No refrigeration?

[AbuelaLoca]

^^^ You could start a new thread!! It's very interesting stuff. To stay thread compliant, tho, I'm sure there were no fridges during that time!

 

[DrJean]

I used to back pack & canoe for a week or so at a time and never had "refrigeration". Granted, a few of the rivers were cool enough to drag a bag of water for drinking.... most of the back packing was inside national forests.... it was all dry food or dried food! I mean, back then being so young, licking on the dry package of jello gave a great flavor rush and carb/sugar hype to finish the day's distance...(or gelatin if you don't do pork, like I don't any more)...

So easy to dry or freeze dry foods now.... the main thing will be water but since you're not back packing it all in, and have a place to put water... you can do this! Oh and we didn't have any canned foods... too heavy. So that's a bonus you would have too!

 

[Ballenxj]

^^^ You could start a new thread!! It's very interesting stuff. To stay thread compliant, tho, I'm sure there were no fridges during that time!

You are right, and my apologies to everybody for my part in the hijacking of this thread.
Shall we carry on here? https://vanlivingforum.com/Thread-VIKINGS
I assure you there were no fridges involved, but it "was" a mobile lifestyle.

 

[Joyce Jason]

Can't give you a clear answer to your question. I have been experimenting with various ideas around that. I found that the canned meats (chicken, turkey, tuna, pulled pork & beef) & canned beans while a little high in sodium are quite acceptable. You can buy most of you vegetables canned also, but I find that fresher fully steamed is my way. Being diabetic I need the cooler for my insulin, it must be kept cool. The blue bags will last a few days & do the job but it helps to have them in a cooler.


The other item that all diabetics (anyway me) rely upon is cottage cheese, gives me my protein, calcium & low carb/calorie. It's my Alfredo sauce, omelet & stew main ingredient. Also must be kept somewhat cool, usually 4 days is sufficient. The is a discussion about eggs, I tried the powdered eggs but would rather eat sand. I have a bottle of pickled eggs on my shelf. Eggs are a reliable healthy meal, but watch the cholesterol (the jury's still out on that).

Have you tried "Ova Easy" dried eggs?  Pricey, but really taste good -- just like eggs.

 

[purplepeopleeater]

Not sure if you mean never having any cold food but with a small ice chest you can go shopping and purchase some meat and a package of frozen chicken/fish which I have seen readily available in many grocery stores. You can then eat the cold meat until the frozen fish/chicken is thawed and ready to cook. Then you can eat your shelf stable foods. Fresh salads,veggies & fruit can be purchased at the same time. When this are gone you can eat canned or dried ones. Canned veggies can be rinsed to wash off some sodium as well as beans. Save the wash water and use it with some noodles and canned chicken for some soup with some seasoning. I find Nido powdered whole milk isn't bad in cereal. Canned chicken/fish with taco seasoning in a taco shell
is good. Buy cabbage to thinly slice & add. Lasts longer than lettuce out of the fridge. Carrots too.
Fresh kale cooked with some white beans and broth is good too.
Living without refrigeration can mean no refrigerator,or no ice chest,or no fresh foods kept cool for a short period. Much depends on how often you plan to shop and how much room one has. A city dweller may shop daily after work. Someone living on BLM land for weeks at a time may only shop monthly.

 

[purplepeopleeater]

This website has suggestions for eggs in recipes as well as a recipe for eggless French toast,pancakes and many other eggless meals.

http://www.egglesscooking.com/egg-substitutes/

 

[XFILE36]

You could try these and kill two birds with one stone.

http://heatermeals.com/

http://selfheatingmeals.org/

http://www.omeals.com/

http://www.emergencykits.com/emerge...inute-meals-self-heating-assorted-case-of-12/

I bought one of those as a clearance item at CVS.  I  was amazed how good it was and fun to "heat".  Thanks

 

[XFILE36]

I too am trying to use up my stored food until I get on the road.  I have buckets of freeze-dried pinto beans which just take 8 minutes to cook - very good.  I also have buckets of black bean burgers-just add water.  They probably are full of junk, but taste really good.  I also got ripped off by a company (won't say which) and bought their buckets of food.  I only tried a few of them and they are for the end of the world, IMO,  LOL!

