Your level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy?

[debit.servus]

Curious about the median level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy. How important are these to you?:

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?
2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?
3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?

I'll answer first:
1) Moving weight and fuel economy for me is not important because even if the van had double, triple or even quadruple the fuel economy I still couldn't afford to travel the places I desire to be.
2) Since I plan to have the option to be off the grid and self-sufficient for at least a week at a time, this requires carrying extra water, food and fuel. Plus systems like battery capacity and 12v chest fridge. Freedom is about having options. Whenever I can afford to have a certain option I desire compatible with full-time vandwelling, I'll acquire it.
3) Instead of lowering life quality and living without things on the road to save weight and increase fuel economy, I opt to invest in a cheap alternate energy which has proven itself to pay for itself in 7,000 miles or less (woodgasification). With this system I'll learn Real Skills and not have my life revolve around not having energy.

 

[WheelEstate USA]

Your life will revolve around cutting wood and watching gas drip into a cup while I'm out kicking back and having fun.
I learned how to economise a long time ago but you can take it to extremes and then it's too much like work.

 

[ascii_man]

I know what it's like to get overexcited about an idea and a community. But, to an outsider, you seem to be spiraling into a bad place mentally and emotionally right now. This doesn't make you a bad person, but especially without the stability of a job and marriage, it's easy for people to get a little out of control.

There is also the idea that maybe you don't have the funds to do what you want to do right now. I don't think that your recent posts are getting you any closer to your dreams. I know I've had to postpone some of my dreams and just put my head down and work for a few months / years many times. And I know it's not easy to find work sometimes too.

In honor of (Lent / Spring Break), I think you would benefit from a 7-day vacation from here (and maybe, gasp, from THE ENTIRE INTERNET). Come back and see your life and plans with fresh eyes.

Good luck.

 

[GotSmart]

How many ways are you going to ~~~  Never mind.   :s

 

[akrvbob]

How many ways can you ask the same question?
Bob

 

[GotSmart]

Could you provide a link to back up this 7,000 mile break even claim? Unless you are only counting materials, your previous posts concerning cost don't back this up. If you count your construction labor and on the road operational labor as a cost I don't think you will ever break even no matter how far you drive. OR, my math could be wrong, stranger things have happened.

Guy

7,000 miles.

7 mpg.  For sake of argument. I get double. 

1,000 gallons of gas.  

$1.43 a gallon here.  $2.10 LA.  

$2,100 break even for cost of complete gasification unit including self labor building it.  (How many hours, and the value of your time?)

Parts!  Tool rental! Wood!

Inquiring minds want to know!  :huh:

 

[debit.servus]

Stop derailing my threads!

This is what the thread is about:

Curious about the median level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy. How important are these to you?:

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?
2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?
3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?

If I knew people would derail my thread I would have not answered first!!!!

 

[SoulRaven]

Curious about the median level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy. How important are these to you?:

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?
2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?
3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?

Your wording is a little confusing for me, but I believe you are asking about fuel economy and loaded vehicle weight...

Fuel economy means nothing to me as long as I believe that my vehicle is getting the best MPG it is capable of within reason, and without the addition of after market add ons.

My Maxi Van is a 1 ton, and I really don't give much thought to weight, since I do know that I am way under the vehicle's limit.  I _DO_ give thought to keeping the center of gravity as low as possible.

Normally the top things on my priority list are comfort, convenience, practicality, cost efficiency, durability, and fixability.  These things require more than just money, they also require good planning and ingenuity.  Once you have accomplished these things, pretty much anything else can be handled by simply tossing money at it, no special thought processes involved.

I believe that not exceeding your vehicle's weight limit is VERY important.  I also believe that your center of gravity is VERY important in the terms of driveability, and safety.  When driving, I have nothing above my lower window line.

As far as fuel economy, I consider it to be my cost of rent.  That would have made my cost for rent last year to be $2200 for 18k miles.  That's a little less than $200/mo.  Cheap rent for sure.  Even with your horrible gas mileage, and higher gas prices, I doubt that the cost would be more than what I would expect to pay for a regular place that would not be as comfortable as my van.

I compare my costs to those of living in a house or apartment, and no matter how I add it up, I am saving tons of money, without the need of being a cheapskate.  Even IF the costs were higher, I would consider it a reasonable penalty to pay, for the ability to travel and enjoy my life in the way I see fit.

If you take my 18k miles, @ your 7 mpg, x $5.00/gal gas = $12857/yr.  That's still under $1100/mo which I would expect to pay more for in rent & utilities for a month.  If money got tight, you could probably park in an RV park for under $500/mo until you could rebuild your funding, or just travel a little less.  Still cheap rent.

 

[GotSmart]

Stop derailing my threads!

