Am I being unrealistic?

[gkb2016]

Would the following setup be realistic on a van? I don't want to hook anything up directly to the generator, want to have everything running off of a battery bank.

*5,000 BTU Window Unit A/C ~12 hours per day 450-500 watts per hr
*1kW of solar
*Honda EU1000i or EU2000i to top off batteries as needed.
*8x Trojan L16-AGM (http://www.trojanbattery.com/product/reliant-l16-agm) (Yes, 930 pounds of batteries  ) run in Series/Parallel to have 9.4 kWh capacity - I do not want to have the generator running during the night time for stealth reasons, and have read not to run the batteries below 50%... and it appears 8 hours of A/C would do that with a smaller battery bank

Ideally, my goal is to be able to run the A/C around 12 hours a day - with the ability to run it more than that if needed, and not have to run the generator at night. Of course I would also have some other appliances, mainly computer, fridge and microwave.

Would this setup be underkill or overkill? I really am not sure. Ideally, I would like to have the smallest setup possible while still having some room to run other appliances.

 

[IGBT]

Would the following setup be realistic on a van? I don't want to hook anything up directly to the generator, want to have everything running off of a battery bank.

*5,000 BTU Window Unit A/C ~12 hours per day 450-500 watts per hr
*1kW of solar
*Honda EU1000i or EU2000i to top off batteries as needed.
*8x Trojan L16-AGM (http://www.trojanbattery.com/product/reliant-l16-agm) (Yes, 930 pounds of batteries  ) run in Series/Parallel to have 9.4 kWh capacity - I do not want to have the generator running during the night time for stealth reasons, and have read not to run the batteries below 50%... and it appears 8 hours of A/C would do that with a smaller battery bank

Ideally, my goal is to be able to run the A/C around 12 hours a day - with the ability to run it more than that if needed, and not have to run the generator at night. Of course I would also have some other appliances, mainly computer, fridge and microwave.

Would this setup be underkill or overkill? I really am not sure. Ideally, I would like to have the smallest setup possible while still having some room to run other appliances.

I will chime in since we are probably closest to your setup except a much smaller battery bank.

We run a 6000 BTU window unit A/C which consumes about 28 amps on our 24V battery bank when the compressor is on.  670 watt-hr.   This is running through the inverter so there are obviously some losses and the A/C itself might only be pulling 550 watts or so.  We have 1080 watts max of solar, and usually get 850 to 900 watts on a sunny day with no shadows.

Running the A/C during the sun, no problem.  We have even started running it while we are driving in the sun...so nice to park somewhere on a 90 degree day 90% humidity and go inside the camper to find it is 70 degrees and low humidity.

Running the A/C when the sun goes down....well, maybe for an hour or so.  We only have 125AH at 24VDC (two 125AH lifeline AGM in series).  An hour at 28 amp draw brings the batteries from 100% down to about 70%, and then the rest of the night watching TV and running the DC compressor fridge means they are at 55% in the morning.   The upside is they do recharge to 100% by about 10am because the solar is so huge compared to the bank.

So what I have been doing on really hot days is running the A/C on solar all day, then run it on the battery bank until the batteries are at about 60% (this is around 8pm if the sun goes down at 6:30), then I fire up the EU2000i and let it continue to run the A/C and bulk charge the batteries for about an hour (9pm) at which point the batteries are back up to 80%.  I then turn off the A/C with the camper inside at 70 degrees (outside has cooled down by now to 80 degrees usually).   A dc fan going through the night then allows us to sleep comfortably.  In the morning the battery bank is around 70% (lost 10% during the night to the compressor fridge and late night TV   )

Your bank is quite a bit larger but you will have the issue that the A/C will consume your 1000 watts of solar during the day and may not be able to bring that bank to 100%.   You will need more solar or some gen run time.   1600 watts and maybe you could do what we do but with battery alone (assuming not parked under trees).

 

[jimindenver]

It looks pretty good as long as you don't get behind with that big bank. 1-1 is a rule of thumb but get that bank down to 50% and you will wish you had more.