 

[XFILE36]

Here is a freeze dried butter, but I haven't tried it:  https://www.amazon.com/Augason-Farm...rd_wg=FQ1Du&psc=1&refRID=8BEFKXYAJZ7D5JNYS5Y4

 

[XFILE36]

I may have mentioned this in the past but I'll give it a go again.

A guy I worked with was a Vietnam Vet who served in an armored vehicle (Tank).

Where he was in the field they would get cases of beer but they were warm.  So to
have ice cold beer,  the guys would break out a Co2 Fire Extinguisher, several blankets,
and lay the beer on the ground and hose it with the Co2.  Then throw the blankets over
it and wait a few minutes.   Viola...ice cold beer in a hot as blazes place.

I asked about getting the fire extinguishers refilled and he said the supply/service trucks ran through
their area a few times each day and pick up such needs as depleted fire extinguishers.

Now if a person had a smaller Co2 fire extinguisher with them,  they could use it in this way until it
was depleted.  Wouldn't take much to ice down a couple beers or to chill the contents of a well insulated
ice chest.   Don't know what it would cost to get it refiled but it would be a convenience to have along.

I understand people go to AirGas facilities and purchase a 10 or 20 lb exchangeable for less than $15 bucks
(as little as $8 for a 10 lb)  just like getting propane from Blue Rhino.

Think of it as sprayable dry ice on demand.

I've seen that done with an air can to clean your keyboard too, on YOUTUBE.

 

[Trebor English]

If you turn your propane tank upside down it comes out a very cold boiling liquid  That would probably be cheaper than fire extinguishers to chill a beer at a time.  Like CO2, propane will displace oxygen which could suffocate a person.  Avoid ignition sources.  The fireball, mushroom cloud, and ensuing forest fire will reheat the beer.

 

[eDJ_]

Where the guy I mentioned was in a Military War Zone in Vietnam,  they had a regular supply chain of fire
prevention service so they could exhaust those Co2 Fire Extinguishers as often as they wanted.   They
were double duty fire fighting and primitive refrigeration for the GI's in the field.

I've often wondered if it could work with smaller coolers like the Igloo Playmates etc or the Yeti's.  How much
of a charge from a fire extinguisher it would take to keep stuff cold for a day or two.   Then how large of a
Co2 fire extinguisher one would have to carry for these incremental charges so that they could gauge the days
they could camp in a remote area. (this would need to take into consideration the ambient temps and records
kept of it future reference)

In most towns of any size these Co2 fire extinguishers can be recharged or had as exchange units. 
It may be more handy than Ice, and comparable in price too.  The more insulated the Ice Chest the closer
those price points would come together. 

It could be a project to consider for someone.

 

[pearll]

Has anyone been able to get by without using any type of refrigeration by using shelf stable foods, canned goods, etc.? Obviously in extreme heat this would be difficult unless everything was canned or dried and you never had leftovers to deal with.  Just wondering if anybody has been able to do it.

Unfortunately canned food is not very healthy long term. Lots of salt for one. Commercial canning just isn't a good way to go. Certainly a step up from fast food.
Those long term storage foods ie Mountain House are good for a few days in a power outage , but watch the salt intake.
One thing I did learn in a nutrition class is that frozen veg are the same or better as fresh.
They are flash frozen after picked and stay frozen until you make a meal. They won't go bad if not eaten right away. "Fresh" vegetable are picked, transported, etc and later sit in our fridge for a few more days. So in the end they are about the same in terms of vitamins.

 

[pearll]

Can't give you a clear answer to your question. I have been experimenting with various ideas around that. I found that the canned meats (chicken, turkey, tuna, pulled pork & beef) & canned beans while a little high in sodium are quite acceptable. You can buy most of you vegetables canned also, but I find that fresher fully steamed is my way. Being diabetic I need the cooler for my insulin, it must be kept cool. The blue bags will last a few days & do the job but it helps to have them in a cooler.


