Questions about insulating

[grandmawalker]

Thanks to blkjak &amp; BigBlue I have 2 ways to attach wood to the metal rib framing of my van. &nbsp;blkjak: #12 Phillips washer head self drilling screw - 1 1/4" long. Useing a screw gun or a drill. &nbsp;BigBlue: SPAX heavy duty construction screws. &nbsp;Now I can see which ones are avaiable in my area.<br /><br />Thanks Guys!

 

[Journeyman]

<p>No point in being overwhelmed.&nbsp; I tend to go into too much detail and over explain. <br /><br />The air pockets in insulation trap warm air and use it as a buffer to keep interior air warmer longer. That's why insulation works. Any air moving through the insulation pulls out the warm air and replaces it with cold (reduces efficiency of insulation).&nbsp; Moisture fills in the air pockets so it can't hold warm air (same reduction of efficiency - no air pockets, no insulation value). You want the insulation to stay dry, and seal everything to protect it from cold (or wet)&nbsp;air moving into the insulation.</p>The vapor barrier does both: keeps water out of the insulation (from the inside) and acts as a 'wind' barrier as well, keeping colder moving air from pulling the warm air out of the insulation.<br /><br />Anything to accomplish those goals&nbsp;- dry and wind proof air pockets&nbsp;-&nbsp;is a positive thing. Thicker insulation has more air pockets, so a higher R value. <br /><br />If the rubber seals on your vehicle doors - or windows - are bad, cold [and/or wet] air can get in your vehicle and rob the warm air.<br /><p><br />This help?<br /><br />Works for cold weather clothing layers as well.<br /><br /><br />&nbsp;</p>

<br />Also remember not to crush the insulation because this reduces the number of air pockets, thus reducing the R value.<br /><br />

 

[Willy]

&nbsp;I've found this neat carpet underlay/insulation stuff that, at about 1/8" , is claimed to have an R value equivalent to 1" of fibreglass insulation.. and it's a vapour barrier. It's made out of recycled cork and plastic and has a very nice pebbly tan finish. It's also cheaper than foam insulation per sq. ft., if their claims are true, and would make for some fantastic ceiling insulation. <br />&nbsp;The problem with Reflectix insulation is that, in order to work correctly, there has to be something like a 1/2" air gap between it and any other surface (it's in the product literature). Layering doesn't work too well with it and, personally, I'm not too fond of the shiny-metal look. That's why I'm seriously looking at that cork underlay stuff. It looks pretty sharp and 3 layers, adding up to around R9, would only only be around 1/3" and preserve my headroom. Also, it's pretty tuff stuff and can be glued up, removing the need for framing. ..Willy.&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.homedepot.ca/product/nat...or-laminate-and-engineered-wood-floors/911488 &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;

 

[BigBlue]

Bigblue,<br />your #2 item about aluminum causes an electrial current which can then cause rust was very interesting. &nbsp;Someone earilier talked about how they used several layers of bubble pack. &nbsp;What if l put one layer of bubble pack securely taped - then alayer of 3/4" reflective insulation. &nbsp;this would extend from the exterior wall to the inside edge of vans brace ribs. I will then attach 4 - 1x4" boards to attach my interior wall to. &nbsp;This should leave a small (&lt;1") air space between the 1x4's . &nbsp;Do think this is a working idea?<br /><br />I know you ststed that the spray fooam gives off toxic gasses - I was considering just filling those small areas inside the ribbed framind of the van. &nbsp;Do you think this small amount would be a problem?<br /><br />Thanks

<br /><br />i dont see why that would be a problem as long as the reflective layer of bubble wrap isn't touching the metal of the van. with the issue of the spray foam i heard most vans have vents on the floor along the side of the van for moisture venting purposes as long as those aren't being covered up and you have a window cracked to replace the air in the van occasionally. you should be safe getting away with that.

 

[CarCampire]

&nbsp;I've found this neat carpet underlay/insulation stuff that, at about 1/8" , is claimed to have an R value equivalent to 1" of fibreglass insulation.. and it's a vapour barrier. It's made out of recycled cork and plastic and has a very nice pebbly tan finish. It's also cheaper than foam insulation per sq. ft., if their claims are true, and would make for some fantastic ceiling insulation. <br />&nbsp;The problem with Reflectix insulation is that, in order to work correctly, there has to be something like a 1/2" air gap between it and any other surface (it's in the product literature). Layering doesn't work too well with it and, personally, I'm not too fond of the shiny-metal look. That's why I'm seriously looking at that cork underlay stuff. It looks pretty sharp and 3 layers, adding up to around R9, would only only be around 1/3" and preserve my headroom. Also, it's pretty tuff stuff and can be glued up, removing the need for framing. ..Willy.&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.homedepot.ca/product/nat...or-laminate-and-engineered-wood-floors/911488 &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;

<br /><br />This sounds amazing. <br />I've been looking for a good insulator - this could be it but the <strong><em>link is broken</em></strong>...<br /><br />Anyone know what this is called or where I can find more?

