Thinking of buying a utility shell for a stealth/adventure vehicle camper.

[VanLifeCrisis]

Wow, you don't mess around when it comes to changing things up <img src="/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle">&nbsp; That is super cool of that dealership.&nbsp; A huge difference to the one near me.&nbsp; I had an old lady from fl get stranded with a busted axle and i took her to the dealership to see what they could do.&nbsp; They spent most of their time trying to get her to buy a new car, but when she didn't they told her that her car would be more money that it was worth to fix (but they were oddly willing to buy it from her for 200 dollars..), and she had till monday (this was friday) to get her broke car off their lot or they would charge her 75 per day until it was gone <img src="/images/boards/smilies/frown.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"><br /><br />Glad to know there are still decent people out there!&nbsp; Sweet looking truck!&nbsp; Now you have to put those springs on that one <img src="/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle">

 

[Telcobilly]

They are awesome people here! I'm going to Estes Park tomorrow for the day, only 38 miles from here. The parts for the install come in Monday and then I should be good to go. Here's a pic of how close the open 8" port is to my head, 1 foot. Not too worried about suffocating with the heater on.

I'm using this inexpensive 12v water heater to boil water for sponge baths. I heat the water up and pour some of it in a big bowl and wash myself down in the camper with towels laid out. I pour the remainder into a squirt bottle to wash my hair. It may not be too convenient because of the Houdini factor of being in the back, but the more you do something, the better you get at it and the easier it is. Pretty soon, this will be the new normal for me. The Road Pro heater available at big truckstops or online $15-$20. Last about a year of heavy use.

 

[Telcobilly]

Well, the shell is now on my 2008. Six strong guys from the service department wrestled it on 2 days ago. Yesterday was brutal because I had to unload/reload it 2 more times for a total of 3 times because I had to acquire the correct hardware and reposition the camper. But it's done. I really have it efficiently set up with better access to my clothes and easier deployment of the generator. I also replaced the 2 gallon water jug with a narrow 7 gallon container. I have tubs and baskets on the floor but for the second layer of stuff under the cot, the baskets were replaced with 3 large 32" duffle bags, all labeled of course. The bad news? The new truck is on the bump stops because of the weak 3 leaf spring packs. Toyota has a TSB on my truck for replacement 4 leaf packs. Maybe Toyota never thought anyone actually works their trucks.. Working with a dealer in Denver now. Other than the bottoming out issue which will be fixed, the camper almost disappeared as far as the truck power was concerned. It accelerates easily with the other traffic. Will test it out on the freeway when I go to get the spring issue resolved. Will post more pix of my rig, the sun glare was bad for pix this morning:

 

[Telcobilly]

My old truck looks like a peacock in the back and rides like an ox cart with no weight with the add a leaf/SuperSprings still on. A hotrod ox cart with all of the weight gone for sure..lol. Unfortunately the SuperSprings don't transfer to the newer truck..shucks.

 

[Telcobilly]

No dice with Toyota, past the warranty period. Existing springs are considered acceptable. I had this issue with my 2004 Tacoma, soft springs. They make these trucks for comfort, not to do work. I love Toyota, but you have to be aware of their quirks, the overall quality and reliability make it worth the trade-off. Something to consider if you plan on going a similar route as mine.

So, I'm taking the truck to 4WP for some SSA19 SuperSprings next Friday. Otherwise, I'm parking it and driving my old truck. I have one truck with the rear in the air, the other on the ground. Both ride like ox carts..how ironic.

 

[longjohn]

Have you considered installing air bags? Not cheap but you can let some of the air out when you take your camper off and it will ride comfortably.

 

[Telcobilly]

I have considered bags, but the camper is pretty well staying on the 2008, so the SS's are a good balance of cost, simplicity and function for my needs. I'll probably sell off the SS's on the 2004. They are only a few weeks old. Additionally the springs on the 2008 are so inadequate they would probably work ok unloaded. My 2004 has an add a leaf in addition to the SS's.

EDIT.
This Amazon review of the SSA19 SuperSprings I'm buying + the good experience I had with them on my 2004 Tacoma reinforces my belief that this will solve the issue:

"I installed these on my 2005 Toyota Tacoma. The 2005-2007 Tacomas are notorious for having weak springs, and when hauling even the lightest loads, the 05-07 Tacomas will bottom out on the load stops and you will hear a big "thud". Toyota issued a technical service bulletin to install new spring packs on the affected Tacomas, but if your truck is out of warranty, then you will not get the new spring packs, unless you want to pay for them yourself. This is where SuperSprings are an excellent choice.

