Summer location recommendations?

[Richard]

Hi, Everyone. It's been a while, I know. Life happens and all that

The Internet is full of sites with data and chances are I've scoured many of them. Their utility varies a lot so I'm going to take a different approach. Instead of more data [overload], I'm looking for recommendations based on your personal experience of a place.

I'm looking for someplace to boondock and/or stealth camp for June, July, and August.

Things that matter most to me, in no particular order:

1. Air quality -- ozone and particulate matter are bad for us (much worse than many people realize) and I prefer, whenever possible, to dwell in better, rather than worse, conditions.

2. Weather comfort -- Temperature wise, I'm most comfortable at a maximum of 72-73. An occasional variation higher -- and I do mean infrequent -- would be ok if there was plenty of shade and/or a decent breeze to offset the increase in warmth.

3. Altitude -- I've had altitude illness twice now: once in Flagstaff, AZ and once in Timberon, NM. It seems that I'm ok up to around 6k feet above sea level. Higher, and I start to experience symptoms. Flagstaff was mild and simply driving to a lower elevation brought relief. My experience in Timberon was much worse and I ended up in the hospital where it was confirmed that my oxygen levels were low and not recovering typically. All that to say that a maximum of 5k-ish feet above sea level is my limit.

4. Safety -- I know, this is a personal value assessment. Use your criteria as a baseline for your recommendations and if I have questions, I'll ask for clarification (or, if you're feeling chatty, feel free to elaborate in advance).

5. Peaceful -- I enjoy going to sleep when I'm tired, and waking up naturally when I'm refreshed. The noises in nature, so far, haven't been problematic for me but the noise of civilization really gets to me. Loud music, loud people, sirens, horns, etc., are deal breakers.

6. Convenient access to civilization -- I sometimes wrestle with anxiety. Sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. For those times when anxiety is getting the best of me, having a reasonably nearby hospital parking lot to sit in for an hour or two until the panic-mode subsides can be game-changing for me. As such, I suppose I'd like to be within an hour's drive of a hospital just in case.

7. Convenient access to legal recreational cannabis -- After many years playing the role of 'lab rat' for various psychiatric 'cocktails', with very little stability/success, a medical professional suggested I consider medical marijuana. It took me about a year to get over the stigma of being mischaracterized as someone who was making excuses just to get high, at which point I applied for medical use in New Mexico. I was approved and the first time I walked into a dispensary, it was the beginning of one of the most useful and fascinating educational experiences of my life. After a year of occasional use (by which I mean, only 4 visits to the dispensary, and using only once or twice a month as needed), I let my card expire because I intended to travel out of state and the card is only good in New Mexico.

I'm not fond of the East Coast so the recreationally legal states of Massachusetts and Maine aren't high on my list of possibilities. That leaves Colorado, Nevada, California, Oregon, and Washington state as possible locations where legal access is available. (This is significantly restricted for non-resident use as the places where one may imbibe are generally limited, as far as I know, to one's personal residence -- and, one's vehicle isn't generally regarded as qualifying as one's residence so... just a nuance to consider).

If this point (#7) can be satisfied, then the previous point (#6) is likely nullified. If #7 can't be satisfied, then #6 becomes a higher priority.

8. Cost of living -- I'm slowly transitioning to more raw food in my diet so that, rather than meat, eggs, milk, etc., I'm more interested in fuits & veggies. The other big expense category is gasoline: less expensive is better than more expensive.

So, that's it. I'm not asking you to do research for me. I'm literally overwhelmed by data at this point. If you've been someplace that satisfies many/most of my criteria, I'd love to hear from you!

Thanks in advance

 

[slynne]

Except for the marijuana requirement, I would say that Michigan’s Upper Peninsula could be an option if you stayed near the larger cities. Marquette is fairly centrally located and has a hospital but there are other cities with hospitals too such as Sault Ste Marie and St Ignace in the East and Houghton and Ironwood in the West. Michigan does have legal medical marijuana and as I understand it reciprocal agreements with other states but as of yet, no provisions for recreational use. A google search only shows one dispensary though and it is all the way up in Houghton. One nice thing about the UP is that you can boondock in state forests for free and I am pretty sure the same is true with the national forests and there is a LOT of state and national forests in the UP.

