Get comfortable

[Desiraeaps]

Hi all! I've been lurking around Bob's website (as well as others') and this forum for years. I finally registered as a user a few nights ago. 

I apologize up front for the length of this post. I think it will be beneficial for me to externally process my thoughts for my own personal comprehension, as well as to get any encouragement (even just a "hi!") or advice anyone has to offer.  

For many, MANY years I've been thinking about how great it would be to "live in a van down by the river." I googled around and found so many like-minded people who were actually doing it. However, even though I constantly have a raging case of wanderlust, actually becoming a van dweeler always remained in the fantasy stage because I was too scared of what others may think, it seemed financially impossible, and I have always enjoyed/thought I needed(?) a stable life (read: a predictable/reliable income and an actual shingled roof over my head). 

I have had the same job for the last 19.5 years working for a psychologist and it will be coming to an end on June 30th. I've known this would happen for a few years now and had, until this past June, just ignored the deadline. I had a lot of uncertainty about what I was going to do, so I just ignored the situation. Which, of course, is the best way to deal with any problem. 
 

Anyway, this past June I just decided that I was going to use June 30, 2017, as a jumping off point for a new sort of adventure and life. I have felt for the last several years as though I'm stuck in the movie Groundhog Day--which, incidently, is my least favorite movie of all time. I really feel the need to jolt myself out of the rut I'm in. So, my plan for the last 6 or so months HAD been to take a two-month sabbatical and drive around the country to various National Parks, etc., and then relocate...somewhere. I figured the two months would provide the shake up I need, give me some amazing experiences, spark some personal changes, and I'd be ready for a fresh new life in a warmer climate. I have spent time every.single.day. over the last 6 months researching where I want to spend my time, a rough route, and then, also, researching cities or towns I may want to settle in after the trip. I've been making lists of things I need, things I need to do, things I need to sell...

However, in the last few weeks I have been again fantasizing about NOT ending my trip in two months and becoming an actual van dweller. 

Some hurdles. 

Major: I'm currently upside down on my auto loan. I don't even know what else I can say about that. Back when I bought the car two years ago, none of this was on the horizon. I mean, I knew my job was ending, but I figured I'd find another one and continue on living my same life.  

Moderate: I still have substantial school loans. I long ago accepted that I will just die with them, so I'm not going to try to wipe that debt out in the next...ever. However, it WILL still be a monthly expense. 

Moderate: I have a cat, Lola. My sister--the only person I trust to care for her even better than I do--agreed months ago to take her in during my two month trip. If I try to force Princess Lola into van life, only one of us will survive the first evening and I suspect it will NOT be me. In fact, I suspect we won't even make it out of the state. The 10 minute car trip to the vet is rough enough. I will not give her to anyone but my sister, nor would I surrender her to a shelter, so my sister would have to agree to take her in permanently. I would likely have to financially subsidize Lola's care as she has some medical issues I don't want to burden my sister with, but I think I could convince her to take her with that help. 

Minor: Income. Assuming I don't take a total bath on getting rid of my current vehicle and purchasing a replacement (I would be financing unless I find something super cheap), I'll be able to live off my meager savings (even with an auto loan) for nearly a year if I'm super careful. I will, of course, have to find some way to make a living as I don't actually want to ever completely deplete my savings. As someone who has previously refused to do things such as waitressing for a living because "I NEED to know how much money I can count on every week," I find my devil-may-care attitude about not actually having a job to immediately transition into both interesting and slightly concerning. I've either lost my mind or finally come to my senses. The jury's out on that one. 

When my plan was a two-month road trip/relocate, I settled on the Prius (inspired by Suanne and Chris of Hotel Prius) for two main reasons--1.) gas mileage since I planned to do a lot of driving and 2.) climate control while sleeping. I figured at the end of my trip, I'd still have a great road tripping car I could weekend camp in. After thinking for the last several months that I'd be getting 40-50 MPG, I'm finding it real hard to swallow the idea of a van at ~15 MPG. I guess, though, I could still see and do all I want, I'll just do it more slowly, over a longer period of time, staying in one place longer, etc...

Vehicle Requirements: 

1. Non-negotiable--I have to be able to stand up (I'm 5'8"). I can out-minimalist the best of them, but I can't downsize my height and I know that to be happy in a van as my "home," I have to be able to stand upright. 