Having a generator as a back up is a great idea. Looking at what it takes if your bank does hit 50% depends on what the generator can handle as far as a converter/charger. My trailer has a 55 amp charger that takes close to 1000w. Replacing 400 amp hours or more will take a 8 hour day just to do the bulk charging. They do make 100a and 120a converters but that little generator is going to be running like a dog pushing them.

What panels are you looking at? In my experience 24v poly panels handle overcast situations much better than monos. My three polys put out up to 25 amps in cloudy weather and that can really stretch the bank until things clear up.

You will need to understand the care and feeding of a bank like that, if nothing else but to make sure your charge controller and converter can handle the voltages and settings needed.

Big time solar and heavy use is a balancing act. We do a lot with our system but I spend a fair amount of time paying attention to how it handles loads and reacts to different situations. I'm not about to toast a bank that would cost a few grand to replace by not taking care of it.

 

[TMG51]

IGBT used another operative word, "camper." The OP wants to put all this on a van. I'm not saying it's impossible but that's gonna be one loaded up van.

 

[highdesertranger]

that was going to be my question. what type of vehicle are you going to put this battery bank in? better be a 1 ton. plus all that space, where are you going to put them? if at all possible I would just move to a cooler area. highdesertranger

 

[jimindenver]

For comparison our system will be 750w of solar flat mounted, 230w portable. Three lifeline 225 Ah 8-D's that run both the trailer and inverter.

What we do with it is run the 5000 BTU A/C when the sun shines, no need at 10000 ft when it doesn't. We also use a electric cook top, coffee maker, microwave, a small bathroom heater, and would run the TV and satellite all day and half the night for the dogs. Eventually I will add a two door mini fridge too.

On normal days we use so little power overnight that the bank barely has a chance to burn off the over charge. I wake to 12.8v predawn and might get it down to 12.7v making coffee and running the little heater instead of firing up the furnace. Even with cooking on the hotplate the bank is back up by the time it's time to use the A/C, the panels don't need the bank for that.

It took three years to decide on what I wanted as a system. We could have gone bigger on the solar but don't have the room for batteries to take advantage of it.

 

[jimindenver]

I do have to agree about the space. Even with 300w + panels, that is going to be one crowded roof. Those batteries will eat up some space too. We have a 25 ft trailer with a 3000 pound carrying capacity to hold our toys.

 

[IGBT]

You could have the panels hinge or slide out such that when you park you can increase the surface area for solar.  The problem is you are doing all of this to maintain stealth, and having a space station's worth of solar spread out probably gives off the wrong signal.

 

[gkb2016]

I agree with you highdesertranger, will definitely need to have a 1 ton van. Currently, I do not have a van, but just trying to plan ahead.

Stealth will definitely be reduced with all the solar panels, I was thinking of adding something to block the sides off so it looks like a ladder rack or something at eye level... obviously from above it would still look like solar panels.

I'm looking at the LG 310N1C panels (http://www.wholesalesolar.com/1524622/lg/solar-panels/lg-310n1c-black-mono-solar-panel), they seem to have reasonable dimensions and 310w each.

Does anyone know what the power output of the EU1000i and/or EU2000i is when they are on Eco Mode? Honda's site says the 2000i uses only 1 gallon ever 8 hours in Eco Mode. I am assuming when they say 1/4 load in Eco Mode, that means it is generating 500w - but I don't know really understand all of this electricity stuff that well.

 

[Van-Tramp]

Look into lithium batteries

 

[gkb2016]

Look into lithium batteries

They sound like exactly what I need... looked at the prices though... yikes. $1,000 for 100ah... maybe I am looking at the wrong ones?

 

[highdesertranger]

you want AC you gotto pay. highdesertranger

 

[BradKW]

Maybe consider a box truck... this is mine, 3rd large panel wasn't up yet in picture, and two smaller panels bracket the fan:

[img=300x300]http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/...ads/IMG_20160807_154118_zpsysf2mvgq.jpg[/img]

Also consider a more efficient AC unit, this is the one I got and is same as Jim is using: Frigidaire 5,000 BTU 115V

I will be using 4 L16's @ 24v. Since it's really an unknown how much the AC will run until I get it running (lot depends on insulation, and with spray foam + Iso I have high hopes), but my backup plan is to partition the bed, roughly reducing sq/ft by half, and seeing how that does. I'm holding off on a generator until I'm up and running and can see real data.

