Under floor storage design advice

[lana_starr]

Hi!

I'm thinking of building a minimal amount of storage into the floor of the van, maybe 6" deep. Fill it with crap and it serves double duty as a little bit of insulation. I have basic construction ability so here's what I'm thinking for design:

Run three 2x8s (actual height 1.5x7.25) longways in the van, one in centered and one on each side. On the drivers end butt them into another 2x8. Put a few more 2x8s running the short direction in the van to keep spacing and build storage "cells." Get some 1/2" plywood and cut it to fit inside the cells. Then screw little 2x2 chunks (or scraps) into the corners 1/2" down from the floor surface to support the plywood. I'll maybe line the cells with vinyl to make cleaning in them easier.

1) Will there be enough support with 2x2 blocks to use the plywood as flooring? Is 1/2" plywood too thin?
2) How to open them - obviously a protruding handle is not going to work. Cutouts? Any ideas to make my floor not full of holes?
3) Will the floor be level enough to just throw the 2x8s down? Should I be attaching it somehow so it doesn't wobble? Maybe throw down some thin foam? I'm planning on working from a gutted interior (so a metal floor), especially so I can treat any rust down below if it's there.
2) Slightly less structural, but what about making it pretty? I'm thinking of painting it - I've read latex based paint acts as a vapor barrier, would that be good or bad in this situation (I'm basically planning on the Bob formula for insulation - foam glued to walls and covered by more foam then... panels or something...). 

I am shopping for a van now, needing to move in by end of April. I'm thinking a GMC Safari, high top if I can get it.

Thanks vanfam!

 

[suzanne]

Hi!

I'm thinking of building a minimal amount of storage into the floor of the van, maybe 6" deep. Fill it with crap and it serves double duty as a little bit of insulation. I have basic construction ability so here's what I'm thinking for design:
...

Very interesting idea!  I was thinking of putting a shallow drawer just at the bottom of my "garage area", but you are taking the concept to a whole new level!  I like that I could store heavy things in the floor...for good balance in a high top.

 

[rm.w/aview]

I envision accessible underfloor storage at the side door and rear door area and as deep as the typical under bed storage tote, without doors or hatches, just sliding in/out. I think that their width will put one on each side of a structural 2X4 at both locations, and with the structural 2X4 going in two directions integrity should be good. If you have room and choose to put four totes in at the rear, two on each side of a 2X4, you'll need a method to retrieve the deeper totes that is similar to what some folks with pick-up trucks use in the bed of their truck to retrieve items at the front of their bed without climbing in.

 

[Minivanmotoman]

Interesting idea. Doable but with implications and trade offs. Your plan shows you're technically knowledgeable on construction generally.

Floor storage isn't common due to cost, complexity and ease of access. Easier, faster, cheaper to build up, use other creative methods for storage such as side roof mounted cabinets over bed, full height cabinets, etc... Think boat or plane interiors. Spaces where you don't need full height like the foot of a bed or under the bed for storage.

First is, you're reducing your interior height which often isn't enough for most Vans. With the super high tops, maybe doable. Add insulation, how much height is left and how tall are you? Insulation is a debatable point and dependent on your travel area and temperature.
Many opinions/info/ videos on that.

Building any counters or beds? What to do with under space and access there? Wasted?

Building a false floor with access panels requires planning and skill to execute. You are also adding weight. Can it be done more optimally and lighter? Easier access? Why most people build vertically, which should be lighter and easier access.

Spacing and load bearing of floor will depend upon load weight. Can get away with 1/2 but same parameters as a house come into play. How much load weight and stiffness required? Depends upon your specifics. Minimal for home floors is 3/4 minimum with 16-18 inch spacing support.

Minimal space always require tradeoffs on the design for optimal space usage. In a small space like a van, it is often filled to the max leaving minimal open floor space. With so little floor space accessible for under storage, is it worth while? Can be done if you're willing to build that complexity in. Trap doors, false floors and hidden compartments come to mind. Hide your stash or valuables?  :dodgy:
Neat trick and would be so cool. Worth the time and trouble? Up to you. Choose your compromises, which is what it boils down to.

 

[user 423]

What kind of van do you have? What overall width of the 'box' do you mean to have?

2x8's seem overkill unless you'll be putting very heavy items down there.

 

[highdesertranger]

no need for 2x8's. use plywood cut to the height you want. it's lighter and stronger. use 1x2's or 2x2's in the corners to attach the sheets of plywood. highdesertranger

 

[rm.w/aview]

In my earlier post I was in error by using 2X4 as obviously that's not enough height, my early morning thinking was on structural alone, as in studs, and not on the space needed for adequate storage. I should learn to finish my quart of coffee before I post anything. As mentioned, study on ways to gain your height without adding unwanted weight/bulk.

