Got my Solar Kit!

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Mark

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Yeah!

I think I'm going to do a "How I installed my Solar" thread like Seraphim did. I don't mean to compete with his thread, which I've learned a lot from, but more to offer the story of someone who barely knows what he is doing and an instal in a far different rig.

It will also be a naked cry for constant help!!!!

For starters, I've been reading about how all the connections should be nice and tight and clean. I've read about Voltmeters and Crimpers and Heat Guns, so my first request is: Give me the list of the tools that I should get! I really don't want to spend a ton of money on tools I'll use only once but I will buy them if it means a worry free instal down the road.

Many thanks in advance!
 

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nice...youll mostly need a good pair of crimpers..if you have only one battery, than the regular size one will work (does several common size wires, usually can find one that can cut and strip wire too). something to drill thru body for solar wires, rubber grommets, caulk gun and silicon.

the heat gun is if you want to 'shrink wrap' a sheath over connections, i just used electrical tape over the crimps personally.

youll need basic tools for solar mounts, like wrenchs and driver (depends on mounts...mine used self tap screws)
 
a heads up, you can use a pocket lighter(like a bic) or any open flame for heat shrink tubing. just be careful not to burn the tubing. highdesertranger
 
The more the merrier - different obstacles, different solutions, different screw ups lol

If you're going to use heavier ring terminals, Sears makes a heavy plier/cutter with a crimping device on it. I'm going to use mine for the heavier terminal rings I'm putting on.

Also a cheap soldering gun and silver solder will help make connections stronger, and fill in the gaps between strands on the wire, eliminating potential arcs down the road. Cheap protection.

I'll post a demonstration tomorrow on a splice I have to do, if you've never done it before.

Also, if you're using the standard mc4 connectors ( I think that's right) once connected they can be a bear to separate, if need be. Renogy makes a $6 tool for helping disassembly. I ordered one just to have around, in case... Probably never need it.


Was going to post a photo of the crimpers - they have a green handle - but it's out in the camper. Costs about $12 - $17 IIRC. As SternWake pointed out in my post, those cheaper (but not by much) electrical crimpers aren't going to work for heavier crimps.
 
I would have thought of using a propane torch and heat shrink tubing for the soldering. I am not sure a soldering gun gets hot enough (although I have been wrong before, don't know the size wire or wattage of said gun)
 
Heat shrink tubing and solder perform two different functions, if I'm reading your post aright. Propane torch would work for both, if you already have one. Might be overkill, but I don't know.


I'll let you know how my cheap soldering iron works tomorrow.
 
I was thinking with the amount of heat you would need to heat the copper the plastic casing would melt. That's why I mentioned the heat shrink to cover up the extra exposed bare copper.
 
cdiggy said:
I was thinking with the amount of heat you would need to heat the copper the plastic casing would melt. That's why I mentioned the heat shrink to cover up the extra exposed bare copper.

Ok. I didn't get the intent of the statement. My bad...


...but I don't think you have to heat the wire to the extent the casing will melt.
 
I am looking forward to your solar install. I will be doing mine within the next year.
 
The solder will melt and run before it hardens again.

Maybe I'll try a video tomorrow to document my success/failure...


cdiggy said:
I am looking forward to your solar install. I will be doing mine within the next year.

We will want pictures lol
 
Ha! First I need insulation and heat! S'pose will be needing pics of that too :)
 
Okay, I going to start rooting around in my rig tomorrow to get a better idea of what is what and where it all is.

Three questions.

1) The Magnum Inverter I have has AC IN and AC OUT. A diagram show "AC Main Panel" as the IN, and then shows a Sub Panel and, further an AC Plug.

I understand the OUT but why is there an AC IN?

2) The inverter docs show that if the inverter is less that 10 feet away from the batteries, #2 AWG wire should be used. It also states that "The DC wires must have soldered and crimped lugs, crimped copper compression lugs, or aluminum mechanical lugs".

Am I going to have these made up special?

3) To connect my batteries together, will I need the same kind of wire and lug ends as above? Also made special?

Many thanks.
 
Two things,

1) The inverter is generally one of the last things you do. You may want to start at the beginning and dedicate yourself to it and just take one step at a time. It's easy to get so scattered around by all the new things you get lost. Just a thought.
2) It'll help if you give us all the information you have. Which inverter do you have, tell us the model number, size and features.
Bob
 
Good point, Thanks, Bob.

I have a Magnum1000 watt Pure Sine Inverter. The MMS1012.
 
If the inverter has AC IN connections, it is an inverter charger, so that when you have grid power you can charge the batteries from this single inverter charger, rather than having both an inverter, and a separate battery charger.

i am not personally familiar with inverter chargers nor magnum products so will offer no more along those lines.

Electrical tape is the devil. Do not use it. it will unravel at some point and leave a sticky mess and possibly cause a short if a hot hits something grounded. Remembering to slide heat shrink tubing over wires to be joined first is an oft made mistake. There is adhesive lined heat shrink tubing and this is the cats meow. While I've made use of harbor freight heat shrink tubing, Ive found recently that it re expands and can be moved around. if it moves around it is allowing in oxygen. if it allows in oxygen it is allowing in corrosion and higher resistance. I figure all the HF heatshrink tubing I've used over the years is compromised and the connection underneath is now compromised and suspect.

Cheap Nylon covered crimps are very problem prone, often they are steel or aluminum instead of tin coated copper. High resistance and will cause voltage drop and connector heating. generally the insulated crimps with clear insulation in red blue or yellow are of good quality. Avoid the harbor freight connectors at all costs. Do not even glance at them unless you are trying to determine what true junk is and what should never be used.

