Seems to me.. ice is best when off the grid part time

[Sunny1]

Cubey, my 3-way refrigerator was only running 30 degrees below ambient.&nbsp; First I moved the temperature sensor that is on the cooling fins down as far as it would go.&nbsp; The farther away from the freezer it is, the cooler the refrigerator will run.&nbsp; That didn't make much of a difference, though.<br><br>Next I put sheets of reflectix on both sides and over the top of the refrigerator (from the outside), then stuffed Pink Panther insulation wherever I could fit it.<br><br>Finally I made a baffle out of reflectix and duct taped it so it directed all incoming air from the bottom vent over the cooling fins in the exterior compartment.&nbsp; Now mine runs 60 degrees below ambient.&nbsp; In fact, I had to set my refrigerator setting to a warmer setting to keep foods in the refrigerator from freezing.<br><br>You might try the baffle and see how much difference it makes.&nbsp; If it works for you, it's an easy fix.

 

[Zil]

Do you have good house batteries? That may be the better investment before the HF generator. 6 volt golf cart batteries wired series for 12 volts.<br>Have you tried the fridge on inverter power?

 

[Cubey]

One is a 5 year old group 27 DieHard that has barely been used. I forget the AH and it's printed on the side so I'd have to unhook it and pull it out to see. Seems like it may have been 195? They don't make it anymore.. I think it was a non-dual purpose one like they sell now that shows CCA. The other battery is a small cheap wal-mart one that came in the van that is newer (2 years old?) with something around 100 AH as I recall.<br><br>No, I haven't tried it on an inverter yet. I had a Coleman one that was 800W constant but it must have died in storage or maybe it never worked.. I can't remember. I bought it used years ago at a garage sale. Been too busy (and frankly, too broke at the moment) to go buy the HF one right now and try it out.<br><br>I'd have to pull the Onan generator to make room for more batteries. There is simply no where else they could go. Unless I have enough solar to keep them charged, more batteries won't do me much good. I have an RV converter which charges the batteries when plugged in to shore power (it plugs in, I am testing the system without using it right now). <br><br>I could still run a generator to recharge the batteries but then what's the point of more battery storage if I still have to run a generator to recharge the batteries? it would make the generator work harder and use more fuel to power the RV converter AND the fridge.

 

[Cubey]

I went and got the inverter today. It was on sale for $22.99, plus 20% off with a coupon. It was the last one and the box was opened but looked unused. The ring connectors had no scratches. I got the 2 year extended warrranty and with tax, it came out $30.xx. <br><br>I did a quick test of it and it will power the fridge okay. The fridge acts a little funny it seems like bit maybe it's must some kind of timer to protect it from being cycled on and off constantly if power comes and goes due to power issues.<br><br>My batteries were dropping slightly quick but then again they aren't getting much solar charge right now since I am parked under a tree. They get enough to keep charged from my overnight use of LED lights, etc but not enough from trying to power the fridge. <br><br>The van's alternator does a good job of charging the house batteries when the van is running so it'll also feed the inverter when driving.<br><br>I have some 10 gauge wire left over from my solar installation so I wired it up close the batteries. I<br>ll run a short 120v outdoor extension cord to the fridge and put a cord cover over it to prevent tripping. A 120v extension cord will cost less and be easier than running 8 gauge wire from the batteries to the back of the fridge for the inverter. <br><br>Also, I will have easy access indoors to the inverter if I want to plug something else in that is low draw like that I want to use real quick like my electric can opener. Manual can openers seem to all be junk these days and since I already have this one, I'll keep it.<br><br> One manual can opener I had (I threw it away the other day) was the heaviest duty I have ever seen and it was complete garbage. It wouldn't work properly after about 5 times then was worn out pretty much. Mind you, I bought it about 5 years ago then it sat in a drawer after being used only a few times so I couldn't return it when it stopped working after 1 can the other day.<br><br>EDIT: I guess the inverter is too weak. 750W too weak for peak? Maybe the fridge takes too long to power up? It worked earlier (so I thought anyway) but now the fridge can't quite start on the inverter. Still works fine on grid power so it didn't hurt it. I guess I will return it and get the next size up. They false advertised it as 400W/800W on the box but it's only 750W peak based on the manual. So I'll get the 750W constant/1500W peak inverter and try that. It costs twice as much but if that's what I need...

 

[Cubey]

Well, my setup is ok for daytime use with good sunshine, or when driving, but that's it. My batteries can't keep up even after only a couple of hours of poor/no solar recharging.<br><br>It wasn't even totally dark out last night by the time the inverter woudn't run for more than 5-10 seconds when the fridge kicked on before shutting off due to a low voltage reading. When the fridge was running, it would drop below 11.9v which causes the inverter to shut down to keep from killing the batteries. Idle voltage (except for my 68-LED bulbs) was about 12.5v (90% charge). I would need many more batteries to get by and even then it might not work. It's not worth the effort. <br><br>My solar panels and batteries work fine for my basic needs: lights, a fan or two, the electric flush toilet, water pump, phone/tablet recharging. It needs 120v for the fridge, water heater and A/C.<br><br>I guess I'll probably just end up having no refrigeration off the grid. For the cost of ice or gas for a generator, I may as well just pay a little more for food and have it fresh every day. Also, I'd have no worries about having to haul in ice or gas either on my scooter.