 

[Almost There]

no need for 2x8's.  use plywood cut to the height you want.  it's lighter and stronger.  use 1x2's or 2x2's in the corners to attach the sheets of plywood.  highdesertranger

Agreed. Plywood turned on it's side is every bit as strong as dimensional lumber. Also you can use the Kreg pocket screw jig to be able to connect plywood without having to use either brackets or 1x2 etc to join the wood together.

2x4 and 2x8 are complete overkill and would add considerable weight to the interior build.

I'd suggest planning out the rest of the van build and figuring out storage spaces before building an entire 'basement' in to the van. There may be a need for a longer tunnel under cabinets to accommodate longer poles etc but you'll probably find adequate storage in under bed and overhead cabinets.

I see that you're looking at a Safari. Even with the biggest high top they ever came with, you will not get standing height inside before you put in a raised floor. Maybe you're thinking Savana not Safari - the Safari/Astro is the GMC/Chevy mini van...very popular but not nearly as big as the Savana/Express models.

 

[bullfrog]

Maybe use under bed containers or ridged plastic containers as well as wood I beams made from 1x2 with 1/2" plywood centers for main supports to a 3/4" plywood floor. Slide out drawers at all door openings are much easier to deal with than picking up floor pannels. Still going to be heavy for what little storage you get and really affect your head room. Most people do this in pickup truck beds to make a completely flat bed above the wheel wells as well as add storage. It works well if all you need to do inside is lay flat to sleep.

 

[lana_starr]

I was just watching a youtube video of someone lamenting that they had used drawers because it wastes space. I've come across those reviews a couple of times now. Why not just leave a cavity , maybe put a drawer "face" on it without the slides if you're worried about the aesthetic?

 

[Almost There]

OTOH drawers mean that you can access the stuff in the back of the storage without having to remove all the stuff in the front to get to it.

I have never, ever regretted putting drawers in my pantry cabinet as opposed to just putting in shelves. The easy access to all the contents is more than worth the slight loss of square inches of space.

 

[lana_starr]

I envision accessible underfloor storage at the side door and rear door area and as deep as the typical under bed storage tote, without doors or hatches, just sliding in/out.

I'm hoping to avoid going outside when it's rainy or snowy, which is why I'm looking at simple hatches. I'm thinking about putting a kitchen chuck to the rear and leaving the cavity you described below it for things I don't use much, but for the rest I would really like to avoid opening the doors. Might be living in it in VT in the winter next year!

Interesting idea. Doable but with implications and trade offs. ... Floor storage isn't common due to cost, complexity and ease of access. ...

There are definitely trade-offs. The height is one, but I'm 5'10" and don't have the cashola to buy anything I can actually stand in. Especially since I will be insulating the ceiling - I may live in the van next winter in VT. I'm a floor person anyway, so I am thinking under floor storage as a substitute for cabinets and built up bed so that I just have a big open space. Picture the flexible tatami living space in Japanese houses - you just pull out what you need and then put it away. Get a (well-insulated) mattress that folds into a couch area and bada-boom. The weight is a big concern, I'm hoping to come up with a lighter design. Interesting suggestions below about plywood...

no need for 2x8's. use plywood cut to the height you want. it's lighter and stronger. use 1x2's or 2x2's in the corners to attach the sheets of plywood. highdesertranger

So basically 1x2/2x2 joists with plywood walls? Interesting. I don't like the idea of ripping all the plywood though - the other way is heavier but much simpler.

Agreed. Plywood turned on it's side is every bit as strong as dimensional lumber. Also you can use the Kreg pocket screw jig to be able to connect plywood without having to use either brackets or 1x2 etc to join the wood together.

Have you tested plywood on it's side like that? It sure would save a lot of weight. I'm not confident I could rip it evenly though...

I don't anticipate standing room whatever I get in my price range, just enough headroom to sit comfortably. I'm 5'10" and need to insulate the ceiling. O.O

 

[lana_starr]

Oh, and what if the plywood got wet ever? If it's supporting weight and swells or the bonding is affected... not good...

Thanks for your patience with the multiple posts, I'm still figuring out how to use the forum.

 

[drysailor]

Oh, and what if the plywood got wet ever? If it's supporting weight and swells or the bonding is affected... not good...

Thanks for your patience with the multiple posts, I'm still figuring out how to use the forum.

