Intentional Poverty

[Pop]

In a series of articles on Poverty in America called the "In Plain Sight" series, I came across this one called "Intentional Poverty". I found in on my "FlipBoard" news app. It appears to be out of NBC News. Read it at this link:

http://inplainsight.nbcnews.com/_ne...n-purpose-meet-americas-intentional-poor?lite

The guy featured as an example in this article seems of like mind to us. Maybe some of you can relate similar stories.

 

[papas34]

After I got out of the military in the early 70's I was working in the Rock Springs area of Wyoming. Rents were high as were wages, ut the hours were long and the job site was 40 miles each way of dirt roads.
7 or 8 of us found an old ghost town with home all boarded up. We broke in and got by. Finally someone bought the whole town on a tax lean and brought in water and electric. Our rent was only $700 a month, or around $100 each per month with take home of about $450 a week.
My boss found an old animal den a few miles from the job site and lived all summer there, just a small cave in a hill side. He would go into town about once a week.

 

[Patrick46]

I liked his little cave/home. Look like he keeps it nice and tidy...which is one thing I respect!

 

[AltTransBikes]

It's an interesting subject, one I often contemplate. It is commonly said that money corrupts but I've seen where poverty can corrupt also, here in the US and certainly many places outside the US where I've lived and worked.

It seems one would inherently have had to known at least a degree of access to financial gain first before having the luxury of actually having a choice. The flip side hardly works, a life cast into abject poverty seldom gets to choose to be rich.

My wife is from what is called a 3rd world country, a place where real poverty is not an embarrassment. Articles like the one linked will tend to make her smile for she knows what a life of destitute impoverishment can look like, one with few choices.

For some I think voluntary poverty is a standard that can come close to a cloistered existence, that of a monk. Thoreau famously wrote of choosing a life of simplicity and voluntary poverty, but one also adherent to what he called 'higher laws'.

I think of Helen and Scott Nearing also, who lived and wrote about their lives in voluntary poverty. Coming from a fairly privileged background in NYC, they retreated to the woods of northern New England and living out decades a hand-made life close to the bone but rich in things of the mind and spirit. I remember reading an anecdote that Scott wrote telling of at one point having inherited a goodly sum of bonds, something like $150K. Sitting in front of the fireplace one night thinking, he tossed them into the fire to avoid what he called the "tyranny of riches" (though that act has been criticized for simply not giving them away).

Something that I think has been almost completely lost today to popular culture is knowledge of what the Christian ideal of poverty is or was, both Apostolic poverty and the not so long ago ideals of early American settlers, the old yankee notion of conservatism, hard work, thrift and the importance of retaining the unbribed soul.

The fellow in the linked article living in the hobbit hole doesn't appear to have a vehicle other than a bike. I wonder, pertaining to vandwelling, if the consensus thinks it's possible to own and maintain a vehicle and do so on $5K a year?

 

[Lifemagician]

With the ability to make choices, this cannot be called 'poverty', intentional or otherwise. The true poor do not have choices.

Live simply, so all may simply live.

Lifey

 

[owl]

"The true poor do not have choices." So being poor is a life sentence ? No hope, no chance, no way. People escape poverty every day in this world. All over the world. Exactly how does living simply enable others to live ?

 

[Patrick46]

I agree with Owl.

I have a hard time swallowing the idea of 'real poverty', as there are ALWAYS alternative choices a person can make to better their lives. (the few who truely can't are very few)

Take someone growing up in a sharecropper's shack in some desolate town in Mississippi. Doesn't have much for opprotunities there now does he??
But he CAN make the choice to walk away from that place and that life and hitchhike to a different part of the country to get a fresh start at a better life.

Or the fellow who's lost his corporate job due to downsizing. He can spend the next few years looking for a replacement job while he survives on his savings or unemployment...or he can get rid of his stuff, move somewhere new, and try something completely different....but these are his choices.

I don't know what it's like in other parts of the country, but when it comes to the cardboard sign holding panhandlers...our town is littered with 'em...and it drives me frikken nuts when people give these losers money!!!! From my observations...95% of them are young to middle aged ABLE BODIED adult males. They're CHOOSING this life over another one.

If they wanna be the guy with the custom made suit, getting flown around in his Leerjet...they can do that....but it takes HARD WORK, SACRIFICE, AND HEAVY RESPONSIBILITY to get there. But...the rewards can be pretty darn nice.

however...

they can choose to pass up on that, and live their life free from such horrible burdens, and enjoy the freedon of being able to get up and go to sleep whenever & whereever they want. (most of the time) They've got the freedom to not have to show up to work at a certain time everyday, and the freedom of not even having to work everyday...if they don't want to. They don't have anyone getting down on them for getting drunk for breakfast or loaded for lunch if they so choose.

