Help Needed: Efficient Fridge Circuit

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riggyk

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Hi Guys, 

So I bought some electrical materials a ways back in hopes of taking a stab at the below energy efficient fridge setup. It's basically a temperature regulated freezer that serves as a low draw fridge... cool concept, but now that I've setup my solar circuit I'm not quite sure as to how it would feasibly work it's way in whatsoever.



As directed, I've employed the use of a pair of bus bar feeds in my circuit and it seems this thing runs off of some sort of 12V auxiliary connection on the inverter, which my Samlex doesn't seem to have. That, and I think potentially this was constructed to run as the sole draw off this inverter given that "toggling" is required by turning the inverter on and off to promote said energy efficiency of the fridge.

I've attached my house/solar circuit and the mockup of what the efficient fridge circuit looks like as well. I'm a bit stumped here....
 

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This scheme depends on using the temperature controller to turn on and off the inverter which powers the compressor.  The temperature controller can turn on and off only ten amps.  The plan is to use a relay controlled by the temperature controller to turn on and off the power to the inverter.  That's the $11 100 amp relay.

Your inverter may or may not be able to start the compressor motor when applying input power with the compressor already connected.  Another approach is to constantly connect the DC input to the inverter, charging the input capacitors, and then turn on the inverter.  Some inverters have a remote control connection that can be hooked up to the temperature controller.
 
I don't understand what your question is.

The design is for the 12V always-on thermostat to switch a relay toggling the inverter on and off, which directly the AC fridge.

Best with a very efficient fridge and a right-sized pure-sine inverter dedicated to just running the fridge.

A buss is just direct physical wring connection, does not care about anything but amps staying within rating.

I don't understand either drawing there.

Here's another blog post I think more clear, see if that helps

http://intothemystery13.com/diy-hybrid-fridge-cheap/
 
If you get an inverter that turns on/off via toggle swith you can replace the toggle with a small lo-draw normally open relay. ..Willy.
 
This entire idea seems to violate the KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) principle big time! I see nothing but aggravation using this system.
But, I don't enjoy electronics either........

Pick up a new (or used) 12v cooler such as a Truck Fridge or similar, plug it in and call it good.

Dave
 
Those 12V coolers are very energy inefficient, only suitable for truckers or those with excess solar.

A Danfoss-style compressor fridge is the simpler option, mfg like Engel is effective, very robust and low amps consumption.

I like running one as a freezer opening no more than once a day, with frozen bottles going into a cooler for drinks and current meals.

The ideal IMO is a well-sealed top-opening custom box, with at least 4" foam all round, and a Danfoss type compressor kit.

Too much space and trouble for most, but not much more expensive - and a LOT more AH efficient - than an Engel.
 
Sorry for the confusion guys... I guess I was just looking to see if there was a simpler way to incorporate this type of efficient freezer - as fridge - into my current setup. It's been a cheap bill of material and low draw but now seems to be a PITA to work into my inverter setup.... Obviously would rather not pay $500 for a 12V fridge! ---- I wonder if there'd be any harm in just plugging in the freezer intermittently until it gets cold, then turn it off when need be? Largest draw was at startup at about 350W and settled at 50 on average.
 
Or you could get a inverter like the trip-lite that can be set to turn itself off when power is not being called for.
 
Better to plug it in and leave it plugged in until it's at the correct temperature (40F).

How long it stays within a 4 degree range will depend on how much is in the fridge, insulation of the fridge itself, additional insulation you can provide outside the fridge and of course, ambient air temperature.

The problem with trying to control the temperature yourself is that it's time intensive. One must be constantly aware of what the temp of the fridge is and be on immediate stand-by to turn on the fridge to cool it back down.

If this is not done then the fridge temp rises beyond what is safe food handling, wastage occurs and all the financial benefits of not using a compressor fridge go right out the window.

Like a lot of things, it's pay now or pay later!
 
there are gagillions of people who have DONE the same thing you are asking,,,,these are the same people who if you should happen to stop by their rig will be happy to show you the custom box for their 12vdc compressor fridge, while they regail you with tales of trying to decide if the green ring around the edges of the bologna they left in their great money saver reefer,( it quit working 1.5 seconds AFTER they shut the door at 6 am on the hottest day of the year on an asphalt parking lot) after working til 10 at night on the carney for thirty dollars(which you will spend trying to get a jump because a relay fuzed together because your "temporary" wiring job had a dead short where you unknowingly drove a screw thru it trying to secure it to the wall thus running down every battery in a thirty foot radius of your van)coming to the conclusion that, the worst that can happen is a slightly upset tummy or maybe a a little gurgling in the lower G.I. but not to worry, regards, caretaker
 
If you enjoy obsessive tinkering and experimentation to optimize efficiency, or have a lot more time than money, why not.

But most prefer finding a way to earn the money to just buy what you need.

