I want more than I can afford.

[DannyB1954]

Here we go again.  

Solar is a science.  The panels have a 30 year production warranty.  That means that after 30 years, solar panels will continue to produce a guarenteed level of power, or greater.  This is computed with real science, not by guessing. 

A 12v refridgerator can be run off of one 100w panel, as long as nothing else is attached  It is best to have 200w minimum.  With 200W it is possible to run a basic dwelling using fans to cool with, a fridge/freezer, lights, recharging for all electronic gadgets, and cooking with a Roadpro type device.

There is no such thing as more solar power than you need.  More panels mean that the batteries are kept toped up, and last longer.  

Panels and batteries keep improving.  With the new Renogy panels, 20 to 25% more power is produced over last years design.  

IMHO, AC is a bad use of power.  That is just my opinion.   It is possible to run an AC with 1K of panel, and 500ah of batteries.  

Nothing is free, but with solar it is a lot quieter and the pay off is much quicker than buying a generator.

You will excuse me if I do not post all the scientific proof for my statements.  It has been posted on this forum many times.  It is NOT opinion, but reality.

The problem isn't so much having a couple of solar panels as much as it is having an air conditioning unit. We were talking about running a room air conditioner off of a solar system. If for most of the year you only need 200 watts of panels, and you have 1,000 watts of panels on the roof, (to cover a small A/C unit),  I would say that you spent a lot of money for little real benefit. You paid a lot of money for those extra 800 watts, what are they doing for you?  In a house application, you can get tax credits and sell your excess power back to the utilities. 

Is the vehicle even large enough to put on that many panels, I don't think I could fit that many panels on my Dodge van. How many extra batteries will you need to carry around? Oh buy the lithium batteries, that will only cost you a couple of grand more. Like I said if you got money to burn, go ahead. For me a $300 generator feeds anything I need to run and the fuel costs less than $5 if I run it all day. I can even park in the shade. 

I never kept a vehicle for 30 years. So when the vehicle dies, you have a choice. move the system to the new vehicle, or buy the new panels that are 25% more efficient.

 

[John61CT]

OP was just talking about A/C running off batteries, specifically a big LiFePO4 bank.

Solar only came into things later, I believe from other contributors.

 

[DannyB1954]

OP was just talking about A/C running off batteries, specifically a big LiFePO4 bank.

Solar only came into things later, I believe from other contributors.

OK I see that solar came into the picture starting in post #5. A number of people responded to that. Thanks.

 

[jimindenver]

John, that is a pretty expensive work around to not being able to bring the bank up to full. I was told Lipos don't like to be full which makes for a interesting situation with a powerful solar system.

Bardo
Believe it or not I have "been there and done that" We spent a season using the $300 generator
, more commonly known as a Champion 3500/4000 open frame. It wasn't too bad if we were inside running the air and TV. Outside it was obnoxious so I only suggest it for those that truly boondock way out by themselves. Now I didn't do the whole hitch mount feel it as well as hear it thing but when I replaced the original I got the remote start on sale for $425. I left it at home as we never used it and I can't pick up 120 pounds any more.

I do suggest getting the 120v only version as it has a much cleaner output than the dual voltage unit. Also visit the 3000 watt generator thread on RV.net. It's massive like nearly 1000 pages. A fair amount is dedicated to enclosing them and not just the simple enclosure I used to knock 10 db off. Most used a big fan to keep it cool and I'd suggest a venturi exhaust so you don't kill yourself.

 

[John61CT]

John, that is a pretty expensive work around to not being able to bring the bank up to full. I was told Lipos don't like to be full which makes for a interesting situation with a powerful solar system.

Got a great deal on eBay, lots of other advantages too besides eliminating the PSOC problem.

Very high acceptance rate, over 1C is fine, can get right up to full in an hour, no long tail means very short charge times / gennie runtimes, with a good Alt setup, just running an errand into town is enough for days' worth of power.

Can draw down 85% more usable AH rather than 50%.

Also half the weight per AH, less space.

Yes defining "full" at 99.5% keeping charge voltage <14V will double/triple lifetime compared to allowing the standard setting, need precise charge regulation is all.

But they do prefer "resting" at SoC 40-60% when not in active use.

I'll divert any excess solar to the lead reserve/starter, maybe a hot water coil or something.

 

[jimindenver]

Very nice. So a question. What is the voltage drawn down 85%.

 

[John61CT]

Depends how heavy the discharge current is, at normal gentle house bank usage levels, the curve is very very flat, to the point that you really can't judge state of charge from voltage.

You save thousands of lifetime duty cycles by avoiding those so-called shoulder areas, at both the top and the bottom.

And if you ever let them drain completely, you just throw them out, they don't recover at all. Same with trying to put a charge into them when they are below freezing.

So you do need some extra reliable protection gear, but not the full-fledged BMS that the vendors are trying to sell, that is what really makes the price skyrocket. Yes for electric vehicles' much rougher usage, but not at all needed for house bank usage.

 

[user 37446]

Reading this thread makes me wonder about:

1 - priorities
2 - how anyone before a/c was invented ever survived
3- what Tesla's next battery bank could do for mankind
4 - when will we supplement "solar" with, say "lunar" and take advantage of the other 12 or so hours in the 24 hour "day"?

just sayin'...

