Need advice on what Solar system equip to buy

[rvpopeye]

Awww , it's really not so hard.
Plenty of hand holders here to help ya through it !

 

[Hermes1]

Susan, I am not an electrician by any means, but have a basic working knowledge of electrical work and am pretty handy, yet when I did my first solar install I too was overwhelmed with information, filled with self doubt and considered having a pro do the install for me.  What I did was read & re-read (many times) the better information out there, you may recall I posted some links I found helpful and may be for you earlier in this thread.  After a while of re-reading and research, it all sank in enough to give me the confidence to tackle the purchase and install of solar on my previous rig which worked out extremely well.  Another approach I took was to do it in baby steps.  I decided early on to work with the crappy insufficient battery supplied with the travel trailer we had, then once I was up and running and satisfied all my mistakes had been made, I invested in high quality batteries.  At the same time I also installed a very good and recommended battery monitor which I made extensive use of to monitor our energy requirement over time and in different situations.  Then once I had that info in hand, I purchased and installed a solar panel and charge controller to start with.  If all else fails consider a  complete solar kit such as available from Renogy or Zamp which will get you up and running without a large knowledge and skill base.

 

[user 15722]

Susan, I am not an electrician by any means, but...   consider a  complete solar kit such as available from Renogy or Zamp which will get you up and running without a large knowledge and skill base.

IMO, this is good advice.
Helpers here on the forum can advise how to quantify your needs or perhaps change your expectations if needed.
A complete system kit from a reputable vendor must be the simplest way to go after size needed is determined.
Best, wheels

 

[VagaboundSusan]

Good Evening,

I called Solar Blvd this morning and they were very understanding.  That order is canceled and the money is on its way back to me  A huge thank you goes out to WalkaboutTed for catching the Voc rating mistake I made. I had been switching back and forth between so many tabs on my laptop, must have read the numbers for a different panel. 

I am learning, at my pace. There are print outs of diagrams all over my bed and table. My neighbors think I have gone nuts standing on a ladder next to the van measuring and staring off  into space.

I value every bit of input each of you give so please don't stop, we have just begun this journey

 

[tx2sturgis]

My neighbors think I have gone nuts standing on a ladder next to the van measuring and staring off  into space.

Oh I do that all the time....

Just wait till you get up there with loud power tools!

 

[gapper2]

Susan,

  I was working on my van today doing an equalization charge on my starter battery.  Most of my life I've never really taken care of my auto batteries because well I just didn't know any better.  But after reading many  of Sterwakes posts (sometimes many times), I've got a few suggestions. I know you said that money was tight at the moment and if you are like most of us newbs you've been going over and over on which battery to buy?  Got me to thinking,  most of us have starter batteries that are FLA for that reason alone I think that the majority of us should purchase and practice using a hydrometer.   After doing several equalizations I saw definitely my six year old battery's health was improving.  Whichever battery you choose (agm, fla, lithium) the experience with FLA will give you more confidence and also help your starter battery.

Sternwake suggested    https://www.amazon.com/OTC-4619-Pro...=UTF8&qid=1481503192&sr=1-1&keywords=OTC+4619

  Also another invaluable tool is a good multimeter that has a DC clampon probe.  I've used mine soooo many times.  Stern's suggestion:

https://www.amazon.com/Uni-T-B4Q094...=1492748209&sr=8-1&keywords=uni+t+clamp+meter

No matter what you decide on practicing with these tools are a neccessity.  IMHO

Cheers

 

[John61CT]

I think hold off on the combiner/isolator/B2B side of things for now, best next step is finalizing the battery bank choice and pulling that trigger, they are the foundation nothing else works without.

A decent shore charger is also usually essential, has that been discussed?

Then learning how to look after, basic diagnosis of the bank's charging cycle.

Fitting solar can then wait if the budget needs recharging.

IMO of course. . .

 

[VagaboundSusan]

Ok,

Purchase line up #2
http://www.ebay.com/itm/281169784988

Renogy 200w  w/MPPT $399

If I decide to expand my system I will add another controller. I still want the CTEK and Smartpass but will get this part done and behind me first.

For batteries I am only comfortable with sealed. I have severe arthritis in my hands, twisting anything open can be quite difficult for me on my own. Knowing that my first set needs to be affordable as they will be abused while learning, I have narrowed it down to 2 options:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...fl_title_20?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A10QFO4IXVZNRN

2 of these at $158.00 each giving me 200 Ah or

http://www.ebay.com/itm/252800907902

2 of these at 360 Ah for $179.00 each.

