Uhhh ohhh did I get too thick of metal flooring?

[TucsonAZ]

Okay so, I've been MIA for awhile, last year I took my trip in a class a and didn't have a step van build or anything fancy to show for myself.  This year I'm doing a tiny (5x10) enclosed trailer and I'm not skimping, it's getting a shower, sink, stove, microwave, ac, converter, 460 watts of solar, 5,500 watt battery bank and I'm clearly stuffing a lot into this thing.  

I don't like chemicals and didn't want the plywood floor so I yanked that and was trying to figure out what to do.  I love working with metal so was thinking aluminum but it wasn't structural enough in a price range I could afford.  I decided on steel (with a simple carpet over) and was planning on 14 gauge but wanted to be safe versus sorry so I upped it to 12 gauge.  I get the the metal supply place and they have 3 sheets of 4'x5' in the remnants area for half price but yeah um, it's 10 gauge, 5.5 pounds per square foot!  Since my life motto is "anything worth doing is worth doing in excess" and I love saving money I pull the trigger but now I'm wondering if I went too far as this stuff is hard core!

I'm not "too" worried about weight but the trailer sticker says not to add more than 1,940 pounds, I'm guessing that's with the plywood flooring which would have weighed 90 pounds versus the 275 this steel weighs so a gain of 185 pounds.

Advantages I can come up with (please help me justify):

1)  Lower center of gravity (I flipped the axle)
2)  I can cut out areas and box them in to drop the floor for things like the water tank (I don't think 14 gauge would have been strong enough)
3)  I can screw things down to it with some certainty there's plenty of threads to hold

Any additional things I could be missing?

I was also thinking of welding the metal flooring to the bottom of the framing to gain a couple inches in some interior areas.  Any thoughts on this plan, I would have to run like 50 feet of bead to do this but that's fine with me.  

PS Here's last years rig and the trailer in question.

 

[poncho62]

I'm sorry, but what is wrong with plywood? If you are in any home, you are surrounded by the stuff and many other things with the nasties in it. BTW, what are the walls of your enclosed trailer made of? How are you going to attach the carpet to the steel panels?...My guess is glue (nasties)......Just sayin'

 

[TucsonAZ]

I'm sorry, but what is wrong with plywood? If you are in any home, you are surrounded by the stuff and many other things with the nasties in it. BTW, what are the walls of your enclosed trailer made of? How are you going to attach the carpet to the steel panels?...My guess is glue (nasties)......Just sayin'

Odd, I wouldn't expect a post to get derailed on the internet How about we just assume I'm smarter than I look and have thought this through? Okay fine, we don't need to do that, this is the web after all. The walls are aluminum, any wood in the trailer is a hardwood that doesn't release terpens, wool carpet but I guess I should say throw rug as I'm not planning to affix it. I may do a thin hardwood floor though if I find a good deal, I have some 5/8th oak.

Plywood is just perfect for you or anybody else that's making an informed (or uninformed for that matter) choice but it doesn't work for my life goals. I'm also insulating with a rigid foam board polyiso that doesn't use any flame retardant to further reduce chemicals, 100% latex mattress (Dunlop process) and so on.

Thank you for responding, it would apply to most people but I take this over the top seriously.

 

[BradKW]

I like how you think... I'd suggest a couple more pieces of 10ga up the walls to form a bunker box in preparation for the coming Zombie Apocalypse. Firing slots in walls would probably be a good idea too...

 

[ArtW]

I can't really add anything as a positive, but other than higher weight I don't see any cons, either

 

[Almost There]

Okay so, I've been MIA for awhile, last year I took my trip in a class a and didn't have a step van build or anything fancy to show for myself.  This year I'm doing a tiny (5x10) enclosed trailer and I'm not skimping, it's getting a shower, sink, stove, microwave, ac, converter, 460 watts of solar, 5,500 watt battery bank and I'm clearly stuffing a lot into this thing. 

Advantages I can come up with (please help me justify):

1)  Lower center of gravity (I flipped the axle)
2)  I can cut out areas and box them in to drop the floor for things like the water tank (I don't think 14 gauge would have been strong enough)
3)  I can screw things down to it with some certainty there's plenty of threads to hold

Any additional things I could be missing?

I was also thinking of welding the metal flooring to the bottom of the framing to gain a couple inches in some interior areas.  Any thoughts on this plan, I would have to run like 50 feet of bead to do this but that's fine with me.  