...but they SACRIFICE the warmth of a cosy bed every night, a good shower and clean clothes to wear every day. A warm coat and a reliable rig to get around in is a grand thing when its miserably cold and raining out. It's nice to be able to have a good cup of coffee every morning, and go for a fun motorcycle ride...if I so choose.

Even as vandwellers...there is work to be done, sacrifices are made, and responsibilities to handle.

The point is...we ALL have choices to make. (I tried to teach my kids this reality.) Where we live, what we do, and how we spend our time....it's all up to each of us. And each and every one of them takes work, planning, sacrifice, and accepted responsibility to pull off.

YES, there ARE VERY REAL VICTIMS out there...and it's sad, but they are definately the minority...even in this day & age. Opprotunities still surround us, if we only take the time to look!

Watch the movie "the Pursuit of Happyness" for a great 'true' example.

 

[Lifemagician]

Owl, seems like you and I view each word from a different angle. I try to see and comment on things in my context. The context was the link to that article.

Whereas many poor make good every day, everywhere, I believe the true poor do not have the choices as reported in that article.

Lifey

 

[mockturtle]

Our 'living simply' would--alas!--result in more poverty overseas where workers make a living churning out all the needless stuff we buy. Even so, I prefer to live simply and frugally. The global economy would not likely survive on the likes of me. ;-)

Poverty as featured in the article is clearly intentional. There is, of course, unintentional poverty. To me, the key lies in the context of values. Our culture values money and possessions far too highly and many 'poor' people in our society actually live comfortably in contrast to much of the world. If a simple, frugal lifestyle were valued in our culture, then the poor would be less marginalized.

 

[Pop]

The article was clearly mis-titled. I think they wanted it to fit the series of articles it was part of. Someone is certainly not improverished if they don't consider themselves so -- despite the government definition that uses a dollar threshhold.

 

[owl]

Very many years ago I was in a bar in the Cayman islands. The local bartender was having a conversation with a person from New York who insisted on commenting on the poor in the Caymans. The bartender said, we may be broke but we are not poor. I wonder to this day if that guy got it? Do you get it?

 

[mockturtle]

I totally get it.

 

[Patrick46]

Our culture values money and possessions far too highly and many 'poor' people in our society actually live comfortably in contrast to much of the world. If a simple, frugal lifestyle were valued in our culture, then the poor would be less marginalized.

Someone is certainly not improverished if they don't consider themselves so -- despite the government definition that uses a dollar threshhold.

Very well put...both of you!

 

[Willy]

Having lived under the poverty line for all of my 'adult' life, and lived well, I can understand what that bartender was saying. ..Willy.

 

[jeanontheroad]

I don't want to be poor, but I do want to live like I am. I like having enough $$$ in bank so I don't have to worry about emergencies or different choices we may want to make. But I don't want to be lumbered by all the material goods any more. I guess I want life to just leave me alone a little more.

 

[dudleyduright]

In the United States, we have been bombarded by consumerism since birth. We feel the need to conform to normality and have similar material goods the people around us have, plus more. We end up being enslaved to a lifestyle of convenience, comfort and unhappiness. We feel dissatisfied with our lives while living beyond our means in absolute luxury.
To me, I think the intentional poverty news story is about one minimalist's lifestyle, living frugally and achieving a level of happiness through simplicity whether it is in a van, RV or hobbit hole it doesn't matter.. he is happy.
For the truly needy and homeless, I donate regularly to a local homeless shelter, the salvation army and local food bank. I do not encourage panhandling but I will offer someone a meal if they are hungry but I never give money.

Dudley

 

[akrvbob]

Dudley, very well said!
Bo

 

[mconlonx]

In other countries and times, there was and still is the idea of a mendicant. Someone who relies on the kindness of strangers while pursuing a spiritual/religious life free from just about all possessions.

I figure if I ever fall upon hard times where I am unemployed and unemployable, I'll hit the streets not as a panhandler, but as a mendicant. Will pray for person of choice based on anyone donating money, food, shelter, etc. Non-denominational, which means I'd have to learn all kinds of prayers from many different religions; atheists can pay be not to pray.

 

[decodancer]

I was a dog groomer for many many years and made a good living at it. I wanted to travel and try workamping and left a good job to do it. Guess that could be considered intentional poverty. My thought is if I waited until retirement age (if I even live that long, you never know) to follow my dreams, I may not be able to physically enjoy it as much. Even at 53, the body complains when I overdo. I walk like the tin man before he got oil after a long drive now, what will it be like in 20 years? I love my life and enjoy every day of it, couldn't say that before.

 

[user 423]

... the idea of a mendicant. Someone who relies on the kindness of strangers while pursuing a spiritual/religious life free from just about all possessions.

Oh yeah. Like the TV evangelists out there. But then they generally leave out the 'free from all possessions' part.