Do you work/live without a net?

[Queen]

Thanks, John. I'll email the fella listed and see what he has to say.

 

[akrvbob]

I carry a high deductable health policy also so this is something I'm tuned into. When it comes to the deductible on your insurance, bear in mind the Emergency Room will not turn you away, you will get care until you are stabilized and then the hospital will work with you on payments. If you agree to pay $200 a month, but can only send in $50, they'll take whatever you can pay per month. As long as you send it in every month it'll be okay.

I do have the money to cover my deductible, but if I didn't I think between the hospital payments, whatever I can scrape together or borrow, I could figure it out.

I'm kind of hoping that the doctor's will see that after the Deductible, they get 100% of their money, they might be willing to work with whatever isn't covered.

But you've lost sight of the original question, how is any of this any different if you live in a house or an RV Park? It's not!! You'd have the exact same money problems in a house so living in a van or RV has virtually no impact on your need for a safety net!!

Except, living in the RV is much cheaper!! Can you live in any house or apartment for $200 a month?? No!!! Ain't gonna happen! But I know many people in RVs who live in full-hookup Parks for less.

They are much better off in an RV than a house in a medical emergency!!!
Bob

 

[AltTransBikes]

I've spent summers in the Mojave but never in a RV, it's not without challenge, a kind of summer cabin fever can set in.

An RV park for less than $200 a month has to be in the low desert of AZ where summer high temps drive most folks (and why the year-round cost is low) temps average over 100 for months and 115+  not uncommon. Nights are not that much cooler. Electric for AC will run around the clock at that time of year and will be extra of course. Even if one were able to adequately cool a space with AC, no easy feat, I think that would be a tough existence and not considering trying to recuperate or get better from an illness if one were subject to the unfortunate bad timing to get sick at that time of year.

Sometimes I think one has to accede that van/rv living may not be the right choice for everyone in every situation.

 

[ilovemyvan]

"Except, living in the RV is much cheaper!! Can you live in any house or apartment for $200 a month?? No!!! Ain't gonna happen! But I know many people in RVs who live in full-hookup Parks for less."

I love it when I'm given the opportunity to show how cheap it is to live here. I take pride in how efficient our house is. I understand that we are the exception. Not every one has the desire or time to physically build their own house but we did. We paid for every piece of material cash, so we don't carry a mortgage, never did - great saving right there. We build the house out of commercial refrigerator panels. We bought Aluma Shield panel from a local manufacturer. We picked the panels from their discarded (mostly too short for them) pile and save a bundle there. The panels are 6" dense foam insulation sandwiched between steel sheets- sorry can't remember the gauge. The panels are structural no need for framing. They are rated at 46.9. So to give you en example our electric bill last month was $38.00. In the hot summer months it usually goes up to $75.00/month. We live in the county so there is no city tax, water or sewage bills. The only other bill relating to the house is property tax...less than $800/year and a little bit of gas to cut the lawn. True this is an exception but YES it can happen.



"They are much better off in an RV than a house in a medical emergency!!!"

Again I beg to differ. We are in a mist of a medical emergency. I asked my husband if he thought it would be easier on him if we were in an RV Park, his word: "Hell no!". We are surrounded by trees, peacock, cranes etc. not sandwiched between 2 other rigs. It's nice to have a bit more space when cabin fever sets in.

I'm afraid we will have to agree to disagree on the above 2 points.

I understand that not everyone is in a position of building a money safety net and that there are ways to deal with medical bills, however I wouldn't wish these worries and headaches on anyone. It's difficult enough to deal with the physical pains.

With all due respect,

Nicole

 

[ilovemyvan]

[ electric bill last month was $38.00. In the hot summer months it usually goes up to $75.00/month. We live in the county so there is no city tax, water or sewage bills. The only other bill relating to the house is property tax...less than $800/year and a little bit of gas to cut the lawn.

One cup of coffee later I just remembered that we also have to pay around $25/month on propane for the water heater, dryer and stove.

