vandwelling in film, press, utube, facebook, radio,

[flying kurbmaster]

Yet another person has come forward with the novel idea of filming vandwellers. Is this a good idea? Is this helpful for the vandwellers or is this making a few people famous, do websites, news articles, films, utube channels, gatherings etc focused on vandwelling help or hinder, Do they improve those living the lifestyle, are they seen as positive or do they expose a lifestyle that wants to remain stealth. Do they shine a positive light or are they here to entertain the dreamers. Do they add fuel to town and city administrations to legislate more restrictions. Should you participate in them. What is the point, is there a point? Can ones ego resist the lure of being in front of a camera, being forever immortalized, does anyone care? Can overexposure hurt vandwellers like the lost tribes of the amazon. Should we let them be or should everyone move to the Amazon and join them? Should we hide behind every tree like a paparazzi on Oscar night, Is there a tipping point?

 

[Lafnbug]

Count me as one that says:

"Leave well enough alone". This site in and of itself is a double edged sword. It is extremely helpful to those, like myself, that needed help/inspiration. But as the movement grows, you can be sure that mainstream knowledge of it will complicate it and regulate it to misery. I hope I am wrong, but this is the country I know.

 

[Gary68]

it's a passing fad,i am extremely boring and dont like modern t.v. so in the evening i watch fetv,lone ranger then roy rogers then lassie,the other night lassie got lost and had to make her way back home,on the way she ran across a couple suffer guys in a 1950's-60's stepside campervan,that night the propane stove turned itself on and lassie woke them up and saved the day

point being,"van dwelling" is nothing new,conestoga wagon or the roma,been going on forever

 

[Every Road Leads Home]

It's such a niche segment of the population such that most probably have no idea such a people even exists. Many that do know don't care and those that do care will have little to no impact on those doing it as a whole. There will be more regulations to follow for stick and bricker's than there ever will be for the traveling nomad.

Seems van dwellers are an adaptable bunch as a whole and i'm sure we can all adapt to any new roadblocks sent our way.

and it's the inconsiderate, overstay their welcome, leave trash behind, set up their living room in a parking lot, think they own the world van dwelling types that do us more harm than 1000 videos ever will..

 

[FALCON]

That sure is a lot of question marks used to share what an obviously very strong opinion. Why not just say what you think clearly instead of all the loaded questions?

I don't see a problem with Vandwelling being trendy or becoming more trendy. The trend will pass. It's not some kind of secret to life that's going to change a bunch of laws. I also think it's a little funny that people are happy to have found vandwelling and proud to be doing so, but don't want others to know about it. It's like a highschool hipster who loves some obscure band but would hate if that band became popular.

I do have mixed feelings about the documentary proposed in the thread you're responding to. This is because the intended subject appears to have the "homeless" slant: focusing on people who were forced into vandwelling by bad circumstances. I think unrealistic to film people at the RTR for that kind of focus. If she wants to film people who are down on their luck, she could go to Portland to get better examples. Those folks don't have gas money to drive out to the middle of nowhere in Arizona for a sort of party/gathering.

 

[Thirsty Boots Nomad]

Maybe I'm missing something; I've never seen any documentaries about vandwelling/nomadic that were really detrimental to those living the lifestyle or really wanting to join it. Sure, there have been several that didn't focus on the positive aspects, instead of focusing on potential pitfalls; but the people I've talked to about those portrayals (and myself) took those as warnings of what to avoid/prevent happening. In fact, the MOST negative documentaries/videos that included anything nomadic/vandwelling were mostly about the segment that doesn't move --- ie. stay in "Walmart" parking lots for multiple days, do not move locations daily (do not park in multiple places in a city if they are not living "on the road" so their rig looks possibly abandoned), do not maintain/clean their rig, etc.

