Over my head.. Solar, batteries etc

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VintageVan

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This is a diagam of of my current wiring from the 2 front batteries under the hood back into the cab of my van. 


The problem is many. The blue finned isolator, solenoid and master switch are currently under the drivers seat. It all has to be moved because I'm installing swiveling seats. Not that big of a deal but we also want to add 2 more 6v batteries into the mix. Plus we have 200w solar to hook up and i am unsure we can to this setup?
 
We also have 2-100w windy nation solar panels. The charge control they came with. 2- 6v deep cycle batteries. 





And also the ambulance came with a heavy duty 200a alternator



So any advice that will not burn down our future van would be helpful. I do not know if I can hook up the 6v batteries to the 2 12v batteries under the hood setup or should I hook the 6v batteries just to solar power?
 
I would keep the systems separate.  You can pull power from the alternator, through a switched solenoid.  Then have a separate dedicated house bank.  

Fuse everything.
 
Trebor English said:
Does the switch ever have no battery connected to the alternator?

Not sure I understand what you mean.  The switch if wired properly, would only have power when motor is running.  That way it can not either drain the starting battery, or boil the house batteries.
 
While the engine is running can the switch disconnect both batteries? Alternators can produce high voltages with no battery connected. If the switch is changed from battery one to battery two is there an in between state where there is no battery connected? The picture shows a slightly out of focus "BOTH" with 1 to the left and 2 to the right. My question boils down to is there an "OFF" setting opposite the both?
 
OK, you are talking about the current system.  I have never seen a switch with that option.  

Tis is one for the OP.  Vintage Van
 
very important, the manual switch CAN NOT ever disconnect the batteries from the alternator. some manual switches do, some don't. if you have one that does disconnect the batteries from the alternator, the alt will sense no volts and spike the output at more than max and blow all your sensitive electronics. this would be the same as disconnecting your battery with the engine running, a big no no nowadays. make sure you have the right switch. if you have one that does disconnect, only switch it with the engine off. I can not stress this enough. also I would not run the main starter cable through the switch, to many problem areas that way. keep the main cable in the stock location, you could upgrade the main cable though. highdesertranger
 
Some of the better models from Blue Sea Marine come with terminals for Alternator Field Disconnect to protect against that.
 
My apologies on the pics. I'll get better ones. 
The switch does have 4 settings. 
1 , both, 2 , and both off strait down.

I have been mulling this over today and have decided to try and mount both 6v batteries under the hood on the drivers side. I think they will fit if i lower them and make a new mount. 
Both of the 12v up front are about dead. Instead of replacing both i will put the house batts up front and just replace the starter battery. I want to hook up the starter battery to stay on all the time and just have a switch for the house batteries. 
If i can't mount them both then I will have to mount them under the van on a rail or sunk in the floor bebind the drivers seat. 
This is turning into a big project and need to get it done quickly. May or june will be our US tour.
 
Is this a hard to start diesel that needs two batteries?

Under the hood is a good place for batteries.  Heat is a problem.  If you have space to put a heat shield with an outside air supply to keep the batteries cool it would be great.  Keeping the batteries under the hood makes the alternator charging connection much shorter, much more effective.  

The blue finned thing is probably a diode isolator that gives away a half volt.  Getting that out is a good idea.
 
Trebor English said:
The blue finned thing is probably a diode isolator that gives away a half volt.  Getting that out is a good idea.

That's what it is - I recognize it from 30/40 years ago. That's what we used - an isolator!

The OP isn't 'Vintage Van' for no good reason.... :D
 
No its a 76 chevy g30 ambulance we got from auction with only 8000 original miles from a small town over in Oregon.
 
So I can get rid of the blue isolator?
If i do that will it all still work and if so how do I bypass it?

Sorry but this is my first van build that will have power and solar. We know what we want but not sure how to do it. Internet searches only give me 100 or more ways of doing it including burning it to the ground.
 
Replace the isolator with a continuous duty relay with a switch to activate it.
Big wires from the batteries to the relay/solenoid and not so big from the switch.

Those 2-6volt batts are going to be heavy.(about 120#or so)
Size wise they're about a group 27 but a couple inches taller.

You got a nice old van there....love the spotlights
 
The Isolators are diode based, and the diode reduces voltage by ~0.4 to 0.7v, which slows charging of house batteries significantly basically ensuring a premature demise when van dwelling.

Some of these isolators have some wiring to influence the voltage regulator, tricking the alternator to produce more to overcome the loss of the Diode.

The heatsinks are required to cool the Diodes, and are basically wasting energy as heat, turning engine HP into heat.

The Continuous Duty Solenoid is a much better option, but like brake pads they wear out, and do so faster the harder they are used.  Harder meaning passing more amps and the more cycles it goes through and the higher amps it is passing when contacts close or open.

The  CD solenoid is a HeavyDuty relay and sometimes is also called a contactor, but the word 'contactor' is generally used more in AC wiring than DC.

The BEst CD relays/solenoids have silver alloy plated contacts. The two smaller studs for wires are the triggers to close the contacts.  Ideally, these trigger wires would close only after the engine is running.  Less ideal is any ignition circuit which goes live when the key is turned to ON.  One does not want house batteries contributing to starting current. this will wear the solenoid contacts faster, and possibly damage sensitive electronics hooked to house battery as the starter can cause a voltage spike when disengaged.

One can also put an illuminated switch on the solenoid trigger circuit and manually control when the alternator feeds the house batteries.  This circuit can be live only with ignition or live anytime, depending on where one takes power for the trigger circuit.

I recommend one place 2 digital voltmeters on their dashboard, One for the engine battery, one for the house battery.

These voltmeters should be 3 wire voltmeters, with the third wire being a voltage sense wire and hooked directly to (+) terminal of engine or house battery.

When the Solenoid fails, usually the contacts fuse together, leaving the driver unaware that they are not isolating their engine battery with engine off, and cycling,( and damaging) the engine starting battery.  If the two voltmeters always read very nearly the same one will know their solenoid has failed.  When the house batteries are depleted the two voltmeters will be very different until the house batteries get into the 80% charged range.  Much depends on the thickness of the wiring used.

These voltmeters are what i use, and can ( and should be) calibrated with a real digital multimeter once installed:
https://www.amazon.com/bayite-wires...d=1480454857&sr=8-1&keywords=3+wire+voltmeter

Another product which I like and use is this ammeter. One only needs to slide a wire through the round sensor to measure amperage.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01DDQM6Z4/ref=s9_dcacsd_bhz_bw_c_x_3_w

https://vanlivingforum.com/Thread-17-Hall-effect-ammeter

6v golf cart batteries have nearly the same footprint as group24 12v marine batteries, but a few inches taller, and are indeed deep cycle batteries, not a compromised marine battery.
Here is a group 24 side by side with a real deep cycle battery the gc-2 6v golf cart battery:
158768542.sHPqOeL1.jpg


source and a good read:
http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/deep_cycle_battery
 
I built 2 boxes out of plywood to mock up the tray for under the hood but the batteries are too tall to even get one in. I'm going to have to move them under the van on a rail or sink them into the floor. I really dont want them inside. To big, to bulky so im going to need to figure that out.
 

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