 

[akrvbob]

[ electric bill last month was $38.00. In the hot summer months it usually goes up to $75.00/month. We live in the county so there is no city tax, water or sewage bills. The only other bill relating to the house is property tax...less than $800/year and a little bit of gas to cut the lawn.

One cup of coffee later I just remembered that we also have to pay around $25/month on propane for the water heater, dryer and stove.

Nicole, I also say this with all due respect and admiration for you, over the years I've come to see you as a wonderful person with a loving and kind heart that shines through!! I treasure you as a member of the forum!

Is it reasonable that I tailor my advice for the 1% of the audience? It's wonderful and amazing you own your home outright, but I always try to write to my core audience, the people who need to hear my message, and they don't own their homes outright. 

Let's change the question you asked your husband (or any person going through a medical emergency) a little to reflect my core audience:

"If you were living on Social Security of $1000 a month and dependent on Medicare, would you better off in a house/apartment that costs $700 a month or an RV in a Park that cost $200?'

Maybe I'm wrong, but for most people I think the answer is yes, the RV is a better choice and will result in a higher standard of living.
Bob

 

[ilovemyvan]

Wow I never thought that "1%" would be used to describe anything in reference to little ole me
I like a challenge so when I saw...you know, I had to jump in.

Have a good one Bob,

Nicole

 

[akrvbob]

AltTransBike, you must have missed this part of what I said in that post:

"Or, you can sell the trailer, fly to Arizona, buy a trailer and put it in a desert park for less then $200 a month. Stay there for 6 months of the year then tow it up to Flagstaff for the other 6 months--not a bad new reality. You can rent in Quartzsite for $179 a month."

I agree 100% being stuck in the desert year-around would not be good. But I'm almost certain if you looked around in the Park, or ran an ad on Craigslist you could find someone to tow it to flagstaff or Show Low and pay them $200 and pay for their fuel and lunch. Doing that twice a year should be in most peoples budget, it average out to less than $40 a month to save for it.

I gotta tell you, I consider that a very high quality of life!! In fact, I've done that exact thing (winter in the desert around Quartzsite, simmer in the forest around Flagstaff) except I disperse camp on public land. I loved it and if I were no longer able to travel would gladly do it for the rest of my life.
Bob

 

[akrvbob]

 Wow I never thought that "1%"  would be used to describe anything in reference to little ole me  
I like a challenge so when I saw...you know, I had to jump in.

Have a good one Bob,

Nicole

It's all relative Nicole. In the majority of the world, the poorest American is in the top 1%.
Bob

 

[akrvbob]

The timing of this thread was perfect for me because I've been dealing with it in a very personal way. A very good friend broke his shoulder and blew his engine. He was out of money-broke, and unable to care for himself. As a Nomad he was FUC@ED right? WRONG!

His friends flocked to him and every problem has easily been overcome!!

And now another friend has to get off the road. A bad back has finally made him unable to travel, he must move into a RV Park. But he can't afford an RV, what to do? Tribes stick together and care for the sick, needy and elderly as best they can!!!!

He's started a gofund me campaign and I hope MANY of us give just a little so the need can be met and no one has to sacrifice too much. Find his go fund me page here:
https://www.gofundme.com/e-peterson

I just wrote a blog post on the topic (much of it directly from this thread). Find it here:
http://www.cheaprvliving.com/blog/happens-get-old-road-get-sick/

Thank you all for forcing me to solidify my thoughts and think much deeper about a difficult topic.

Lets face it, there is no good solution to this problem for anybody, whatever their circumstances--only better and worse. And that will also vary from person-to-person--no one size fits all.

You are all very wise!
Bob

 

[GotSmart]

I have been staying off of this thread, as I sometimes make light of a serious subject.  I have spent my life being the safety net for others, and now that I am the one needing help, it is extremely hard to take.  

