Dealing with stealth parking?

[Rayd888]

I've heard/read a lot of stories of people being harassed about parking and sleeping in different places... 

Note: the whole thing os ridiculous because you can park during the day almost anywhere as long as you're not either sleeping, or having sex in your van, car or whatever type of vehicle even though it's your own private property/space and no one can see you...

Anyway, this question is for any lawyers out there: if someone is sleeping in their van and he gets a knock on the door from a security guard. Should he just be legally able to just jump in the driver's seat and drive away? 

If it's not a police officer, shouldn't you just be able to crack your window and say, "Yeah, hello. I'll just move along. Bye..."? 

I'm no lawyer and I know common sense has nothing to do with the Law... So can a real lawyer explain this to me? 

Thanks! 

Peace.

 

[safarivan]

I'm no lawyer and I know common sense has nothing to do with the Law... So can a real lawyer explain this to me? 

seems to me, youre thinking that lawful and legal are the same. and it also seems youre thinking lawyers and attorneys are the same. the 'real' lawyers know better, the attorneys prefer others think they are the same.

I would ask myself this question, am I obligated to speak to a private security guard in any way?

 

[Rayd888]

This makes me think that I should have said: "I know nothing about the legal system and laws..." since I don't even know the basic definitions that you mentioned. Haha!



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[lenny flank]

It's really pretty simple---you have no right to sleep in anyone's privately-owned parking lot. Period. If they don't want you there, they will let you know--and you leave, quickly, quietly, and cheerfully.

In publicly-owned places, the situation is a bit different. You can park any place that it is legal to park. Whether you can SLEEP there or not is different and depends on circumstances. In many localities it is illegal to sleep in a vehicle, or to camp overnight. If the coppers show up and want you to leave, you leave, quickly, quietly and cheerfully.

"Not talking to them" won't help you. If they want you or your car to be gone, you and your car will be gone, one way or another, whether you talk to them or not.

The key to stealth parking is to (1) not park where you know you are not wanted, and (2) be invisible and don't attract any attention to yourself.

 

[Rayd888]

"Not talking to them" won't help you. If they want you or your car to be gone, you and your car will be gone, one way or another, whether you talk to them or not.

The key to stealth parking is to (1) not park where you know you are not wanted, and (2) be invisible and don't attract any attention to yourself.

Thanks for the info.

I didn't mean "Not talking to them" - I meant just leave.

But I hear you. The best thing to do is Not be confrontational ever. Just like you said.

I know I'm preaching to the choir here but these laws about not sleeping in your vehicle don't make any sense to me.

Vandwellers spend so much energy dealing with this...

I imagine that some people could stay up at night and sleep during day?




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[lenny flank]

I think people worry about it much more than they need to. If you're not doing something dumb, you'll likely never have a problem--the people who continually have cop troubles usually bring it on themselves. In three years of dwelling I've only had one cop encounter and one security encounter--and both of those were friendly (and neither was because of anything I had done).

 

[Rayd888]

I think people worry about it much more than they need to. If you're not doing something dumb, you'll likely never have a problem--the people who continually have cop troubles usually bring it on themselves. In three years of dwelling I've only had one cop encounter and one security encounter--and both of those were friendly (and neither was because of anything I had done).

True. Your attitude/energy is very important. It's not what you say, but How you say it.

Some people have an aversion to cops that ckearly shows in their mannerism and tone. It sets the cop off in a bad way. This should be obvious, but many people don't even notice they're doing it...

I've talked myself out some situations that were supposed to end really bad for me, but ended up in a very positive note.

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[DwelledLongAgo]

True. Your attitude/energy is very important. It's not what you say, but How you say it.

Exactly.

In most cases, just letting your "I'm a good person. I'm not here to cause anyone any trouble.  If I'm not supposed to be here I will happily comply with your request to leave if necessary" mojo to shine through is all it takes.

 

[Almost There]

Vandwellers spend so much energy dealing with this...

Not ALL vandwellers even think about this, let alone use any energy doing so!

The difference...a lot of us don't ever even think about parking in some spot where we're not sure we'd be welcome.

The only time I parked on a city street was in front of my sons' home. While I felt conspicuous getting out in the morning (fishbowl syndrome), I wasn't doing anything that anyone could possibly complain about.

I don't pull in to a town without already  having checked out where I can park for the night...Cracker Barrels, W/M, truck stops etc. etc. etc. There are so many places to park where you're not going to be bothered - why bother to park some place that's questionable.

I'd say that amongst full time van dwellers, the ones that don't worry are in the majority!

 

[Rayd888]

Awesome. I guess that judging from YouTube videos and some posts, I got the Impression that finding a free place to park and sleep was a time consuming issue.

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[Almost There]

How difficult it is depends entirely on where you are in North America.

If you're stuck in a big city then it can certainly be problematic. Streets are crowded, there's all kinds of parking restrictions etc. And even then those that absolutely must be in the city can still find places to sleep for the night with just a little ingenuity and exploring.

If you're free to roam just about anywhere west of the Mississippi then it's not much of a problem at all. The far east coast is a little bit more difficult because there is not a lot of BLM/National Forest land to choose from but even then with a little planning you can do it rather effortlessly.

Personally, I do whatever I  need to do to avoid a big city! Horrible places in my mind... And anything other than really rural is just a place to pass through and do my shopping....

Take a look at a site: Freecampsites.net for your state and then zoom in on the hundreds of campsites that they list. You'll be amazed at what you can find. And that doesn't even usually include all the parking lots that you are able to stay in without being bothered.

As to YouTubers moaning and groaning about finding places...well if they made it sound easy to them the video would only be a minute long and wouldn't attract any attention. Think of it like the 6 o'clock news...if it isn't blood and gore or bad politicians it won't make the headlines.

 

[GeorgiePorgie]

Awesome. I guess that judging from YouTube videos and some posts, I got the Impression that finding a free place to park and sleep was a time consuming issue.

I've gotten the opposite impression. If you use common sense, you will have very few problems with the police. I hope to get a van soon, but I have a friend who has been living in his for years without many problems. I met him at the local public swimming pool where he has a membership and comes to shave and shower everyday. He keeps it to himself, but I kept seeing him in his van and realized what he was doing.

 

[DLTooley]

There is no reason not to be polite. Once you are asked to leave private property don’t go back.

The law on police officers is trickier, generally they need probable cause. A no sleeping ordinance gives them that, but is challengeable. That is a fight worth fighting, but doing it alone is not advised

If you just drive off from an officer that alone can be construed as probable cause. I would audio record any conversation including the question. “Can I leave?”

 

[deadwood]

I find that finding a good spot to park us usually pretty easy... unless in a big city like San Francisco or Seattle. It's almost impossible to find free parking in the big cities and I usually would not feel safe parking in those downtown areas either. I am however about to move to Philadelphia so I will find out when I get there what the parking situation is. Most likely I will park a little out of the city in the burbs where I think it will be easy to find places to park.

As to the issue of answering a knock on the van door in the middle of the night. I would definitely make sure who it is out there before I let them know I was in the van. But I would also do everything I could not to park in a parking lot. It is private property after all. It is not usually difficult to find legal parking on the street. And as long as you aren't in front of someones house I doubt it will be a problem. But if I did park in a lot and get a knock I would answer if if was the police and if it was security I would crack the window a little and tell them I'm moving on. No reason to be rude.

 

[RVTravel]

And hopefully security would not try to block you in by pulling up across the front of your vehicle.