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1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 3, 2024

Hi everyone, I'll make this short as possible.
I'm cheap, looking at buying a 1973 P30 KurbMaster Step Van, J.B.E. Olson box 55611 KCM 7314M, (Vin# CPY323V311698 = the vin doesn't pull up any information) just over 14 feet behind the seats, all stock, body in very nice condition, runs, needs 6 new tires = just a box now, either 100K or 188K miles, it was a propane powered small block Chevy 350 = converted to gas now.

I will add solar to power for AC, fridge, lights, shower, cooking area & other items to classify it as an RV if I live long enough.

My question is who insures a stock step van and/or as I move towards it being classified as an RV

Progressive said no, passed me to the commercial sales = they said NO because it would be an owner converted vehicle & someone
said no because it has no rear windows or side windows.

Did an online quote for Hagerty and it went through for a total of $233.00 = called Hagerty & they said No

So who that has these older step vans = what insurance company are you using.

Thanks in advance
Mark

Gr8ful · Sep 4, 2024

Try State Farm.

bullfrog ! · Sep 4, 2024

It depends on what state you are in as states legislate insurance laws and companies write different policies based on what state you are a resident of. Try a school bus forum and post there. You will find commercial insurance is generally more expensive I believe but in some states it may be your only option. You might be able to get classic vehicle insurance if you drive limited mileage as well. Many states it will be too expensive or almost impossible to register and insure I believe.

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 4, 2024

Gr8ful said:
Try State Farm.

I have a call in, they are sending to the underwriters, she asked the weight I said (ONLY) the first number listed 10K
This is actually so frustrating it's comical. The girl asked for a picture of title, looks like it's seen better day
s

Gr8ful · Sep 4, 2024

That Olson box was made about 35 miles from me.

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 4, 2024

Gr8ful said:
That Olson box was made about 35 miles from me.

Yankee

I was born in Ohio, left in 1977, been in Tx. a long time.

I am guess this is close to a P30 van but don't see that on the title. Anyone know what TK means on title

Ya'll stay safe

Gr8ful · Sep 4, 2024

I think TK body style means truck.

datac · Sep 4, 2024

I've had a couple of step vans that I converted. The first ones seemed like Insurance was no problem at all. Just another "Truck", rig thing turned into a camper. The last one did however required it to be insured as a "commercial vehicle", even though it was fully converted and now had "Motor Home" plates on it. If I recall correctly, 5 years ago, it was like $580 dollars a year for rather poor coverage.

I had 4 other vehicles at the time covered for less than just that one. So, it kind of ticked me off and made me realize the world we are living in, full of mamby pamby dumb a$$es that have no understanding of anything. You can't fix stupid. They got new "rules"....... and I have to adapt. So, I sold the step (and lord knows, I sure do miss step vans), bought a small cargo, converted it and tow it with a mini van, getting 14-17 mpg rather than 10. Gotta play the game I can play. I'm tired of fighting stupid.

So, regards insurance on a step today, I would assume you will be stuck forever paying insurance for a "commercial vehicle" because the VIN number will always indicate that no matter what you do with it. I did have a claim once for hail damage on it with PROGRESSIVE...... of course not much was damaged because they are built like brick house compared to an "RV". Then they notified me they were cancelling insurance after they paid that out.

My agent said they would find insurance with another company....... A few days later, the agent called and said they had it insured now with full coverage with roadside assistance and towing for less than I had been paying ! Yay !

Who picked it up ? PROGRESSIVE. Go figure. one end doesn't know what the other end was doing.

Good luck !

maki2 · Sep 4, 2024

If I was an agent and you showed me that photo and title I would turn you down! Those look downright scary with major red flag neglect issues expected for maintenance. Have you gotten a safety inspection done on it by a reputable company? If so presenting that safety, road worthy report, might help you find liability coverage for a not too outrageous price.

KarlH · Sep 5, 2024

I'm with Progressive and have a very similar van. Is yours still titled as commercial?

I had to read through my state's vehicle statutes to figure out what category it could fit into. (Minnesota allows stepvans under a certain GVWR to be titled in the same category as a minivan or a privately owned Express van, which was a much easier way to start out.)

Re-titling your truck as an RV will probably require you to install some combination of plumbing, 120V wiring and a propane stove, and have all of the work inspected. (The list of amenities comes from an industry standard, so it's almost exactly the same across states. In MN the actual wording of the statute is 'must have at least three of the following...' or something like that.)

