Propane safety questions.

[Telcobilly]

I'm looking at different propane tank options for my Mr Buddy heater and I have some questions. I'm thinking of spending the extra money on aluminum for the weight savings and non-corrosion properties. Is it worth it? Do they have to be retired like the steel tanks?
I would like to store it in the basement of my camper which would be inside. I have a propane detector to verify all connections for leaks. Could a locker be made with a plastic box and vent to the outside (tube)? Any benefit to that? Also what is the BEST 02/Propane alarm to get? Are any of you using your propane tanks inside your mobile dwelling?

The reason for the inside installation is primarily stealth.

Thanks in advance for your input.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

Do a search on youtube for 'rickvanman'. He shows how he built his van out in good detail. He shows how he built his propane vented box. Basically just make sure you have a hole leading to outside and you can use weather stripping as a gasket.

Best of luck!

 

[flying kurbmaster]

I have them inside, the cupboard is accessible from the top inside, sealed and vented from the bottom with holes to the outside. I have done it that way so I can access the valve, to turn it off. I store two 6lb tanks in there, one is hooked up to the stove one to the heater. I spray soapy water on all connections to check for leaks every time I refill them, turn them off after every use as well as a propane detector on at all times. I feel comfortable with this set up.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I'm under the impression that aluminum tanks are primarily used on boats, where the steel tanks would rust too easily. Other than weight savings, I don't think they have any particular advantage in non-marine applications. They have to be recertified every so often, just like the steel ones.

Regards
John

 

[Telcobilly]

Thanks for the speedy replies. With all due safety and caution, I'm going place the propane bottle in the basement then and hook up my 12' line (with filter) to the Mr Buddy. I know for a fact when I first used that heater in Boulder 2 years ago, the low oxygen cutoff was so sensitive that I had to have the front bulkhead and one of the rear door hatches open or it would extinguish the heater. If I closed one opening, it would shut off. Great peace of mind.

 

[akrvbob]

If I had the money to buy any tank I wanted, I would buy a plastic one. I forget what they are made of, maybe fiberglass or carbon fiber, but they are clear and you can see right through them--you'll always know exactly how much propane is in them. They also are extremely light. I found some in Moab Utah but couldn't make myself spend $100 for a 11 pound tank. I kinda wish I had! This isn't the exact one, but it's like it:
http://www.amazon.com/Viking-Cylinders-11-Composite-tank/dp/B00LOPBD5Q/

Bob

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Bob,

You're probably thinking of the brand called Lite Cylinders.

There was a recall because of quality control problems, and that company is out of business now.

Regards
John

 

[akrvbob]

OP, maybe so, now I guess I'm glad I didn't buy one! But other companies are still making them and if I was sure I could get one filled I'd like to have one.
Bob

 

[66788]

I don't know Bob. Seems like there is an awful lot riding on the integrity of the simple propane cylinder. Especially when used inside of a van.

Going out in a ball of fire is not exactly what I had in mind!

66788

 

[akrvbob]

Propane is an extremely regulated industry. If it got federal approval for sale I'm satisfied they are fundamentally safe. That manufacturer had a safe product, they simply messed up production.

More car recalls this year than ever! but cars are still safer than they have ever been, they are just messing up production.

However, no doubt it's a risk. The product hasn't been around for very long so it has no long-term track record. That's probably partly why I didn't buy one.

66788 said "Going out in a ball of fire is not exactly what I had in mind!"

No doubt the first guy who bought the first few Model T heard his neighbors say exactly the same thing to them. But that seemed to have worked out okay.
Bob

 

[highdesertranger]

I heard though the grape vine that the composite tanks will be back. as far as aluminum vs steel, they are lighter but still must be recertified every 12 years just like steel and are more than 2x the price. if you build a box inside to house your tank you must vent it. the lowest point of the box is where this vent should be. highdesertranger

 

[Seraphim]

Thanks for the speedy replies. With all due safety and caution, I'm going place the propane bottle in the basement then and hook up my 12' line (with filter) to the Mr Buddy. I know for a fact when I first used that heater in Boulder 2 years ago, the low oxygen cutoff was so sensitive that I had to have the front bulkhead and one of the rear door hatches open or it would extinguish the heater. If I closed one opening, it would shut off. Great peace of mind.

I'm no expert here, but I'm concerned about potential leaks in the basement area building up in that confined area; will you have sufficient venting or an alarm system down there? Are there electrical connections in the basement area? Perhaps I'm being overly cautious, but I can envision a couple of possibilities which would not end up well, should a connection somehow loosen...