The other item that all diabetics (anyway me) rely upon is cottage cheese, gives me my protein, calcium & low carb/calorie. It's my Alfredo sauce, omelet & stew main ingredient. Also must be kept somewhat cool, usually 4 days is sufficient. The is a discussion about eggs, I tried the powdered eggs but would rather eat sand. I have a bottle of pickled eggs on my shelf. Eggs are a reliable healthy meal, but watch the cholesterol (the jury's still out on that).

I learned that our eggs are washed for need to be refrig. Other countries do not do this so they can be kept at room temp. Thanks for the cottage cheese tip. Just starting to learn about diabetes. Apparently Carbs really are evil. Dr Atkins was right.

 

[pearll]

You could try these and kill two birds with one stone.

http://heatermeals.com/

http://selfheatingmeals.org/

http://www.omeals.com/

http://www.emergencykits.com/emerge...inute-meals-self-heating-assorted-case-of-12/

I haven't tried them yet, Magic Cook or Barocook are heat packs that heat your mug of coffee or container of food. About $1 each

 

[XFILE36]

Unfortunately canned food is not very healthy long term. Lots of salt for one. Commercial canning just isn't a good way to go. Certainly a step up from fast food.
Those long term storage foods ie Mountain House are good for a few days in a power outage , but watch the salt intake.
One thing I did learn in a nutrition class is that frozen veg are the same or better as fresh.
They are flash frozen after picked and stay frozen until you make a meal. They won't go bad if not eaten right away. "Fresh" vegetable are picked, transported, etc and later sit in our fridge for a few more days. So in the end they are about the same in terms of vitamins.

freeze dried veggies don't have any salt

 

[AlasKen]

I have no refrigeration on my boat but want to be prepared in case I get weathered in or something else takes place so I keep 30 days of food for one person.  As a wet environment I use #10 cans for staples.  I will share what I understand based on my research is a complete nutrition option although it is bland and carb heavy.  No meat but beans for proteins.  I like to use whole grains when I can so I have a hand cranked grain mill for grinding the wheat.  Exercise is good but this may not be for everyone.  I do not see why this would not work in a van as well.  This is the same method I use at home to be prepared for the next big disaster which could impact the food distribution in AK.  I use the LDS Home Storage Center which allows non church members to also purchase from there.  It is open 2 days a week but is significantly less expensive for my area.  I shared the costs as of the last time I visited.  YMMV

30 day supply for complete basic nutrition
#10 cans from Home Storage Center (except milk)
Item                      #             cost       weight in lbs                     
Beans, Pinto       1             5.75       5.2                       
Flour, white        2             6.00       8                           
Macaroni             1             2.75       3                           
Milk, nonfat        1             3.00       1.8                       
Oats, Quick         1             3.25       2.4                       
Rice, white          1             4.00       5.4                       
Spaghetti             1             2.50       2.7                       
Sugar                    1             5.25       5.6                       
Wheat, white     2             6.00       11                         
                                                                                                        
Totals                   10           38.50     45.1
 
From Walmart
Item                      #             cost       weight   in lbs     
Baking Powder   1             2.18       .6                          
Baking Soda        1             0.97       1                           
Yeast                    1             4.58       .25                       
Cornmeal            2             7.36       5                           
Oil                         1             2.75       1.5
Shortening          1             3.68       1.24 (butter flavor sticks)
Salt, iodized        1             4.25       1.6
These additional small quantities of Legumes are required for a balanced nutrition.  Eat small amounts weekly.  I mix it together and throw in with beans once a week.
Lima Beans                        ?.??        .25
Soybeans                            ?.??        .25
Split Peas                            ?.??        .75
Lentils                                 ?.??        .75  
Daily vitamin       10           0.50                      (one every third day)
 
Totals                                  ~27.00   13.19
Combined total                $66.50   58.29
 
This is the minimum for 30 days.  It is bland but I can fix rice, beans, cornbread, tortillas, biscuits and gravy.  I also add some additional items that open up my diet to much more variety but wanted to share the minimum for those in financial difficulties.

