Should HOWA be a Membership Organization?

[DLTooley]

It’s in progress. I’m definitely not the only one.

Are you all coming along?

 

[abnorm]

It’s in progress. I’m definitely not the only one.

Are you all coming along?

Confused.................

 

[Happy Camper]

You build the boat, then I'll decide if it's worth taking the three hour tour.

 

[DannyB1954]

It would be fine with me if HOWA was membership only. I would not join. Perhaps from 68 years of dealing with groups and people who perceive themselves as powerful, I choose to avoid them. Many "worthwhile" organizations have a sinister side. Google St. Jude Hoards 5 BILLION as an example. Charities can be a great front for the self interested and greedy. I am not very familiar with HOWA. but in its early days it seemed like all those getting help were friends of the board of directors. Maybe it is changed? They do their vehicle builds about a mile from my house in Pahrump. Being pretty handy myself, I do charity work for others without being part of HOWA. Maybe I am childish, but it upsets me when others take credit for my efforts. I work for free, and see no reason that others should be filling their bank with contributions because of work I did. Look how many people HOWA has helped! And by the way thanks volunteers. enjoy your pat on the head.

 

[RvNaut]

Look how many people HOWA has helped! And by the way thanks volunteers. enjoy your pat on the head.

I can't tell if you are criticizing HOWA or complimenting them.

 

[Happy Camper]

The purpose of a charity is to bring like minded people together for a common cause. That requires effort to direct everyone's efforts. That requires volunteer help. Donations. Logistical support, etc. Administrating that is sometimes like herding cats, so you can't discount that aspect.

I've seen where some set up "charities" for personal benefit. From what I have seen from my limited perspective, Howa isn't in that category. Could it be better? Sure. But everything can be better. You. Me. Decisions. Everything.

But remember, everything can be worse. 100%

 

[maki2]

HOWA has a “membership” as in a Board of Directors who made decisions as a team and vote on what gets done. You can of course write them and express an opinion and offer suggestions too. That is how you can “vote”.

 

[bigskybob]

Is HOWA a charity?

 

[jacqueg]

Is HOWA a charity?

It's a 501(3)c, and thus donations are tax-deductible.

 

[PlmrPaulie*]

The purpose of a charity is to bring like minded people together for a common cause. That requires effort to direct everyone's efforts. That requires volunteer help. Donations. Logistical support, etc. Administrating that is sometimes like herding cats, so you can't discount that aspect.

I've seen where some set up "charities" for personal benefit. From what I have seen from my limited perspective, Howa isn't in that category. Could it be better? Sure. But everything can be better. You. Me. Decisions. Everything.

But remember, everything can be worse. 100%the camp

HOWA Caravans:
Yesterday Purple Pupfish Caravan did an organized litter pick up; & made a huge pile of trash magically dissappear from the camp area! Later we enjoyed great food at Lily's Mexican restaurant in Parker, AZ. Great fun was had by all. Several of the nomads expressed the joy they felt, at the days events!
BTW - There is a transfer station east of Parker, about a mile out past the Wal-Mart. For the Black 4&1/2' tall contractor bags, they charged a dollar per bag.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

..... if HOWA ..... As a leadership community organization it seems obvious to me that it should have a board elected by members .....

A couple of questions:

Who would be eligible for membership?​

Who rules on an individuals eligibility?​

Once eligible, what is required to become a member?​

What are the rights/responsibilities of membership?​

​

Membership qualifications in small organizations is important because it doesn't take many to 'take over' (this is what happened to a lot of HOA's).

..... The RTR was once a place for the old timers to meet up, and I don’t see that happening substantively any more. At least not for me.

IMO RTR got too big.

..... I don’t see evolution happening with HOWA .....

There are thousands of small non-profits that have a single goal. They are usually started on a vision of an individual or small group. They stay focused; nothing wrong with that.

Those of you who give time and/or money have a vote. Smart organizations listen to those who invest in their cause. Those that do not respond don't last long.

 

[WanderingRose]

I’ve been following this thread, and just want to say that, whatever the OP’s grievance is notwithstanding, the longstanding, well known character of Bob Wells is enough for me to give basic benefit of the doubt that HOWA is being run with honesty and careful thought as to how they run the organization and donations are distributed.

I would have to see something seriously substantive to change that.

My two cents.

 

[RvNaut]

the OP’s grievance is notwithstanding,

...and therein the crux... what does the OP want from them that they are not doing?

 

[RoamerRV428]

...and therein the crux... what does the OP want from them that they are not doing?

I asked that of the OP alot of posts back. No response. So? I am sure there is something underlying in some fashion but who knows

 

[Happy Camper]

The op has said they have something they are working on. And I replied.

It’s in progress. I’m definitely not the only one.

Are you all coming along?

You build the boat, then I'll decide if it's worth taking the three hour tour.

 

[Ric G]

I’ve been following this thread, and just want to say that, whatever the OP’s grievance is notwithstanding, the longstanding, well known character of Bob Wells is enough for me to give basic benefit of the doubt that HOWA is being run with honesty and careful thought as to how they run the organization and donations are distributed.

I would have to see something seriously substantive to change that.

