Remodelling vintage campers

[mdoverl]

So lately I've been thinking and discussing with my dad the idea of remodeling vintage campers and possibly selling them (I'll keep one that I remodel). I got this idea as I was walking through my dads camper and thinking "huh, this could be way more efficient if certain things were changed, and it doesn't seem to be built for a dweller."
     Like, why waste space for a stove top and oven, turn it in counter top space and just have a coleman burner (which i have the crazy or unique idea of including in the sale). I'm been wondering if there is a way to make it planet friendly and remove the black tank. I haven't fully though everything out, but I'm in the stage of bouncing around ideas in my head. I would love to hear other peoples ideas, good and bad, pros and cons on this idea. I'm sure some other people have already done this.
     My is willing to donate his 1965 camper (18 footer I thing, don't know the manufacturer yet) as the first test subject after the winter.

 

[GotSmart]

Every dollar you put into a vintage unit is money gone.  Nobody wants to pay anything close to the cost of materials as improvements on a used rig.

 

[Almost There]

When you count in your labor, which you should always do if you want to stay in business, there is no way you're going to be making a profit on something like that.

Also, while you think that a stove top unit and oven are a 'waste of space' for most others they are either a total 'must have' or they are 'really nice to have.

If I were ever to move up to something other than my DIY cargo van, the first two things that would be on the 'must have' list would be an oven and a full shower.

 

[rvpopeye]

I have a friend that does that.
Def leave the stove and holding tanks or you will lose most of your market.
Learning how to make a vintage retro look for cheap will be your objective.
The first one should give you some idea of if you want to do others.
You'll have to buy really cheap too.

 

[mdoverl]

The first camper I will build for myself and it will serve as a model and learning lesson for future campers I work on.
So how many people think that no oven is deal breaker?
Water from a shower, are we allowed to let it drain anywhere? as long as there is nothing from a toilet, I mean the water would be clear, guess it depends on if the soap and shampoo you use, if it is ok for the ground. Suggestions please!
Yes finding cheap material for certain parts of the build is a must. I plan on completely gutting the old campers and re-doing everything from the structure on up.

 

[GotSmart]

Get caught dumping grey water, and you have trouble you do not want.

 

[djkeev]

You cannot gut a unit, build a new interior and expect to make any money.

Unless...... you construct top quality high technology, high luxury encased in a classic exterior made to look and function like new.

Using "cost effective" materials is going to net you a loss.......... eliminating basic accepted RV anemities will make you no sales.

Even going for the high end market...... that's going to be a very small customer base.

Dreams are good though, they give you a starting base for a realistic goal.

Dave

 

[Sabatical]

I made some pretty drastic changes to the camper that my wife, dogs, and myself spend winters in. I'm sure some would say we ruined it but we made a pact to keep it for at least five years so it seemed worth it to have it the way we want it. It was 13 yrs old when we got it and so it won't have much value when we are done.
I guess my point is to make changes that fit your life and enjoy spending time in it. If you do it right then it won't matter if you don't make a bunch of money down the road.

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[rvpopeye]

Dumping grey water is a no no just about everywhere.
Taking out tanks that are already there sounds counterproductive.
Materials alone for building a ground up rig will make the sale price pretty high.
I think I'd make that first one with the thought that it might end up being your rig !

I'd be looking for junked out campers and trying to recycle parts as much as possible.

 

[Gary68]

there are people that do it and even a tv showhttp://www.greatamericancountry.com/shows/flippin-rvs/galleries


you have to do wam bam flips or high end pro resto to make money

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

So lately I've been thinking and discussing with my dad the idea of remodeling vintage campers and possibly selling them (I'll keep one that I remodel). I got this idea as I was walking through my dads camper and thinking "huh, this could be way more efficient if certain things were changed, and it doesn't seem to be built for a dweller."  There is a market for classic campers built with modern conveniences.  Don't think dwellers would pay a premium for a spartan classic.

     Like, why waste space for a stove top and oven, turn it in counter top space and just have a coleman burner (which i have the crazy or unique idea of including in the sale).  I for one would want a built in stove, with cover to reclaim counter space.  Having a portable stove that I have to store and drag out every time I want to use it would be a turn off IMO.  If it had an oven I'd use it for storage.