The pricing for SLA at Batteries + in both states around me are higher than these prices.

They are asking $289.00 each for the Duracell Ultra AGM plus 18.50 core plus 10% tax, even with online discount that is almost $600.00 for batteries that I may abuse quickly.

If anyone knows of a better price for a sealed battery bank please let me know.....I am begging :angel:

 

[John61CT]

For batteries I am only comfortable with sealed. I have severe arthritis in my hands, twisting anything open can be quite difficult for me on my own. Knowing that my first set needs to be affordable as they will be abused while learning

Sorry to harp on this, but FLA GCs are just **so** much more robust, longer lasting, higher AH, overall just much better value for money!

I've only read about the add-on watering kits like Flow-Rite, but people say they really make maintenance a **lot** easier.

Anyone know if they also solve Susan's arthritis issue with her hands? They remove completely the need to remove the caps, and I was under the impression the water connections are snap on/snap off.

Also, price those Renogy panels only, and please link to their specs once you think you're sure which ones. If the 47 X 21.3 inch in that kit, they will work just fine with a Victron MPPT (under $100).

If the total is in the same ballpark, it's a much better quality controller.

 

[gapper2]

Susan,
  I agree with John61ct that the FLA's are more bang for the buck and that is why I suggested getting A hydrometer but even with the watering caps you will still need to remove the caps and test the specific gravity to learn the true health of your batteries..  

 But I understand for health reasons you can't do that and I chose AGM's for my health problems.  Not much choice I definitely understand.  Now as far as your two AGM choices I believe the two from Amazon are a better choice.  That is two 12v 100AH in parallel for 200AH total.  You second choice would be two 6v in series for 180AH.

 You will need some way to supply 60 amps on occasion for your first choice to keep them happy.  Good luck in your search.

Gapper2

 

[John61CT]

 Now as far as your two AGM choices I believe the two from Amazon are a better choice.  That is two 12v 100AH in parallel for 200AH total.  You second choice would be two 6v in series for 180AH.

If that is the choice the two paralleled gives redundancy, if one fails can limp along on the other. But replace both at once of course, maybe repurpose the last one standing as a starter batt.

Plus 10% more capacity, shallower discharge longer life.

 

[John61CT]

WindyNation has a rep to maintain

https://www.amazon.com/WindyNation-Amp-Hour-Reserve-Capacity-Battery/product-reviews/B01ACKDGPS/

 

[John61CT]

Duracell Ultra AGM

Not great anyway, Deka makes great FLA, a good Gel line, but not AGM.

 

[VagaboundSusan]

Sorry to harp on this, but FLA GCs are just **so** much more robust, longer lasting, higher AH, overall just much  better value for money!

I've only read about the add-on watering kits like Flow-Rite, but people say they really make maintenance a **lot** easier.

Anyone know if they also solve Susan's arthritis issue with her hands? They remove completely the need to remove the caps, and I was under the impression the water connections are snap on/snap off.

Also, price those Renogy panels only, and please link to their specs once you think you're sure which ones. If the 47 X 21.3 inch in that kit, they will work just fine with a Victron MPPT (under $100).

If the total is in the same ballpark, it's a much better quality controller.

Thank you John,

I looked at the Victron....do I need to get the blue tooth dongle also? I will gladly get my parts ala carte but it keeps adding up to be more than that darn kit. I think that is why us noob go for the kits over the cheaper option.

Okay will clear the cart and go back at it, I will take your very valued advice and get the Victron and start pulling in the basics of what will be needed. :shy:

 

[John61CT]

I looked at the Victron....do I need to get the blue tooth dongle also? I will gladly get my parts ala carte but it keeps adding up to be more than that darn kit.

You will likely want the dongle eventually, it does add great monitoring ability, customizing setpoints etc.

None of which would ever be possible with the Renogy (actually EP) SC, the bare Victron is lots better out of the box, more than enough to get you started.

But I'm nervous about you mismatching again, please link back here with the detailed panel specs, confirm physical size for your roof etc, how many? before you pull the trigger on either, then place both orders around the same time.

Alan at Bay-Marine has great service, PKSYS may be a little cheaper, check both on return policy.

Also note that kit had some pre-made connectors, other bits and bobs you need to source, ideally with the Renogy panel.