Extras to make more variety (much more than 30 days supply)
#10 cans From Home Storage Center
Item                      #             cost       weight                 
Apple Slices         1             11.25     1                           
Carrots                 1             11.50     2.1                       
Onions                 1             9.00       2.1                       
Potato Flakes     1             5.00       1.8
 
From Walmart or Amazon (Augason Farms #10 cans)
Item                                     #             cost       weight                 
Buttermilk Powder           1             15.00     2                           
Butter Powder                   1             18.94     2.4        
Potato Shreds                    1             17.23     1.5
Cheese Powder                 1             16.92     3.2
Tomato Powder                1             32.00     3.5
Powdered Eggs                 1             34.00     2.0
 
Other Walmart items
Southwest Seasoning  (2 cups DIY mix)     
               NM Chili powder
               Ground Cumin
               Paprika
               Garlic Powder
               Onion Powder
               Red Pepper Flakes
               Dried Oregano
               Cayenne
Pepper
Cinnamon
Vanilla extract
Vinegar
Mustard
Ketchup
Bouillon
Cocoa
Coffee
Tea
Pure Maple Syrup

This will increase the monthly cost but these items may last many months.  By adding some fresh caught fish or tuna/salmon packets, canned chicken, etc it will again add cost but also variety.  Everything on this list is shelf stable and will last a long time unopened and at least a year after opening.  I use wide mouth canning jars and vacuum seal attachment to store after opening. 

I have created some simple recipes using these ingredients that I keep with the items in case I am not around when they are used.

I share this in hopes it might trigger ideas of what might work for you in a no refrigeration environment.  If interested in the cooking method I use on the boat just ask.  I don't want to spam the forum with un necessary info.  I cook everything using a Coleman propane combo grill/burner unit which has been discussed on other threads.  I works well for me.

 

[VanForNow]

Regarding powdered eggs, I have found the OvaEasy brand to be the best. Scrambled eggs made with OvaEasy are delicious. Not the cheapest brand, but worth it in my opinion.

 

[AlasKen]

Regarding powdered eggs, I have found the OvaEasy brand to be the best. Scrambled eggs made with OvaEasy are delicious. Not the cheapest brand, but worth it in my opinion.

I totally agree but as you say they are more expensive and harder for me to find.  Some things I have found in using the Augason Farms whole egg mixture. 

I use them for cooking with no issue.  I do not store the scrambled egg mix as it does not work as well in cooking.  I just add the equivalent amount of powder into my dry ingredients.  I add the equivalent amount of liquid when adding the liquids to the recipe if needed.  I use in my pancakes and cornbread mixes with no discernable difference in taste or texture. 

When scrambling I add a little powdered milk, salt and pepper, and twice the amount of water called for when scrambling and mix well.  I found that using the amount water recommended created a strong powdered egg taste and heavy consistency.  I also go heavier on seasoning.  I use a home made Taco type seasoning mix that I call Southwest Seasoning as it reminds me of NM.  I also add some rehydrated onion and pepper mix as well as green chile and just a touch of oil or butter powder.  I find that with these additions adding the result to a warmed tortilla is quite edible.  If money was no object I would use more Ova Easy.  I do pack Ova Easy when my wife joins me but then I usually take some fresh eggs instead of powdered as it is usually a shorter duration trip. 

This list reflects what I store in order to be prepared for a quick exit into the back country with no time to pre plan.  Having it on hand ensures we can eat a decently nutritious diet for a minimal amount of cash outlay.  I can also store it and forget it for years at a time.

 

[highdesertranger]

hey Ken what kind of green chilies do you use. I use Thrive brand not bad,

http://www.thrivelife.com/green-chili-peppers-freeze-dried.html

highdesertranger