How do you carry, if you carry a gun?

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Look in to obtaining a Utah carry permit which is recognized in I believe 38 states. Hopefully your home state is one of them. Some states have reciprocity with other states to recognize out of state carry permits. The NRA has a list on their website.
 
The Byrna HD Personal Security Device is not the cheapest thing out there, but it looks very effective, easier to use than pepper spray, it can carry multiple loads, and if you buy some of their practice ammo in enough bulk, can be used for training, discouraging animal pests, or even some target practice.



It is also relatively easy to carry, either openly or concealed.

I haven't gotten one myself, but I think I will at some point. I like non-lethal alternatives whenever possible. And I asked the maker a question or two, and he was friendly and quick with answers.
 
Dingfelder said:
The Byrna HD Personal Security Device is not the cheapest thing out there, but it looks very effective...



...

That pepper spray looks like a pistol. The person being fired on by you could return fire which escalates to a much more dangerous level. You are now in a gunfight with a pepper spray dispenser to defend yourself with. Something to consider.

My pepper spray looks like pepper spray. The main problem I have with it is it gets old and leaks out a little. Then you have the hot pepper residue in your living environment.
-crofter
 
tradesman said:
I would suggest bear spray as alternative and addition to your pepper spray. Compared to typical pepper spray it sprays much stronger and farther. The benefit to a firearm is that it’s unlikely to kill someone or yourself having/using it. Of course certain states restrict its use just like pepper spray but less than a firearm. Btw I’m not against firearms but if you don’t practice and train a lot (like others have said) I think it’s risky and has consequences that can’t be undone.
Plus if you are ever in the woods and come across a bear or mountain lion you are ready.

Not if the bear or mountain lion has a gun.
 
crofter said:
That pepper spray looks like a pistol. The person being fired on by you could return fire which escalates to a much more dangerous level. You are now in a gunfight with a pepper spray dispenser to defend yourself with. Something to consider.

My pepper spray looks like pepper spray. The main problem I have with it is it gets old and leaks out a little. Then you have the hot pepper residue in your living environment.
-crofter
It's not pepper spray, and has vast advantages over it.

If you believe you are in a gunfight, you definitely shouldn't be using either device.
 
you know its pepper spray but when I’m coming toward you and that looks like a gun mines gonna come out. Anybody else that has a gun for self protection would see it and do the same. So if something like that Happens you better shoot first. I hope there’s not more than one Person with a gun unless you’re fast enough to disable more than one before they fire back at work certainly appears to be a gun.
 
crofter said:
A quote, "[font=proximanova, sans-serif]“We need to treat any kind of weapon as if it’s a real weapon,” said Officer Sara Horan."  From this article:

Description: link to news article
https://www.9news.com/article/news/...-guns/73-811a8f38-8962-4628-8870-c5f21724dfa5
~crofter
[/font]
Absolutely anything that is going to be drawn on you is going to look like a gun, from car keys to a flashlight to my wallet to a flashlight to a kubotan or yawara - yeah, really no point in compiling a list.  Journalists in hot zones get killed for "wielding" cameras far too frequently. It is hard to say it's even anyone's fault.
 
Is that thing just a glorified paint ball gun?Knife to a gunfight?
 
1shemp said:
Is that thing just a glorified paint ball gun?Knife to a gunfight?
Its main use is to fire the equivalent of pepper spray, in multiple charges if desired, in a ball that explodes to get it into you in powder form.  I want it mainly to keep dogs and wildlife at bay when walking my own dogs, but wouldn't mind if it did more if needed.  It's not a substitute for a lethal weapon, but strikes me as more potent and reliable than a spray that can be immediately turned against you if the wind shifts or if you aren't aware of the wind in the first place -- as I imagine virtually nobody will be in the case of a sudden, violent attack.  That versus either something like coyotes or bad-actor neighborhood dogs or possibly cougars bothering me for sure.  Dedicated criminals, not so sure.  But that's what less lethal should be about - decision making, not a panacea.  Let's face it, these are all ugly outcomes.  There is no happy outcome.  You just have to choose your least worst.
 
I certainly agree with the use of such a thing on threatening critters my concern in the last post was Threatening people considering it a gun and then pulling theirs out in reaction. I have a friend who scared off a black bear with one of those wasp sprays that goes like 30 feet in a straight stream. Very effective if you happen to have one with you when you Are confronted by an angry bear. Not sure how that would go on your western grizzlies but it worked on our eastern black bears. With my budget bear spray or Wasp spray is more affordable than a $300 paintball pistol. I’m guessing that a long-distance wasp Spray would be pretty good against an angry person Who was not packing a gun. God bless the nomads and keep the critters happy or far away.
 
nature lover said:
I certainly agree with the use of such a thing on threatening critters my concern in the last post was Threatening people considering it a gun and then pulling theirs out in reaction. I have a friend who scared off a black bear with one of those wasp sprays that goes like 30 feet in a straight stream. Very effective if you happen to have one with you when you Are confronted by an angry bear. Not sure how that would go on your western grizzlies but it worked on our eastern black bears. With my budget bear spray or Wasp spray is more affordable than a $300 paintball pistol. I’m guessing that a long-distance wasp Spray would be pretty good against an angry person Who was not packing a gun. God bless the nomads and keep the critters happy or far away.
Bear spray, wasp spray, and some of those other sprays are explicitly against the law in some jurisdictions.  I see people promoting the use of such things regularly, and believe they might be getting themselves in big trouble.  Plus, how many people are really likely to equip themselves with anything at all, much less bear spray, much less hornet spray or wasp spray or whatever?  I would guess few to vanishingly few.  My guess is that someone who paid a fair amount of money for a defensive weapon would be reasonably like to have it on hand.
 