LargeMarge · Sep 7, 2024

1973 P30 KurbMaster said:
... Anyone know what TK means on title

.
Apparently, you have a very rare former military vehicle.
In Germany, that is a 'taktisches Kommando', a Tactical Command vehicle.
.
Apparently, the official designation 'TK' was carried over after its time in the Bundeswehr ('Militias of the German People').
.
As I understand it, that particular vehicle was probably assigned to a high-up mucky-muck, a man holding the rank of Field Commander or higher.
In all likelihood, that individual directly reported to and advised his Field Marshal, the rank held by one of the most brilliant minds of all time, Erwin Rommel 'The Desert Fox'.
.
You can do anything you want with it, but honestly, something with such a glorified heritage should be on display in a museum and driven in parades on Independence Day.
.
We had a step-van identical to your rig.
We camped in it for SCUBA and surfing.
Sold it to a pal for his restaurant supply business.
He burned out the rear axle, we repossessed it, then sold it as-is to a mobile forklift repairman.
.
Last I saw it in about 1991 or so, that sturdy steed was covered in Black berry vines.
.
[edited to add]
I don't recall we ever had any insurance on it, so I am just no help at all today...

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 11, 2024

datac said:
I've had a couple of step vans that I converted. The first ones seemed like Insurance was no problem at all. Just another "Truck", rig thing turned into a camper. The last one did however required it to be insured as a "commercial vehicle", even though it was fully converted and now had "Motor Home" plates on it. If I recall correctly, 5 years ago, it was like $580 dollars a year for rather poor coverage.

I had 4 other vehicles at the time covered for less than just that one. So, it kind of ticked me off and made me realize the world we are living in, full of mamby pamby dumb a$$es that have no understanding of anything. You can't fix stupid. They got new "rules"....... and I have to adapt. So, I sold the step (and lord knows, I sure do miss step vans), bought a small cargo, converted it and tow it with a mini van, getting 14-17 mpg rather than 10. Gotta play the game I can play. I'm tired of fighting stupid.

So, regards insurance on a step today, I would assume you will be stuck forever paying insurance for a "commercial vehicle" because the VIN number will always indicate that no matter what you do with it. I did have a claim once for hail damage on it with PROGRESSIVE...... of course not much was damaged because they are built like brick house compared to an "RV". Then they notified me they were cancelling insurance after they paid that out.

My agent said they would find insurance with another company....... A few days later, the agent called and said they had it insured now with full coverage with roadside assistance and towing for less than I had been paying ! Yay !

Who picked it up ? PROGRESSIVE. Go figure. one end doesn't know what the other end was doing.

Good luck !

Alright I looked at the 73, it is kinda rough but still has good bones, the bad was the sliding drivers door, & 2 square
holes in the roof, one open to the elements, so gutting the interior was going to be needed anyways needs 6 new tires = $900.00 to $1200.00 the good was the old small block chevy fired up pretty quick, no valve train noise, guy said it was powered by propane, popped of the oil fill cap & peeked inside = looked real clean, another plus was it still had the propane tank mounted & I was thinking perfect for an on demand hot water heater.

Insurance wise if I don't want to hop through Texas's hoops (and I don't want to) convert it to RV title is to keep it commercial at a cost $579.00
Had a pretty good conversation with a guy from Progressive, his quote was $681.00. I inquired if it would be alright to add bed/beds = Yes no problem, than an AC system = Yes no problem, I stopped asking there. He did mention I wouldn't be allowed plumbing.

We also have 3 other vehicles insured for $359.00 for 6 month policy.

I also am playing the game as best I can, I'm cheap, retired on fixed income so I do watch the money. I looked at a 36 foot diesel pusher & after checking price on tires I RAN as fast as I could from those that idea.

Appreciate the feed back

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 11, 2024

maki2 said:
If I was an agent and you showed me that photo and title I would turn you down! Those look downright scary with major red flag neglect issues expected for maintenance. Have you gotten a safety inspection done on it by a reputable company? If so presenting that safety, road worthy report, might help you find liability coverage for a not too outrageous price.

Well I guess your not an agent = so lucky me.
If having a title that is a little abused, I can't help that, it would turn into a brand new one upon transfer = problem solved.
As far as neglect goes are you expecting a brand new van at over 50 years old, safety = funny Texas just passed that we are no longer required any safety inspection so I'm covered there.