2. It has to be a single unit in which I can move from the rear to the driver's seat without ever exiting the vehicle (i.e., no tag-along trailers, no pick-ups with a slide-in). This is strictly a requirement as far as me being able to feel as though I can quickly and safely vacate a dangerous situation and will allow me to sleep soundly at night. 

3. I'd like it to be inexpensive to purchase, inexpensive to repair and maintain, and to have a reputation for reliability and longevity. I don't even know if that combination is possible. I will want to make it livable (a bed, insulated, ventilated), but I don't necessarily want/need to fully convert it into a full-on camper situation. I have a ton camping gear already that I can toss in there. I can always improve/convert it later if I desire.

4. The highest MPG possible.   

Any and all ideas/suggestions/constructive criticisms are welcome. 

If you've made it this far, I both apologize for the length and thank you for sticking with it. It feels good to put it out into the universe, and get encouragement and feedback from experienced folks.

 

[Wabbit]

Hi Desiraeaps and welcome! I hope you find some great info and answers. It takes time and searching for some answers. Best wishes!

 

[Dennis]

Some of your comments sound so familiar. For some reason. lol
The upside down car loan makes it tougher but that is something that can eventually be worked out. You might take some savings and put with the car towards a trade in for a vehicle that can serve as home for whatever period of time you decide to travel. Then it could serve as adequate transportation if you ever decided to work for a while again.
That pretty much means get as good a deal as possible and as reliable a vehicle as possible because you will be living with it for a while. One payment would be covering housing cost and transportation cost. I expect you have already ran that through your mind. Just takes time to wiggle out of a tight spot. Been there....more than once.

Hi, BTW

 

[DannyB1954]

Welcome to the forum. You can't stand up in a Prius.  I think it is a good policy to go with what you already have for a time. If you buy a vehicle first you may find it doesn't fit the type of camping that you end up doing.  Everything's a compromise when it comes to RV's. You are not going to get a lot of space, all the creature comforts and great gas mileage.  To meet most all of your specifications a class B or B+ would be a good fit, (high top van). Unfortunately it is not the least expensive option. Used Class B's tend to be high mileage, (people get them with the intent to drive a lot and save money on gas). It is not unusual to find a low mileage Class C. Things do wear out with miles.

Gas mileage is a consideration, but it isn't the only consideration. If you drive more than camp, it becomes more important. If you camp more than drive, maybe something a bit larger will bring you more comfort.  If you drive 10,000 miles in a year and get 20 mpg and gas is $3 a gallon it will cost you $1,500 for gas. If you only get 10 mpg, $3,000. You save $1,500 a year, but your living space will be a lot smaller.  If you drive 5,000 miles a year your savings would be $750, (5,000 / 20 x 3 = 750,  at 10 mpg would be $1,500).   Now if you paid $10,000 more to get a gas efficient rig it would only take about 13 years to make it worthwhile, ($10,000 / $750 =  13.333333 Yrs). 

One would think it an easy decision on what to get.  I am still working on getting it right.

 

[Desiraeaps]

The upside down car loan makes it tougher but that is something that can eventually be worked out.  You might take some savings and put with the car towards a trade in for a vehicle that can serve as home for whatever period of time you decide to travel. Then it could serve as adequate transportation if you ever decided to work for a while again.
That pretty much means get as good a deal as possible and as reliable a vehicle as possible because you will be living with it for a while.  One payment would be covering housing cost and transportation cost. I expect you have already ran that through your mind.

The upside down loan does make it tougher, but isn't completely insurmountable. You're right--I probably would have to take some of my savings to rectify the situation. I'll be able to get more if I privately sell, but I will need to find someone willing to work with a bank-owned title, so we'll see how that goes. I won't be ready to get rid of it until April, so I still have time to work the vehicle situation out.

 

[Desiraeaps]

Thanks for your response, DannyB1954.  
 
I definitely can't stand in a Prius. I have several reasons for not wanting to keep my current vehicle (a 2013 CR-V), but I could if I had to for the short term. I definitely don't want to live in it, though, if I can help it. 

I have run all the gas mileage numbers. Well, I thought I had. I didn't run the version where it takes me 13.333333 years to make a more fuel efficient vehicle worth the up front costs, so that's definitely something to think about. I'm not being snarky--you make a good point! 