 

[Blanch]

Your answer is most likely Oregon. I just left Klamath Falls Oregon and it was very nice, there a numerous places on freecampsites.net to stay at in Oregon. You should be able to chase 70 degree weather between the coast and mountains. When the mountains get too warm head towards the coast and you will not have altitude problems.

Marijuana is legal, there are many good hospitals. I would also recommend the Brookings Oregon area.


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[highdesertranger]

I was going to say get above 7k. so now I say go north and get along the coast or above 5k. Oregon is probably your best bet however gas is not the cheapest. highdesertranger

 

[Richard]

... Michigan’s Upper Peninsula could be an option if you stayed near the larger cities. ...

Thanks for your reply, Slynne. Seems a good fit re: temperature.

... One nice thing about the UP is that you can boondock in state forests for free ...

Sounds promising.

What can you tell me about black flies in the upper peninsula? From what I've read, they make summers there intolerable. Thoughts?

 

[Richard]

Your answer is most likely Oregon. ... You should be able to chase 70 degree weather between the coast and mountains.

Hi, Blanch. Yes, Oregon is definitely a candidate area on the basis of temperature. Not only Oregon, but also Washington's coast, particularly near Bellingham, was on my short list of preferred places to spend the summer.

That said, during my research I found a sobering article from the July 2015's "The New Yorker" magazine. It's a lengthy piece exploring the seismic risk to Washington's and Oregon's coastline. That risk comes from a fault known as the Cascadia subduction zone, and it poses far more significant risk than the San Andreas ever has, or is projected to have, on California.

It's not at all a fear-mongering piece. In fact, the following year its author won the Pulitzer Prize and a National Magazine Award for feature writing. I consider it a fine example of journalism and very relevant to any plans one may entertain to spend time along the Washington-Oregon coastline:

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/07/20/the-really-big-one

The follow-up piece is here:

http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/how-to-stay-safe-when-the-big-one-comes

I don't know if you'll read that pair of articles but if you do (or if anyone else does), I'm interested to hear of thoughts about staying in that area in light of the information presented in those two pieces.

 

[Richard]

I was going to say get above 7k.  so now I say go north and get along the coast or above 5k.

Thanks, HDR. I'm thinking 'north' may be a better option for me than the Pacific Northwest coastline (see my reply to Blanch for reasons). Given the forecast for this summer (1-minute video here: Summer 2017 Temperature Outlook), it seems that most of North Dakota, most of northernmost central- and eastern- areas of Montana, and northern Wisconsin are now finalists in my area selection.

If you (or anyone else reading this) are familiar with those areas, I'm interested in more specific recommendations.

 

[CautionToTheWind]

I would choose Montana. (for me, passport, Canada).

 

[Blanch]

Hi, Blanch. Yes, Oregon is definitely a candidate area on the basis of temperature. Not only Oregon, but also Washington's coast, particularly near Bellingham, was on my short list of preferred places to spend the summer.

That said, during my research I found a sobering article from the July 2015's "The New Yorker" magazine. It's a lengthy piece exploring the seismic risk to Washington's and Oregon's coastline. That risk comes from a fault known as the Cascadia subduction zone, and it poses far more significant risk than the San Andreas ever has, or is projected to have, on California.

It's not at all a fear-mongering piece. In fact, the following year its author won the Pulitzer Prize and a National Magazine Award for feature writing. I consider it a fine example of journalism and very relevant to any plans one may entertain to spend time along the Washington-Oregon coastline:

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/07/20/the-really-big-one

The follow-up piece is here:

http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/how-to-stay-safe-when-the-big-one-comes

......

Well...... I was a geological sciences major in college with a minor in physics. The article is well written and does a good job of explaining the science. But it is fear mongering. We live on a planet and stuff happens on a planet. Tsunamis, earthquakes, tornados, hurricanes, wild fires..... I can't protect myself from all of it. If it's my time then it's my time.