Proper crimping, or Soldering requires not only the right tools, but the right skills. I shudder at some of the crimps and solder connections i've seen over the years. I even shudder when i found a crimp i myself installed 10 years ago before i knew better. It is not only a mechanical connection but an electrical one and they can be really badly done and will cause issues that are very difficult to find the cause of at a later point, when one discovers an issue.

There are many videos on crimping and soldering on U tube. Try to find one by somebody who actually has a brain. many on there actually show you "how it is done" but it is more of how they did it, and how not to do it.


While one can go completely overboard and make things way more difficult than they need to be, one can also do the exact opposite, like crushing a crimp in some pliers and wrap it in electrical tape and call it macaroni, when it should be called a fire or a failure waiting to happen.


A proper crimp will not accept any solder into the crimped area, and soldering can cause the connection to become brittle when solder wicks up the wire. Generally both Soldering and crimping is unnecessary. A good crimp needs no solder, a good solder joint should need no other mechanical means, but should be supported to the wire cannot flex and vibrate. A crimp that needs solder, is a bad crimp.

For terminating large cables, it becomes much much much more important to do things right, and as such, I recommend that anybody with little experience or desire to buy quality speciality tools to do the job, have their cables made for them professionally. It will cost less in the long run. Cheap tools yield inferior end results.

http://www.genuinedealz.com/custom-cables

Watch some of this guys videos on examples of a pisspoor product than many use for their wiring jobs:


Keep in mind that while this guy is doing pull tests to see the strength of a crimp, these substandard tools will yield a much higher resistance electrical connection, and instead of solar wattage flowing from solar panel into battery, some wattage will go into heating these bad quality crimps and the wires surrounding them, all becuase one wanted to save a few bucks on a tool.

While an RV need not meet the exacting standards set by the ABYC, please read the following articles:
http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/wire_termination.

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/terminating_small_wires

The cheap and easy to use hammer crimpers used on larger cable are not really adequate for a long lasting low resistance wire termination.

Please read the following article as to why i recommend you have your battery cables or inverter cables made by a professional

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/battery_cables

Often, when one looks at their own wiring job a few months after completing it, they are lost as to what wire goes where or came from and what it does.

Please read the following article on labelling your wires. This will save many headaches down the road. you can just write on blue tape and cover the blue tape with clear scotch tape instead of going as nuts as this guy:

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/wire_labeling

In fact, if you peruse the following website where i pulled all these links from, where it concerns batteries and things dc electrical, your next thousand questions can be answered.

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/boat_projects



Please also keep in mind the "just fine" phrase that is often used with regards to either battery or solar performance or the wiring between the two

"Just Fine" is synonymous with " I know it is not quite the proper way to do things, but it has not failed yet, and therefore, is 'just fine"

One should seek to divest themselves from 'just fine' or at least view anything or any claim with the words "just fine", with great suspicion.
 
Agree with most everything, but I have recently been using the HF Marine heat shrink, which has an adhesive in it. So far it has proven to be a good quality product. I'll say this, do you best to not have to remove that heat shrink, once that adhesive sets, that cover is not going anywhere.

Mike R
 
I'm digging the links that SternWake posted. I made my own cables, and they seem to be holding up. Not that I did any of this the "right" way, but here's what I used:

For thick cables (size 2 to 4/0), I used a hammer crimper and a hammer. After hammering them down, I placed the hammer crimper in a vice (sideways) and used that to smoosh the crimp down further. I used heat shrink over the lugs, and that was really fun for some reason.

For cable size 8 to 20, I used ring terminals from Home Depot, and West Marine. DO NOT use Harbor Freight terminals, the wires pull out of them easily. I used a cheap Harbor Freight wire stripper, and it worked fine. To crimp wire size 10-20, I used this ratchet crimper. http://www.amazon.com/Tool-Aid-1890...id=1418451700&sr=8-2&keywords=ratchet+crimper

To crimp size 8, I smooshed the terminal in a vice. Not exactly textbook, but it seems to have worked okay.

To cut thick cable, I used a Harbor Freight 10" cable cutter. Worked okay, even for 4/0 cable, but I kind of had to "chew" though the 4/0--not exactly the cleanest cut in the world.

I chose not to solder any of my connections.

I'm gonna say it. My system is running just fine. And I have to say, most "pros" have disappointed me greatly. I have almost no faith in anyone who calls themselves a "pro" at anything, so I do things myself when I can and I feel just fine about it.
 
christine said:
To crimp size 8, I smooshed the terminal in a vice. Not exactly textbook, but it seems to have worked okay.

This is a failure waiting to happen. A crimp is 360 degree compression, Smushed in a vice does not come close.
I bet 20 pounds of pressure could separate wire from crimp and passing 25+ amps the connector gets hot.

Unsafe on every level.

At least you did not claim this method is "just fine"
:)
 
So do you have a crimper for size 8 wire that you recommend?
 
I use my Harbor freight hydraulic crimper to 8 awg, but the dies I have are too small and i use the ones marked for 2 awg and 4 awg to do 8 awg wire. It is a pretty poor crimper overall. But newer models have better Dies. I wish i spent another 50$ for a better tool.

I think Somebody here hound a mechanical crimper for 6 and 8 awg wire in the 30 to 40 dollar range. Don't remember where or who but I think they started a thread on it specifically so you should be able to find it in a search
 

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