My safety net is the result of a lot of hard work, and some luck.  I put in 12 hour days for years, and when I found a high paying commission job I put in 16 hour days for more years.  I moved on to another company, and then I was hit by a drunk and stoned driver.  It does not take long for you to go through savings.  It got to the point that everything we had was in storage, and the family was sleeping where we could.  

The kids remember this time as a fun adventure.  I wish I could.  It took years for the disability to kick in.  Just about everything was sold off.  I was down to flipping burgers to survive, and keep a roof over our heads.  

My net is my children.  We have always helped each other out, and it is understood that what ever happens, we are family.

 

[Queen]

I have been staying off of this thread, as I sometimes make light of a serious subject.  I have spent my life being the safety net for others, and now that I am the one needing help, it is extremely hard to take.  

My safety net is the result of a lot of hard work, and some luck.  I put in 12 hour days for years, and when I found a high paying commission job I put in 16 hour days for more years.  I moved on to another company, and then I was hit by a drunk and stoned driver.  It does not take long for you to go through savings.  It got to the point that everything we had was in storage, and the family was sleeping where we could.  

The kids remember this time as a fun adventure.  I wish I could.  It took years for the disability to kick in.  Just about everything was sold off.  I was down to flipping burgers to survive, and keep a roof over our heads.  

My net is my children.  We have always helped each other out, and it is understood that what ever happens, we are family.

That is awesome.  Can't really imagine having kids, but if I had I'd hope they were like this.

 

[GotSmart]

That is awesome.  Can't really imagine having kids, but if I had I'd hope they were like this.

With the exception of Santa and the Easter Bunny, I made it a point to never lie to them.  I told them they could tell me anything in a calm voice, and I would not get mad at them.  If I said "NO" they could make their case in a calm voice, and I would reconsider.  Then I encouraged debate classes.  I never used baby talk, and always treated them as an equal.  I was the parent, but they had a voice in the family.  

One year close to Easter, my 5 year old was being a pill.  I told her that she had better keep her temper, or The Easter Bunny would give her a rock instead of candy.  My friend Fred was playing E. B. for the Lions Club.  At the egg hunt he was handing out candy.  When he saw Rita, he shook his finger at her, and handed her a rock.  PRICELESS!     She knew he was not real, but the shock value of Dad knowing the easter bunny~~~.  She got her candy, and was a lot less trouble.

 

[Queen]

That is such a great mental image!! Oooh, dad knows the Easter Bunny!

 

[ilovemyvan]

I have been staying off of this thread, as I sometimes make light of a serious subject.  I have spent my life being the safety net for others, and now that I am the one needing help, it is extremely hard to take.  

My safety net is the result of a lot of hard work, and some luck.  I put in 12 hour days for years, and when I found a high paying commission job I put in 16 hour days for more years.  I moved on to another company, and then I was hit by a drunk and stoned driver.  It does not take long for you to go through savings.  It got to the point that everything we had was in storage, and the family was sleeping where we could.  

The kids remember this time as a fun adventure.  I wish I could.  It took years for the disability to kick in.  Just about everything was sold off.  I was down to flipping burgers to survive, and keep a roof over our heads.  

My net is my children.  We have always helped each other out, and it is understood that what ever happens, we are family.

This really sucks. I hate it so much when bad things happen to the nicest people. It screams "NOT FAIR" in my mind. Not to be mean but...did the drunk driver got his share of bad issues? Man! you didn't deserve that.

Nicole

 

[AltTransBikes]

AltTransBike, you must have missed this part of what I said in that post:

"Or, you can sell the trailer, fly to Arizona, buy a trailer and put it in a desert park for less then $200 a month. Stay there for 6 months of the year then tow it up to Flagstaff for the other 6 months--not a bad new reality. You can rent in Quartzsite for $179 a month."

I agree 100% being stuck in the desert year-around would not be good. But I'm almost certain if you  looked around in the Park, or ran an ad on Craigslist you could find someone to tow it to flagstaff or Show Low and pay them $200 and pay for their fuel and lunch.  Doing that twice a year should be in most peoples budget, it average out to less than $40 a month to save for it.

