Thoughts on Preparing for Winter.

[One Awesome Inch]

Thoughts on preparing for winter.

    One thing I know for 100% certain: I refuse to freeze. During the months of December, January and February it can easily hover around 1 or 2 degrees Celcius, often go to -5 C and sometimes go as much as -10 C where I live in Vancouver BC. About 20 years ago I lived in a double-wide trailer for a few months during the winter. It only had electric heat and being thrifty I did not want to heat the whole trailer just for me. So I heated the smallest room, which was about 7 feet long and 6 feet wide, with a small portable space heater. That winter was particularly cold and the space heater wasn't nearly enough. I often woke up cold and uncomfortable as a result. This was with a sleeping bag and wearing a toque on my head. Now I'm in my mid 40s and I know that having a heated space is important to me. The problem that I see with the van is either I run my propane heater (Olympian Wave 3) all night unattended or I turn it off and wake to freezing temps. Its my opinion that my vents need to be open at all times because otherwise it gets very stuffy in the van and most certainly you need adequate venting when running a propane heater.

    I have thought of a couple ways to solve this issue. Ideally, I could rent a driveway with an electrical plug-in. However, having occasionally scanned craigslist, I am not seeing alot of opportunities to do so. A second option would be to rent a room in a house/ apartment for those colder 3 months. I would make sure there is adequate parking for my van on the property of the rental housing and not have to park on the street. At night one could sleep in the rented room and during the day, one could live in the van with the propane heater running. This would avoid the majority of problems and hassles associated with living with roommates as you have your own private, detached dwelling. I think I could find a roommate situation in my area for about $300 a month, while I'm guessing I would need to pay $200 to rent a driveway with electrical plug-in.

Thoughts on this? Do you think its a workable plan?

 

[Almost There]

The thought of renting out a driveway has probably not occurred to a majority of home owners. Try running an ad asking rather than just looking for ads already placed.

IIWM I'd be renting a room over the winter time since you find the temps too cold for you. I've gone camping in Ontario winters in a van and while I find 1C absolutely balmy I wouldn't want to be doing it for several months at a time.

If the price difference between comfort and not comfort is only a couple of hundred bucks a month, take the comfort.

You can always save money for the other 9 months by van dwelling.

Q for you - if you're renting a room why would you live in the van during the day and only use the room for sleeping in...makes no sense to me?

 

[LeeRevell]

A Mr. Heater Buddy propane heater would be a lot less expensive, and a one-time purchase, plus whatever propane you need.

 

[Almost There]

A Mr. Heater Buddy propane heater would be a lot less expensive, and a one-time purchase, plus whatever propane you need.

Keep in mind what the propane will cost as well when making a decision.

I just checked a bunch of reviews and the most accurate use I could get was about 10 days from a 20 lb tank when used judiciously and part time.

The Canadian version of the Mr. Buddy was selling on Amazon.ca for $189 Cdn plus tax and still needs the adapter and filter for running from a remote tank.

I don't know what you're paying for propane in Vancouver but the prices here are ridiculous.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

Regarding Mr. Buddy and propane heaters... having zero experience with them I have some concerns.

I'll be hooking up my Wave 3 to a 20LB tank. What happens if the propane runs out while I am sleeping? I know the heater will shut off, but the tank valve will be open. Is that problematic?

Since I have no experience with a propane heater in the winter (or at all) I'm wondering if it might get too hot having the heater on for 8 hours continually. My van is very well insulated with 2 inches of rigid foam board in the ceiling and walls. I have the option of running my Wave 3 at 1600btus or 3000BTUS.

Is it safe to run a propane heater all night while unconscious?

 

[One Awesome Inch]

The thought of renting out a driveway has probably not occurred to a majority of home owners. Try running an ad asking rather than just looking for ads already placed.

IIWM I'd be renting a room over the winter time since you find the temps too cold for you. I've gone camping in Ontario winters in a van and while I find 1C absolutely balmy I wouldn't want to be doing it for several months at a time.

If the price difference between comfort and not comfort is only a couple of hundred bucks a month, take the comfort.

You can always save money for the other 9 months by van dwelling.

Q for you - if you're renting a room why would you live in the van during the day and only use the room for sleeping in...makes no sense to me?

I would live in the van during the day because from my experience roommates are often a nuisance or a hassle. Loud noises, strange smells (as a vegan I dont like the smell of cooking meat), and drama, drama, DRAMA. If all I do is sleep there all these things are minimized significantly.

The cheapest I've seen propane in Vancouver is $27 for 20LB tank. I think that was at Canadian Tire. I've seen the green bottles at $4 each... thats the lowest I've seen them.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

BTW I already own the Olympian Wave 3 so the initial purchase cost is covered. If I ran my heater 16 hours a day at 1600BTUS I would go thru 3 tanks a month... maximum. Probably less. So that's about $90 a month.

 

[HarmonicaBruce]

If you don't like the cold, why not go south for the winter?  Due to some horrible family issues I had to spend the past winter in Michigan, and it really sucked.  I hope to NEVER see snow again.  Actually, Boise Idaho isn't bad in the winter, I spent 2 winters there.  The average high in December and January is 38, average low 25 (F).

 

[One Awesome Inch]

Bruce, under different circumstances that would be a great solution. However, I need to stay within a 3 to 4 kilometre area as need to spend time with my children, 3 and 10 years old. Also, I have good job in the same area.

Moving south is a grea idea for those who are not tied down to a particular area.

 

[SoulRaven]

My experience living in the 45 sq ft aluminum tent with no insulation in Florida last winter is that the little buddy on low setting of 4000btus provides way too much heat and uses too much fuel.