Basically, I'm of the mind that anything that focuses a light on "alternative" possible lifestyles allows people (who, let's face it have to be at least partially interested to even be able to find it to watch) to see if it might be something they want to check out AND somewhat forces the lazier, "lower" segment of that "lifestyle" into some type of recognition. In the case of the nomadic/vandwelling lifestyle, it shows specific people that think they are "owed" new/repaired/etc. vehicles and boondocking areas or spots and anything else even though they have, thus far, not cared for or respected what they and the general public already have. The "restrictions" already in place and any in the future are, imo, in response to 1. campgrounds/resorts (and their organizations) that are worried about people not staying there because the campground is too costly/unclean/unsafe/etc. and 2. vandwellers/rv'ers that don't have any respect for themselves, their property, or anyone else's property --- sure; it hurts the majority that lives this lifestyle responsibly sometimes, but for the most part the "restrictions" are bent and/or overlooked when someone's demonstrating their responsibility (unless there has been recent or overwhelming incidents of the minority's irresponsibility).

When I was nomadic before, I never had a problem because I didn't "camp" in Walmart parking lots or stay on someone's private land without permission, my rig was kept clean and in good working order, and any disturbance or potential "problems" I might cause were kept to a minimum (e.g. trash, generator noise, taking up multiple "good" parking spots) --- I became stationary because of the number of nomads (including my parents) I personally encountered that thought there was nothing wrong with staying in a Walmart parking lot for several days in a row without moving, either throwing their trash on the ground or filling up one can with their accumulated trash rather than taking it to the dumpster so no one had to clean up after them, and ran their generators or played music loud enough to disturb people around them and I didn't want to be confused with people thinking I was like them.

 

[SternWake]

While I'd like there to be less of a Stigma with a bedroom on wheels lifestyle, I also do not want to see hordes doing so, as the ignorant self absorbed few, always cause the implementation of rules and laws that affect everybody who might never have caused an issue.

With many of the younger generation having no respect for anything but their immediate selfish desires, and no consideration for anybody other than for themselves, I would much rather they never even consider this lifestyle, and remain unaware of it, or even scoff at it entirely. Such people's opinion matters not one whit to me, and I do not want to interact with them, or with those stick and brickers who are offended/annoyed/indignant at their methods of getting by/ beating the system.

I would prefer the rest of Humanity to play their 'keeping up with the Jonses' " consumerist $lave wage driven hell, and leave me out of it. So any attention brought to this lifestyle, in my book, is negative, unless it keeps the hordes from considering living in the same manner.

Which of course makes me a hypocrite, but who isn't?

 

[DannyB1954]

At some point the public land administrators might say that the public lands were not intended to be places for people to live. There might come a time where you are allowed X number of days a year to camp on public land. If they can make you register and move every 12 days, they can track how many times they have had contact with you. I think trash and destruction left behind will have more impact than a video. If the video can educate people to leave no trace, It may even put vandwellers in a better light with the caretakers of the land.

Basic rule is follow the money. At the present time I would say that there are already dozens of Youtube interviews of vandwellers. People who have monetized Youtube channels make money from them. What incentive would they have to stop making them? So now that the horses are gone should we worry about closing the doors? An interesting thought is if the maker of the documentary makes money from the video, is a release needed from all those in the video? Do the stars of the show deserve compensation? I am not clear on how all that works.

If the videos of Slab City have not brought any action, I don't see how how this particular video will cause public opinion to shift. Now that I think of it, there may be a need to video fairly normal decent people just so that the videos of those not so normal do not skew public opinion.

I guess my bottom line is I am not in control of anybody. Anyone with a cell phone can do a video, and they do not need an invite to be there. As far as the people being interviewed, I guess they will have to consider how the video will impact their particular life after it is released.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

It's such a niche segment of the population such that most probably have no idea such a people even exists.  Many that do know don't care and those that do care will have little to no impact on those doing it as a whole.   There will be more regulations to follow for stick and bricker's than there ever will be for the traveling nomad.  

Seems van dwellers are an adaptable bunch as a whole and i'm sure we can all adapt to any new roadblocks sent our way.  

and it's the inconsiderate, overstay their welcome, leave trash behind, set up their living room in a parking lot,  think they own the world van dwelling types that do us more harm than 1000 videos ever will..

that is all very well but how did we find out that this type of vandweller existed, and I guess you could also  say that this type of vandweller is such a niche segment of the vandwelling population that most would have no idea they existed.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

That sure is a lot of question marks used to share what an obviously very strong opinion. Why not just say what you think clearly instead of all the loaded questions?