I'm been wondering if there is a way to make it planet friendly and remove the black tank.  Curious why you think a black tank is not 'planet friendly'?
. . .

The first camper I will build for myself and it will serve as a model and learning lesson for future campers I work on.  Good idea.
. . . 
    Water from a shower, are we allowed to let it drain anywhere?  NO!!!  Boondocking one can get away with 'watering the bushes' with small amounts of water, just don't be too obvious about it.  Never in a developed campground and never from a hose connected to the camper.
. . .
I plan on completely gutting the old campers and re-doing everything from the structure on up.  I think one lesson you will learn is that it is not cheap (in parts or labor) to rebuild an old camper.

If your dad's camper is in good structural shape go ahead and build it out for yourself.  That is what I did.  I took an old pickup camper, stripped it out and built it the way I wanted.  I have 300+ hours and 6X the cost of the camper in the finished product.  I just don't think there is a market for a camper that looks old and has a basic interior.

 -- Spiff

 

[GotSmart]

there are people that do it and even a tv showhttp://www.greatamericancountry.com/shows/flippin-rvs/galleries


you have to do wam bam flips or high end pro resto to make money

They make their money off the show.

 

[Cammalu]

I've had several vintage campers and have followed forums for at least ten years. The campers are worth more if original just the same as an antique. If you are going to make any money at it you want to start with a high end camper to begin with like an Airstream, Vagabond, palace, etc.


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[Txjaybird]

 I would love to hear other peoples ideas, good and bad, pros and cons on this idea. I'm sure some other people have already done this.
     My is willing to donate his 1965 camper (18 footer I thing, don't know the manufacturer yet) as the first test subject after the winter.

If you google diy vintage camper remodels, also classic or vintage camping trailers for sale you should get some more ideas

What kind of shape your dad's camper is in should give you some ideas of what needs to be done to make it usable and then what is it you want to do to it to put your personal stamp on it. for example a hole in the floor NEEDS to be fixed.  I would look at what needs repairing if anything and then concentrate on how I want to fix it up to suit me.  Since you said you want to modify this to suit you and not to sell you have some leeway in what you do to it.  Others here have made very valid points in what many people want in a in a camper.  Original appliances, light fixtures, furniture and REAL wood  interiors all can add to the value of for selling prices.

Some things are more important to different people.  I just bought a 2004 Aliner and already I'm not happy with certain things however as I  intend to eventually sell or trade it I need to compromise now so I can get a good deal later.

  The stove top is too close to the bed however I will not remove it.  Since I'd rather not smell the breakfast bacon on my pillow at night I intend to cook outside and if the weather is bad I'll use the microwave or eat food that doesn't need to be cooked.  The water storage tank takes up a lot of space under the bed I will not use it in the winter because i'm woried about the water lines or pump freezing. I'll use it in the warm weather so to save the space water jugs would take up except for my drinking water.  

There is no bathroom however there is room for a small tub/potty combo, of course then I lose storage for food/clothes/books/cd&dvd's.  So I'll use a luggable loo/semi-composting toilet, a solar shower and a pop-up "privacy" room or dome tent if I'm not camped where there are restrooms or showers available.

I intended to really do some interior painting until reality bit me in the butt.  I'm only 5ft 5in tall and the ceiling is way up there and it slopes too.  As I can get dizzy changing a light bulb the painted ceiling needs to be rethunk. Since I'm older than dirt and Queenie my Chihuahua was NO HELP when I like to never got off the floor after I painted some cabinet doors.  So for now I'll sew new curtains and put up some wallpaper boarders and call it done.  ...for now.

So only you can decide what you want in your camper to make it functional for you and how you use it or even live in it.

What are some of the things you'd like to have changed in the camper?  What is the floor plan and do you have pics to post...if you can, I haven't figured it out yet.  I still forget to hit the send button on a cell phone 50% of the time. 

Have fun with your camper project  

Jewellann

 

[ArtW]

I have an old camper with no backwater tanks, no grey water tanks, just a small sink and a porta pottie, that's how it came
no way I would buy another camper like that one, but hey, i lived in it for a year for $600
It DOES have a 3 burner with oven though

 

[dragonflyinthesky]

Most of you are wrong. There is a market for ready to go small vintage campers, keep it original. Small campers sell better. One of the poorest made, Shasta, sells easy. We that have them just laugh we have high priced poor quality campers. Must have wings though.