While it's best to keep plywood from being constantly wet, you may be thinking of particle board or OSB swelling when wet. It's not as bad with actual plywood, particularly outdoor rated ply.

 

[highdesertranger]

the 1x2's and 2x2's just make it easier to attach the ply at 90° angles or you can use pocket screws like Almost There said. you should not need joists. outdoor rated plywood handles moisture well. do NOT use particle board or OSB. also a ripping guide for your saw makes ripping parallel cuts easy. highdesertranger

 

[Almost There]

Have I tested the plywood turned on it's side...well yes...my entire bed frame is made up of 1/2" plywood turned on it's side. It's also 24" from floor to bed top so it's not just a little 8" cabinet.

The top of the bed is 3/4" so it won't warp or sag over the openings. Unless you're jumping on the 'floor' or weigh in at well over 200 lbs I wouldn't worry about it.

If you're worried about ripping the plywood straight, have it done at the lumber yard. In my entire build I only ever brought home 1 full sheet of plywood, all the rest was cut for me at H/D or the local lumber yard. The full sheet was needed for my floor installation and it never came out of the van...I cut the template for down the passenger side while the full sheet was still in the van. I can't handle a full sheet of plywood....

 

[TMG51]

I have storage under my floor. It's just a 2x4 on edge with plywood on top, creating a couple ~7' long cavities. They are accessed from the back doors and I use them only for lengthy items such as sawhorses, cut offs of trim pieces etc (I'm a carpenter).

I agree that 1x material is sufficient for what you want to do.

 

[lana_starr]

@highdesertranger - Plus the 1x1 could be ~3/4 from the top of the plywood and serve as support for the hatches made with 3/4 plywood. Hit the top with a sander to smooth out any little whoopsies and bada-boom!

@Almost There - Thanks for all the tips, I feel like I have a solid (floor) plan! It's reassuring to know you've done it yourself. Would you recommend doing anything to level the floor or cushion it, or just throw the ply down on metal? I'm definitely about to go read though your build.

@TMG51 - Another reassuring case study!

Still wondering if anyone has ideas about how to open the hatches (I just discovered I like saying "open the hatches"). I'm leaning towards a simple hole? And maybe I should ask this in insulation, but do you think that painting the floors would pose a problem in terms of moisture barriers?

Thanks all!

 

[Minivanmotoman]

Thinking about your idea and exploring online a bit, simple and open. Interesting, I Like that. Totally opposite of typical.

But is it liveable? Can you downsize down to that minimalist level? Are you a Buddhist monk? Will you be happy with that? Even if not, can build up and over.
So worth exploring. Think that 12" depth is doable without having to get too heavy in structure while max the space. And works well with 4*8 sheet. Hatch size will determine strong enough thickness. Small hatch, thinner hatch.
Home Floors are usually 3/4" btw for minimal flex and rigidity. Thinner floor requires more support underneath. Optimal? Need more specifics.

How many hatches? Design specifics to be determined which will then give answers on build details. There is a sticky here on van dimensions would give you a starting point for the floor plan and determine hatch number and placement.

Looking on Pinterest for floor storage gave lots of ideas and pics to answer your questions. Will have to box in the openings and support the edges of the hatches. Thin strips for this will do.

Will require precision cutting to minimize gaps or hide the gaps with mats or carpet. Carpet square tiles could be used.

Handles can be recessed into the floor. Simple flat U handle that requires only two holes and a recess slot but requires thick enough hatch to recess into. And a router for recess slot.

With a simple open layout, quality of material and finish will be obvious. If that is important to you and within budget. Can be done basic, and or industrial if you wish to, as well as full on Japanese Craftsman hardwood floor which would be impressive. Will love to see your plans and result exploring this.

Great concept. 
Insulate the floor, slide in your prefabbed plywood box(s) with hatches and you're off to explore the world.

https://www.google.com/search?q=how..._AUIEygD&biw=360&bih=560#imgrc=cxB8JdjwUh-E2M:

 

[lana_starr]

@Minivanmotoman - Liveable? Yes, moving from a Camry (several months at the beginning of last year) to this it will be spacious! I'm currently downsizing (further, I still don't have much that wouldn't fit in my Camry...) so I can lay all my things on the floor and check the depth I would need. I'm thinking I'll go 3/4" on top for peace of mind. If I did go with a Safari the dimensions are approx 8'x4' which would lend itself to an aesthetically pleasing grid. I'm in love with the image you found, it's already changing the way I'm thinking about this! I had googled similar things in the past and didn't turn that up so thank you!