I'm just a bit concerned about a couple of things and since you asked!

5,500 watts of battery - I hope that was a typo and that you meant 500 amphours not watts?

500 ah of battery probably isn't enough to carry the a/c that you plan on unless you add a generator and I don't see one in the plan.

You said you flipped the axle but that would raise the trailer not 'lower the center of gravity'. Flipping the axle normally raises the trailer to give you more ground clearance. If indeed you lowered the trailer then I have to question how you're going to be able to put below floor water tanks in without scraping ground even on good roads never mind NF and BLM roads since it appears you're planning on boondocking.

And finally, have you made any attempt to add up the weight of EVERTHING you plan on putting in or on the trailer, including the weight of water, batteries etc. etc.

If not, then now would be the time to do so....before you add the weight of the steel to the trailer.

 

[BradKW]

Actually, watt hours is a more accurate measurement of battery capacity...Amp hours is only useful for 12v. But 5500wh is about 460ah...

 

[Queen]

It's pretty awesome that you can work with metal. Do you think the floor will get super hot/cold since metal conducts temps so well?? Although wool carpet could ameliorate it some.

 

[abnorm]

I went back and read some of your early posts..............I see you have Multiple Chemical Sensitivity........

How did the Class A work out with your condition ?

And I'm not following the 10 ga Aluminum weight per foot................Steel weighs your 5 lbs.............Al is a pound and a half

And You know what they say about ASSUME

 

[highdesertranger]

ok I have to say something about the "flipping the axle". flipping the axle is the old days. you CAN NOT flip an axle anymore to gain ground clearance. trailer axles are not straight anymore, they have an arch to them that straightens out when loaded. if you flip the axle you have thrown the geometry out of wack. if you flip it the arc will be going in the wrong direction, then when you load it the axle will flex in the wrong direction. this WILL cause damage to the axle.

the right way to gain ground clearance is to get a new set of weld on spring pads and move the axle from a spring under configuration to a spring over configuration, YOU DO NOT FLIP THE AXLE. this is the ONLY right way to gain ground clearance on a newer trailer(last 25-30 years). BTW, new U-bolts must be used too. trailer U-bolts are stretched to torque and are one time use only. highdesertranger

 

[highdesertranger]

oh yeah the metal floor. I would have gone with Aluminum. they should have aluminum remnants too. highdesertranger

 

[Every Road Leads Home]

Everyone still uses the term flip the axles still, I actually never knew they were literally flipped, I just thought it meant flipping it from under the springs to over the springs, thus flipping of the axle. Like flipping a coin in the air.

 

[highdesertranger]

back in they day you used to flip your drop axles to gain ground clearance. no mas. today a lot of people move them to the bottom of the spring but because they don't have a welder they flip them over so the spring pad rides on the spring. big nono. highdesertranger

 

[abnorm]

opps.................I saw Aluminum................You said steel..................sorry about that

 

[TucsonAZ]

I love this forum, you guys totally rock and are my kinda crazy [people]!

I like how you think... I'd suggest a couple more pieces of 10ga up the walls to form a bunker box in preparation for the coming Zombie Apocalypse. Firing slots in walls would probably be a good idea too...

Yeah, I was thinking the very same thing, I might go with 4 gauge on the floor in case of land mines and 10 gauge for the walls.  

I'm just a bit concerned about a couple of things and since you asked!

5,500 watts of battery - I hope that was a typo and that you meant 500 amphours not watts?

500 ah of battery probably isn't enough to carry the a/c that you plan on unless you add a generator and I don't see one in the plan.

You said you flipped the axle but that would raise the trailer not 'lower the center of gravity'. Flipping the axle normally raises the trailer to give you more ground clearance. If indeed you lowered the trailer then I have to question how you're going to be able to put below floor water tanks in without scraping ground even on good roads never mind NF and BLM roads since it appears you're planning on boondocking.

And finally, have you made any attempt to add up the weight of EVERTHING you plan on putting in or on the trailer, including the weight of water, batteries etc. etc.

If not, then now would be the time to do so....before you add the weight of the steel to the trailer.

I meant 5,500 watts, I have two 12V 230 amp hour batteries in a 24v system.  I may lug around a EU1000i with me but the AC unit I've selected is a 5,000 btu that I modified with a hard start capacitor, even on high it only pulls 450 watts so with a fully charged bank and a 50% discharge I could run it for let's say 6 hours without the sun shinning.  I mostly just need it to let me sleep in a couple extra hours not to run all the time.