Choosing to be a full time car/van/whatever-dweller would definitely have me "camping" more than driving. (As opposed to my originally planned two-month trip where I'd definitely be doing more driving than camping--or, at the very least, equal amounts.) 

I have a deadline, but I do still have some time. I'm hoping to find the perfect (for me) vehicle by the end of April/beginning of May. I check around online nearly daily hoping something amazing will jump out at me. Unfortunately, I'm a little challenged in that I won't know a diamond-in-the-rough or a good deal when I see one--I'll just see "rough" and pass it by... Lots to learn!

 

[rvwandering]

Welcome to the CRVL forums Desiraeaps!

To help you learn the ins and outs of these forums, this "Tips & Tricks" post lists some helpful information to get you started. We look forward to hearing more from you.

 

[user 13531]

It's taken me years to finally commit to the life style change. Tomorrow I purchase my RV in Mesa, Arizona.. I plan on living in it full time beginning February 1st.  I won't be traveling full time put rather staying in a 1000 trails RV park on an annual space lease. I still own a business and work full time but will spend more time on the road each year using the RV park as my home base.

Thanks to Bob, this website and all the YouTube full timers for shedding light in my particular tunnel.  I can indeed see the light!

 

[DannyB1954]

my current vehicle (a 2013 CR-V), but I could if I had to for the short term. I definitely don't want to live in it, though, if I can help it. 

I have run all the gas mileage numbers. Well, I thought I had. I didn't run the version where it takes me 13.333333 years to make a more fuel efficient vehicle worth the up front costs, so that's definitely something to think about. I'm not being snarky--you make a good point! 

Choosing to be a full time car/van/whatever-dweller would definitely have me "camping" more than driving. (As opposed to my originally planned two-month trip where I'd definitely be doing more driving than camping--or, at the very least, equal amounts.) 

I have a deadline, but I do still have some time. I'm hoping to find the perfect (for me) vehicle by the end of April/beginning of May. I check around online nearly daily hoping something amazing will jump out at me. Unfortunately, I'm a little challenged in that I won't know a diamond-in-the-rough or a good deal when I see one--I'll just see "rough" and pass it by... Lots to learn!

You don't live in a car, you live out of a car. A lot of people also carry tents, Most things you will be doing will be outside of the vehicle. I like the Prius, it just didn't meet your desire to stand up, (inside of it that is). 

Many people spend thousands to save hundreds. I think humans have a knack for talking themselves into what they really want even if the logic makes no sense.  Thee last time the gas prices went up people were spending thousands on new vehicles when their old large car ran just fine and was paid for. Great, they saved $300 a year in gasoline  and it only cost them higher insurance, registration, and a new car payment. All vehicles will use gas, so it is the amount of difference between them that only should concern you. How long will it take for that gas savings to pay for the loss you take selling a good vehicle and the premium price you pay for the replacement.  How much full time comfort are you willing to give up for part time fuel savings. Not a good idea to go broke trying to save money. 
  
If the CRV front seat doesn't fold flat, maybe take the passenger seat out. Maybe put it in backwards. Make a flat place to sleep. Plywood is cheap. Go to Youtube and search for CRV Camper.

 

[eDJ_]

Welcome to the CRVL Forum    

My rig is a 1990 Ford E 350 (1 ton) Econoline Van.  It is extended and has a fiberglass high top.  I have several inches above my head and can walk from behind the front seats to the rear standing up.

With that said....the bed takes up 5 ft of the rear (out of the 11 ft of usable cargo space).   Over the seats in the driver/passenger compartment the original roof with head liner is still in place.  Most of these High Top mods I've seen do this.  It gives you storage over the top of the driver as a nice shelf area.

My rig looks about like this outside.

And on the inside

The tan rectangle behind the passenger seat is my ice chest and can be moved anywhere.  The tan rectangle attached
to the kitchenette is a hinged fold up/down table.   The two small brown rectangles behind the
drivers seat next to the kitchenette would be a couple of 5 gallon Jerry Jugs for fresh water.