I gotta tell you, I consider that a very high quality of life!!

No, that was not missed, rather just following along the scenario laid out doing the math. I assume you would like to disseminate sound information and not misrepresent but sometimes in our zeal simple day to day realities can get left out.

This scenario would necessitate paying two park rents. The $200@mo RV park fee in the low desert would be based on finding a cheap park that allowed annual tenancy, paid in advance, electric not included, stay 6 months but pay for 12. Then one would need to find another park at elevation for the hot months. This would be the high summer season when they can generally charge more (and generally more snooty than the low desert parks) I doubt one will find as low a cost RV park in the summer months up in Coconino Co.

There would be the added expense of moving a trailer, as stated. Hiring it done would probably be doable but it would remain to be seen if $200 would cover the over 250 miles each way. Also, as stated in your scenario, one would have no means of getting around once the trailer was parked. A bicycle might suffice for some who were able but groceries, supplies need be gotten, appointments attended, etc.

The OP asked about a safety net during illness or financial crisis. I stated "Sometimes I think one has to accede that van/rv living may not be the right choice for everyone in every situation" and I maintain that is the case.

 

[ilovemyvan]

One option none of us have mentioned so far is Nursing Home. Before you leave the hospital you will be ask what kind of assistance you will have after you leave. If at first you have no one to physically help you do things for you, you will have the option to go to a nursing home. In the nursing home business, because it is a business, you get what you pay for. My last job was phlebotomy (drawing blood) The hospital where I worked went to nursing homes, that's when I decided that I would not end up in a place like that EVER, but that's a story for an other day. You could tell the difference as soon as you walked in - strong pee smell. And so I know what these places that are financially supported by Medicaid are like....and no, you don't want to know.

Here's the reason why I can't just walk away from this subject: There are older'ish people reading this forum and making decisions based on the information provided here. Let's say an individual or couple of the middle class, mentioned in the recent blog post, are in the process of deciding if they should sale or rent their house before they hit the road. I believe we are doing them a disservice by saying that RV is the 'universal' solution.

For a great % here it might be what they prefer to do but this does not necessarily suits everyone. When you have to make a decision about what to do with your house you have to make sure that the option (when you're ill or too old to be on the road) available to you will be the best for YOU!

I'm not trying to get the last word here, I'm just trying to show a different point of view.

Nicole

 

[Ella1]

I was going to stay out of this discussion as I haven't posted much for several months. I have a s&b as well as my van. I'd been preparing the van for a first weekend out, but got that nasty flue months ago. It held on, I never did fully recover. (With my copd and other health problems, even a mild cold is serious for me. I thought i was getting better again, then a few days ago got the news that my left diaphragm is not working. I may have Valley Fever. Right now I have no idea what all that means, I have a doctor appointment next Wed.
I am more sob that previously, on O2 almost constantly, slight exertion wears me out.
I am very glad I have the s&b. There is no way I would be able to live in the van.
Tomorrow I am to pick up a friend to do some work for me, but I don't know (now) if I will be able to get into the van in the AM due not only to sob, but general weakness and health.
We MUST do what we can to provide for ourselves the best way we can. Situations vary, and options available to one person may NOT be available to someone in a similar situation.
Take care, All.
edited to add that nursing homes are out due to disabling chemical reactions

 

[akrvbob]

This scenario would necessitate paying two park rents. The $200@mo RV park fee in the low desert would be based on finding a cheap park that allowed annual tenancy, paid in advance, electric not included, stay 6 months but pay for 12. No, in Quartzsite it's $179 a month by the month or by the winter season. I have a vandweller friend who paid the $179 and he parked his van in the RV park for 1 month. I've seen it as low as $1000 for 6 month. That's probably less than 1 months payment in a house. Then one would need to find another park at elevation for the hot months. This would be the high summer season when they can generally charge more (and generally more snooty than the low desert parks) I doubt one will find as low a cost RV park in the summer months up in Coconino Co. I'm sure you are right about that. I haven't looked into it but I'd guess $400-$500 a month. However, I am equally certain it will be MUCH MUCH less than rent or house payments so you are till FAR better off! I'm equally certain it will be a MUCH better life being able to move twice a year.