As mentioned I installed these on my 05 Tacoma Double Cab, 4x4 LB, and I have have hauled a little more than 1500 lbs, and the SuperSprings have performed excellent.

Body roll, with or without load, is now what I consider normal, whereas before the SuperSpring installation, there was excessive body roll, going around corners, or when entering the freeway on the curved entrance portion. This is not safe, especially when trying to get up speed to enter traffic, or when it is raining. The SuperSprings took care of the body roll problem.

Definitely worth the upgrade cost. Another nice feature is the SuperSprings allow me to enjoy the original ride of the truck, which is comfortable BTW, and then the load support of the springs gets stronger as more load is put into the bed of the truck.

I have had these installed on my truck for ~2 years."

 

[Telcobilly]

Installed a 1000W inverter under the hood. It's stored in the drawstring bag when not in use. I'm purchasing the part to install a circuit breaker to protect the cables, the unit has it's own internal protection. From what I have been reading, 100 amps will protect the #4 wire and handle the power surges of a 700W microwave? Sound about right?

Moved my ScanGuage 2 over from my '04 to the '08.

 

[Telcobilly]

Ok, I'm learning as I go, reading these forums and I read Bob's book; "How to live in a Car, or Van, RV and get out of debt".
A few items that need attention are; I don't think the Little Buddy Heater is keeping up with the 14* weather I experienced last night. I already bought an adapter to refill the small 1lb propane bottles from a larger tank. I have to wait til payday to get the bigger tank. Also, the condensation was really bad last night. I hear about using a piece of metal on top of the heater or something about clay flower pots being heated, can someone elaborate? The shell is at least 1/4" thick fiberglass and the doors have a wood core, making them over 1/2" thick.
I'm reluctant to put a dark covering on the ceiling and walls as it has a nice bright white finish, helping to minimize the "cave" feeling with light only coming from two 6" round ports in the doors. Any ideas for insulation or what I can do different to minimize the condensation? Also, should I upgrade to the bigger Mr Buddy heater and run it to a bigger bottle?

Thanks.. Over two weeks of cheaprvliving now and I feel I can sustain it once I overcome a few issues..

 

[Telcobilly]

Did some surfing this morning as in web, not wave, lol. I found an awesome link which explains in detail about condensation in single walled dwellings. This was geared towards tents, but is still relevent to our vandwelling lifestyle. I know what I did wrong, I left the rear hatches closed and the front one open. I noticed the condensation was considerably worse at the rear of the shell. Tonight, I'm going to open one and continue to leave the pass-through hatch open as well. We expel approximately 2 litres of water daily, it has to go somewhere. With adequate ventilation, the problem should be reduced.

Here's the link: http://www.eastonmountainproducts.com/pdf/condensation-article.pdf

I'll post my findings tomorrow as the temp tonight is virtually the same..

 

[Telcobilly]

Decided I'm going to buy the regular Mr Buddy heater, a hose, 20lb tank and a propane detector on Friday. The Little Buddy heater I have doesn't seem to put out enough heat, as well as going through a lot of 1lb bottles. I'm reading thoroughly all of the safety aspects of going that route.
Set up my glovebox as a central charging station for all of my telecom,computer, camera & shaver equipment. I have 4 USB ports fed by a full time fused line from the battery and a 300watt inverter to charge my laptop, camera and shaver. The inverter is plugged into a switched power outlet. Additionally I have a 12v extension cord plugged in to the glove box jack. It is run through the passthrough to give me a low wattage receptacle in the back for phone charging and a 12 volt light.

All cables are hidden by the dash or center console. It is all neatly stored in the glovebox and out of sight when it's closed.

 

[mad*sparrow]

Nice setup you have now. I'm still a ways off from having everything hooked up and I'm still worrying about installing my 20w solar panel on top to help charge things. Fiberglass is a new experience for me. My 96 Tacoma had the 2 leafs so it's sad that Toyota still undervalues suspension. My Nissan is more stout but I sure miss my Taco. I've got some ideas for the condensation that I responded to you in my thread but I agree with the outside air vent probably helping the most. I'm going to have to get that water heater for morning coffee. Bathing is not going to work in my shell tho. I'll have to do it outside or do the washcloth bit.
If you can find dessicant at a hardware store it'll help with the moisture. Especially if you have a microwave to remove the moisture from it when it saturates. Next time you are in OK let me know. I would love to check out your rig and tell war stories.