You mention (REPUTABLE) I find that very amusing, we have an aerobic septic system that by law is required to be checked every 4 months by a REPUTABLE company = FUNNY, I worked nights, was home during the day while a REPUTABLE company was supposed to do the inspections, watching out the window I see instead of replacing the small filter on top of the air pump the guy ran his hand across the top instead of taking 1 screw out & doing the correct maintenance & replacing it = so ???
I am now licensed/approved to work on my own system because I'm not paying some fool NOT to do their job.
So no I am not going to put my life or others in danger of some incompetent REPUTABLE company. I've been working on cars, trucks, tractors, machinery for many years, I do all of our maintenance on 4 vehicles = I tend to trust myself more than I trust some goof ball telling me I need this or that.
the vehicles I maintain range from a 1971 Corvette, 1991 Chevy S-10 I bought new, 2001 Chevy express 3500, wifes 2013 Mazda 6, John Deere tractor so I have a pretty good idea of how to inspect things.

These look downright scary, do you not drive on public roads ? there are hundreds of thousands of these step vans on the public highway, putting in millions of miles on the roads = Amazon, UPS, FedEx, & who knows who else.

I'll be adding 2 more scary step vans in a post, please advise me on those.

Appreciate your concern but I'm good thanks.

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 11, 2024

KarlH said:
I'm with Progressive and have a very similar van. Is yours still titled as commercial?

I had to read through my state's vehicle statutes to figure out what category it could fit into. (Minnesota allows stepvans under a certain GVWR to be titled in the same category as a minivan or a privately owned Express van, which was a much easier way to start out.)

Re-titling your truck as an RV will probably require you to install some combination of plumbing, 120V wiring and a propane stove, and have all of the work inspected. (The list of amenities comes from an industry standard, so it's almost exactly the same across states. In MN the actual wording of the statute is 'must have at least three of the following...' or something like that.)

I believe I will keep it as commercial, I can't deal with the process & my wife said she didn't want to either.
Progressive told me I could not have plumbing so commercial it is until some miracle happens.
I guess I should check Texas requirements

I'm researching amenities (lost my whole paragraph here) ?
Appreciate the feedback

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 11, 2024

LargeMarge said:
.
Apparently, you have a very rare former military vehicle.
In Germany, that is a 'taktisches Kommando', a Tactical Command vehicle.
.
Apparently, the official designation 'TK' was carried over after its time in the Bundeswehr ('Militias of the German People').
.
As I understand it, that particular vehicle was probably assigned to a high-up mucky-muck, a man holding the rank of Field Commander or higher.
In all likelihood, that individual directly reported to and advised his Field Marshal, the rank held by one of the most brilliant minds of all time, Erwin Rommel 'The Desert Fox'.
.
You can do anything you want with it, but honestly, something with such a glorified heritage should be on display in a museum and driven in parades on Independence Day.
.
We had a step-van identical to your rig.
We camped in it for SCUBA and surfing.
Sold it to a pal for his restaurant supply business.
He burned out the rear axle, we repossessed it, then sold it as-is to a mobile forklift repairman.
.
Last I saw it in about 1991 or so, that sturdy steed was covered in Black berry vines.
.
[edited to add]
I don't recall we ever had any insurance on it, so I am just no help at all today...

I don't think this has any nobility to it other than it is still around.
The more I see (TK) is truck as Gr8ful mentioned previously

bullfrog ! · Sep 11, 2024

If you are in Texas I would check with the Escapee’s group insurance advisor, they might have some insight that might help. Their headquarters is in Livingston Texas and they deal with new members every day becoming Texas residents and registering and insuring vehicles.

1973 P30 KurbMaster · Sep 11, 2024

Here is another 1 of 2 I am looking at, this is a Chevy chassis with a 350 fuel injected setup, runs, drives, I'd check fluids & hit the road towing a vehicle home from Oklahoma.
Interestingly the insurance is cheaper on these two at $531.00

This is an 1985, Chevy chassis, 350 fuel injected, looks like it has factory AC (nice), this owner has had it 20 years. Will need some TLC as it hasn't run in a few years, I might have to tow it home or ship it. taking my tool box, think I can get it running without to much trouble.

KarlH · Sep 12, 2024

@1973 P30 KurbMaster - FWIW, here's what the process was like in MN:

https://vanlivingforum.com/threads/registering-insuring-a-stepvan-in-mn.41155/#post-507367

...and this was the required-amenities list, which I'd guess is very similar to Texas' law:

https://vanlivingforum.com/threads/registering-insuring-a-stepvan-in-mn.41155/#post-507374

Nothing wrong with keeping it commercial as long as insurance doesn't break the bank.

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