Van versus Car???

[Mechelle]

I'm looking into this, I'm thinking about it.  And I'm on the fence and go back and forth.

I've camped all over the southwest, lived out of a suitcase for a year in India and lived off the grid for three years in the high dessert.
I'm in a big city now and will be leaving in several months and I am seriously thinking of a nomad camp marathon, save some money to buy land at a county tax auction for cheap and do an off the grid thing... maybe start with a trailer, 
but would love a cob/mud-hay house, so old world,  so peaceful.

So here's the deal, I love minimalism and frugal and I love luxury and comfort, 
they fit together well for me, except in this van versus car thing.
I'm also quiet content with what I have and don't miss it if its in storage or gone.

I would love class C but that is not in the finance cards at this moment due to possible high repair cost...
I could do a cargo or old hippy ish van, there is a great old van for sale here but the mileage is 400,000.
I already have most everything I need to trick an empty cargo out.
or 
I could go with a 
frugal ford station wagon  (roomy, very dependable, cheap to fix and great, great gas mileage),
I already have a 9"x9" pop up tent, a big sheep skin rug to sleep in (cold-cold Himalayan old style)

what to say?

I'm a bit stuck and would appreciate any help.  thnx

 

[Dennis]

I like the idea of the van in the best condition you can handle financially. Over the years I have had and camped out of a car, station wagon, pop up, travel trailer, slide in and truck topper, and van. Tent also.
All have their pros and cons of course but the van has worked best all around for ME. After saying that I am considering selling mine and going to a cutaway box van when time and finances align. Or possibly a short schoolie in decent shape.
Many use cars and tents and make them work. I just think for max comfort, room, and privacy a van appeals to me over a car/station wagon and might for you also. We just all have different needs and desires so that is just my opinion.

 

[Almost There]

If you're planning on doing anything on the road long term - like longer than a few months then IMO a full size cargo van is the way to go.

Take a long hard look at as many videos as you can tolerate of people living out of their cars and SUVs. It's tough! You don't have room enough for any amount of fresh food storage so you're eating canned and dried foods or sticking so close to an urban area that you can shop daily. I can't imagine trying to pee in a bucket/bottle of any kind when you have no headroom.

In the three years I've been out on the road full-time I've met a great number of women who are managing to live out of their cars but to a one, they all look at my van with envy. And then they plan for the day when they can afford to have a van of their own. Some end up with a van, others with a trailer or other larger more spacious homes on wheels but none I've ever talked to actually want to stay with just a car for the long haul.

 

[PattySprinter]

My situation seems to be so similar to yours … except storage - I would rather sell and pass forward items than put in storage.
I seem to recall a video on YouTube by Bob Wells where he says that unless you are mechanically inclined - I would say go for the vehicle in the best mechanical condition.
'Almost There' has consistently posted good advice - and I believe there is a video on her rig by Bob Wells posted on YouTube.
I have been researching and bugging people on this site for a while now for opinions and advice. After 3 years of searching and researching I finally bought a new hightop cargo van two days ago.
Please post what you end up getting

 

[Minivanmotoman]

The simple easy answer?
Budget estimated costs for all of your options for ball park values. Miles, gas, insurance and registration, maintenance and repairs.
Look at your income or how fast your savings will delete, there's your answer. Whatever you're comfortable with.
But get the newest, biggest but not too big, most reliable rig that you can afford, generally. More research.
The obvious answer should stick out on the page of analysis for you. No one can answer this for you with all of your unknown variables and income.

 

[RoamerRV428]

Your comfort and what is important to you.
Is standing very important? Then a high top van is imperative.
Is a crouching type lower roof van ok and maybe a tent outside as a 'side room' to do things needed you can't do inside the van? That kind of thinking.

This will be your home. A home is important on some personal comforts only you can answer that will fit your needs. Don't forget every day living your life in this vehicle cause once you buy and don't have a lot of money options to change out later, be smart on that first buy

best of luck to you!!!