What isn't shown is an adjustable spring loaded shower curtain rod that is mounted just behind the seats against the two dark brown squares.  The rod is even with the roof/shelf over the driver/passenger seats.
To this rod is mounted a beach towel for a privacy curtain using wire shower curtain pins.  Simple & effective.
I can store a lot of stuff under the bed in slide out plastic containers and hold them in place with "bungee" cords.   If I wanted I could add a sheet of plywood over the bed on the old roof edge (where the fiberglass high top is mounted)  It would be about like the roof over the driver passenger.  This would provide storage
in otherwise unused space.  (and if I'm in bed I don't need to be standing up.  But there is still 6 ft of walk around room.  If it were only going to be you,  you could cut the bed to 3 ft width and have 8 ft of walking room. 

This Van has a 351 V8 gas engine with a 4 speed auto overdrive transmission.  I figure that as it is it gets about 16 mpg if I drive it at 55 mph.  It's high top really cuts back on the mileage at speeds over 55.  But all in all it is a rather dependable platform.  The tires are 16 inch and large.  I was able to get a deal on them awhile back for $100 each. (made in the USA)

It's minimalist and adequate.  If for some reason it got to be extreme weather,  I'd park it at a Motel where I could get a week by week efficiency room till the weather blew through. (so far it isn't insulated for extreme weather).   I'm not full time yet,   so I use it in the nicer weather months for week end outings,  day trips, fishing, and if I go to a field day with my HAM Radio friends. 

I'd welcome you to look at my sites below for any ideas you can gain from them.  The lower link is for planning trips and once you go on the road. (loads of handy info at your finger tips)

All the best.

 

[DuneElliot]

Welcome.

The gas calculations are a huge thing...and I've never seen it spelled out in the x amount of years it would take to recoup the costs as was done above.

I think you make do with what you've got, at least for now. Start out in the CR-V and see if you can make it tolerable, after all you are only going to be sleeping in it not "living in it" as someone correctly pointed out.

The point is that the most important thing is to get out there and live the dream you want to follow

 

[#1BonBonQueen]

I have just one suggestion about finding a vehicle, check out Craigslist for your area, or as far away as you are willing to travel to find a vehicle you may want to camp from in your new lifestyle.
A few years ago, before our new Motorhome, I found a great deal on a Ford 250, with an extended top. What a great van that was. Too bad Hubby found the Motorhome on our trip back from PA where we found a bought the van. LOL
I did re-sell it tho, and got our money back, after buying the Motorhome tho.
So, keep looking, at any place you can to find what you may want to have to came out of.
Good Luck and Welcome to the greatest group of van dwellers there is.
Sharon

 

[ArtW]

Welcome!
I can't really help you re car choices, I'm about to head to Q in a Ranger with a camper shell lol
While I'm there I might rent a UHaul van for a few nights to see the difference
A small class b would sound like your answer, but usually they are High Dollar

 

[hepcat]

Gas mileage is a consideration, but it isn't the only consideration. If you drive more than camp, it becomes more important. If you camp more than drive, maybe something a bit larger will bring you more comfort.  If you drive 10,000 miles in a year and get 20 mpg and gas is $3 a gallon it will cost you $1,500 for gas. If you only get 10 mpg, $3,000. You save $1,500 a year, but your living space will be a lot smaller.  If you drive 5,000 miles a year your savings would be $750, (5,000 / 20 x 3 = 750,  at 10 mpg would be $1,500).   Now if you paid $10,000 more to get a gas efficient rig it would only take about 13 years to make it worthwhile, ($10,000 / $750 =  13.333333 Yrs). 

There's even more to it than gas mileage... and that is the total cost of ownership of the unit during the time you have it.  Buying new is THE most foolish thing anyone can do. Don't get me wrong... I appreciate that people do it, because eventually those units come on the used market where I can afford them... but I sure can't afford a new motorhome.

But, I digress. As an example:  a new Roadtrek Popular 190 B-van  lists (starting) at $101,114.  Many of the Sprinter chassis vans run in the $135k arena, but for the sake of argument we'll use the Roadtrek because there are so many of them.  So, let's say you buy the base version for $101,114 with no options.  Add tax (5% in Iowa) $5,055.70, License in Iowa $110, and insurance ($1200/yr) and you're up to $107,479.70  Now let's say you keep it five years... a 2012 with 40,000 miles on it is currently selling in the neighborhood of $65,000 give or take.  Doing the math here, that's a loss to depreciation of $42,479.70, or $3540/year or $300/mo.  That's $300/month that you're just losing on top of whatever other money you're spending.   So...  if you're saving a ton of depreciation loss buying an older used B-van, you can afford a LOT of gas and maintenance for the money you're NOT spending on depreciation.