 

[Toes]

So am I to understand that your propane tank should be in a vented box as well? I know the area you're heating usually has to be vented for oxygen flow, but is it safe to just have your propane tank sitting there?

 

[highdesertranger]

if it is inside your living space then it should be in a sealed box and vented to the outside at the box's lowest point. I know a lot of people on here are going to poo hoo that statement. but that is how it should be done. highdesertranger

 

[Toes]

Thanks, highdesert.

So are we talking "should be done" as in, I'll get sick or die if I don't? Or is that a "should be done" as in, just playing it safe?

 

[66788]

However, no doubt it's a risk. The product hasn't been around for very long so it has no long-term track record. That's probably partly why I didn't buy one.

66788 said "Going out in a ball of fire is not exactly what I had in mind!"

No doubt the first guy who bought the first few Model T heard his neighbors say exactly the same thing to them. But that seemed to have worked out okay.
Bob

Ford Motor Company has been around a long time and they have a track record, but they also made the Pinto. I'm sure you were around when they were exploding into balls of flame when rear ended.

Your logic, although generally true, does not hold true always, and why be one of the exceptions?

 

[One Awesome Inch]

So am I to understand that your propane tank should be in a vented box as well? I know the area you're heating usually has to be vented for oxygen flow, but is it safe to just have your propane tank sitting there?

Yes, definitely put it in a vented box. In another post you mention your in a Previa with the 20LB tank inside.... it really would be not that much bigger to build a wooden box it and you could keep the size tight. Building it so that it just adds an inch or so all around the box is totally feasible. Go to a tool rental place and rent a drill with a 2 inch saw and drill a hole into your van floor... of course making sure to check underneath first to ensure no damage. Then place your completed box with a second 2 inch hole exactly above that hole. Its a bit more complicated than that, but its not rocket science. Your life is worth it! If you insist on keeping the tank in the van, put soapy water around all hose connections to make sure there is no leaks. Bubbles mean leaks. Google for more info.

Be safe!

---

So am I to understand that your propane tank should be in a vented box as well? I know the area you're heating usually has to be vented for oxygen flow, but is it safe to just have your propane tank sitting there?

Yes, definitely put it in a vented box. In another post you mention your in a Previa with the 20LB tank inside.... it really would be that much bigger to build a wooden box around it and you could keep the size tight. Building it so that it just adds an inch or so all around the box is totally feasible. Go to a tool rental place and rent a drill with a 2 inch saw and drill a hole into your van floor... of course making sure to check underneath first to ensure no damage. Then place your completed box with a second 2 inch hole exactly above that hole. Its a bit more complicated than that, but its not rocket science. Your life is worth it! If you insist on keeping the tank in the van, put soapy water around all hose connections to make sure there is no leaks. Bubbles mean leaks. Google for more info.

Be safe!

 

[Seraphim]

Thanks, highdesert.

So are we talking "should be done" as in, I'll get sick or die if I don't? Or is that a "should be done" as in, just playing it safe?

With propane, it's not just a matter of fresh air, it's a matter of blowing up and dying.

In a closed compartment, with no venting and a propane leaking, you have a bomb waiting for ignition - pure and simple. That's my concern with putting it in the basement - just one time the connection isn't as tight as it should be, or vibrations from driving down the road work it loose, or the hose gets a crack and leaks - how is one to know? What can ignite it? An exhaust piece hitting the ground creating a spark, a passerby tossing a lit cig, an electrical connection arcing, an open flame in or near the unit. Will it probably happen? Probably not. Can it possibly happen? Most assuredly. Take a lesson from RV designers: the tanks are sealed off from the interior, accessed from the outside, the door is vented, and there is a large vent hole in the floor of the compartment, unless they are mounted on the exterior.

So how do you wish to interpret 'should be done'?

 

[One Awesome Inch]

I meant to say 2 inch hole saw.

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There is also the possibility of buying a smaller tank 5, 10 LBS etc and attaching it somehow on the outside of the rear door. Build / buy a box for stealth.

 

[Telcobilly]

All concerns that I have too.. Not making my mind up just yet. I'm listening to all ideas posted here. It would be simple for me to vent the box outside as the hose could exit out the barn doors at the back. It would also be simple to sniff the gas connections at the bottle (have to turn it on every time I use it) and at the heater connection. By sniffing, I mean using the gas detector wand. Just things I'm mulling over..