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

The regular mr buddy should be more than enough to heat that space, even with the ventilation.&nbsp; That thing kicks out heat.&nbsp; Just be aware they get very hot above the heater, so make sure its near the floor or you might melt your roof <img src="/images/boards/smilies/tongue.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"><br /><br />To help with condensation, I think a couple users here said this item works well with the little refill pellets, which cost like 15 bucks for a big bottle of them.<br /><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Dri -Z-Air</span><br /><br />Their website says they are sold at dick's sporting goods, camping world,&nbsp; ace/true value, rite aid, and some walmarts.&nbsp; <br /><br />Lowes also sells a similar product called damp rid.<br /><span style="text-decoration: underline;">Damp Rid @ Lowes</span><br /><br /><br />For insulation, can't you glue some foam panels up from the hardware store (lowes has several)?&nbsp; They come in white i think <img rel="lightbox" src="/images/boards/smilies/biggrin.gif" class="bbc_img" /><br /><span style="text-decoration: underline;">One type of Foam Board<br />Another Type<br /></span>

 

[Telcobilly]

Dazar, thanks for all of your links and suggestions. Saved them all and will buying some kind of dessicant on Friday, along with the bigger heater, hose and 20lb tank. I'm assuming I DON'T use plumbers tape on the connections for leak proof connections? Going to triple check every connection and shut off the tank when the heater is not in use. It wouldn't be hard to install insulation in bands from the ceilings to the walls down to the floor, or maybe just the bed. I'm hesitant to glue it and have mildew/adhesion issues later. What do you think of closed cell foam with velcro attached to the shell and foam? It would allow me to remove it for future wiring and inspections..

MS, I posted this reply in your thread, but will repost here to keep the continuity of my experiences in this Durashell. Also, I look forward to meeting you in OK. All of the rigs I have worked on have been in OK and 2 in KS. Our shop is in OKC, but our work is all over like Alva, Arnett, Enid, ect I'll be back there soon I'm sure.

Thanks Mad Sparrow! I coincidently did almost all of your suggestions last night with a HUGE REDUCTION in condensation. On top of that, it snowed in Boulder last night. I took off one of the 6" ports in the rear barn doors and reduced the use of the heater. I already had the 8" port in the front bulkhead open. I used the heater to get a warm spot near my face and to spot heat the camper. Once I was in my sleeping bag with a light zip up jacket, gloves, beanie and thick socks, I was very warm and comfortable. The small area of my face was the only part that was exposed. Maybe I should get a ski mask?
There was a light damp sheen of moisture in some area of the shell, but no drips at all.
Going to look into of your other suggestions.

My two taco's under a blanket of snow this morning:

28th St in Boulder:

MS, You asked about that little hot water heater. It is convenient, but it takes awhile to get hot water. I'm using my camp stove to heat a small metal pot of water. It's almost as fast as a microwave.

Here it is being used to make some awesome espresso with my Brikka 2 shot pot:

 

[mad*sparrow]

I've got a few campstoves I'll have to consider trying then. I'm concerned about lighting them up inside since one is a snowpeak dual fuel that leaks a little and a tiny alcohol stove that I haven't tried yet but expect a little overflow. My little propane should work though. My backpack cup works great for instant coffee.
At a truckstop I saw a 12 volt heated blanket I might pick up and try out for extra cold nights but I'm waiting to get my solar panel installed on top first so I don't drain the truck battery.
I'm currently in OKC but hope to be heading towards Colorado in a few months. Btw, I don't know if you know it but you have some of the best Mexican food I have ever had just outside of Boulder in a few little towns within a short drive. I'd have to look on the map to remind me of the towns but one of the places is called the Blue Parrot and has some interesting history as well. Its in a little town Northeast of Boulder. The BBQ in Broomfield was really good too. Can't think of the name of it.

Also, If you run into any problems I have some friends around there that might help.