Now, that said, most of us don't have $107k to even spend on a base model motorhome, but the analogy still holds; buy the best, most in-demand unit you can find used at the very best price you can get it for.  It'll always be in demand and easy to sell when you're ready for something different.   It will also hold its resale better giving you a better return on what you spent, and it will depreciate at a slower rate than other coaches because of the demand (Chinook is a good example.)  Adhering to those tenants will help get you toward the lowest cost of ownership per mile you can get.   You want to buy a solid, reliable unit that won't require a lot in maintenance costs, but one that is already well-depreciated but in really nice usable condition. 

I have posted this in other threads, but last year, I found my '95 Coachmen for $5k with 26,000 miles on the drivetrain.  It needed some work, and I've put another $4k into it.   So I have $9k into a coach that everything works on, and will probably pretty much always be worth at least what I have into it. Similar coaches with higher miles are going for about $18k right now on RVTrader and Craigslist.  It gets a solid 13mpg, but my license is $60/year and insurance is cheap.  At $2/gal for gas, my operating expense and total cost of ownership is something around $0.25/mile.  Compare that with $2.00/mile for my '16 Jeep Rubicon (including depreciation.)  I don't even know what the total cost of ownership per mile would be on a new Roadtrek Popular 190 B-van at $107k purchase price.  

Just something else to consider on the financial end.  "Miles per gallon" is really not a big consideration in the total cost of ownership; the comparison should be "total cost of ownership per mile."

 

[Desiraeaps]

It's taken me years to finally commit to the life style change. Tomorrow I purchase my RV in Mesa, Arizona.. I plan on living in it full time beginning February 1st.  I won't be traveling full time put rather staying in a 1000 trails RV park on an annual space lease. I still own a business and work full time but will spend more time on the road each year using the RV park as my home base.

Thanks to Bob, this website and all the YouTube full timers for shedding light in my particular tunnel.  I can indeed see the light!

Congratulations! I agree, thanks to Bob's website, these forums, and the YouTubers, there's a wealth of information and possibilities to consider!

 

[Desiraeaps]

Welcome.

The gas calculations are a huge thing...and I've never seen it spelled out in the x amount of years it would take to recoup the costs as was done above.

I think you make do with what you've got, at least for now. Start out in the CR-V and see if you can make it tolerable, after all you are only going to be sleeping in it not "living in it" as someone correctly pointed out.

The point is that the most important thing is to get out there and live the dream you want to follow

"...live the dream you want to follow" 

How much happier/nicer a place would the world be if everyone did that?! 

The only way to make the CR-V "tolerable" is to remove the backseats. Not only do the rear seats not fold flat, but the seat bottom sticks up even more. Once you build a platform to go over the whole mess and stick a mattress on there (even just a 3" foam), it's going to feel like I'm sleeping in a coffin. I get claustrophobic just thinking about it. 

I know they MUST be able to be removed since I assume they weren't built in as one continuous piece with the frame, but I can't find any obvious way to do it. I have to search Google and YouTube more thoroughly than I already have.

 

[Desiraeaps]

I have just one suggestion about finding a vehicle, check out Craigslist for your area, or as far away as you are willing to travel to find a vehicle you may want to camp from in your new lifestyle.
A few years ago, before our new Motorhome, I found a great deal on a Ford 250, with an extended top. What a great van that was. Too bad Hubby found the Motorhome on our trip back from PA where we found a bought the van. LOL
I did re-sell it tho, and got our money back, after buying the Motorhome tho.
So, keep looking, at any place you can to find what you may want to have to came out of.  
Good Luck and Welcome to the greatest group of van dwellers there is.
Sharon

Thanks, Sharon. I've been searching Craigslist, cargurus.com, autotrader, and more almost daily. I usually keep my search to within 200 miles, but I sometimes do extend it further out just to see what might be available. And, with a little luck, like yourself, maybe I'll be able to find TWO vehicles that fit the bill! Ha!

 

[Desiraeaps]

Welcome to the CRVL Forum    

My rig is a 1990 Ford E 350 (1 ton) Econoline Van.  It is extended and has a fiberglass high top.  I have several inches above my head and can walk from behind the front seats to the rear standing up.

Thanks for all the detailed info, eDJ_ ! Your rig looks perfect. Want to sell it? Ha! I've actually been to your website before--lots of great stuff, there! 

