips.
The biggest feature I look for in a van/moho however, is total cost of ownership over the period I own the van. If you spend $25k on a van, have it three years and put 50k miles on it, you're going to lose a fair amount to depreciation. And of course, the newer the van and the more you spend, the more depreciation you'll eat. Depreciation is the largest expense in owning an RV. Fuel expenses are signficant, but the difference in total cost of ownership between a van that gets 9mpg and one that gets 14 mpg is negligible over the time you own the van. I bought the '95 Coachmen last year with 26k original miles on it for $5k. I put another $4k in it in maintenance and repairs. I had the mechanical work done by competent mechanics. I did the coach repair/resto work myself. I can drive this van for about 100k miles in five or six years and still get $5k out of it if I keep it in good condition. With $2.00/gal gas, my total cost of ownership with be about $0.20/mile. That compares to about $2.55/mile for the first year for my '16 Jeep Rubicon Unlimited (according to the Edmond's calculator, and presuming 10k miles the first year.)
Sorry for being so long-winded here... but I hope that'll give you a little better idea of how to sort out what you really need in a coach from the glitz.
What you buy should depend on your needs... not your percieved needs, but your actual needs. For example, the Airstream B-190 had a LOT of "wasted space" by an unusable shower/tub/bath, was top heavy and wallowed in turns and in the wind, and was pretty dark inside. It had a 460 in it and was VERY heavy. It got less than 10mpg. The Born Free was larger, of course, and not a "stealth camper" in any sense of the word... but was VERY comfortable. It had the V10 and got about 10 mpg. The Coachmen is on the e250 chassis. It has a toilet inside, but no shower. The rear of the van is a dinette which I use for storage which is VERY useful. It has an outside shower should I need it; I've never used it. It has a 351 V8 rather than the Triton and gets a solid 14mpg. It's on the e250 chassis and is relatively light and airy inside. It isn't top-heavy like the Airstream and doesn't wallow.
Folks look at the Roadtrek with it's three or four seats up-front and center-table and decide that would be wonderful for entertaining friends. They look at the full bath and think about how nice it would be to shower in the morning. The reality for most folks is that they seldom, if ever, entertain IN their van... and that shower stall often gets filled with hanging clothes and other storage items, never to be used as a shower. Those extra seats take up valuable room and cause other actual necessities to be crammed into a much smaller and less-accessible space. As someone mentioned earlier, the floor pan shower drain just lowers the clearance of the van without adding much value. Remember that your van only carries about 10gals of fresh water, and has about the same for the gray tank. If you shower, even doing a Navy shower, you'll end up needing to dump your gray water almost daily. An on-board bath with shower just isn't as practical as it looks at first blush; and there's almost always a truck stop, municipal swimming pool, or campground shower nearby that you can get to when you need one. Absent that, a solar shower is a good accessory, but I've never needed one.
I've found that unless you're a smaller than average AND a particularly lithe individual, overhead bunks are best used either for childrens' accomodations, or in my case, storage. A long side-couch makes for the most comfortable bed for me in a van. At 6'5" I still hang over the Coachmen's couch-bed, but it's do-able. The rear dinette area makes great extra seating for two, and I've carried as many as seven adults in the van when using it as the Family Truckster, but for extended trips with the dogs, I take the cushions out, and the last 4' of van turns into storage for the dogs' crate, tools, a folding bike, bottled water, and other necessities that there's just no other place for on extended trips.
The biggest feature I look for in a van/moho however, is total cost of ownership over the period I own the van. If you spend $25k on a van, have it three years and put 50k miles on it, you're going to lose a fair amount to depreciation. And of course, the newer the van and the more you spend, the more depreciation you'll eat. Depreciation is the largest expense in owning an RV. Fuel expenses are signficant, but the difference in total cost of ownership between a van that gets 9mpg and one that gets 14 mpg is negligible over the time you own the van. I bought the '95 Coachmen last year with 26k original miles on it for $5k. I put another $4k in it in maintenance and repairs. I had the mechanical work done by competent mechanics. I did the coach repair/resto work myself. I can drive this van for about 100k miles in five or six years and still get $5k out of it if I keep it in good condition. With $2.00/gal gas, my total cost of ownership with be about $0.20/mile. That compares to about $2.55/mile for the first year for my '16 Jeep Rubicon Unlimited (according to the Edmond's calculator, and presuming 10k miles the first year.)
Sorry for being so long-winded here... but I hope that'll give you a little better idea of how to sort out what you really need in a coach from the glitz.
Hepcat,
A lot of what you mentioned did not apply to the Roadtrek in the OP's question.
I have a RT versatile. I do not entertain company but the extra seats allow us to sit in comfort and enjoy a meal or snack while in travel mode without tuning the front seats around. Also they allow us the comfort of propping our feet up as we recline with the front seats turned around.
It also allows for a lot of open area up front so we don't feel confined while just chillin out reading, watching tv or computer etc.
There is also storage under both seats. The dropped shower pan doesn't hinder clearance as the tanks are between the frame rails and lower than the shower drain. The water capacity is well over 20 gal. not 10, plenty of fresh water, grey and black storage.
Since the shower pan is in the isle there is no chance of anyone hanging clothing in the shower.
You can't compare a class C or another type of class B. with the RT in question. It is like comparing apples and bananas.