This is what the thread is about:

Curious about the median level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy. How important are these to you?:

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?
2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?
3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?

If I knew people would derail my thread I would have not answered first!!!!

So my comment asking for clarification of your answer was derailing the thread?   :huh:  

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?

I am more concerned with moving the square footage of what I put things into.  My rig can deal with weight and I am satisfied with the fuel economy.  I worked extremely hard for my situation.  

2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?

Rig choice was entirely random.  I saw it, I liked it, I put the parts together. 

3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy? 


About 1 hour a month for general maintenance, safety checks, and adding fuel.  I find this time to be enjoyable.

It seems to me that the gasification comment was the derailing factor in this non discussion.  

How about doing us all a favor, and answering my questions about my understanding of your answer to #3  Pretty Please?  :angel:

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]3) Instead of lowering life quality and living without things on the road to save weight and increase fuel economy, I opt to invest in a cheap alternate energy which has proven itself to pay for itself in 7,000 miles or less (woodgasification). With this system I'll learn Real Skills and not have my life revolve around not having energy.[/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]7,000 mile payoff.[/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]7 mpg.  For sake of argument. I get double. [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]1,000 gallons of gas.  [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]$1.43 a gallon here.  $2.10 LA.  [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]$2,100 break even for cost of complete gasification unit including self labor building it.  (How many hours, and the value of your time?)[/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Parts!  Tool rental! Wood![/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Inquiring minds want to know!  [/font]

Then I also have questions about the logic of the other answers.

 

[debit.servus]

6GotSmartThis is the LAST time I'll answer these questions:
How about doing us all a favor, and answering my questions about my understanding of your answer to #3  Pretty Please?  :angel:
OK.


[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]7,000 mile payoff.[/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]7 mpg.  For sake of argument. I get double. [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]1,000 gallons of gas.  [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]$1.43 a gallon here.  $2.10 LA.  $2.39 Average gas price for San Jose, CA as of March 1st, 2016. I'll use this number.

[/font]So to go 7000 miles at 7 mpg would cost $2380.

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]$2,100 break even for cost of complete gasification unit including self labor building it.  (How many hours, and the value of your time?) Well seeing as on my income waking hours are about $2 an hour, so with 350 hours of labor it would be $700. So using your $2100 system build cost it comes to $2800. Since I don't know how to accurately calculate personal labor for what I will describe below we will not include labor costs.
[/font]
I see paying for gas like paying rent on an apartment or house. One isn't building any equity or investing by renting.

Say I have $3000:

I could travel 7000 miles and burn 1000 gallons of gas at a cost of $2.38 a gallon (gas won't stay at this price forever), leaving me $620 at the end of my trip (To keep it simple every gallon costs the same and we're assuming gas doesn't shoot back up to $4 a gallon when I am on the eastern seaboard).

-Or-

Invest $2100 money cost into a Cheap energy system, leaving me $900 after it's up and running. To compare apples to apples, we will amortize the initial cost of the system over 7000 miles. The Cheap energy system costs $0.30 a mile. To account for maintence costs, we will take 20% percent of the Build Cost (a very generous amount accounting for costs to fix rookie operating error and mistakes) for the first 7000 miles. 2100 / 5 = 420. 420 / 7000 = $0.06 per mile. $0.30 + $0.06 is 36 cents per mile. $0.36 x 7000 = $2520 to build and maintain the woodgas system for 7000 miles. I have $480 after my trip, but now have a cheap energy system that fuels the van for waay less than the cost of gas.


Worst case scenario, I could sell the woodgas system on Ebay for at minimum the build costs. Best case scenario, I keep and use the system going 3000 miles for the money and time price of 1000.

...
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Inquiring minds want to know!  [/font]

Then I also have questions about the logic of the other answers. I will answer those if you re-rail my thread and post the questions in my "Wood Gasification" thread.

One of the big slogans in the woodgas world is "Smile With Every Mile" or SWEM. It goes to show the people running on wood are very happy with their cheap energy investment.

 

[debit.servus]

Your level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy?

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?

2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?

3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?

Cheapskate KRIS (Who changed his name from Chris to save on writing his name):
1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?
Evertthing.
2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?
I live out of a bicycle because gas for any car is a waste of money. My rig consists of other peoples spaces, which I spend $0.00 to maintain. I will bike 3 miles out of my way at midnight to save 5 cents on a pack of gum at the 24 hour grocery store.
3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?
I spend every waking minute of my life inventing ways to reduce wear and tear on my bicycle, and working to reduce my living expenses and save on everything. I now carry no bodywash to save a penny on bike repair, calculated using my unique tried and tested savings algorithim. Everybody should use my savings algorithm to improve their lives!
Gotta go, need to get off the library computer!!!