I'm still weighing options. Someone in this thread (my memory fails at this moment) mentioned not living IN a vehicle, but living OUT of it. And that's a very good point. The big draw of this lifestyle is getting OUT and seeing and doing things. But if it's my "home" and I'm in inclement weather or just feeling plain non-outdoorsy one day, I do want to be able to move around in it while I'm in it.

 

[Desiraeaps]

There's even more to it than gas mileage... and that is the total cost of ownership of the unit during the time you have it.  Buying new is THE most foolish thing anyone can do. Don't get me wrong...  I appreciate that people do it, because eventually those units come on the used market where I can afford them... but I sure can't afford a new motorhome.  

But, I digress.  As an example:  a new Roadtrek Popular 190 B-van  lists (starting) at $101,114.  Many of the Sprinter chassis vans run in the $135k arena, but for the sake of argument we'll use the Roadtrek because there are so many of them.  So, let's say you buy the base version for $101,114 with no options.  Add tax (5% in Iowa) $5,055.70, License in Iowa $110, and insurance ($1200/yr) and you're up to $107,479.70  Now let's say you keep it five years... a 2012 with 40,000 miles on it is currently selling in the neighborhood of $65,000 give or take.  Doing the math here, that's a loss to depreciation of $42,479.70, or $3540/year or $300/mo.  That's $300/month that you're just losing on top of whatever other money you're spending.   So...  if you're saving a ton of depreciation loss buying an older used B-van, you can afford a LOT of gas and maintenance for the money you're NOT spending on depreciation.

Now, that said, most of us don't have $107k to even spend on a base model motorhome, but the analogy still holds; buy the best, most in-demand unit you can find used at the very best price you can get it for.  It'll always be in demand and easy to sell when you're ready for something different.   It will also hold its resale better giving you a better return on what you spent, and it will depreciate at a slower rate than other coaches because of the demand (Chinook is a good example.)  Adhering to those tenants will help get you toward the lowest cost of ownership per mile you can get.   You want to buy a solid, reliable unit that won't require a lot in maintenance costs, but one that is already well-depreciated but in really nice usable condition. 

I have posted this in other threads, but last year, I found my '95 Coachmen for $5k with 26,000 miles on the drivetrain.  It needed some work, and I've put another $4k into it.   So I have $9k into a coach that everything works on, and will probably pretty much always be worth at least what I have into it. Similar coaches with higher miles are going for about $18k right now on RVTrader and Craigslist.   It gets a solid 13mpg, but my license is $60/year and insurance is cheap.  At $2/gal for gas, my operating expense and total cost of ownership is something around $0.25/mile.  Compare that with $2.00/mile for my '16 Jeep Rubicon (including depreciation.)  I don't even know what the total cost of ownership per mile would be on a new Roadtrek Popular 190 B-van at $107k purchase price.  

Just something else to consider on the financial end.  "Miles per gallon" is really not a big consideration in the total cost of ownership; the comparison should be "total cost of ownership per mile."

I get the appeal of having a brand new, never-been-lived-in-by-anyone-else RV but, you're right, it definitely doesn't make good financial sense. Not that I have that kind of money to even consider it anyway! 

Total cost of ownership per mile is definitely a better way to look at it, rather than MPG. 

Also, looks like you got a heck of a deal on your Coachman, even with the $4k of work!

 

[ganchan]

I'm not really qualified to speak on this topic, since I haven't actually begin my "four-wheeled lifestyle" yet, but the phrase "for now" strikes me as an important one. No one vehicle does everything equally well, so as your lifestyle goals change, so will your rig. 

In my case, I plan to spend the first couple of years zipping all over the U.S. making business connections and finding new clients for my (freelance) career, which means lots of driving and days spent out and about instead of living in the vehicle all day. So for me, a minivan is probably the most sensible option -- like those "capsule hotels" Japanese people squeeze themselves into at night when they've missed the last bus home. I have a feeling this class of vehicle will also be easier for an inexperienced vandweller as far as maintenance, repair costs, parking, stealth boondocking etc.

Once I've done all the cross-country business building I can reasonably do, I may want to stay put most of the time. At that point, I'll scale up to a cargo or conversion van of some sort and park the thing on BLM land, etc. MPG won't be a big deal at that point, so I'll focus on comfort.