My two cents.

Check out their 2019 and 2020 Annual Financial Reports - they're not good. I'm not suggesting dishonesty at all, but income relative to expense, doesn't seem to be well managed. Also, they've told me three separate times over a 5 month period a 2021 report would be posted "soon" - still nothing. It's now 2023.

 

[Frood]

Check out their 2019 and 2020 Annual Financial Reports - they're not good. I'm not suggesting dishonesty at all, but income relative to expense, doesn't seem to be well managed. Also, they've told me three separate times over a 5 month period a 2021 report would be posted "soon" - still nothing. It's now 2023.

You know the old saying about good intentions and where the road leads...

If you don't like the way a charity is run, don't contribute to it. It's as simple as that. Everything else is just whingeing over spilt beans.

And as an aside I'll just mention that I don't hesitate to contribute to HOWA because I like Bob's videos and what people who have spent significant time with him say about him. If Bob leaves HOWA or HOWA becomes a membership org (ie run by a committee) my contributions (admittedly not significant or massive) would either stay in my pocket, go to a different charity, or maybe I'll start working to develop a StarBucks habit.

From reading this thread I DEFINITELY do not have confidence in the posters that claim grievances. I would even go so far to say that reading those posts strongly discourages me from supporting a different organization.

 

[Happy Camper]

Being a person that has been self employed for most of my adult life, I can say that I do well with the running the business part. But I'm less than stellar at paperwork.

Having close family that has worked closely with a non profit, and had one themselves, I can say that the paperwork, and other administrative requirements are daunting for some. I decided against doing a 501c specifically for that reason. I had just about everything in place, but I knew I would spend more time with my computer and printer than the work I wanted to do. For some the paperwork is a walk in the park. That's just not me.

I remember when this forum was a lot smaller. Bob and the others posted quite a bit, and we're engaged and helpful. Hell, I wanted to go buy a Prius at one point because Suanne make it seem so cool. Bob was just Bob. And still is.

He started this site to help others believe they could do this thing. Go back and read his posts. But from when you started reading the forum. Go back. And you tell me if you can see where he posted anything that wasn't respectful or want trying to help someone.

These are people just trying to help other people. If you dislike the way they handle the paperwork, offer your CPA skills and non profit expertise. They seem to be busy doing the work they set out to do.

Years ago when eBay was young, they had message boards. I was a member of a board and someone invited me to check out the giving board. It was an amazing collection of people working together to help those in need. We would sell items with an angel symbol that became known with eBay regulars. An auction with that symbol meant that the proceeds would do towards helping someone. We donated items and clothes, sent care packages, cards, you name it. We did a lot of good. And had such a fun time doing it. Great people, great times, and just so much good that was being done. New people would come in and chip in for they could. It was truly amazing. A couple years passed and someone that was relatively new thought that we should make it all more formal. They had thoughts I on how it would be better if eBay was involved, and this person was in charge.

The majority of the board, especially the older group, didn't really want that. We had a system and it worked for us and those we helped. There was a bit of a split, and the newer person contacted eBay and became the defacto leader of the giving board. They put rules and processes into place. A framework of do's and don'ts, and so on. It was the beginning of the end. We all tried our best to work within the new rules, but it just wasn't as productive and helpful. It was truly a low point. Eventually most of the group left. I did come by from time to time, but it was a husk of what it has been. It went from the giving board, to a modified giving board. Then it morphed into eBay gives. You'd think that was a good thing. But it ended up being some generic thing that was already being done by other big charities. The individuals and families we used to help weren't big enough to bother with. But everyone felt so proud of the new improved system they had created.

I rarely think about it these days because it's one of the few things that really hurts when it comes to mind. We had the best of groups doing the best of things. No one was worried about tax deductions and how much was being given to this person or that. Everyone did and gave as they wanted.

And it was ruined by someone that convinced a few others that our way wasn't good enough. It should be done in a more fair and democratic way. Allocating this and controlling that. Vetting those that asked for help in a way that wasn't comfortable at that time. I wish they had started another board and done their board their way. Then both could have been happy and helped even more people.

So with that in mind I'll just say this. If you have an actual problem, speak your grievances clearly and plainly. Don't allude to how things have been done and infer what might have could have should have happened. Give examples so we can better understand what issues you're trying to get across. No vague sort of kind of explaining. Blunt and to the point please. It's just easier than some general complaints we have to try and figure out.

And don't take over someone else's work and make it yours. Make your own and show us. That's something I can and would respect.

 

[user 22017]

Check out their 2019 and 2020 Annual Financial Reports - they're not good. I'm not suggesting dishonesty at all, but income relative to expense, doesn't seem to be well managed. Also, they've told me three separate times over a 5 month period a 2021 report would be posted "soon" - still nothing. It's now 2023.

Did they say why the 2021 report isn't out yet? Should it be out by now? How long do they have according to the law?

 

[WanderingRose]

And, seriously, are they required to make this report public?

I’m just going to say that I am uncomfortable with the critiquing here of an organization not present here.

An organization born of this original site and its creator, that we know has done so much good for so many.

I would like to see this thread closed and removed.