 I started this thread because no one else did after Bob suggested to do so, I have often wondered if all this attention to vandwelling impacted it negatively, even if it is presented with a positive tilt. Vandwelling is not highly esteemed in society, believe it or not, I thought how media affects it was a good topic for debate. Your analogy of the hipster, is flattering. Most of the enjoyment the so called hipster, gets from seeing his favorite obscure band, is that he does not have to deal with line ups, crowds, the ticket prices, the drug and alcohol abuse followed by the music changing, that goes with becoming a rock star with too much fame and money. Of course by  the time that happens and everybody is lining up the trendsetter will be off watching a new band.

 

[eDJ_]

Just a few weeks ago CBS Sunday Morning TV show aired  a piece on people doing this.  They showed higher end people who were living in a large Class C and working at what I would call State Park Resorts.   They weren't making the money that they had made in their Corporate Jobs but were now working more menial jobs and reporting more satisfaction. 

I think the show treated the story fairly but I couldn't help sense a undertow of middle class "downward mobility" in today's America.  I believe Jane Pauley covered the story.

 

[Gadget728]

Since joining this Site, anytime I'm near a Wal Mart or truck stop, I check out the "other" vehicles in the parking lots. I've noticed that Class A's or big 5th wheels are right out in the middle and the less expensive rigs on the fringes.

 

[Lafnbug]

How is presenting someone's last resort before homelessness, for entertainment and a paycheck, furthering most dweller's plights?

Do you think more public awareness is going to make OUR world a better place?

Do you think more public awareness is going to make THEIR world a better place?

The only freedoms we enjoy are the ones that are under the radar. Like us.

I believe that anyone interested will seek this information, and find plenty. They are welcomed with open arms. I don't believe it needs to be presented to The Masses of Asses for their edification and viewing pleasure. Maybe I don't understand the intended audience. But, there's already plenty out there.

Bob has done a fantastic thing by hosting and promoting this site, for which I thank him, and all the contributors, profusely.

But, ironically, for a site that doesn't allow any political discourse, it is diametrically opposed to everything the political sphere represents. This movement is a backlash and escape from The System. There is not an abundance of escapes, and it would be nice if our fellow citizens would exercise a little discretion and give us a break, and maybe offer a little protectionism for those that are already on The Fringe.

For those that think further exposure is A Great Idea, I will kindly ask you to expound on this idea; WHY? What is the benefit?

I guess everyone wants it to be mainstream. You will probably get your wish. I hope it's only 15 minutes.

 

[Gadget728]

Media will do a story on anything. Haters will hate the idea, no matter what.

If I were to worry about anything, it would be restricting our right to camp on BLM or any public lands.

 

[rvpopeye]

I'd like to see a video about how so many places are making living in a vehicle illegal ...leaving so many folks living in their vehicle as a last resort the only place they have left with no option but move to the next town which is likely also working on the same laws..... maybe it could raise enough support to reverse all that from happening.

I'm afraid that won't happen and eventually the laws would point at public lands.........................

 

[Vagabound]

Media will do a story on anything. Haters will hate the idea, no matter what.

If I were to worry about anything, it would be restricting our right to camp on BLM or any public lands.

"Haters will hate the idea, no matter what."  I'm afraid that this saying, in general, has increasingly become used to dismiss anyone with a different opinion or objections, without the burden of even listening to what they say, much less thoughtfully evaluating it.  Likely that wasn't your intention here.  Generally, dismissing anyone out of hand is a dangerous practice.  It is partly what led to the national quagmire that the whole country was and is still stuck in.

----------

Flying kurbmaster:  Thanks for starting this thread.  It's a discussion that needs to take place and be carefully considered.

I have two main thoughts about this video/documentary topic:

1.  Exposure:  While I identify with the concepts and methods of vandwelling in general, I have no desire to be in any videos of any kind.  How exactly is a documentary filmmaker going to a) film group events, and b) keep everyone out of it who doesn't want to be videoed?  It is a realistic, practical question.  There are issues of privacy involved here.