BTW I lived in Crescent City when the 2011 tsunami hit. I was working as a senior DBA and I got a call at about 5am that a tsunami was on the way. I went into work and unplugged my server and put it in my truck and went to high ground. There was plenty of warning for that particular disaster.

That evening I went to the harbor and got a picture of the free floating ships in the damaged harbor at sunset. I won a award for the picture.

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[DLTooley]

You'll have to go North to get temps at a lower elevation. With the need for recreational marijuana that list gets short. Some States may offer reciprocity on Medical Status. I also wouldn't rule out AK and Canada.

 

[Richard]

Well...... I was a geological sciences major in college with a minor in physics.  The article is well written and does a good job of explaining the science.

Agreed.

But it is fear mongering.

Perhaps we understand the term "fear mongering" differently. On this point I respectfully disagree with you.

We live on a planet and stuff happens on a planet.

Tautology, yes?

Tsunamis, earthquakes, tornados, hurricanes, wild fires..... I can't protect myself from all of it.

I don't believe it's an all-or-nothing proposition. Excluded middle?

If it's my time then it's my time.

That's a personal conviction, and it's fine to embrace it on a personal level. I believe it crosses a line, though, when you project a personally held belief such that it's now alleged to have some substance 'out there', beyond the confines of your personally held space.

I don't believe that there's some fore-ordained time that I'm scheduled to go. I believe that I have agency in the world, and that to be aware of some of the things that can happen, and to take some steps to avoid, or minimize, the risk of those things affecting me adversely, is distinct from the motive/practice of fear-mongering. The author's follow-up piece goes on to elaborate that there's no need to be in a panic about the science and that there are some very practical steps one can take if one wishes to put oneself in that environment. She also goes on to say that she grew up there, still spends summers there, etc.

In short, not at all a fear-mongering piece the way I understand the term. To me, in order to qualify as fear-mongering, the author would have to also have omitted some very important elements in the science, misrepresented (whether by ignorance or malice) at least some of the science (e.g., out of context, exaggerated, etc.), and would have drawn an alarmist conclusion (with no space for discussion) that everyone needs to evacuate as soon as possible because, otherwise, they're all going to die. I didn't get a sense that any, much less all, of those elements were present, hence, not fear-mongering -- again, as I understand the term.

All that said, I appreciate you having taken the time to read those pieces and to feedback as requested.

BTW I lived in Crescent City when the 2011 tsunami hit. I was working as a senior DBA and I got a call at about 5am that a tsunami was on the way. I went into work and unplugged my server and put it in my truck and went to high ground. There was plenty of warning for that particular disaster.

Anecdotal. Granted, it's a data point. But, hardly established as representative of the range of plausible range & experiences of Cascadian subduction activity.

That evening I went to the harbor and got a picture of the free floating ships in the damaged harbor at sunset. I won a award for the picture.

Absolutely gorgeous image. Congratulations on the award.

 

[Richard]

I would choose Montana. (for me, passport, Canada).

Having only passed briefly through the bottom of Montana, and that several years ago, I'm not familiar with it beyond topography maps and online comments. Any particular areas of Montana that you'd prefer?

Some of my reading about Montana includes some fierce winds coming down from Canada, mostly the central plains area if I recall correctly. Some areas, like Missoula, seem protectively nestled in the mountains and so less affected by wind, but with the down-side that as a major highway corridor, a lot of the industrial and exhaust often gets trapped in the valley due to temperature inversions, making the air quality horrendous even to imagine for a day, much less for a season. Even so, I imagine a state as big as Montana probably has pockets of micro-climate where there's less intrusive wind intensity but that are still open enough to allow for a cleansing air movement to keep air pollutants to a minimum. That said, any places come to mind?

 

[Richard]

You'll have to go North to get temps at a lower elevation. With the need for recreational marijuana that list gets short. Some States may offer reciprocity on Medical Status. I also wouldn't rule out AK and Canada.