Yes, flipped the axle so it's got roughly 22" of ground clearance if you don't count the axle height.  I was saying the metal floor would lower the center of gravity adding so much weight so low.  

I have added up the weight including 300 pounds of personal things and I've over estimated all weights and that leave me roughly 50 pounds to spare.  

It's pretty awesome that you can work with metal.  Do you think the floor will get super hot/cold since metal conducts temps so well??  Although wool carpet could ameliorate it some.

I'm going to add some insulation, it will be in the shade and I don't know if I want to drill a hole in the cross braces and spray foam them but it's an option, either way there will be some thermal bridging.  

I went back and read some of your early posts..............I see you have Multiple Chemical Sensitivity........

How did the Class A work out with your condition ?

Well, it was fine but it mostly just took me a really long time to find one that hadn't been contaminated already.  It was a 20 year old model, the windows were open often and I ran a carbon scrubber a lot of the time.  It wasn't the ideal but it was fine for a month long trip other than taking 9 months of looking to find the right one.  I also dumped 50 pounds of baking soda on everything (vacuumed up later of course) and removed all the stuff that was more prone to bothering me.  

ok I have to say something about the "flipping the axle".  flipping the axle is the old days.  you CAN NOT flip an axle anymore to gain ground clearance. BTW, new U-bolts must be used too.  trailer U-bolts are stretched to torque and are one time use only.  highdesertranger

HDR come on now, expect better from me!  I used to own 7 FJ40s, 7 FZJ80s and a 100 series...all at the same time!!  I said "axle flip" because it was easier than "axle removed, new spring mounts welded in place and axle replaced with new u-bolts torqued to 65ftlbs" which is a mouth full.    

oh yeah the metal floor.  I would have gone with Aluminum.  they should have aluminum remnants too.  highdesertranger

I just called, even the new price isn't as bad as I thought but here's my thinking.  Firstly I have to deal with galvanic reaction, secondly if I put the floor under the cross members I would have to use mechanical fasteners which I don't trust as much as welds and lastly I don't have a tig welder anymore so any pockets I decide to make would be much, much harder to fabricate.  It isn't too late, a 5x10 sheet of 10 gauge is $225 and weights 87 pounds which is a 188 pound savings but other than rusting I'm struggling to see the advantages.

 

[highdesertranger]

sorry I jumped to conclusions. I understand that you understand. however for the sake of people that don't understand I wish people would explain correctly. most people still think it's perfectly fine to flip the axle. they move it to under the spring but then they flip it instead of welding the pads on and doing it right. then they quote all the people who use the term "flipping the axle". highdesertranger

 

[Every Road Leads Home]

Any reason you didn't just go with a solid wood deck in lieu of the plywood? Some nice 5/4 oak or similar and you'd have no chemicals, lighter than the metal and the finished floor all in one shot.

 

[TucsonAZ]

Any reason you didn't just go with a solid wood deck in lieu of the plywood? Some nice 5/4 oak or similar and you'd have no chemicals, lighter than the metal and the finished floor all in one shot.

Fair question, mostly it was because I would need to buy something like a metal flashing for the very bottom to keep the wood from the road debris and elements. Also because it wouldn't be as easy for me to do things like mount the water tank under it without the plastic being exposed to rocks and such. Also, I live in Arizona so 1.25" thick oak would have coast me a sold $350-$400 plus the cost of flashing and so on. If I lived in another area I would have gone this route though for sure.

 

[BradKW]

I'm fairly certain that what is used in box truck floors is Southern Yellow Pine...it's a very dense and strong pine. It's readily available and not too expensive...I buy it for making stair treads, staging platforms, and recently replaced all the closet shelves in a hotel so they were strong enough to support the room safes.

I have been surprised at how durable my box floor is on the unprotected underside, where bare wood is open to the road and elements, and heat from exhaust. If I were doing it new, I'd definitely use something on undersides, maybe Rhino coat, but for a 14 yr old floor, the only signs of decay have been from roof leaks above, not exposure below...

 

[DLTooley]

I have mild MCS, and a whole lot of the associated. I sleep under an open truck canopy and have tons of ventilation. Natural planking would be an option as the floor seal doesn't need to be perfect. Can you tolerate linseed oil?