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

Eco Cork Foam Natural Choice Underlayment, for Laminate and Engineered Wood Floors<br />When i clicked the link, it still had the reviews.&nbsp; I clicked on 'view all of this persons reviews" and it gave me the name of the product he reviewed.

 

[CarCampire]

Thanks! <img src="/images/boards/smilies/smile.gif" /> I did the same but it just gave me the option to sign up / register for my e-mail address. - I figured I needed an account to see further.<br /><br />I wonder if i can use ONLY this product to achieve a good R value... floors, ceiling, walls, doors, the barrier behind the drivers seat and the back area...? Would be nice not to have several steps of Refletix - than styrofoam / fiberglass - than panel board...<br /><br />Gonna do some reading, any extra info on this stuff would be greatly appreciated!<br /><br />

 

[Willy]

&nbsp;If you check out the posts I've authored, there's one where I just put in my sub-ceiling using Ayr-Foil (basically Reflectix, considerably cheaper), 1x2"'s, and Coroplast. Looks sharp, easy to clean, and has a pretty high R-value.

 

[CarCampire]

&nbsp;If you check out the posts I've authored, there's one where I just put in my sub-ceiling using Ayr-Foil (basically Reflectix, considerably cheaper), 1x2"'s, and Coroplast. Looks sharp, easy to clean, and has a pretty high R-value.

<br /><br />https://vanlivingforum.com/post/Time-to-insulate..-CEILING!!-6079334<br /><br />Just saw that! Good stuff - my only concern is the moisture that may accumulate behind the Chloroplast. <br />Im defiantly converting a stealth cargo van and it gets very cold by me - not to mention I LOVE overheating my surroundings so I worry.<br /><br />Im looking for something that breaths and doesn't break down into toxic gasses when undergoing drastic temperature changes on a daily basis. Otherwise I would just shove the pink Styrofoam all around me and use 'great stuff' to seal in all the holes.<br /><br />Any 'eco friendly' - moisture resistant suggestions?

 

[Willy]

&nbsp;Just run a bead of silicone under the edges of the Coroplast and the only moisture getting behind it will be from holes in your exterior wall. It's a vapour barrier so, by it's very nature, moisture can't get through it.<br />&nbsp;On a somewhat related subject, right now it's a couple of degrees above freezing here and (visiting ATM) I have an electric heater plugged in and keeping my camper nice and warm. It's set on 'lo', maybe 900-1000W, and kicks on a coupla times an hour for 5-10 minutes.. not bad, eh?&nbsp;

 

[CarCampire]

Not bad, not bad at all! :3<br /><br />So what Im thinking for a standard cargo van insulation plan is; <br />From inner bare van walls to interior wall (paintable):<br /><br /><span style="color: #339966;">Ceiling:</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">Ayr-Foil -&gt; pink Styrofoam</span> glued to the back of<span style="color: #ff0000;">-&gt;</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">Choroplast</span> so theres a gap inbetween the Ayr-Foil and the Styrofoam.<br /><br /><span style="color: #339966;">Walls:</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">Same as above</span><br /><br /><span style="color: #339966;">Floor:</span> <span style="color: #ff0000;">Ayr-Foil -&gt; 3x 1/8" Eco Cork Foam</span> glued to <span style="color: #ff0000;">Coroplast</span> panels so theirs a gap under it.<br /><br /><em><strong>Can I step on coroplast?</strong></em> Is it strong enough to hold a 119LB girl and her furniture - clothing - ect...?<br /><br />Any constructive criticism would be greatly appreciated. I still have yet to figure out what size framing will be most efficient (AKA less space used - lighter framing for weight (mpg) - and overall easy to screw/drill into with ease/secures well).<br /><br />Another thing I would appreciate knowing is what sizes of 'choosen framing wood' I can get at a Lowes or home depo as I lack a table saw... im good with a saws-aw though. <img src="/images/boards/smilies/tongue.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"> Not many females can say that.<br /><br /><span style="color: #ff6600;">[Insert cocky thumbs up here]</span>

 

[Willy]