I wasn't aware of possible medical reciprocity before replies to my original post mentioned the matter. I wish I'd kept my card current for that option. Alas, hindsight

Alaska, at least for a summer, seems interesting. And that implies some time in Canada along the way. I like the idea but at the moment my 20 year old van needs more work than I can do before this summer. It's not off the table entirely but for this summer, it's probably not a strong possibility. Now for day trips or short stays, I'd be willing to venture into Canada occasionally. Any places along the Montana, North Dakota, or Winconsin border you'd recommend seeing first?

 

[myway_1]

I was under the impression that it gets into the 90's in the Dakotas.

 

[slynne]

What can you tell me about black flies in the upper peninsula? From what I've read, they make summers there intolerable. Thoughts?

I seldom notice them unless I am swimming. For some reason they like to bite when one is getting out of the water. Otherwise, no real problems. The mosquitoes can get a bit thick on still nights though.

 

[speedhighway46]

Black Flies in Michigan's Upper Pennisula:

The "season" for these vicious monsters is very late May until very early July. In other words, forget about June! I was in the UP last year on the 7th of July and these little black suckers (literally) were already gone.

The Michigan UP is wonderful. Vast, sparsely populated country, with enough population centers for convenience. Ft. Wilcox at Copper Harbor; Porcupine Mountain State Park; the city of Marquette; and of course the Mighty Mac Bridge.

This is an awesome place; the locals are friendly.

 

[slynne]

That explains why they never bothered me. I dont think I've been to the UP in June. When I went to college there I was gone by the middle of May and otherwise trips have mostly been in July and August

 

[Richard]

I was under the impression that it gets into the 90's in the Dakotas.

I downloaded the national weather service's data for all weather stations in the U.S. (9,700+ total) and wrote a small utility program to scour the data relevant to my interests. It's true, there are some areas of North Dakota that will reach into the 90's.

Overall, though, my analysis found 96 North Dakota weather stations have recorded average high temperatures in July (normalized over 30-years) between 81-85 degrees Fahrenheit. Another 32 weather stations recorded average highs in the 76-80 degree range. Two stations recorded average, normalized highs above 85, and one station recorded highs in the 71-75 range (just Northeast of Rolla).

Granted, these are 'normals' and the actual temperature may fluctuate a bit. Standard deviations run around 3 degrees so the coolest station's temperatures may still reach into the high 70's on occasion. Considering just the available data, that makes North Dakota kind of borderline related to my my preferred temperature.

But, I linked in an earlier reply to a 1-minute video from weather {dot} com that shows the summer 2017 forecast and it shows North Dakota as significantly cooler than average for the month of July. That suggests that the 30-year standard deviation may subtract, rather than add, temperatures. And that suggests that even the 32 stations in the 76-80 degree range may be areas that are mostly cool enough for my comfort.

Granted, this is all speculation. If the forecast for cooler than normal temperatures in North Dakota prove incorrect, I can always wander north into Canada for a few weeks. The data suggests that July, rather than August, is the hottest month in North Dakota so at worst, perhaps I'll be in Canada for up to a month or so.

This is probably illegible after shrinking down for size consideration but the colors are probably useful indicators according to the following key:

COLOR = temp: red=86-90, orange=81-85, yellow=76-80, dark green=71-75, light green=66-70.

View attachment 13278

 

[MrNoodly]

3. Altitude -- I've had altitude illness twice now: once in Flagstaff, AZ and once in Timberon, NM. It seems that I'm ok up to around 6k feet above sea level. 

You didn't say whether you tried acclimating yourself by moving gradually to higher elevations. I spend late winter, all of spring and early summer working my way up from less that 200 feet in the Yuma AZ area up to 10,000 feet in places like Leadville CO. By the time I drove to the top of Mt. Evans -- 14,000 feet -- I was only short of breath and felt a small headache coming on. But that was just a short visit, so no big deal. Sure, everyone reacts differently to high elevations, but I think it's possible to adapt. However, my Colorado friends say not to encourage any more people to come there.

 

[lenny flank]

It's not at all a fear-mongering piece.

Yeh, I think it is. It's about as likely as a Yellowstone Supervolcano wiping out all life in the western US.

*Could* it happen next week? Yep. But I won't hold my breath worrying about it. (shrug)