 

[drysailor]

The first camper I will build for myself and it will serve as a model and learning lesson for future campers I work on.  Yes finding cheap material for certain parts of the build is a must. I plan on completely gutting the old campers and re-doing everything from the structure on up.

Please keep in mind that this comment comes from someone who's never done what you're considering.
It sounds like you are maybe looking at a new part of the RV market, what might be called a"niche" segment: buying disused TTs at low cost, & rehabbing them primarily as simple full-timers, TinyHouses on wheels. I can't tell you how many times I've read, "I don't want or need all the junk in a factory RV" on this forum.
Developing the practical technical / mechanical expertise would be essential, as would researching where to look for cheap stock (where has the economy fallen into a hole recently?) You can often see people selling off toys, like RVs & boats, for cents on the $$ once unemployment runs out.
I think it might be best to start this as a limited "hobby" business, until you really get up to speed. Having your dad's donor TT is a great place to start.
As other posters have pointed out, you really need to identify all codes & practices at the outset. If your customers can't get insurance,
you might severely restrict your market.
If you haven't watched "Flippin RVs", please do. They seem to encounter many rotted floors, requiring essentially a gut job. And apparently some early aluminum builders were not aware of electrolysis, or the fact that it could turn a chassis/frame into mush, over time.
There is a kind of old generic business model that suggests you need to sell your finished product for 3x your direct costs to be viable: 1/3 to repay actual out-of-pocket costs, 1/3 for business expenses, 1/3 for yourself.
If you can start this on the cheap, and organize it as a 'real' business to evaluate it's viability, I say go for it!

 

[flying kurbmaster]

if I were to do this with profit in mind I would stick with small campers 12 footers or less, funky looking, I once bought a 1971 10 foot camper for 2,000 dollars brought it home cleaned it up, repaired a few things, installed new hubcaps used it for 10 years sold it for 5,500. I kept it in its original vintage state, it just happened to be in very good condition under all the grime and falling parts. three summers back I bought a 1993 pop top mini van cleaned it up repaired a few things and have turned down three times what I paid for it. It is possible but you have to find the right units. Ideally one sitting in a back yard for many years untouched with lots of mould growing on the outside looking tatared, mostly in need of a good clean up perhaps a few new lights, wheel bearings, maybe new flooring, that grandma, parked there when grandpa died and no one has been using it in decades except the grand children to play in who have left scrapes, grime, old toys and a few things to repair.. I am with the group that says don't remove the stove or the tanks, work around them they are handy and valuable.

 

[rvpopeye]

AND post pictures , lots and lots of pictures , before , during and after !

(I know everybody was waiting for me to say that !)

 

[mdoverl]

Alright so definitely leaving a full shower, but I'm leaning toward setting up a wet shower. This also means I have to plan and account for a gray tank. No Black tank for my first camper, as I'll set up a lug able loo.

OK so no dumping Grey water. I kept thinking that maybe if you used Bio-degradable material that it should be environmentally safe to dump ( I was even going to supply materials that were safe in the final sale of the camper). I personally loved how some people responded to this, as if I was in left field without a clue.

Alot of "You cannot do this because, because, because.". Sorry, I politely ignore these parts of those post. This would be a pointless world if I kept saying "I cannot...."

Anyways, I'm hoping these are not "High End". I'm hoping I can keep material cost down to 3000 dollars.

So apparently no Oven is a big turn off for a few people. I just didn't imagine many people actually used the Oven. I just can't get past how much propane is wasted when using an oven. So I guess this is something I 'll have to re-think.

I've worked on houses before, so I plan on using this knowledge to rebuild the camper. I'm rather low on tools, so I my initial investment will be going toward tools. I'm on the low end of electrical and plumping knowledge, but this is the perfect time to learn. So I've never rebuilt a camper before, but some people think if you haven't done, you shouldn't be doing it, such a boring response, where is the excitement people?

Anyways one of the first few steps would be stripping everything out and determining what type of rust damage we are dealing with.

1. Acquire camper
2. Strip Camper
3. Determine the severity of Rust

How does everyone feel about a wood burning stove?