 

[gkb2016]

Maybe consider a box truck... this is mine, 3rd large panel wasn't up yet in picture, and two smaller panels bracket the fan:

[img=300x300]http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/...ads/IMG_20160807_154118_zpsysf2mvgq.jpg[/img]

Also consider a more efficient AC unit, this is the one I got and is same as Jim is using: Frigidaire 5,000 BTU 115V

I will be using 4 L16's @ 24v. Since it's really an unknown how much the AC will run until I get it running (lot depends on insulation, and with spray foam + Iso I have high hopes), but my backup plan is to partition the bed, roughly reducing sq/ft by half, and seeing how that does. I'm holding off on a generator until I'm up and running and can see real data.

Funnily enough, that is the exact AC I'm looking at. I found Trojan's battery bank calculator web page and it seems very helpful

 

[DannyB1954]

Looked at the frigidaire 5k. only half the people who rated liked it. Over 10% said it was worthless. On running A/C at night, if you can curtain off just your sleeping area and A/C, it will use less energy. The curtain should have insulating qualities, like wool or a quilt.
You may be able to find a small dehumidifier that will run longer than an air conditioner. Having less moisture in the air can make a big difference.

 

[907KHAM687]

yes

 

[ccbreder]

IGBT; your solar and battery bank charging are very efficient. I can't get that from my lead acid GC batteries.

 

[jimindenver]

CC

I don't understand what you are saying. I have Lifeline batteries, the biggest difference is that they can accept any charge rate I could possibly throw at them and snicker. That includes my solar output plus the generator pushing as large of a converter as it could and you would still be talking a 30th of the acceptable rate. Other batteries can have charge rates much lower and can be damaged if charged to quickly.

Efficiency in a solar system is in the wiring and controller conversion. Different batteries have different characteristics but in the end it's still amps out have to be replaced as soon as possible.

 

[IGBT]

CC I am with Jim, I do not know what you mean.

The lifeline AGM can just take a ridiculous bulk charge, like 100 amps into a 125AH battery.   I don't go quite that much but when I run the EU2000i into our Magnum MSH4024 inverter/charger, which can charge a 24V battery bank at 125 amps, I usually set it for 60 amps max.  I know Lifeline says I can do more, but 60 amps into 125 just seems enough.   An hour of that can easily bring a 60% battery to 80%.

The Magnum pure sine 4kW inverter is up to 93% efficient.  Our Midnite Classic 150 MPPT charge controller is also very efficient and I have the solar coming off the roof at 70+ volts so there are very little losses in the 10 gauge wiring because 900 watts at that voltage is only 13 amps.  The Classic converts that 70 volts at 13 amps into about 28 volts at 30 amps to bulk charge the batteries when we have sun.

Jim and I know what we are talking about

edit: I also use 00 gauge wiring from the inverter to the battery bank and keep the run less than 3 feet. You can get a silly amount of loss in wiring when running a 1000 watt microwave oven and pulling 70 amps. Even the A/C pulls 28 amps or so, which could be a lot of I^2 R loss if you use too small of a wire or have long runs.

 

[jimindenver]

All of my wiring is 1/0 welding cable. That includes the run down from the roof to the controller. (panels are pushing over 30a @12v down) Controller to bank, inverter to bank and the battery inter-connects. Why? Because I picked up half a spool for less than it would have cost for 2 gauge.

The controllers are both 97%, not sure on the inverter but at some point I had enough excess power to stop fretting. Sans the A/C we use 150-200 Ah a day, running the A/C for 5 or 6 hours can double that. The generator can push a 120a converter at altitude but we haven't needed or even taken the generator in years. We can easily handle a week of cloudy weather, more considering we still get 50% of peak from the system. It gets cloudy mid day a lot where we camp, I built a system to take it. I can't wait to see what it will do in the dead of winter.