Hello everyone! I am new to the forum and doing research for small living in a big city. The problem I haven't been able to find a solution to is how to live with pets in a city. I have two large dogs who are fine in small spaces (they sleep most of the time), but do bark on occasion. I am hoping to live in a conversion van (or tiny house if I find a place to park it), but I'm concerned about doing it with my dogs. I also do work and would need to leave the dogs in the van during the day. Any suggestions for temperature control, soundproofing, and generally living with dogs in a city? Is it possible?
Stealth Living with Dogs?
- Thread starter Azuca
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My suggestion is to find the dogs a good home. Temperature control is very hard in the summer. You could leave your engine running and run the A\C, but there goes your stealth. If your engine or AC goes out for any reason, your dogs get cooked. There are also more and more places with actual laws against leaving unattended pets in cars. That means a pricey ticket and possible court consequences if you get caught and, perhaps, having your windows broken to get the dogs out.
The one solution I can think of is doggy daycare. You would have to check for availability cost.
The one solution I can think of is doggy daycare. You would have to check for availability cost.
I agree with "gcal". I don't see this working in a vehicle. In a tiny house, I think it could work if you could find a place to park and you couldn't do that "stealth". I'm not sure what kind of climate you are thinking of either. In warmer climates, you are sure to run into places that don't allow dogs to be kept in the vehicles at all.
For barking, I suggest a citronella collar. It worked with my determined and stubborn chow/shepherd.
For barking, I suggest a citronella collar. It worked with my determined and stubborn chow/shepherd.
Patrick46
Well-known member
There was a thread earlier this year that talked about this very thing.
Our own Bindi&Us had the LEO called on them, because they were inside a store or somewhere, and left their dog in their van. (a very small dog who has lived nearly his entire life in a van or RV. They had the windows cracked, and a Fantastic Fan blowing fresh air for the dog. Didn't matter, someone called 'em in anyways.)
Too many people worried about what everybody else is doing, and not minding their own damn business.
I don't see this going well for 2 big dogs in a van in the city. Sorry.
b'sides...big dogs need room to run. (JMO)
Our own Bindi&Us had the LEO called on them, because they were inside a store or somewhere, and left their dog in their van. (a very small dog who has lived nearly his entire life in a van or RV. They had the windows cracked, and a Fantastic Fan blowing fresh air for the dog. Didn't matter, someone called 'em in anyways.)
Too many people worried about what everybody else is doing, and not minding their own damn business.
I don't see this going well for 2 big dogs in a van in the city. Sorry.
b'sides...big dogs need room to run. (JMO)
Anyone remember the character I posted pictures of with the one massive boot and the very unique van? In telling me to get a dog, I told him I couldn't because I never stay in campgrounds, just wherever I find, and with a dog I wouldn't be able to fall back on retail outlets and park in their lots and then take my dog for a walk on the asphalt. He said, "Sure you can, I do." He said he parks at Walmart etc and walks his big dog around and no one bothers him.
If you're staying in one city and stealth is important, then I agree it's going to get problematic keeping dogs. But apparently if you're a semi-urban wild old man keeping all your weirdness out in the open, it isn't a problem.
If you're staying in one city and stealth is important, then I agree it's going to get problematic keeping dogs. But apparently if you're a semi-urban wild old man keeping all your weirdness out in the open, it isn't a problem.
Canine
Well-known member
The short, easy answer is to give up your pets and live your life more like what most other people would prefer. That is a totally acceptable decision. Here is a long answer and one that I, a city dweller, primarily adhere to:
Dual pane windows do a lot for soundproofing, but, holy cow, are they expensive. Mass stops sound, so the thicker the plywood, the more sound it will stop. There are specially made materials that stop sound, but they are expensive. When I was in an apartment, my neighbors were noisy, so I hung a blanket on the wall. It made kind of a big difference.
Temperature control can be done. Dual pain windows help and covering the windows from the outside helps. Use the best quality insulation you can as you have a very limited space and that limits the amount of insulation you can put up. Some places have an outlet placed at the end of the parking spaces to plug in your block heater during the winter. Perhaps that is available and you could plug in air conditioning? I'm planning on getting AC that runs only on my solar, but that is an expensive ordeal and may not work anyway. A lot of things need to line up to make AC work on solar and having that much solar on your roof is noticeable. If you can park in shade and use a fan, you can do a lot to keep your pets safe and comfortable. Perhaps on the hottest of days doggie day care may be needed, but the rest of the time it would be fine.
I get out a lot. As a result I have had more than my fair share of confrontations. If you have a pet and get out a lot, you are going to have problems. Every once in a while law enforcement is called on me. Because I've never, ever been a problem, I've never gotten in trouble. My dogs have always had the best behaviors and that makes a huge difference. Yes, I've made mistakes as have my dogs, but anyone who expects perfection is too onerous and isn't taken seriously. Cops have better things to do than bother a hard working man and his exceptionally well behaved dog.