2.  Promotion:  Although I mean this in a different way, I'd like to see this effort (or the next one) be on the theme of promotion.  I don't mean that as a recruiting tool.  Instead, promote two things:  a) good ethics for vandwelling, and b) an improved image of those doing it, not by puffing things up or exaggerating, but by showing the good, contrasting it with the bad, etc.  That type of video might do a great service, for those living this way, and for others to form a more balanced opinion, and not hyperventilate themselves into changing local or national regulations unnecessarily.

Overall, I do worry about potential negative effects from all of the video exposure that vandwelling is getting, especially those that might take place involving BLM land usage or similar tighter restrictions via local ordinances in many communities.

Tom

 

[flying kurbmaster]

another side of the argument could be, if you take it out of the closet like we have done with other fringe lifestyles over the years, you make it common, acceptable and then protected by laws. If you do as popey suggests show the injustices, expose the prejudices, we may find society will move to be more compassionate towards the idea.

 

[DannyB1954]

The assumption is being made that the video is predisposed to portraying vandwelling in a bad light. If the only people that are willing to tell the world about themselves are the down and out, guess what the video will portray. How many of you feel the video Without Bound has a negative impact on the people here?

I see interviews on youtube and think this is a reasonable intelligent person who has chosen a different path. I don't recollect seeing any interview and thinking what a loser. So as far as what the rest of society sees, I think seeing the reality of what people are like will cause less harm than what some may imagine vehicle dwellers are like.

Maybe it will even encourage some understanding. Wouldn't it be better for a S&B person to see a van and think probably a nice person traveling and trying to get some sleep, than they are casing the neighborhood? Assumptions are made by what people see in the media. Hopefully there will be a mix of people of different backgrounds. Maybe society will see we are not the boogieman.

 

[Lafnbug]

"The assumption is being made that the video is predisposed to portraying vandwelling in a bad light."
Although the production itself is a question mark, my assumption is based on human nature. No matter how many vandwelling videos are made, and regardless of their content, public opinion is unlikely to change. Unlike many, I have made it a point to share my situation with everyone in my inner circle, more as an experiment. The overall outcome is, it HAS opened eyes, but NOT minds. Perhaps the long term effect will be different.

"I see interviews on youtube and think this is a reasonable intelligent person who has chosen a different path."
The difference here is that the person made their own video, with total creative control. There was no hidden agenda or influence from a third party. Also any profit involved went to the dweller.
Risk = Reward. Plus, they can take the video down if they decide to. Not So in the case we're talking about.
Third party people, the reason for this thread, HAVE NO SKIN IN THE GAME. They are unaffected by the cumulative outcome.

"Maybe it will even encourage some understanding. Wouldn't it be better for a S&B person to see a van and think probably a nice person traveling and trying to get some sleep, than they are casing the neighborhood? Assumptions are made by what people see in the media. Hopefully there will be a mix of people of different backgrounds. Maybe society will see we are not the boogieman."
We all want this, but seeing how the homeless are treated, I highly doubt this. As far as society as a whole is concerned, we ARE homeless.

Once a critical mass of awareness is raised, and everyone is aware of the Concept of Vehicle Living, those in this lifestyle will be under constant scrutiny. Human nature is Herd Mentality/Hive Think. You have to understand that The System as a whole does not want you "Opting Out". The concept of Legal Fiction, 'Home Address', Licenses, Real ID Act, License Plates, cameras, surveillance, No Parking signs, etc, are all about CONTROL. If you are viewed as someone Out Of Control, both the citizenry and the bureaucracies will look for ways to bring you under control.

The campground industry alone is responsible for many of the statutes making it illegal for RVs to boondock in areas that RVers themselves paid taxes to build and maintain! Everyone wants their pound of flesh.

But, what do I know? I know that I am in the minority here!

 

[Lafnbug]

another side of the argument could be, if you take it out of the closet like we have done with other fringe lifestyles over the years, you make it common, acceptable and then protected by laws. If you do as popey suggests show the injustices, expose the  prejudices, we may find society will move to be more compassionate towards the idea.

Love ya, Kurbmaster, but how has that worked out for the homeless?

I believe that NO ONE is going to go to bat for vandwellers, in the legal arena. And dwellers don't have a bottomless pit of legal funds, the support of public opinion, or a system of bureaucratic support behind them.

Oh well...