Question on order of conversion

[Tuesdayafterlunch]

Greetings! I've been reading the forums for a while and have a question about the order of cargo trailer renovations (and that question leads to a bunch more). If you're starting from the ground up, what's the order you do these things?

1. Install windows
2. Insulate
3. Install wiring from solar to batteries and from batteries to outlets

I've seen pictures of people's conversions where it looks like they've cut a hole through the wall and insulation in order to put in a window, but is that the best way if you have a choice? And is it better to put the wiring behind the insulation or on top of it? How do you protect/shield the wiring, or do people tend to let it hang loosely on top of the walls?

I've got ZERO experience with this stuff, as you might have guessed, but I keep on reading trying to educate myself. Any insight will be greatly appreciated! :heart:

Cheers,
KD

 

[akrvbob]

Tuesday after lunch I can tell you a bit about how I did mine. Winter was coming and I was in a hurry to get in it so that changed some of my decisions.

1) Installed vents. There is no good reason why I did that first except it did keep the trailer cooler while I worked on it. Also, I stained my floor and I'm sure that helped it air out.
2) Deal with the floor. You probably have plywood floors and you want to cover it with something or it will get really beat up over time. I just bought a quality floor stain that is intended for floors so it is really tough. And then I put down area rugs in the traffic areas. It took a very long time to air out!! Seems like it was 3 weeks.
3) I did the insulation next because i did not have my windows yet. In retrospect, I should have put the windows in first, But it isn't critical. The best place I've found for windows is ebay. Many, many great choices. You don't want to cut any ribs so get a tall thin window to fit between them. Mine are 18 x 36 and fit perfectly between my 24 " ribs.
4) Built the interior. Again, I wanted in fast and this was the fastest route.
5) Moved the solar. My solar was on my camper so it couldn't move until I moved into the trailer. But I much prefer the wiring on the outside of the insulation for these reasons: 1) Heat is the greatest danger for wiring, heat=fire. It makes no sense to me to have the wire behind insulation if I can avoid it. 2) If I make a mistake, I want to find it easily without tearing up the walls. 3) The only reason to hide it is for looks and you can run the wiring through many different kinds of tubes for looks
5) Installed windows. The only reason I did them last was because I needed to beat winter and they were the lowest priority. I could put them in anytime. It would have been easier and better to do it first.

Here is a post I did on my build:
http://www.cheaprvliving.com/living-converted-cargo-trailer/

I see that actually I insulated first but in the post I say I should have done the floor first. On the day I bought the trailer, I stopped by Home Depot and bought everything I needed. Because I built the trailer in my campsite in the Sierra National Forest (I was a campground host) I was worried about the wind and weather damaging the styrofoam or somebody stealing it. That's why I did the insulation first to get it out of harms way.

Also I strongly encourage you to buy Polyiso instead of styrofoam, much better! It's very similar to styrofoam, but better R value and actually a little easier to work with--it's tougher

Hope that helps!
Bob

 

[Reducto]

Definitely windows and any other structural changes first. Next would be insulation, then build in the bed and such, then wiring. I saw wiring last because you're going to want it to be accessible when you're done - if you do it first it may wind up behind structures that are difficult to remove. If you do it last you can find ways to run them under a strip of removable insulation or somesuch.

You'll want protection for the wires anywhere it goes through a hole in sheet metal or anywhere it's going to get hit with something. For the most part mine is just tacked up to the under side of shelves where it's unlikely to be hit.

 

[highdesertranger]

a lot of it depends. on what you are installing. I am assuming you have no interior walls. do the structural changes first then insulation then interior walls. like reducto said keep the electrical accessable, plumbing and propane too. this will relieve headaches in the future. the most important thing in my opinion is to have a detailed plan. list what you want and draw up a diagram of where you want it. then proceed accordingly. highdesertranger

 

[Tuesdayafterlunch]

Thank you all, it's getting clearer with every new bit of information.

Back to the planning board and the research.

Cheers,
KD

 

[oldman]

Good info. I'll be doing the same next spring and am using Bob's as a guide. From the windows to the rack on top for solar panels. Will build my own rack with another support in the center, my trailer is 6x12, but the base for panels and providing shade for the roof is a great idea.

 

[Belchfire]

Thanks
Great tips

I wonder what a solar rack would look like?
Anyone have pictures ?

 

[Almost There]

While we're talking about order of builds, I have a question for y'all that have added awnings.

Do they bolt right through the fiberglass tops?

As in should I plan for easy access for installation.

It's most likely that they are going to be added later on as opposed to before I start the interior and if I need to I can plan for inside access for the installation crew.