I have a CCW. That means I'm one of the good guys and that makes a difference. If I had a rap sheet, had a warrant for unpaid fines, and acted like a dysfunctional jerk, I wouldn't have what I have now. If you are one of the good guys/gals, then do things that demonstrate that. Don't brag about yourself, but tactfully display who you are. Good people are given more leeway. Bad people not so much. You will need to be given leeway if you are to have two large dogs in a van.
I'm a one-dog dude. As competent as I am, I won't have two dogs. Too constricting. One dog is a lot of work and two dogs is more work than I care to do. Having one dog makes a huge difference. I've seen vandwellers with more than one dog, but I won't make that much of a sacrifice.
Mine is a 45 pound dog. I like the size. Any bigger and having them around becomes surprisingly more difficult. Small dogs are much easier! Am seriously considering a small (20 pound) dog for my next partner in crime. It wouldn't be my first choice, but not a bad one.
No matter what you like to have in your life, someone will have a problem with it. I largely do what I want as long as I'm not hurting anyone. Being courteous and making as big of an effort as you can to minimize your impact on others goes a long way. I'm amazed at what I get away with when I don't inconvenience anyone or cause harm to my environment.
If work allows you to go out and let the dogs out every 2 to 4 hours, that makes a big difference. If you can limit work to 4-6 hours a day, you could simply go to work then let the dogs out when you get off. Living without bills and without a ton of stuff will allow you to be free from a self-imposed, financial prison and will better allow you to have the freedoms you want with your pets.
I had a job where I said I would work for them, but only if they allowed me to bring the dog to work. They agreed to that. No one else could, which I'm sure was problematic for some of my coworkers. As long as I had my dog, I didn't care. I put it out there and it worked, but I also did the 100's of hours of training that allowed me to have a dog that was able to be at a job. Keep in mind, however, most people will say, "no" no matter what. You can be one of the most competent, responsible people in the world with a dog to match, but because you have a dog, most will hold that against you when it comes to work.
Some jobs prefer you have a van/camper and a dog. Working a fireworks stand comes to mind.
Having a pet requires a lot of sacrifice. Are you willing/able to give up your job, your stuff, your current residence, and whatever else to have your pets? Are you willing to make the time to train your dog(s)? If so, you can make it work. It isn't for everyone, but for those who want to make the sacrifices, then it certainly does work. Good luck!
Dual pane windows do a lot for soundproofing, but, holy cow, are they expensive. Mass stops sound, so the thicker the plywood, the more sound it will stop. There are specially made materials that stop sound, but they are expensive. When I was in an apartment, my neighbors were noisy, so I hung a blanket on the wall. It made kind of a big difference.
Temperature control can be done. Dual pain windows help and covering the windows from the outside helps. Use the best quality insulation you can as you have a very limited space and that limits the amount of insulation you can put up. Some places have an outlet placed at the end of the parking spaces to plug in your block heater during the winter. Perhaps that is available and you could plug in air conditioning? I'm planning on getting AC that runs only on my solar, but that is an expensive ordeal and may not work anyway. A lot of things need to line up to make AC work on solar and having that much solar on your roof is noticeable. If you can park in shade and use a fan, you can do a lot to keep your pets safe and comfortable. Perhaps on the hottest of days doggie day care may be needed, but the rest of the time it would be fine.
I get out a lot. As a result I have had more than my fair share of confrontations. If you have a pet and get out a lot, you are going to have problems. Every once in a while law enforcement is called on me. Because I've never, ever been a problem, I've never gotten in trouble. My dogs have always had the best behaviors and that makes a huge difference. Yes, I've made mistakes as have my dogs, but anyone who expects perfection is too onerous and isn't taken seriously. Cops have better things to do than bother a hard working man and his exceptionally well behaved dog.
I have a CCW. That means I'm one of the good guys and that makes a difference. If I had a rap sheet, had a warrant for unpaid fines, and acted like a dysfunctional jerk, I wouldn't have what I have now. If you are one of the good guys/gals, then do things that demonstrate that. Don't brag about yourself, but tactfully display who you are. Good people are given more leeway. Bad people not so much. You will need to be given leeway if you are to have two large dogs in a van.
I'm a one-dog dude. As competent as I am, I won't have two dogs. Too constricting. One dog is a lot of work and two dogs is more work than I care to do. Having one dog makes a huge difference. I've seen vandwellers with more than one dog, but I won't make that much of a sacrifice.
Mine is a 45 pound dog. I like the size. Any bigger and having them around becomes surprisingly more difficult. Small dogs are much easier! Am seriously considering a small (20 pound) dog for my next partner in crime. It wouldn't be my first choice, but not a bad one.