Me:
1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?
Not worth going without comforts and luxuries to save an MPG or two, even though I am a poor boi.
2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?
My rig choice was out of my hands. My way of life isn't affected by this, thus I LIVE instead of obsessing over every penny, pound of moving weight or ounce of fuel.
3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?
Not much. Like I am not carrying a box of rocks or lead bricks around, and if I take them on they'll likely won't be carried far.

 

[highdesertranger]

well without doing all the math of the last post I will try to answer the questions.
1. moving weight is very important to me. fuel economy is not important.
2. I have the rig to move that weight(gear) to where I want it.
3. I spend my time converting to diesel because the diesel engine is the most energy efficient internal combustion engine ever invented. however I do not revolve my life around this. I still do what I want to do and go where I want to go.
you say you want to stay out for 1 week. I can do that backpacking. at the moment I can stay out 3 weeks easy. I hope to stretch that to 1.5-2 months. if you want the best fuel economy you can possible achieve with an internal combustion engine, a diesel engine is the way to go. highdesertranger

 

[GotSmart]

6GotSmartThis is the LAST time I'll answer these questions:
How about doing us all a favor, and answering my questions about my understanding of your answer to #3  Pretty Please?  :angel:
OK.


[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]7,000 mile payoff.[/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]7 mpg.  For sake of argument. I get double. [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]1,000 gallons of gas.  [/font]

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]$1.43 a gallon here.  $2.10 LA.  $2.39 Average gas price for San Jose, CA as of March 1st, 2016. I'll use this number.

[/font]So to go 7000 miles at 7 mpg would cost $2380.

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]$2,100 break even for cost of complete gasification unit including self labor building it.  (How many hours, and the value of your time?) Well seeing as on my income waking hours are about $2 an hour, so with 350 hours of labor it would be $700. So using your $2100 system build cost it comes to $2800. Since I don't know how to accurately calculate personal labor for what I will describe below we will not include labor costs.
[/font]
I see paying for gas like paying rent on an apartment or house. One isn't building any equity or investing by renting.

Say I have $3000:

I could travel 7000 miles and burn 1000 gallons of gas at a cost of $2.38 a gallon (gas won't stay at this price forever), leaving me $620 at the end of my trip (To keep it simple every gallon costs the same and we're assuming gas doesn't shoot back up to $4 a gallon when I am on the eastern seaboard).

-Or-

Invest $2100 money cost into a Cheap energy system, leaving me $900 after it's up and running. To compare apples to apples, we will amortize the initial cost of the system over 7000 miles. The Cheap energy system costs $0.30 a mile. To account for maintence costs, we will take 20% percent of the Build Cost (a very generous amount accounting for costs to fix rookie operating error and mistakes) for the first 7000 miles. 2100 / 5 = 420. 420 / 7000 = $0.06 per mile. $0.30 + $0.06 is 36 cents per mile. $0.36 x 7000 = $2520 to build and maintain the woodgas system for 7000 miles. I have $480 after my trip, but now have a cheap energy system that fuels the van for waay less than the cost of gas.


Worst case scenario, I could sell the woodgas system on Ebay for at minimum the build costs. Best case scenario, I keep and use the system going 3000 miles for the money and time price of 1000.

...
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Inquiring minds want to know!  [/font]

Then I also have questions about the logic of the other answers. I will answer those if you re-rail my thread and post the questions in my "Wood Gasification" thread.

One of the big slogans in the woodgas world is "Smile With Every Mile" or SWEM. It goes to show the people running on wood are very happy with their cheap energy investment.

[font='Segoe UI', 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif]He's as blind as he can be,[/font][/SIZE]

[SIZE=4][font='Segoe UI', 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif]Just sees what he wants to see,[/font][/SIZE]
[/quote]

[color=#333333][SIZE=4][font='Segoe UI', 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif]You made the connection to [/font][/SIZE][/color][color=#333333][SIZE=4][font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]gasification, not me.  [/font][/SIZE][/color]

[color=#333333][SIZE=4][font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]Seriously, you sound like a snake oil salesman trying to talk his way out of jail.  [/font][/SIZE][/color]

[color=#333333][SIZE=4][font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]The value of labor is  nonsense.  $2?  Good Uncle Sammy will get on your case for not allowing minimum wage.  Having work done by a professional is currently running in the $120.00+++ range.  [/font][/SIZE][/color]

[color=#333333][SIZE=4][font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]Then there are breakdowns, (The van is also prone to breakdowns) fines for transporting raw wood through quarantine zones, (Yes, they are all over this country.  Many have already mentioned this fact.) [/font][/SIZE][/color]

[color=#333333][SIZE=4][font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]Have you even checked to see if such a vehicle is permissible under the DOT laws?  They will tow the van away in a heartbeat if you start giving them this brand of hyperbole and obfuscation.   They do not have a sense of humor at the side of the road. [/font][/SIZE][/color]



[quote pid='185238' dateline='1456899970']
One of the big slogans in the woodgas world is "Smile With Every Mile" or SWEM. It goes to show the people running on wood are very happy with their cheap energy investment. 