I am thankful for all these ideas. We have a lot to think about.

We have asked some people that do a lot of camping as well and it is interesting what we have heard.

It seems more people carry then we thought.

There are a lot of ways they carry and it surprised me how many don't have legal licenses and how many are doing it secretly.

There are a lot of folks who carry just for 'fun'. They like to target shot and/or hunt.

The number of folks that feel safer with guns or have really strong fears that they will need to kill someone is very high.
They seem to be the same ones who have their guns locked up and hidden. Which leads me to question how fast could you get that gun out if you really did need it? Not that I want all those guns out in the open, but really if it takes you at least 10 mins to get at that gun how does it help? What is your back up if you can't get at the gun? There is a hell of a lot of pepper spray out there.

Hubby still is thinking he needs one, but he is starting to ask/think about more questions of the responsibilities and real needs, the reality of how and such. We had a night at a rest area that was scary for someone else at the rest area so he is now thinking more about it for more reasons. The same night for me was to think we need to get stronger phone service...
 
why do i need a gun when i am proficient in bat, jack handle, and crow bar.
 
Now you know where the bad guys are at stay away from those kind of places. I haven’t heard of any problems at Cracker Barrel other than deadly weight gain!
 
RVTravel said:
why do i need a gun when i am proficient in bat, jack handle, and crow bar.
Because they can shoot you, before you are close enough to bat them or bar them proficiently with your miscellaneous instruments.
Jus sayin'....
 
I have my CCW, and have several guns, but rarely carry one. I'm not usually in a threatening situation while walking around. I keep it in the back map pocket of my passenger seat in my car, so if a situation arises, I can easily grab it in seconds. I haven't found (or really looked for) a small conceal carry gun that is comfortable to have on me at all times like I know many people do.

Some people will say that a .45 cal has enough stopping power to bring down just about anyone, or anything charging at you, but also weighs so much because of the large diameter shells, and has a small capacity for those rounds. Trust me when I say that a .22 cal magnum has plenty of power, and noise to scare 95% of whatever is coming at you, and if the first shot din't get their attention, maybe the next 19 shots will (small diameter, and weight rounds).
 
Couple points. Impact weapons, tire irons, bats etc, have very limited range and nearly impossible to use once actual contact has been made and someone has you pinned against a vehicle or wall or has hold of your arm and such. They arent entirely useless, but much less useful than proponents seem to think. Someone with much real experience or training can also likely take them from you, in which case you just gave them a deadly weapon. Theres techniques that deal with contact and entangled situations, it often involves retention techniques for a firearm and compact knives carried easily available to disengage from someone thats grappling with you.

Some states dont require any permit to carry concealed, most dont require any sort of permit to own, most western states dont require any permit to have one loaded in a vehicle so long as its not concealed, or some say something like "2 steps" to be able to use if loaded and concealed in the vehicle but not on a person, such as in a holster or glove box, locked glove box or variations on that theme. It can vary by state. Utah has some truly weird laws in regards to non-concealed carry permitted persons, like an auto pistol can be carried openly with an empty chamber, or a revolver can be carried openly if the chamber under the hammer AND the next one up in rotation is also empty. So, some that say they carry and dont have a concealed carry permit arent necessarily violating any laws. Local state laws vary considerably.

A 45 isnt necessarily heavier than other similar guns, yes the ammo weighs more, but in the greater scheme of things, theres not often a large overall difference in weight. if one isnt carrying it long or far, the weight is much less of an issue, except that many are simply lazy and dont want to deal with it. Also a factor, despite whatever financial investment they may have in the gun, few people with carry permits carry full time or even regularly from what I understand. In years past, many police felt any officer that actually carried off duty were gun freaks. Many involved with law enforcement have only rudimentary training or interest or knowledge of guns or even the laws about them. For some reason many people think if someone is a police officer they much know a lot about guns and are good with them.

"Good area" "Bad area" have some bearing, but not as much as most seem to think, in the chance one may need their firearm for defense. Crooks are mobile, they also often go where theres more plunder, meaning not in poorer neighborhoods. The so-called good areas are what, a few minutes walk or drive from the so-called bad areas, not really much of a hurdle. Less likely? Yes, but certainly not enough to completely disregard the chances of anything happening.
 
The thing it may be hard to admit, especially if one is heavily invested in the macho syndrome, is that we tend to lose reaction time as we age. Speed and balance too, often dramatically. Relying on our physicality as we age becomes steadily less practical and therefore steadily more dangerous to us. One of the main weapons in our arsenal should be the ability to be honest with ourselves. My 20 year old self could kick the crap out of me with relative ease. It happens to people with training no less than anyone else -- age can and WILL hobble us and it should humble us at least enough to keep us realistic about our present-day abilities.
 
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