No matter what you like to have in your life, someone will have a problem with it. I largely do what I want as long as I'm not hurting anyone. Being courteous and making as big of an effort as you can to minimize your impact on others goes a long way. I'm amazed at what I get away with when I don't inconvenience anyone or cause harm to my environment.
If work allows you to go out and let the dogs out every 2 to 4 hours, that makes a big difference. If you can limit work to 4-6 hours a day, you could simply go to work then let the dogs out when you get off. Living without bills and without a ton of stuff will allow you to be free from a self-imposed, financial prison and will better allow you to have the freedoms you want with your pets.
I had a job where I said I would work for them, but only if they allowed me to bring the dog to work. They agreed to that. No one else could, which I'm sure was problematic for some of my coworkers. As long as I had my dog, I didn't care. I put it out there and it worked, but I also did the 100's of hours of training that allowed me to have a dog that was able to be at a job. Keep in mind, however, most people will say, "no" no matter what. You can be one of the most competent, responsible people in the world with a dog to match, but because you have a dog, most will hold that against you when it comes to work.
Some jobs prefer you have a van/camper and a dog. Working a fireworks stand comes to mind.
Having a pet requires a lot of sacrifice. Are you willing/able to give up your job, your stuff, your current residence, and whatever else to have your pets? Are you willing to make the time to train your dog(s)? If so, you can make it work. It isn't for everyone, but for those who want to make the sacrifices, then it certainly does work. Good luck!
insulate well, have a reflective light blocker for your windshield, keep the water dish as full as practical, and have an automatic solar powered extractor fan pulling hot air (from near the ceiling). have your cool air intake drawing air from a shaded area.
I've had a larger for nearly all my years of traveling and have never had a problem with overheating. Had bylaw called on me once and, having seen my setup, the guy complimented me on the care I took of my dog; it was cooler inside my rig than anywhere outside. ..Willy.
I've had a larger for nearly all my years of traveling and have never had a problem with overheating. Had bylaw called on me once and, having seen my setup, the guy complimented me on the care I took of my dog; it was cooler inside my rig than anywhere outside. ..Willy.
WildTrappist
Well-known member
I live in a city with my dog. He is small, however He is vigilant and He believes I am killing him every time I leave him alone in our home. (the van). I have never been bothered or harassed by anyone. I take him with me if I will be gone more than 3 hours. I find that he sleeps on my obscured bed most of the time that I'm gone. He barks and goes to the window when someone approaches. So far so good.
I have a few folks I can trust to care for him around town If I need longer time away form him.
Nobody has ever given me grief for leaving him in my van. I leave side windows open, water on the floor, and the front windows cracked.
That is my experience.
I have a few folks I can trust to care for him around town If I need longer time away form him.
Nobody has ever given me grief for leaving him in my van. I leave side windows open, water on the floor, and the front windows cracked.
That is my experience.
buckwilk
Well-known member
Azuca said:
The answer to your question depends a lot on where you live and the temps there. If you live in a city where the daytime, summer temps are triple digits then most of the advice above is worth every penny you paid for it. You took on the responsibility of these dogs and now you are looking to do what? The answer is, if you can't take care of them properly then find them a GOOD home BEFORE you change your lifestyle. Taking care of them properly is not locking two large dogs in a van for 8 to 10 hours a day and then another 8 while you sleep!
wagoneer
Well-known member
Do not care what anyone has said. Bad bad for the dog
highdesertranger
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I have to agree with wagoneer on this. highdesertranger
Canine
Well-known member
wagoneer said:
Can you tell us why so bad? I don't want to be confrontational, just wanted some insight.
I realize that for many people, their dogs are valued companions. But, honestly, if you expect a dog to remain stuck alone in doggy jail in the cramped quarters of a van for 3/4's of the day or more, with a couple of 15 minute walks if he is lucky, find your dog another home. That's not what dogs were born to do. What crime did your dog ever do to deserve that? Even at daycare kennels, it will be hard and expensive to find one in a city where a dog will have room to run.
You have every right to live the lifestyle you please. But that does not mean that if you try to impose it on your dogs that your dogs should be expected to change their nature to conform to it. If you are at work all day and out after work and sleeping all night, not only will your dog be unhappy and frustrated, it will be bored. A bored animal will find ways to entertain itself that you won't like. A dog confined in a small space will shed and smell. Pretty soon, everything you own will smell like dog and be covered with dog hair.
You will find that having the dog in that van in a city seriously affects your own life and the things you can do if you are really concerned about the dog's welfare. Any time you leave that van for errands or your own social life, that dog stuck in solitary confinement in a cell.