[font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]A Google search turned up NOTHING!   :dodgy: [/font]

 

[VJG1977]

Here is an interesting site selling Wood Gasifier Kits and links to manufacturers. 

http://www.build-a-gasifier.com/gasifier-kits/

Canada: This is a small scale unit,  that converts wood chips/wood waste into a gaseous fuel that can be used to power generators, pump water or any small gasoline engine up to 16 HP….Basic system starts at $7,990.00 

United States: This package is comprised of the “Victoria” a six inch gasifier manufactured by NSR with cooling, cleaning and carburetion components to run a small 8-13hp engine or generator. The generator and trolley cart as pictured are not included in the kit. The Gas Station is currently (20 July 2014) advertised for $US 1,995 plus shipping costs

[font='Open Sans', Arial, sans-serif]The M-Series II Gasifier with Cyclone Filter and 20” Condenser best suited for running wood chips and chunks and capable of 10 hp to 25 hp engines is quoted as being $2,100 plus shipping and handling.[/font]

 

[Spirituallifetime]

I haven't considered weight or fuel economy at all because I know if I stay in a place for a couple of weeks to a month the fuel will not cost much! My largest expense is food.
It seems to me from your posts you are young and unemployed. Learn a skill that will get you a job that pays well and will give you the money for vandewlling and building your wood gasification project. A job that pays well will give you more money than you need for vandwelling. This extra money can be saved for projects and traveling.
We all have to work to earn a living, it helps to save here and there to save money but we can't do it to the point that life becomes free and we don't have to work.

 

[debit.servus]

[font='Segoe UI', 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif]You made the connection to [/font][font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]gasification, not me.  I will just keep quiet on woodgasification on here. [/font]
...
[font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]The value of labor is  nonsense.  $2?  Good Uncle Sammy will get on your case for not allowing minimum wage.  Having work done by a professional is currently running in the $120.00+++ range.  Since I don't know how to accurately calculate the time cost of 350 hours of personal labor[/font], I decided to leave that out. The labor is done by me, as the most hours I could afford to pay someone at $120 an hour is ONE hour. If I had the money for it I would just buy somebody elses operational woodgas system, I don't so I have to build my own from materials and a set of unsupressed plans. This is the LAST time I am going to answer this on this board.

[font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]Then there are breakdowns, (The van is also prone to breakdowns) Woodgas system breakdowns are accounted into the monetary maintence cost. fines for transporting raw wood through quarantine zones, (Yes, they are all over this country.  Many have already mentioned this fact.) To outsiders it will look like I am carrying a refinery looking thing and a pile of wood. The system doesn't put out any visible smoke, but does emit co2. [/font]

[font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]Have you even checked to see if such a vehicle is permissible under the DOT laws? This is one of those things where it's easier and cheaper to ask for forgiveness. Which agency to ask about which laws affect me and how they affect me? ...[/font]
[font=Segoe UI, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Lucida Grande, sans-serif]...[/font]

If you want to ask me a question about woodgasification that I haven't already answered, please ask it in my "Wood Gasification" thread in the "Going Green" forum. Questions and comments about woodgasification in any of my other threads will be reported.

 

[debit.servus]

Your level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy?

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?

2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?

3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?

 

[GotSmart]

If you want to ask me a question about woodgasification that I haven't already answered, please ask it in my "Wood Gasification" thread in the "Going Green" forum. Questions and comments about woodgasification in any of my other threads will be reported.

I am done.

I now have blocked you, because my time is worth more to me than this abuse.  

:dodgy:

 

[highdesertranger]

ok let me try this again.
1. I need to move weight(prospecting gear)
2. fuel economy is important but not as important as getting my gear there.
I drive a 1978 1 ton truck and get between 5.5 and 9.2 mpg.
I am in the process of converting to diesel, I am doing this for the fuel economy and the simplicity and reliability of a mechanical diesel engine. I am doing this because a diesel engine is the most energy efficient engine ever invented, by far. you will go further on a gallon of diesel then any other fuel and many fuels can burn in a diesel. waste motor oil, waste tranny fluid, waste vegetable oil, or just plain veggie oil, gasoline, jet fuel, kerosene, coal oil, basically any liquid that will burn will run a diesel. so there you have it, again. highdesertranger

 

[debit.servus]

Your level of importance for moving weight and fuel economy?

1) How important is moving weight and fuel economy to you?

2) How has this influenced your rig choice and way of life?

3) How much of your life do you spend optimizing moving weight and fuel economy?