&nbsp;If you can find it where you're living, try to get that 3/4" polystyrene (white styrofoam) insulation with the reflective aluminum layer bonded to it. The other side has a thin plastic skin. It's Way cheaper than Reflectix style insulation (abt $8 for a 4x8' sheet) and it's also a radiant barrier. You can also use it instead of the pink rigid polyurethane sheets. Depending on how thick you want the walls/ceiling, you could even add a second layer or some other insulation.&nbsp;<br />&nbsp;Leave about a 1/2" gap between the styrofoam insulation and the Coroplast. The Coroplast is great stuff cuz it comes in different colours (I chose white to brighten things up and reflect a bit of heat), is waterproof (vapour barrier), has a bit of an R-value, and is easy to work with. It's also cheap (white is the cheapest at under $10 for a 4x8' sheet) and comparatively even cheaper since it doesn't need to be painted. <br />&nbsp;For the floor, just slap down some of that reflective white polystyrene and throw some 1/4" plywood on top of it.. Coroplast isn't strong enuf.<br />&nbsp;For framing, use some cheap 'n straight 1x2 's or, if you can find it, 1x1 's. Get one of those countersinking bits and pre-drill the screw holes in the wood. That way you won't split it and the crew heads will sit flush.

 

[CarCampire]

If you can find it where you're living, try to get that 3/4" polystyrene (white styrofoam) insulation with the reflective aluminum layer bonded to it. The other side has a thin plastic skin. It's Way cheaper than Reflectix style insulation (abt $8 for a 4x8' sheet) and it's also a radiant barrier.

<br />Awesome! Thank you. - Just one question; the side with the plastic skin - im assuming that side is the side that faces the coroplast?<br /><br />

You can also use it instead of the pink rigid polyurethane sheets. Depending on how thick you want the walls/ceiling, you could even add a second layer or some other insulation.

<br />Any particular reason you favor this over the pink stuff? - Easier to work with? Higher R value?<br /><br />I also hear from other threads - styrofoam rubs the interior of the van's metal walls while in motion and makes a screaching sound - thats why I was thinking of placing the refletix against the walls 1st and then the styrofoam - can you confirm this?<br /><br />

Leave about a 1/2" gap between the styrofoam insulation and the Coroplast. The Coroplast is great stuff cuz it comes in different colours (I chose white to brighten things up and reflect a bit of heat), is waterproof (vapour barrier), has a bit of an R-value, and is easy to work with. It's also cheap (white is the cheapest at under $10 for a 4x8' sheet) and comparatively even cheaper since it doesn't need to be painted.

<br /><br />Where do you get your coroplast - Lowes? Home depot? I see theres a few places to order it online too...?<br /><br />Also; I hear Kyrlon spray paint will bond to coroplast if I want to re-paint it. Know anything about this? - Im greatful for the 'white color' suggestion - I know that must help brighten the space and reflect the light / heat <img src="/images/boards/smilies/smile.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"><br /><br />

For the floor, just slap down some of that reflective white polystyrene and throw some 1/4" plywood on top of it.. Coroplast isn't strong enuf.

<br /><br />I know heat rises but there doesn't need to be any gap inbetween the reflectix and the polystyrene?<br /><br />

For framing, use some cheap 'n straight 1x2 's or, if you can find it, 1x1 's. Get one of those countersinking bits and pre-drill the screw holes in the wood. That way you won't split it and the crew heads will sit flush.

<br /><br />Thank you! I would have so split the wood and then realized lol.<br /><br />P.S - Shortly after I posted this I started looking up coroplast and I see it doesn't look sturdy enough to stand on. Hehe... I still like the eco- cork foam product for the floor though. It looks to be cheeper.<br />I also see some insulate with three area rugs on top of eachother... im always open to suggestions.<img src="/images/boards/smilies/smile.gif" /><br />[Shrugs]<br /><br /><br />

 

[Willy]

&nbsp;The reflective side is the one you want with the air-space. If you want to keep it cooler inside, have the reflective layer facing the ouside, with abt. a 1/2" air space. If you want to keep the interior warmer, have the reflective layer on the inside with that same 1/2" gap between it and the Coroplast.&nbsp;<br /><br />&nbsp;I prefer it over the pink/blue stuff for 2 reasons.. WAYYYYYYY cheaper with only slightly less R-value AND it acts as a radiant barrier which, conceivably, could give it a HIGHER effective R-value.<br /><br />&nbsp;I've never had a problem with styrofoam 'screeching', but then I always have a tight fit. Use spray-in foam around the edges if you're worried. I get my stuff at Home Depot or Rona and not online.<br /><br />&nbsp;I wouldn't worry about a gap between the polystyrene and the wood on the floor. The effective R-value is considerably higher when insulation is on the floor and it saves on weight/wood, since there needn't be any special bracing or thicker wood.<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;