Hybrid Car Technology vs. Solar Energy Technology

[kllcbosmetris]

Stop start vehicles just restart if interior gets too hot or cold.  

Stop start vehicles. Are you talking about vans with "Eco Start/Stop"? I think Metris comes with it.

 

[John61CT]

Article with details http://autoweek.com/article/technology/what-auto-stop-start-autoweek-explains

 

[kllcbosmetris]

The secret sause is the 400v electric AC compressor.  You add that to your van system and run the interior fan and a condenser fan and you"vs got cold AC

I'd love it if you could elaborate on this, when you get a chance. FWIW, the van would have an enhanced rear A/C package, with a second condensor and heat exchanger (whatever these things are) for the rear.

 

[John61CT]

Yours only works with the engine running.

An EV's needs (**very** dangerous for DIYers to mess with) very high voltage electricity.

The sort you get as part of owning an EV.

Which is pretty useless for House bank usage without very expensive conversion gear.

 

[Bdog1]

I'd love it if you could elaborate on this, when you get a chance. FWIW, the van would have an enhanced rear A/C package, with a second condensor and heat exchanger (whatever these things are) for the rear.

I'm unable to post a pic with my connection but if you google Prius AC compressor you will see an electric powered unit with the tell tale orange hi-voltage wires. And yes, currently your's is engine (belt) driven. Poke around and check out the new Hymer/Road Trdck with the advanced battery option, it has a dedicated alternator and an automatic engine start for when the battery gets low.



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[John61CT]

Poke around and check out the new Hymer/Road Trdck with the advanced battery option, it has a dedicated alternator and an automatic engine start for when the battery gets low.

http://roadtreking.com/new-class-b-activ-hymer-makes-debut/

Yes, autostarts the propulsion engine based on low House bank voltage to charge it from a purpose built alt/VR "DC genny".

Interesting.

But no high voltage EV tech in there, standard 12V other than lithium, I assume they use LFP.

 

[kllcbosmetris]

I'm unable to post a pic with my connection but if you google Prius AC compressor you will see an electric powered unit with the tell tale orange hi-voltage wires.  And yes, currently your's is engine (belt) driven.  Poke around and check out the new Hymer/Road Trdck with the advanced battery option, it has a dedicated alternator and an automatic engine start for when the battery gets low.

Found out it is called "Voltstart" but proprietary system only used in Hymer vans. Anyone with a DIY Voltstart experience, feel free to chime in. Also people who may have used hybrid or electric car technology in their van conversion.

 

[John61CT]

Found out it is called "Voltstart" but proprietary system only used in Hymer vans. Anyone with a DIY Voltstart experience, feel free to chime in.

That is a feature I'd likely disable if I owned that van. I want to control myself when the engine is running, and would prefer a DC genny with its own little motor rather than idling the propulsion engine for bank charging.

Also people who may have used hybrid or electric car technology * in their van conversion.

* for House bank usage

It's very important to include that specific bit.

EV propulsion usage is where all the hobbyist action is, AFAIK **no one** has publicized any experimentation yet adapting / converting the high-voltage technology for House-use low-voltage storage.

Other than camping in a Prius.

Presumably the new RAV4 and 4runner hybrids work the same. None are tow vehicles though.

Best scenario I come up with is using it is this:

 

[kllcbosmetris]

That is a feature I'd likely disable if I owned that van. I want to control myself when the engine is running, and would prefer a DC genny with its own little motor rather than idling the propulsion engine for bank charging.

Is there a generator that would fit under the hood and autostart when the house battery is low?

 

[John61CT]

It would be possible to design one, but electric start units tend to be larger or poor quality

Maybe on some huge old truck, not modern fuel-efficient vehicles, every cubic inch is accounted for.

And for me I definitely would not want autostart anyway.

 

[Mrcap]

A YouTube search will show you many examples of lithium batteries used for RV dry camping and solar setups. Some of the users have reclaimed electric auto batteries while others have new style dedicated lithium batteries. Some even configure their own by building a battery bank or battery wall using smaller lithium cells.

Many people are not aware yet that there are tons of lithium battery options that may only require a programmable mppt charge controller to switch to lithium.

In the long run lithium is cheaper as you can deplete a lithium battery to 20% without adversely affecting the batteries life cycles. With my AGMs I try not to dip below 75%. Lithium batteries have over 10 time the number of discharge cycles as well.

Lithium’s don’t off-gas and can be stored inside. There are so many positives with the most common drawback being only that the initial investment is much higher. Here are a few links that might be helpful.







A YouTube search for “RV Lithium Solar” gives a ton of great videos.









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[kllcbosmetris]

A YouTube search will show you many examples of lithium batteries used for RV dry camping and solar setups. Some of the users have reclaimed electric auto batteries while others have new style dedicated lithium batteries. Some even configure their own by building a battery bank or battery wall using smaller lithium cells.

I am aware of the lithium setup videos but haven't found a lot of van conversion videos with reclaimed electric auto batteries. That set up could help me to understand whether it is possible to have an EV-chargeplug on a van conversion and change my entire conversion plan (i.e. prius type electric A/C compressor + heating via your manufactured vent set up + avoiding propane all together and running everything on electric + no need to worry too much about roof solar space, which is stealthy as well + longer boondocking options). Pretty enticing ... to at least learn about it.