 

[James AKA Lynx]

Try using dry ice well warped in newspaper for frozen foods. Some say it works great and will last almost 5 days in moterate heat.<br><br>James AKA Lynx

 

[wrcsixeight]

A 5 year old battery which has not been used much, does not mean it will perform like a new battery. &nbsp;They have shelf lives and yours is near the end of it. Capacity loss is occurring from the moment the acid is poured to cover the plates in the factory.<br><br>Inverters need to be wired close to the battery over thick cabling. &nbsp;Use AC extension cords to power AC items rather than moving the inverter nearer the appliance being powered. Much less voltage drop on AC wiring<br><br>The alternator does not really do a good job charging distant house batteries, unless steps have been taken to shorten and thicken the circuit. &nbsp;The last 20% of charge to reach a true 100% takes hours and hours and hours regardless of charging source. &nbsp;Most think 85% is full or they read surface charge after engine shutdown and assume incorrectly the battery is full<br><br>On another forum, a member had to get a 1200 watt/2400 surge inverter to power his 2.2 cubic foot Dorm fridge. &nbsp;His new group 31 battery could not power it through a full weekend with the inverter alarm starting Saturday evening after leaving Friday afternoon and driving 3 hours.<br><br>He assumed that the battery would fully recharge on his 3 hour drive home, because like most, he thought the alternator was some magical, near instant, battery recharger. &nbsp;Naturally the battery got blamed &nbsp;a month later when it could barely power his stereo in camp for a few hours while he was taking beers from his cooler.<br><br>Then realizing his battery was sulfated from chronic undercharging, went out and bought a "desulfating" battery charger and performed several reconditioning cycles on it. &nbsp;Then declared the charger a waste of money after it didn't magically restore to new his abused battery.<br><br>So in his bid to save money with a dorm fridge, he spent an additional 120 on inverters, another 110 on a charger, 50 dollars in thicker cabling in between battery and alternator and he is stuck with a battery will little capacity remaining, a charger he didn't need, a larger inverter than he will ever need, and a fridge which is basically useless unless plugged into the grid.<br><br><br><br>Dry ice in an enclosed space can be dangerous as &nbsp;Co2 will displace oxygen from the floor up.

 

[Willy]

&nbsp;That's why I'm sooooo into solar. I have one battery (fridge only) hooked up to both the alternator (via solid-state battery isolator) and solar, while the other (for everything else) is straight solar. The charge controller is a dual battery unit that ISN'T one of those cheap bulk discharge controllers. This setup works really well and I always have cold or frozen food/drinks. Really, the initial cost is greater, but the savings in bought ice and food spoilage makes up for it right quick.&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;Over here, one can get 200W of solar and a charge controller for abt $250. A used Waeco 12v compressor fridge (I get mine for a bit over $200) and, with a deep cycle battery, yer set up for years of *free* refrigeration after the initial outlay. With a cooler, there's the not insignificant expense of a GOOD cooler, and the ongoing expense of ice. Plus, with all that moisture, things can get rather soggy/stinky and you're unable to actually freeze anything. It also removes a limitation on 'trip time', since it makes no difference how long one can stay out in the stix.&nbsp;<br>&nbsp;With ice, you're not able to just spontaneously decide to hang out in the middle of nowhere without heading back to town.. and there's another added expense: gas. Making those trips to get ice could very well double or triple (or more) the effective cost of the ice, so that has to be taken into consideration. It's a case of paying a fair amount now, vs paying a lot more down the road. ..Willy.

 

[Cubey]