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

Velcro is a rather unique idea, i never heard of anyone making quick release insulation before <img rel="lightbox" src="/images/boards/smilies/rofl.gif" class="bbc_img" />&nbsp; I'm no expert but I'd imagine just about anything you can do to cover the walls and ceiling would help keep it warm in there (which means less propane costs).

 

[Telcobilly]

Thanks MS! Appreciate your help & input. Love this forum, it's about like minded people helping each other. In regards to the trucker blankets, I have had 2 with mixed results. The most common is the RoadPro blue blankets at the Loves/Pilots/Flying J's. Very weak heat, save your money. Maybe you will get a good one..not sure. Later I bought a tartan design, red & black plaid 12v blanket at the TA in Sparks NV after fighting snow on Donner Pass (had to chain my rig). It put out decent heat but comes with a timer 30min/45min. You push a button and it runs for the time selected. It was pretty marginal too, but a big improvement over the the RoadPro. Look for it at the TA's.

Last night it only got down to 25* per the local weather on my phone. I removed one of the door hatch covers with the front pass through remaining off. I was nice and warm in my sleeping bag and only used the heater sparingly. Not a trace of condensation today. I'm sure I would have gotten some had it been colder, but the ventilation is definitely helping. Other than the initial getting settled (brutal,lol) in the cold camper, the rest of the time was comfortable.

I'm on a cot with a camping foam pad (hard!) a cheap sleeping bag and my new one for padding. I find when I lay on my side I get uncomfortable due to pressure points. So, today I did what I used to do in trucking to fix those hard mattresses, I bought a $10 foam mattress pad. I folded it and tucked it into the unused sleeping bag to make a mattress out of it. If it's not enough, I'll buy another one.

Finally, I have been really thinking thru the whole propane tank/heater problem, so I'm going to try another tack. I purchased a T fitting today where the center screws into the big tank and allows 2 smaller connections to be made. This will allow me to have a male connector pointing straight up like it does on the 1 lb bottles. I'll then screw my Little Buddy heater on top of it. With some gas rated washers, I'm confident I can get it all lined up right. Additionally with an inline filter, the heater body will clear the tank even better. Is there some type of sealer or tape to ensure a leak free assembly or is the sealing done with the washers?

Using some cheap plastic trays for a pull out work surface for cooking outside the camper. Very similar to cooking outside with teardrop trailers.

I may be getting the hang of this..

 

[mad*sparrow]

Thanks for the info on the blanket. That saves me $30. It was the blue one I was looking at. I'll hold off then until I get my solar set up and see if my heated mattress pad will suffice. It may pull too many watts though to run off a solar charged battery. I have two comforters that should do the job.
The nice thing about the foam inserts is that they will help insulate too. Good idea with stuffing them in the extra sleeping bag. Should help keep them from shifting. I was thinking velcro for the insulation too but I had a bad experenhce with the velcro coming off in my pelican box on my motorcycle in high temperatures. Be sure to use a better glue solution then what comes with the velcro. Sad part is that when I bought the velcro it said it was industrial and would work in extreme temps. All it did was hold a small flashlight.

 

[Telcobilly]

Pretty productive day. I wired in a 150 amp breaker for the inverter to protect the cables. I wired in a 12v drop light in the camper to get away from the cold LED lights, plus not having to deal with batteries. The warm glow of an incandescent bulb is more comfortable.
Bought the Mr Buddy heater, a filter and hose, but no propane tank yet. I already like this heater a lot better, more heat, adjustability, easier to start and more stable on the floor.

I wanted input from the forum to calm my fears. I want to put the bottle under the floor towards the back but not all the way back. My thinking is the propane would leak out the rear doors in the unlikely event of a leak. Of course the bottle would be shut off when not in use. Should I use plumbers tape for a better seal?
Are there any detectors for propane? Just want to be as safe as possible.

50w bulb in the drop light. Bought the last one, would like another one for more light.

150 amp breaker, left in the off position when the inverter is not used.

 

[bk2valve]

Telcobilly,<br />I would sure feel better if you were to run by an LPG shop and ask them about your propane plan. It really is something that should be done right. You can't just make something up when you are installing a system...you really need to do it right...<br /><br />I would feel really uncomfortable offering advice or validating a planand not seeing exactly what you plan to do...<br /><br />That is just me though. I always would rather lean toward safety....<br /><br />Bri