 

[bullfrog]

Let me throw one more into the mix. A pickup truck with a topper or home made box. You have a tent so standup room is available when you need it. You plan to build so you must have or want to develope construction skills. You will pay a higher price for a van than a pickup and pickups are usually easier to get to mechanical componets so cheaper to fix. The components you use in the truck can be used on your homestead just build a box for the truck and make it storage for when you build. Take a look at the foamie topper on the tnttt.com site.

 

[Mechelle]

I really like what you are saying about comfort and privacy.  I suppose less work in set up and take down equates in comfort as well?

 

[Mechelle]

This is a very convincing argument.  I like the idea of a trailer, but the hitching and unhitching, not so much.

Why a cargo over an 'cali hippy style'???

 

[Almost There]

Why a cargo over an 'cali hippy style'???

The 'Cali Hippy Style' tend to be older campers. Most have not been properly maintained. Anywhere there is a hole cut in the body or a seam needs to be meticulously maintained with new sealer/butyl tapeby all the previous owners which seldom happens. The butyl tape used to seal exterior lights, vents etc used by the RV industry only has a life expectancy of 10 years. Heck the whole camper including the appliances only  has a life expectancy from the RV manufacturers of 10 years. When buying an older camper, a whole lot of people end up gutting it from the skin in, replacing rot and getting rid of mold. And then the appliances need replacement since their past useful life as well.

A lot of people, either learning through others or their own bad experiences with manufactured campers are turning to converting cargo trailers which are built to a higher standard than RVs. One also has the convenience of adding only those appliances and features that one truly wants.

It does take some construction skills and the forethought to know exactly what you need and where to place it both for comfort and best towing. But in the end you get a camper that will last for the next decade at least.

 

[Mechelle]

My situation seems to be so similar to yours 

 thats a long time in planning.   I'm looking at 2 years+ and have furniture I love so storage... the most amazing house ever for me was a tibetan mud plaster with super thick walls in Southern India.  It just felt so peaceful and nailed to the ground, like it would stabilize your relations and health.  Vastu Shastra geomagic feung sheu old world style.   I dream of a court yard and roof top living, so lovely in India families living on the roof in winter, women massaging babies and old men, preparing food storage and doing laundry, children playing in the sun....  

I am so interested in why you chose cargo???

 

[Mechelle]

sorry double post

 

[Mechelle]

The simple easy answer?
Budget estimated costs for all of your options for ball park values. Miles, gas, insurance and registration, maintenance and repairs.
Look at your income or how fast your savings will delete, there's your answer.

I've done a little of this in my head.       Van = +comfort + privacy -gas -higher repairs - higher purchase cost
                                                               ford wagon =  -comfort  - privacy +gas +lower repairs +lower purchase cost

question is for me is                             +comfort +privacy > +gas +initial outlay +lower maintenance

money versus creature comfort,
an affordable van (3-4K) could run 4-8k more in 2 years, it is so variable because maintenance and gas prices

does that sound about right for a ball park?

 

[Mechelle]

Is a crouching type lower roof van ok and maybe a tent outside as a 'side room' to do things needed you can't do inside the van?  That kind of thinking.

this is in the back of my mind

 

[Mechelle]

Let me throw one more into the mix.  A pickup truck with a topper or home made box.  You have a tent so standup room is available when you need it.  You plan to build so you must have or want to develope construction skills.  You will pay a higher price for a van than a pickup and pickups are usually easier to get to mechanical componets so cheaper to fix.  The components you use in the truck can be used on your homestead just build a box for the truck and make it storage for when you build.  Take a look at the foamie topper on the tnttt.com site.