I did wire up the inverter close to the batteries... as close as possible. About 2-2.5ft for hot and about 1.5ft for negative. I used 4 gauge wire I already had (bigger than the cables it came with). I just bought the terminal ends for the wires. <br><br>I butchered a 120v outdoor extension cord and ran it to the fridge with a new male end at the inverter so it could be run through drilled holes in the wood cabinets since it's running from one side of the van to the other. I placed the female end of the extension cord in the rear compartment where the regular outlet is for the fridge so it can easily swapped between. It'll be useful when driving long distances during the day between RV parks or campgrounds where I will be on the grid since my panels and batteries can keep it going during the day.. plus the alternator helps as well. It connects the alermator to the house batteries through an isolator solenoid when the key is turned... which actually allows me to recharge my starting battery through solar in an emergency by just turning the ignition key to 'on'.<br><br>My solar panels are charging the batteries 100% for sure during the day with good sunshine. My plug in 12v volt meter shows about 14v tops when it's charging. I do have a solar charge controller and it does it's job. It stops the charging at times during the day since I see the meter go down to 12.8v when it's not getting charge current due to being fully charged.<br><br>One of the batteries is about 7-8 years old actually, not 5 (found the receipt the other day). The other is about 2-3 years old. The batteries are doing a good job of keeping a charge for use besides that big inverter and the fridge. I had had my in-dash stereo running for about 4 hours now since the sun went down (they stopped being effective about 5-6 hours ago as the sun was setting) plus my XM radio running on 12v for the same amount of time. I also had a 12v fan running for a while plus lights (all LED except the bathroom light, i think the fixture is wired backwards, LED wont work in it.. I need to check/fix it). It's at 12.5V and has been for a long time now... which is about 90% charge. It started out about 12.8v when the sun was going down.<br><br>I realize the one battery is probably not going to be as good as a new one but it's doing very well for it's age. The newer one could be doing most of the work though. It's hard to say.<br><br>Ice isn't cost effective, nor is gas for a generator for everyday use of a fridge. What IS cost effective is to not have refrigeration ... or a new RV fridge that'll run on propane. I will just eat shelf stable food and save my money for something else when off the grid. I'll just have to change my eating habits when off the grid. As it is, I use powdered milk and just mix up 1 cup at a time so no refrigeration is needed for it.<br><br>Most of the time I will be on the grid so I don't think it's even going to be an issue. For the times I'm not, I'll just try to use up any cold stuff before I do so so nothing goes to waste. The freezer in this little 1.7cu ft dorm fridge barely freezes ice cubes but keeps the refrigerated stuff nice and cold.

 

[wrcsixeight]

The solenoid draws almost an amp just to hold the contacts closed for parallelling batteries.<br><br>Leaving the ignition on to recharge the engine battery by solar will fry your coil. &nbsp;Bad idea, move the wires to the same &nbsp;large stud on the solenoid if this becomes necessary. Better yet use the engine battery for no house loads whatsoever so it can't likely ever be depleted.<br><br>14 volts is not enough to fully charge a battery when it was discharged the night before, most will need 14.4 or more for 90 minutes. Ideal acceptance and float voltages are dependent on battery brand/design and temperature.<br><br>If you are not taking specific gravity measurements with a quality hydrometer, or do not have an amp hour counter, or are not taking voltage measurements many many hours after any load or charging source was applied to the battery, then you only can have a vague idea of the state of charge of the battery.<br><br>A flashing green light means little. A voltage reading taken soon after a charging source was sending current into the battery means even less.<br><br>&nbsp;Old Batteries will fail when you need them most, in the worst place to find replacements.<br><br>Powdered milk is awful, nor cheap. &nbsp;I did it for years. Hope to never again.

 

[James AKA Lynx]

You can do serious damage overcharging your battery. That is what the controller is for. Please get one.<br><br>James AKA Lynx

 

[Cubey]

As I said, my voltage readings were many hours after charging ceased. This morning now at 7:30am, before the sun is reaching the solar panels much yet due to a tree, it still showing 12.5v, same as it was when I went to bed almost 8 hours ago, with no draw when sleeping.<br><br>If/when the old battery fails, so be it. My van DOES have a gas hungry generator and I do have the newer battery as a fallback. I also have a good battery lantern on hand for emergencies.<br><br>Powdered milk is cheaper than buying a refrigerated pint (16oz) which tends to run $2 each. A small box of powdered milk runs about $5-6 which makes 3 quarts (32oz per qt, or 96oz total). At $2 each for pint bottles (16 oz) I'd end up with 48oz for $6. With powdered, I get 96oz for $6 and I don't have to run out and find milk daily since I only use 1 cup or less of milk a day anyway. <br><br>Buying anything over a pint would be wasteful with no refrigeration since it would go to waste. After throwing away gallons of spoiled milk from not ever using it up fast enough (when I'd buy gallon jugs and i had a big fridge!) I went to powdered and I like it fine. I can buy a box of it and use it over a 6 month period. Good luck doing that with refrigerated milk!<br><br>And anyway, powdered is cheaper since it takes no electricity to store. Think about how much money is wasted on energy transporting and storing refrigerated milk. Powdered milk is also lighter weight since it doesn't have the water (8.34 lbs per 1 gallon of water) and therefore costs less to transport in terms of fuel. It also takes up less space.

 

[Cubey]

<br>You can do serious damage overcharging your battery. That is what the controller is for. Please get one.<br>

<br><br>Uh.....<br><br>

<span id="post_message_1278628680">I do have a solar charge controller and it does it's job. </span> It stops the charging at times during the day since I see the meter go down to 12.8v when it's not getting charge current due to being fully charged.

<br><br>

 

[James AKA Lynx]

OK, I miss read. James AKA Lynx