 

[jonsun]

already been solved. you pump water uphill with excess solar in the day and let it drain back down at night.

 

[BradKW]

Priorities: Many years ago I choose to live in a tent for as long as I could, in large part out of curiosity. I was employed, and my camping gear was basically expedition quality. I lasted 5 months, and one of the big things I took from that was that as long as I could sleep comfortably, I was generally happy with the other aspects of living like that. Cold certainly made for some brisk mornings, but proper gear negates the need for a heat source...but we see most everybody has a propane heater for comfort due to its low cost and convenience.

But what ended my tent living was the heat...when it doesn't even start to cool off til after 9pm and the lows are 85 and humid, I was no longer able to sleep comfortably...or even sleep at all sometimes.

Moving around based upon temps sounds like a great idea and someday I hope life simplifies to the point where that can indeed be my primary focus. However, that is not in my immediate plan right now, and for a number of good reasons. Like many others, I am able to make a good wage if I stay put, and save $1k+ per month if I'm not paying rent. So AC not only becomes necessary for comfort, it pays for itself by allowing my to live in a vehicle in an area that other vandwellers run for the hills for 6 months a year. Is the heat survivable in a van? Of course, and I know people that do it...but it's not comfortable, pleasant or desirable.

I kinda figure that Tesla PowerWall will be an upgrade I'll look at in a few years...it's been out for 2 years and still in such high demand that nothing is available for the private market.

And pretty sure Lunar energy isn't gonna happen...unless we manage to tie a cable to the moon or something

 

[VanKitten]

Didn't I read that the tesla power wall was withdrawn from the market?

I seem to remember hearing something about that last year.

 

[jonsun]

Bardo
Believe it or not I have "been there and done that" We spent a season using the $300 generator
, more commonly known as a Champion 3500/4000 open frame. It wasn't too bad if we were inside running the air and TV. Outside it was obnoxious so I only suggest it for those that truly boondock way out by themselves. Now I didn't do the whole hitch mount feel it as well as hear it thing but when I replaced the original I got the remote start on sale for $425. I left it at home as we never used it and I can't pick up 120 pounds any more.

1. way by themselves is ideal anyway
2. build a quiet box
3. an inverter generator like the ryobi is already pretty quiet and will easily handle startup of a small AC and has eco mode so when the ac kicks off it will idle down.


now running that for heat and AC lets you have a very small cabin battery and just a little solar for topping off and you can go park in the shade too. probably use about 3 gallons a day.

 

[666JTK666]

Useing a generator is a fine Idea, But I live in the land of the thieving cockroach, absolutely anything you can not keep secured WILL be stolen.
If I do go the cheap generator route I will have to somhow secure it to the exterior of the van or create a vented and sound deadening box on the interior of the van. I am still debating on the best thing to do. It's kinda silly I keep changing my mind or get sidtracked by this or that possibility.

 

[John61CT]

Are you saying these "cockroaches" (really?) can steal your gennie while you are present with it running?

To me solar is even more prone to theft, you can't (OK, don't) bring them inside when not in use.

 

[jimindenver]

Portable solar maybe but I have never heard of a mounted panel being stolen. I'm not even worried about the panel mounted on my truck and it's within reach. The ones on the trailers roof would take some effort to remove, a lot more than walking away with a generator.

 

[John61CT]

Yes, I am of the "overly trusting" school from the POV of the "realistic" types that call others subhuman.

My point was that being able to lock up the gennie out of site makes it **even less likely** to be stolen.

If I were someplace "they" would run off with it while you are there using it, I would definitely move to a better location.

 

[DannyB1954]

Useing a generator is a fine Idea, But I live in the land of the thieving cockroach, absolutely anything you can not keep secured WILL be stolen.
If I do go the cheap generator route I will have to somhow secure it to the exterior of the van or create a vented and sound deadening box on the interior of the van. I am still debating on the best thing to do. It's kinda silly I keep changing my mind or get sidtracked by this or that possibility.

You can make or buy a steel cargo box to mount on your vehicle. put in some vent holes and sound deadening material to the inside. The box serves 2 purposes, anti noise and anti theft.

 

[John61CT]

You don't want to be in or around your van with a gennie running in on or attached to it. CO is deadly, the noise and vibration to me **very** annoying.

I'd make sure the gennie's light and small enough to run well away from the van, rather than me having to be the one to move, especially in bad weather.

 

[BradKW]

My friend Howie recently upgraded his genny to a Honda 3000i and has it mounted on a bumper hitch. You really can't hear it inside the van and vibration isn't an issue. I often drive by his van during the day and make a point to listen for it, but it really is a very quiet machine. You can check out his setup here on YouTube:

Skip to the end to see how he has it mounted...electric start, custom extended gas tank and ported exhaust box aren't installed yet.

 

[GotSmart]

My friend Howie recently upgraded his genny to a Honda 3000i and has it mounted on a bumper hitch. You really can't hear it inside the van and vibration isn't an issue. I often drive by his van during the day and make a point to listen for it, but it really is a very quiet machine. You can check out his setup here on YouTube:  

Skip to the end to see how he has it mounted...electric start, custom extended gas tank and ported exhaust box aren't installed yet.

For the $2K ++ cost of a 3000i I can build a nice quiet solar system that never needs gas or oil. Cockroaches do not like to work hard to steal anything.