We have a roomy class A. We spend most of our time in parks with hookups. We are retired. There are 2 of us. Our dog is only 20 pounds. He is a breed that does not shed. There are still things we cannot do because we have the dog. Sometimes dogs are not allowed. There are places we want to go and spend all day but we can't find a boarding kennel and we don't know anyone well enough to hand them a key and ask them to keep an eye on the AC and walk the dog. Sometimes we can't trust our generator not to overheat and stop the AC whole we are enjoying a restaurant lunch.
Our dog doesn't shed, but he costs $35-50 a month to have clipped. Regular vet checkups and shots cost $300-400 a year. If you travel with your dog and it spends time outside with you, you can count on extra $$$ for extra vet visits because the dog is absolutely certain to find unfamiliar trouble to get into. New parasites, new germs, new things on the ground to eat that the new vet will have to dig out of it.
Sometimes, things you want to do are incompatible. You really cannot have it all, at least, not at the same time. If we were making the choice again, I would not want to RV with a dog. I would definitely not want to have a dog in a van.
You have every right to live the lifestyle you please. But that does not mean that if you try to impose it on your dogs that your dogs should be expected to change their nature to conform to it. If you are at work all day and out after work and sleeping all night, not only will your dog be unhappy and frustrated, it will be bored. A bored animal will find ways to entertain itself that you won't like. A dog confined in a small space will shed and smell. Pretty soon, everything you own will smell like dog and be covered with dog hair.
You will find that having the dog in that van in a city seriously affects your own life and the things you can do if you are really concerned about the dog's welfare. Any time you leave that van for errands or your own social life, that dog stuck in solitary confinement in a cell.
We have a roomy class A. We spend most of our time in parks with hookups. We are retired. There are 2 of us. Our dog is only 20 pounds. He is a breed that does not shed. There are still things we cannot do because we have the dog. Sometimes dogs are not allowed. There are places we want to go and spend all day but we can't find a boarding kennel and we don't know anyone well enough to hand them a key and ask them to keep an eye on the AC and walk the dog. Sometimes we can't trust our generator not to overheat and stop the AC whole we are enjoying a restaurant lunch.
Our dog doesn't shed, but he costs $35-50 a month to have clipped. Regular vet checkups and shots cost $300-400 a year. If you travel with your dog and it spends time outside with you, you can count on extra $$$ for extra vet visits because the dog is absolutely certain to find unfamiliar trouble to get into. New parasites, new germs, new things on the ground to eat that the new vet will have to dig out of it.
Sometimes, things you want to do are incompatible. You really cannot have it all, at least, not at the same time. If we were making the choice again, I would not want to RV with a dog. I would definitely not want to have a dog in a van.
gcal said:
No disrespect intended, but how is this any different than keeping a dog in a house or apartment? Every single point made in this post applies to all living situations. If you work all day, your dog is home alone. When you socialize or run errands away from home, your dog is alone. Aside from the unique climate control issues of van dwelling, I can't see where it makes one bit of difference to the dog.
I'm fortunate that my house is only a mile from my workplace, so I can usually go home on my lunch break and play with the dog. When he's in my vehicle parked outside the office, I can visit with him every hour.
GotSmart
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Houses are less likely to get to 140* on a hot afternoon.
IMHO, as someone raised on a farm with room for a dog to constantly run.. I do not understand why anyone would keep a large dog in an apartment.
You are capable of thinking. Your dog, your situation. I do not know exactly what it is, Just be honest for both your sakes.
IMHO, as someone raised on a farm with room for a dog to constantly run.. I do not understand why anyone would keep a large dog in an apartment.
You are capable of thinking. Your dog, your situation. I do not know exactly what it is, Just be honest for both your sakes.
If it were me, I would either try to take the van to the workplace where I could tend to the dog on breaks/lunch or find a job out of the city like camp hosting where I could be available. A barking dog in a van is going to draw attention which is the first obvious clue that this isn't going to work well. I totally understand since I have traveled with big dogs and lived full-time in an RV park with large dogs. I would never give my dog up so I adjust my current choices to blend with the choices I made in the past.
Larger dogs have different energy levels. Decent walks will take care of many of the breeds.
Larger dogs have different energy levels. Decent walks will take care of many of the breeds.
GotSmart said:
So to be clear, you feel that dogs belong in the country and not in an urban environment. I'm sure you are aware that not everyone shares that opinion. You may not be aware that not all dogs need to "constantly run".
As I pointed out, the challenge of climate control is the key difference.
mayble said:
I have never owned a dog in an apartment. Always a house with a dog door and a fenced yard. People I know who have apartment dogs have little ones and they use pee pads. Do you want pee pads for 2 big dogs in your van?
The climate issue is not a small issue and neither is the space issue. If you think it is not a problem, try spending 16 hours a day in your closet for a week.