Now that I am living in a well insulated apartment on the highest floor (4th) this winter I am going for a 10-week winter Florida expedition from the first week of January to about St. Pats Day.

So this winter the little buddy is not making the trip. Instead, I am taking a double mantle propane lantern with a reflector that will provide both heat and light that will provide just as much heat as needed using just a few 1lb disposable cylinders thus saving the weight of a 20 pound cylinder and the potential for a life ending explosion..

I am doing an ultra light set up this year vs. last winter.

Gone: 2 burner gasoline stove, gasoline lantern, little buddy heater, 3/4" plywood sleeping platform, cheapo air mattress less food and clothes

Added: double mantle propane heater hung off a swivel plant hanger, model 25 Trangia alcohol stove, Cabelas big man's cot with ThermaRest base camp 2" thick XL mattress.

On rainy days, I can knock the cot down to save space to provide more living spaced during the daytime hours.

Menthol alcohol is available at $15 per gallon at Home Despot.

 

[compassrose]

Can you find a park (RV/Mobile home) to stay in? I know nothing of Canada (except what I watched years ago on CBC via C-Band satellite dish).

I have an LP fireplace and a Dyna-Glo Tag-a-long heater mounted on a wall (similar to the Mr. Buddy... this is a great little heater that I have had since 2004 and rated for use indoors). I do not run my LP heaters at night. Paranoid I guess. I would prefer to not wake up dead. I do have a CO/LP detector along with a smoke detector. We all should if running propane. I heat at night with electric. I have a 10F sleeping bag under my quilts. Last winter was what I intend on being my last freezing winter. That said, I did not remove the heat tape & insulation from my pipes. Just being cautious. I have had a black tank valve on the old Class C freeze and break while only 100 miles north of the FL/GA state line (it was a 3 day freeze, so many houses had broken pipes). I have propane heat as a back up to the electric heat which does not work all that great once it dips below 45F.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

There is an RV park right close by. However, they want $200 per week / $800 per month. They may have discount rates for winter, but I have a feeling its likely going to be around $500... I should check though.

 

[akrvbob]

I lived in Anchorage, Ak in a box van for 6 years. Every single one of those years we had one or more cold snaps of -30 Farenheit (not Celsius) that lasted for weeks. I used a Wave 3 and a Wave 8 to stay warm. I turned them on in October and the Wave 3 ran continuously 24/7 until May. I only turned it off to change the bottle. Once it was in the single digits, I turned on the Wave 8 on low. At below zero they were both on high.

It was an old beat up rusted box van with holes in the floor. I never left any ventilation open. I loved that life!!!!! My kids came and stayed with me on weekends and they loved it too!

When one of my sons turned 16 he decided he wanted to live with me so I bought a 24 foot travel trailer and put it in a trailer park hooked up to two 100 pound propane battles. It was a very cold winter and I was miserable the whole time. The only thing that that worked was to buy a 500 watt heat lamp and put it at our feet so it heated just us. Hated that RV!!!!!

I think you can do it with very little problem. It sounds like you have great insulation so the Wave 3 will be perfect. I wouldn't hesitate to leave it on at night, but even if you aren't, with your insulation it should easily be able to stay warm enough for you to be comfortable overnight with a good sleeping bag or down comforter. My cargo trailer is not as well insulated as your van, but even at freezing if I have it warm when I go to bed it's fine the next morning. Cool but not miserable. The Farenheit-Celsius conversion makes it hard for me to explain but I think you will be fine.
Bob

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

There is an RV park right close by. However, they want $200 per week / $800 per month. They may have discount rates for winter, but I have a feeling its likely going to be around $500... I should check though.

Many RV parks include electric in daily or weekly rates, but bill you separately for the electricity if staying monthly.

Regards
John

btw, were you planning to keep the 20 lb propane tank inside the vehicle with you?  Propane flow drops when you go below 0 F, sometimes so low that appliances shut off.  I believe that Bob mentioned that when he lived in a truck in Alaska, he had to keep his propane tanks inside where it was warm.

 

[Canine]

I haven't had to deal with real cold for several years now, and never in a van, but I have lived in a 24 travel trailer through a Colorado winter. I plugged in a small 1500 watt space heater and left it on the lowest setting day and night. It cost me $300 for the RV park site and electricity averaged $75 a month. The trailer was your std 3 season unit, and I could have helped it by using foam boards to block the windows but I didn't. Same with skirting.
If you haven't already insulated then do that first. Blanket off the cab. Make sure you have some sort of insulation or non conductive floor material.
Don't burn candles, too dangerous.
You have good ideas so try to rent that room.

Dusty

 

[highdesertranger]

OneAI, good for you that you are planning for this with plenty of time and not waiting until the last minute. what about parking at your work and plugging in there. highdesertranger

 

[ZoNiE]

Hard for me to think about winter when I just paid my $435 electric bill. Yeah, July is usually about that!!!

 

[Canine]

$435? Time to close the windows!
(And I live in Phoenix 10 months of the year...)

 

[gcal]

If you can, go south. If you can't do that, choose the option that gives you as much physical comfort as you can afford. I'd go for the room. I spent the worst part of one midwest winter in a TT with a good propane furnace and an electric space heater. I still never felt fully thawed out. Some purists here will tell you that you are selling out if you give in to your need for comfort (and safety) by opting for central heating thru the worst of a northern winter season instead of opting for stoic endurance. Ignore them. Mother Teresa also devoutly believed that suffering was a virtue (in other people), but I noticed that she never applied that philosophy to herself when she had a choice.

 

[GypsySilver]

What about asking a church (or some other business) if you could park and hook up to electric in exchange for keeping an eye on the place?