 

[Mrcap]

I am aware of the lithium setup videos but haven't found a lot of van conversion videos with reclaimed electric auto batteries. That set up could help me to understand whether it is possible to have an EV-chargeplug on a van conversion and change my entire conversion plan (i.e. prius type electric A/C compressor + heating via your manufactured vent set up + avoiding propane all together and running everything on electric + no need to worry too much about roof solar space, which is stealthy as well + longer boondocking options). Pretty enticing ... to at least learn about it.

You might enjoy this guys channel that shows lots of lithium battery applications including electric vehicles and charging methods.





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[scottorious]

I did end up buying the Chevy Volt battery I mentioned in the earlier post. There are all kinds of salvaged Volt parts going pretty cheap, including the Aircon compressor. The problem I see with that is that it is driven from an inverter and 3 phase, I suppose that inverter is for probably for sale also but I would have to believe that it just keeps getting more complicated. It really wouldn't be super stealthy either. I drive a Volt and it's rather noisy when the car is sitting still and the compressor is running.

It is possible to use EV charging stations with that adapter like in that other post. John is probably right though and if people start building trailers with salvaged EV packs and foraging for electricity at the free stations they wont be free for long, there are some chargers that I pay a fee to use and it's still rather cheap considering that 10KWH(the volt's useable capacity) is only a couple dollars in electricity. So even if the free stations turned into pay stations your idea still might be worthwhile. Two grocery stores in my hometown (Normal Illinois is trying to be EV town) have free chargers out front, I'm sure their power rate is even lower than residential rates so I imagine they are happy to give away 50 cents in electricity if you were to replenish your food stocks there.

Something I'm going to look into for heating and cooling if I feel safe with the using the 16KWH pack is to adapt a ductless mini split to my RV. 1 option is a 48 volt DC model mini split which just happens to be the voltage of 6 of the Volt pack modules. The other would be to run a 120 volt mini split from an inverter. Neither of those would be stealthy though.

I'm interested in your thoughts though as my plan is very similar. Use a big battery that doesn't require daily top ups and require less chasing of the sun and less generator runtime. As an EV driver I come to rely on those charging stations so I probably won't be using them as I'd also hate to be responsible for some kind of failure that caused expensive damage to the charging station. I see myself checking into a campground every so often for a night to charge up the bank, empty the holding tank and fill the water tank.

 

[scottorious]

This is the closest thing I have found for what would be applicable to a van setup.

 

[scottorious]

Here's kind of a crappy clip of the 48 volt mini split.

 

[John61CT]

> van conversion videos with reclaimed electric auto batteries That set up could help me to understand whether it is possible to have an EV-chargeplug on a van conversion

Anything is possible with an experienced engineer, or maybe one of the EV super hobbyists if you could get one interested, but I think very early days on that yet, pioneers will be collecting arrows in the back for another year or three.


> change my entire conversion plan (i.e. prius type electric A/C compressor + heating

But how are you going to **power** those functions? plugging in overnight will only get you a few hours' worth, and I would not count on plugs being available for non-EV use.

A decent sized genny will get you there, running 5-8 hours a day, but nothing to do with high-volt EV banks tech, all these re-charging issues are the same with regular low-voltage batts as well.

 

[John61CT]

And forget stealth with air con, heaters and gennies running, total pipe dream there.

Not important anyway, you just need to find places where people don't mind you parking.

 

[kllcbosmetris]

But how are you going to **power** those functions? plugging in overnight will only get you a few hours' worth, and I would not count on plugs being available for non-EV use.

A decent sized genny will get you there, running 5-8 hours a day, but nothing to do with high-volt EV banks tech, all these re-charging issues are the same with regular low-voltage batts as well.

My initial thought was to have an Inergy Kodiak, which is portable (re: you can take it with you to an office and fully charge it in a few hours with a fast charger), connected to a stationary AGM system. Then I found out that wouldn't be so efficient because AGM additions would limit Kodiak's 80% lithium discharge to 50%. Passed. Too expensive for a system that is capped at 1100w (which wouldn't run my 1800w mini convection oven) and a 50% discharge capacity.

My second plan was to build a system myself, with a 200AH (or more) lithium battery pack + 2000w pure sine inverter (to run my 1800w AC appliances). This option would require a full roof solar (dark EFTE flexible panels - around 400w or more, if I can fit another 100w) to charge.

Third option appeared as I was trying to understand how Prius campers do what they do in their hybrid vehicles. Seemed pretty convenient to run A/C or heat with their car battery (w/o running the engine). Very stealth and convenient. Then I said "Why can't we just build that in a conversion or just use Prius/Volt/EV batteries?" and here we are.  

2000w inverter generators, which I've researched, can be a good back up option for the times I go out boondocking in nature but not feasible for me as I plan to be in urban areas (re: can't run a generator even in a covered parking lot, while keeping stealth) to make a living. So at this point I am either doing #2 or #3 ... and #3 would be so nice as you don't have to reload the battery bank frequently and you can replace your entire roof solar set up with a portable/foldable pack. Very stealthy. We'll see. Research continues.

 

[Mrcap]

Technomadia is a great source of info too:




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