I think a truck with camper or esp trailer would be my first choice, (except for that gas mileage :dodgy:  but I am on a 3-possibly 5k budget.    I cant do construction, neck injury. So not probably into a hitch either... I will have to hire out.  Here's a question.  If I went that route, would it be possible to find nomadic folks in say Arizona during the winter to help with that kind of project???  I love projects  :heart:

 

[Mechelle]

The 'Cali Hippy Style' tend to be older campers. Most have not been properly maintained. Anywhere there is a hole cut in the body or a seam needs to be meticulously maintained with new sealer/butyl tapeby all the previous owners which seldom happens. The butyl tape used to seal exterior lights, vents etc used by the RV industry only has a life expectancy of 10 years. Heck the whole camper including the appliances only  has a life expectancy from the RV manufacturers of 10 years. When buying an older camper, a whole lot of people end up gutting it from the skin in, replacing rot and getting rid of mold. And then the appliances need replacement since their past useful life as well.

A lot of people, either learning through others or their own bad experiences with manufactured campers are turning to converting cargo trailers which are built to a higher standard than RVs. One also has the convenience of adding only those appliances and features that one truly wants.

It does take some construction skills and the forethought to know exactly what you need and where to place it both for comfort and best towing. But in the end you get a camper that will last for the next decade at least.

Excellent information, thanks.

 

[bullfrog]

Hitching is easy once you practice getting the ball under the coupler. There are several different types of guides and tricks to help you starting out, just look on youtube There are electric jack posts or manual crank posts that can be adatped to a battery operated drill so all you have to do is press a switch. If you take your time and plan well you can slide things like a sheet of plywood into place without lifting and build your floor right on the trailer. If doing a foamie over half the work is done with a paint brush. The sheets of foam insulation that form the walls and roof weigh 20 lbs or less. If done properly the trailer would be light enough to pull with your present station wagon and could easily be built for less than $2500 including the trailer. There isn't that much to it as you are basically just building a box with plenty of help at tnttt.com and so many built all over the country if you had problems most likely someone local would help. Lots of us do this as sort of a hobby. There is one or more club in Arizona I think last year they had a rally in Why.

 

[Mechelle]

Hitching is easy once you practice getting the ball under the coupler.  There are several different types of guides and tricks to help you starting out, just look on youtube  There are electric jack posts or manual crank posts that can be adatped to a battery operated drill so all you have to do is press a switch.  If you take your time and plan well you can slide things like a sheet of plywood into place without lifting and build your floor right on the trailer. If doing a foamie over half the work is done with a paint brush.  The sheets of foam insulation that form the walls and roof weigh 20 lbs or less.  If done properly the trailer would be light enough to pull with your present station wagon and could easily be built for less than $2500 including the trailer.  There isn't that much to it as you are basically just building a box with plenty of help at tnttt.com and so many built all over the country if you had problems most likely someone local would help.  Lots of us do this as sort of a hobby.  There is one or more club in Arizona I think last year they had a rally in Why.

This is so cool.  Could a dirt cheap pop up camper have foamie sides put on it for a super cheap, easy, up-cycle?

 

[bullfrog]

Yes, Apache made a manufactured hard sided pop up camper as a matter of fact. A lot of homemade foamie campers start with an old pop trailer as they usually are pretty cheap once the canvas rots and they leak and the floors rot. The A-Frame type trailers are basically hard sided tent trailers. Some have just made a hinged top that opens up to standing height at one end with hinged walls on three sides. It is much simpler and much more weather tight to build a simple box to your exact hight plus a couple inches on a well built or cheap "improved" utility trailer. Camping gear plus full time possesions equals more weight so the lighter the trailer the better. Towing a trailer that weighs 1500 lbs. the same profile as your car will only cut your fuel milage by 10% or so but a taller and wider trailer with 1500 lbs will make it more like 40% in my experience. That is why many choose a teardrop with a tent especially with small engine/automatic transmission tow vehicles.

 

[kygreg]

Consider a Toyota Prius for the car / tent option. The hatchback is huge, store everything you need, then off load it into the tent at camp. The hatchback can sleep (2) 6'-2" people in AC / Heat all night long with the hybrid engine / electric system. You can also add a 1500 watt inverter to that same system and run a frig., microwave, coffee maker etc. Top it off with 50 mpg. and one of the most reliable cars on the market. The downside is low ground clearance, so you are limited to where you can camp.