 

[highdesertranger]

you are correct to get this figured out before hand. first be sure your fiberglass top can handle an awning. what type of construction is it? single wall, double wall sandwich. if double what material is core? imho, especially in windy conditions the only good way to mount a tarp is bolt through the vehicle. if you believe your top can handle the clamping force and the wind load then go ahead. if not some type of reinforcing must be done. without seeing your top I really can't recommend anything. maybe you could give us a little more information on the type of construction. highdesertranger

 

[Almost There]

you are correct to get this figured out before hand. first be sure your fiberglass top can handle an awning. what type of construction is it? single wall, double wall sandwich. if double what material is core? imho, especially in windy conditions the only good way to mount a tarp is bolt through the vehicle. if you believe your top can handle the clamping force and the wind load then go ahead. if not some type of reinforcing must be done. without seeing your top I really can't recommend anything. maybe you could give us a little more information on the type of construction. highdesertranger

Darned if I know what kind it is. Maybe someone can help identify it.

The previous owner had it done locally here in Ontario 12 years ago when the van was brand new. All the pics on the internet of fiberglass tops show the more recent models. My first job this spring will be to gut it entirely.

The whole inside of the van, including the complete interior of the fiberglass top, is covered in what his daughter termed 'rustic' - my words for it aren't nearly so nice...

If it's not strong enough on it's own I will be looking to reinforce it until it is.

 

[highdesertranger]

well I can't tell by the pic. you are going to have to figure it out. does it have a roof vent? if it does pull the inner trim ring(4screws) you should be able to see the type of construction. if it doesn't you have to pull one of the side windows to see. hint pull one lower screw out of the side window you should be able to judge the thickness by the length of the screw. that should tell you if it's single wall or double and how thick if it's single. do this and post the findings and we will go from there. highdesertranger

 

[Almost There]

well I can't tell by the pic. you are going to have to figure it out. does it have a roof vent? if it does pull the inner trim ring(4screws) you should be able to see the type of construction. if it doesn't you have to pull one of the side windows to see. hint pull one lower screw out of the side window you should be able to judge the thickness by the length of the screw. that should tell you if it's single wall or double and how thick if it's single. do this and post the findings and we will go from there. highdesertranger

No roof vent - it's on the shopping list!

The next warm day (that's anything above freezing at 3 PM ) ...
I'll get out there and pull enough of the wood trim off to get at one of the window screws.

 

[sassypickins]

Does that window in the hi-top open? If so, stick one hand out the window and touch the outside wall and put your other hand 'over' that hand. You should be able to tell by feel if you have a single-wall or a double-wall hi-top. I can tell by knocking on mine where the wood cross frames are, too, and if it's double, it's very likely insulated, a nice benny.

 

[masterplumber]

Order of work on my trailer: first cut in windows and roof vent, second insulation, third paneled and built front lower cabinet in v nose - this is where the electrical equipment is housed so I needed to do this part before I could run electrical, forth ran electric - I ran up the front v nose and then along each side at the curve between the wall and roof with blue flexible conduit (smurf tube), this way I can add electric in the future without having to totally dismantle parts of the trailer, I also ran conduit to a roof mounted junction box for future solar. Fifth I finished paneling the walls and ceilings. Then sixth I finally built my folding bunks - the first few trips we slept on cots. Currently I'm working my way through plumbing, overhead cabinets, trim, and all those other little bits that make it our own and a home. I actually planned a lot ahead of time, had a good idea of what I wanted, and still changed things add I went along. Just make sure you double check you have everything done you want before covering up any area that will be difficult to uncover in the future.

 

[Belchfire]

Hi Master Plumber

Can you tell me

How long it took you to do all this?

Do you have any pictures of your van?

Thanks

 

[highdesertranger]

if it's double wall you must ascertain what the core is made of. the cardboard cored ones cannot take a large clamping force. like sassy says if the window opens you can judge the thickness. will the side flex if you put pressure on it with your hand? lets us know what you figure out and we can go from there. highdesertranger

 

[masterplumber]

Belchfire, I've worked on it in spurts, partly as money allows, and partly as time allows. I don't know how many actual hours I have in it as sometimes I go out to work on it, and start daydreaming about hitting the road instead. I would guess that it approaches 100 hours or so.

 

[Belchfire]

Masterplumber
Any pics?

 

[masterplumber]

I haven't taken many since it's been mostly done, but I will. Right now I leave in the dark and come home in the dark Still trying to decide if I can afford to go to RTR - If I do maybe I can convince Bob to use his mad photo skills on it. As far as during the build, I took some, but lost a bunch in a computer incident. I have to search my memory cards and hopefully I can recover some.