 

[Almost There]

Susan, I hate to ask the obvious but feel I must - have you tried to take the caps off of a battery and not been able to or are you being cautious that with arthritis in your hands you think you'd have difficulty.

If you can unscrew your gas cap to put gas in, you're more than likely  able to handle the caps on a battery. That is, unless some strong armed person has put them on extra tight.... If you put them on yourself then you only tighten them to the strength in your hands to start with, therefore it takes the same strength to loosen them the next time.

They really aren't like a jar of pickles that hasn't been opened before....  

Maybe go to a battery shop and try opening a few because unless there's more compelling reasons - like they have to be placed on their side, FLA batteries are far better, especially for a beginner.

A permanently installed watering system would remove the need to unscrew the caps but also removes the ability to use a battery hydrometer... an important part of the learning curve. Also  I've found that snap on caps are harder for my arthritic hands to handle than unscrewing things. I can use arm muscle and or a pair of pliers to unscrew things, snap on stuff seems to use only finger muscle.

 

[frater secessus]

You will likely want the dongle eventually, it does add great monitoring ability, customizing setpoints etc.

None of which would ever be possible with the Renogy (actually EP) SC, the bare Victron is lots better out of the box, more than enough to get you started.

The stock Renogy/EP controller in the eBay link has adjustable setpoints configurable from the display.  Or it can be done from a remote.  Or from PC with a $5 cable.

 

[Hermes1]

AGMs should also vented, not as robust or long-lived, more precise charging requirements, cost a lot more.

Good quality ones are Northstar, Odyssey and Lifeline.

Ok,

Purchase line up #2
http://www.ebay.com/itm/281169784988

Renogy 200w  w/MPPT $399

If I decide to expand my system I will add another controller. I still want the CTEK and Smartpass but will get this part done and behind me first.

For batteries I am only comfortable with sealed. I have severe arthritis in my hands, twisting anything open can be quite difficult for me on my own. Knowing that my first set needs to be affordable as they will be abused while learning, I have narrowed it down to 2 options:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...fl_title_20?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A10QFO4IXVZNRN

2 of these at $158.00 each giving me 200 Ah or

http://www.ebay.com/itm/252800907902

2 of these at 360 Ah for $179.00 each.

The pricing for SLA at Batteries + in both states around me are higher than these prices.

They are asking $289.00 each for the Duracell Ultra AGM plus 18.50 core plus 10% tax, even with online discount that is almost $600.00 for batteries that I may abuse quickly.

If anyone knows of a better price for a sealed battery bank please let me know.....I am begging :angel:

If it is not too late, you should consider a PWM controller vs the MPPT for only 200W of solar.  There are a lot of misconceptions about MPPT, to get the full benefit of MPPT you really need to be at least 500W of solar.  Don't get me wrong MPPT will work but will cost you considerably more than a high quality PWM charger and I will argue a high quality PWM charger will perform as well if not better than cheaper MPPT charger controllers.  The people pushing MPPT will typically say they deliver 2-30% more efficiency than a PWM, but those numbers are typically over inflated as that assumes ideal conditions which is rarely the case and again 500w + of high efficiency solar panels and with the high end MPPT charge controllers.  You indicates earlier a need to save money and buying a PWM will not only work well for you, but save you lots of dollars.

 

[tx2sturgis]

There are a lot of misconceptions about MPPT, to get the full benefit of MPPT you really need to be at least 500W of solar.  

{snip}

You indicates earlier a need to save money and buying a PWM will not only work well for you, but save you lots of dollars.

There is one more advantage to MPPT when using 2-4 panels: simplified wiring. You can run both of those panels in series, and then no MC4 'Y' adapters needed, and a single 10 gauge cable extension is all that is needed for the run to the controller.

Most PWM controllers will only accept those 18-20v panels in parallel for a 12v battery bank, so she might need to upgrade the wiring and buy the Y adapters if she only had a PWM controller.

She did say that an additional panel may come later.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Hermes1]

The problem with wiring panels in series is, if one panel is shaded or somehow obstructed, it shuts down or significantly reduce the other panel(s) as well.  To wire in parallel is as simple as wiring each panel into a combiner box, no need for MC4 connectors, then one wire to the charge controller.  With a combiner box in place it is a very easy task to add a panel or panels later on.  Easy to accomplish and the advantage of not having other panels shut down because of shade.