Niche market, good quality and very efficient, robust and compact mobile gear will always cost more than the mainstream B&S mass-market stuff.
 
120vAC fridges and freezers can certainly be made to work on batteyr power, but often the 'savings' is just not there.

An inverter with a Low idle current or  dedicated feature to nearly eliminate parasitic draw when compressor is not running, will eat up a lot of the 'savings'

Rigging and wiring up the other accoutrements to make it function as intended, will eat up a lot of other savings.  The 120Vac chest style freezers are only more efficient due to the extra insulation.  Increase the insulation to 4 inches on Any fridge box and the efficiency will go way up.



Yes the 500$+ price of a 12v compressor fridge is a hard pill to swallow, but so is trying to amke a 120VAc unit work reliably, without the likely  necessary doubling in battery and recharging capacity to run it.

Among 12v fridges, there is not huge differnences in energy consumption.  No one 12v fridge is Vastly superior than another in the energy consumption world if all the variables are equal. Such claims are ludicrous.

The biggest differences come in the insulation of fridge box and door/lid seal, and how well the condenser is ventilated.  Meaning do not block the cooling vents, or ask it to work in a 130 degree vehicle baking in the sun comparing its consumption to one in the 60 degree ambient shade.

I had a sawafuij compressor powered norcold with passive condenser, which I found Noisy and annoying.  I did make sure the condenser was well ventilated.  When the fridge failed at the 5 year mark and I replaced it with a danfoss powered Vitrifrigo, the design of the VF allowed me to better ventilate condenser.  Both had/have the same amount of extra insulation, the Norcold had better door seals, but the door twisted with age and did not seal as well as it should have.

The VF uses about 10 to 15% less battery power than the Norcold, to keep colder internal temps, in my Van, with my installation/ventilation methods. 

 This is not a blanket statement that DAnfoss powered fridges are more efficient than Sawafuiji or Waeco powered 12v compressor fridges, but my opinion definitely leans heavily toward danfoss/secop based 12v compressors based on my personal experience with the units I own(ed).  The danfoss compressor controller also allows easy addition of 12v computer fans(0.5 amps max) that cycles on and off with compressor to help suck out hot air, or push ambient air through condenser, rather than relying on passive ventilation or convection.

Also, while the Sawafuji compressor has the potential to be much louder, there is a lot of variability in how loud any specific unit will be, and much depends on the vibration suppression efforts employed by the manufacturer/ assembler, and the temperature of those vibration suppression bushings.

I expended a lot of effort in dampening noise and vibration my Norcold with success, but an empty fridge or a heavly loaded fridge could negate those efforts and cause angry fists to make dents in fridge door when Awoken by harmonics caused by the swing compressor.
  Those efforts, as well as angry fists, might also have contributed to its demise from loss of refrigerant. and those 3 weeks of going back to a cooler and block ice while waiting on the funds and delivery of VF fridge, still cause nightmares.

12v refrigeration and more than enought solar power for it, makes Van dwelling from a chore into a luxury, in my opinion.  Definitely the best upgrade I have done.  Bite the bullett and well ventilate the cooling unit of  whatever fridge you choose to employ.

If you do go down the inverter/120vac unit  rabbit hole, you still have to makes sure its compressor and condenser are not bathed in hot air it has removed from the box.  So many people never consider that the heat pulled from the interior of any Fridge, has to be expunged to the exterior, and the more efficiently this is accomplished, the less energy consumed, and the degree of that difference can be vast.

Those in stick and bricks usually never consider its electrical consumption and do not care as the fridge alone might only consume 17 cents  worth of grid power every 24 hours, but a hot vehicle baking in the sun relying on battery power certainly needs to.

Some friends of mine in a stick and brick bought a larger fridge which would barely fit into the opening in their kitchen, and complained it was not cold enough.  My IR thermometer found the drywall behind the fridge at 135F  after I slid the fridge out and was assaulted by heat.  I modified cabinet above fridge to allow heat to escape, but did not lower thermostat and the next morning things inside the fridge portion were frozen. 

Look into Truckfridge for low cost danfoss powered fridges and there is a recent thread on MaxBurton fridges which are even cheaper.
 
Thanks everyone. SternWake, as usual you're a huge help.

I think I'm just gonna scrap everything and go with a cooler for now. Maybe look into a 12v down the line. - Hopefully the cooler route isn't an issue inside the house of the van with leaks and such.. but I assume it's as risky as having a fridge next to your electrical and to just get something solid like a Yeti etc.
 
their is a link somewhere around here to expedition outfitters or something like that has reviews of coolers, i think you will be surprised, if your thinking yeti how much you will save. looks to me like about $250.00
 
if you search around for the price of that Yeti you could get a 12v refer. I just bout a slightly used Engel for 300 bucks. highdesertranger
 
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