There would be the added expense of moving a trailer, as stated. Hiring it done would probably be doable but it would remain to be seen if $200 would cover the over 250 miles each way. But, you already own a van, all you need to do is find someone to drive it for you and hook and unhook it--assuming you aren't able to do it yourself. Also, as stated in your scenario, one would have no means of getting around once the trailer was parked.  A bicycle might suffice for some who were able but groceries, supplies need be gotten, appointments attended, etc. No, we are assuming you are a vandweller and own a van, no bicycle necessary unless you want one. You are using your $4000 emergency fund to buy a $2000 trailer and putting it in an RV park. You still own the van and if you are able, you can drive it. What if you aren't able to drive? The exact same question applies to a house dweller and is totally unaffected by being in a travel trailer instead. Whatever solution would work in a house or apartment will work equally well in a RV Park. IN fact, being so low income probably opens up many more possible solutions. Again, the system works much better for the poor than the middle class who make too much to get help and too little to pay for it themselves.

The OP asked about a safety net during illness or financial crisis. I stated "Sometimes I think one has to accede that van/rv living may not be the right choice for everyone in every situation" and I maintain that is the case. Of course I 100% agree, it isn't always the best choice. But the knee-jerk reaction that it must be a terrible choice is even much more wrong. There are numerous advantages to being in a van or RV during a medical emergency or long term problem To my mind, the advantages far outweigh the disadvantages. If you are low income, there may be no choice and your quality of life will dramatically go up by being in an RV. Can there be any doubt that for a the low income retired person that paying $179 a month for rent is better than paying the average rent (median rent in USA is $934).
Bob

 

[AltTransBikes]

Bob, all we can do is talk about what works for ourselves with the caveat it might not work for all. YMMV.
I know what a knee-jerk reaction is but I don't see where that applies in this thread. I was following along the scenario you had presented in an earlier post where you wrote "fly to Arizona, buy a trailer and put it in a desert park", thus it seemed implied one would not have a van or tow vehicle. Mind, this was in the original context of the OP 's 'safety net during illness or financial crisis".

Putting aside all the cliches or quotes about how statistics can be maneuvered to support an argument.....for example, I don't own an American average s&b 2400 plus sq' Mcmansion but do own a 500 sq' cabin on 2 acres with garden beds, and ground and tree fruit. Fixed costs are below $200@mo incl. taxes with the nice benefit of high quality organic produce along the season. (BTW, this is not a high priced spread but more a rustic homestead converted from a hunting retreat purchased over 20 years ago for less than what a new full size van would cost today)

I have a sister who bought a very well cared for furnished mobile home in FL for $1200 (!) w/park rent of $275@mo, water, sewer, trash included, and had her pick of more than a few in the area she located around price range. (She preferred a corner lot and found one)
I have another sister who is happy in HUD senior housing after tiring of owning and maintaining a home. Her rent is 30% of AGI which comes out around $240@mo for a quite nice garden apt. 
There are other options possible also. I spent 2 months this past winter in southern Mexico ($300 r/t airfare from the border) and rented a cottage for $165@mo. w/garden, gate and garage. It was lovely with a sort of side bonus of like being in Los Algodones every day.

A number of folks have replied in this thread outlining specific reasons, health or circumstances, and why it makes sense for them to make the decisions they have. My health, so far, is good knock on wood. I own a van, owned a few in fact, that I can easily live in. Vans make sense to me over owning an RV because of utility, economy and ease of handling. I own a van I could live in full time if I had to but I really own the vehicle because I like adventure. Having a home base is a comfort, albeit a humble one, and my simple answer to the OP's question of "Do you work/live without a net?"