Also, as you noticed I mention We, my wife and myself. Plenty of room although we are very compatible. I am sure it could be uncomfortable for some couples who need their space.
A lot of what you mentioned did not apply to the Roadtrek in the OP's question.
I have a RT versatile. I do not entertain company but the extra seats allow us to sit in comfort and enjoy a meal or snack while in travel mode without tuning the front seats around. Also they allow us the comfort of propping our feet up as we recline with the front seats turned around.
It also allows for a lot of open area up front so we don't feel confined while just chillin out reading, watching tv or computer etc.
There is also storage under both seats. The dropped shower pan doesn't hinder clearance as the tanks are between the frame rails and lower than the shower drain. The water capacity is well over 20 gal. not 10, plenty of fresh water, grey and black storage.
Since the shower pan is in the isle there is no chance of anyone hanging clothing in the shower.
You can't compare a class C or another type of class B. with the RT in question. It is like comparing apples and bananas.
Also, as you noticed I mention We, my wife and myself. Plenty of room although we are very compatible. I am sure it could be uncomfortable for some couples who need their space.
hepcat
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To each, his own... it's always interesting to hear the perspective of others. Certainly everyone's needs are different... and Roadtrek sells a TON of coaches. They obviously suit a lot of folks, and more power to them!
It wasn't my intent to denigrate the brand, just to point out that for many folks, some floorplans are more suited to the way they travel than others, and that some of those 'features' that look really appealing for some folks at first blush, turn out in practice to be frustrating space-wasters. The shower in the Airstream B-van, for example, wouldn't have been a deal breaker for me, and it wasn't... but it wasn't as practical for me as what I have now. I used the wet bath shower in my 23Rk regularly, but I had 30 gal tanks. The small tanks in a B-van, for me, are what makes a shower <mostly> impractical.
And having had both B-vans and the 22'-23' B+/small C moho, they have more in common than they are different and I used mine much in the same way. The 23RK I had was more motorhome-like and the extra 4' made a significant difference in room and tank capacities. OTOH, I wasn't as excited about having duals on the rear, and the extra width and length when using it as a van and trying to get around town.
It wasn't my intent to denigrate the brand, just to point out that for many folks, some floorplans are more suited to the way they travel than others, and that some of those 'features' that look really appealing for some folks at first blush, turn out in practice to be frustrating space-wasters. The shower in the Airstream B-van, for example, wouldn't have been a deal breaker for me, and it wasn't... but it wasn't as practical for me as what I have now. I used the wet bath shower in my 23Rk regularly, but I had 30 gal tanks. The small tanks in a B-van, for me, are what makes a shower <mostly> impractical.
And having had both B-vans and the 22'-23' B+/small C moho, they have more in common than they are different and I used mine much in the same way. The 23RK I had was more motorhome-like and the extra 4' made a significant difference in room and tank capacities. OTOH, I wasn't as excited about having duals on the rear, and the extra width and length when using it as a van and trying to get around town.
drysailor
Well-known member
VanForNow said:
One other odd thought on these - you'll be able to get good insurance on it, because it's "factory" made as an RV. Not so with a DIY conversion.
VanForNow said:
I am considering buying an older Roadtrek, possibly a 170, which will bring the purchase price down a lot. I was originally considering a cargo van, but a recent arthritis diagnosis made me reconsider. I am still in good shape, but in future years, as the arthritis progresses, the full headroom offered by a Roadtrek will be an advantage.
Thanks for your opinion.
Van for Now
[/quote]
As someone with osteoarthritis, I can say that you will find the standing room in a class B or a small C invaluable. Depending on how bad it is, you may also have found yourself short changing yourself on comforts in a self-build because it was just too difficult and painful to do everything you wanted. Also, bluntly, it depends on your size and weight. Spaces that seem fine if you are short or thin are going to feel cramped if you are tall or overweight. also, the arthritis will limit your mobility over time.
Make sure you can:
1. Fit well in the bed area.
2. Easily reach all storage areas.
3. That you fit in the toilet or shower area.
4. That you can reach all the nooks and crannies so you can keep them clean.
5. That you can reach and see all gauges.
6. That you can physically get at all wiring, plumbing, etc that you expect to maintain, yourself.
Pay attention to how much crawling and squirming and contortions you have to do. A certain amount is inevitable, but it is not going to get easier as you age.
BigT
Well-known member
VanForNow said:
Ha! Not around here it won't! :s (At least not through a dealership)...
The 170's are considered "Classics" and fetch a hefty price.
I guess they must have made less of them, probably because people found them to be too cramped, so the dealers can claim their fewer numbers make them "rare as hen's teeth" and jack the price up.
If that '05 I recently found had been $25,000 - $30,000 I'd have snatched it up, but $50,000?!?! No thanks!
Ballenxj
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BigT said:
We have to lay blame where blame is due for this kind of pricing. Supply and demand, don't you know? There is no way I would lay down 25 to 30K on an 05 Roadtrek.
A Roadtrek is basically an over sized van that the manufacturer threw a sink, shower, toilet, and bed into. Not to mention 11 years of wear and tear. Vehicles are supposed to depreciate with age. Houses appreciate only for the property they are sitting on. Before I paid that kind of cash I would be looking more seriously into a class A.
I have to keep looking at the name of this forum to make sure I'm in the right place.
