My project this week

[SternWake]

No love on the 6awg dies and the harbor fright provided dies. As it was late and as I did not want to disturb those neighbors on the other side of fence, i did not use powertools, but only hand files, and came up well short of earless crimps on the 6awg lugs.

But , while no perfect crimp, I also feel is is well overkill for the intended duty.

I've walked a couple neophytes, who know nothing about DC power through the abilities of the powerpack, as i am designing it, and it is blowing a few minds, and doing so without any 'Lithium' in the battery chemistry.
A couple musicians who are friends of mine are willing to subject their Vibrolux Tube amps to the PSW inverter. I might have to get video of a bassist and a lead guitar playing at full volume at the oceans's edge to get the point across.

My friend who entrusted me with his 50K+$ truck, and his credit card numbers, to purchase the building blocks of this powerpack, have really honored me with this opportunity to build something so electrically kick ass, and I

I am expending a lot of extra effort into making this powerpack not only extremely capable, but a woodworking piece of artwork.

I am feeling a bit possessive about the actual layout of the guts. I'd rather determine such a project has no marketable value, before giving away the internal design. With a close to 1200$ price tag, just in materials, no labor included, perhaps there is no point in possessiveness, but at the same point, anybody wanting just as capable a portable DC system, is also going to have to spend the same in materials anyway. With me assembling them, how much is the elimination of that guess work worth?

Nothing about the products contained within is supremely secretive, but laying them all out to not only look impressive, but function impressively, matched together, is not something am just going to forward to the masses.
I've given enough details already.

What is it worth to have an extremely capable 12v lead acid powerpack designed to fit into the footwell of a passenger seat.

So many of the questions on this electrical subforum are about how to set something like this up.

What is is worth to have it already set up, and delivered, just add this cable to have it charge Via alternator??

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

Im not sure the answer, but people will pay for quality and convenience, so it seem like there may be a market for it. I think your hurdle is convincing someone why it is better than say, the little yeti power packs etc without making their eyes glaze over

 

[SternWake]

Here is the finished PowerPack, in place in the Ram Powerwagon's back seat footwell behind the driver's seat:

The Lifeline GPL-31XT battery's performance was very impressive, exceeding my expectations during discharge, and accepting huge recharge currents from the alternator over the 2awg cabling.

When depleted to 50%, it took well over 100 amps initially from the alternator, and alternator temperature rose to 220F quickly, when oil and coolant temps were still sub 155F.  At 220F maximum output fell to 86 amps and the Lifeline was still happily drinking all it could, the limiting factor was the alternator. The 2 awg cabling and winch connector stayed cool.

The large red (should have gotten the black one)  Manual BlueSeas ON/OFF Switch only switches the 2 awg or 6awg connectors to the alternator or Jumper cables.  ON to charge while driving, OFF to separate engine battery from powerpack loads with engine off.  This switch is easily reached from drivers seat. 
The Drok Ammeter voltmeter combo displays only charging amperage, and its accuracy at low currents not very impressive.  It is switched separately via a small rocker switch above it.

The Charge wizard pendant for the PD9245 charger/converter is the lower right corner of the upper face plate.  One can override the automatic stages with it, and force it to seek 14.4v, 13.6v or 13.2 volts when desired.  It is also possible to run the PD9245 current through the watt meter, if one really desires to count Watt hours or Amp hours into the battery.

There is a plug on the back into which one can easily plug in a household 120vAC extension cord and charge the battery upto the 45 amp maximum rate.

There is a 2awg winch connector rated at 500 amps and a 6awg connector on the back too.


T Nuts are used inside the plywood casing and bolts go through the Teak and plywood for the steel hold down straps. Stainless Steel turnbuckles hold the unit in place. These are attached to the seat mounts.  If the vehicle rolls the unit will stay put and not crush the occupants.  There are 4 hold downs, one on each side.  All but the removable  2 piece face plate is both glued and screwed together.  Several coats of polyurethane protect the teak, White and red oak, Maple and the Ecuadorian manufactured plywood, which was much softer than desirable.  I will never use Varathane polyurethane again.  So slow and hard to spread evenly.  I had the various hardwoods laying around from other projects, and stained the Oak and maple to better match the Teak.  I bought the red oak for the trim but the other hardwoods were used as they were available in my workshop, and more desirable than doubling up the 1/2 inch plywood to increase the strength.

The battery has 5/16" White Oak spacers around all six sides, and there is ventilation holes on the 4 vertical sides,at  top and bottom.  This low resistance AGM battery should not heat up all that much when charging, but it will to some degree.

The 'precision' Wattmeter with the Blue face as shown, only measures discharging current of the loads. It can be removed or plugged inline on any single device.  Unplugging it removes all loads from the  battery unless the 45amp Anderson  Powerpoles are re mated together without the wattmeter inline.

All  8, 10, and 12awg  connections are both Crimped AND soldered, and covered with adhesive lined heatshrink tubing. They are also assembled with Caig Deoxit Shield to prevent oxidation and enhance conductivity. The 2awg  tinned copper boat cable, I hydraulically crimped with my HF Crimper whose Dies I ground out to fit 2awg thick walled lugs to properly crimp without making 'ears'.

The Lid is hinged and all 6 ATC blade fuses and the Single 120 amp ANL fuse, are easily accessible.
The center round plug  of the 3 is a 2 port 5v USB power supply capable of supplying 2.1 amps.

There are two 45 amp Anderson powerpole connectors on 10awg, one of which will power the ARB fridge, and one of which will be the future portable solar panel input.  I did cut the 16awg 12v ARB cord in half and installed 45 amp powerpoles, as I thoroughly despise Ciggy plug connectors for their lossy inefficient  intermittent nature.  I did include two Ciggy receptacles on the powerpack, as they are a ubiquitous connector.  They are Blueseas Brand, wired with very short lengths of 10awg, and the fuse block itself is fed with only a few inches of 8awg.

Getting all these wires to fit within the upper compartment and appear somewhat organized, was one of the biggest challenges and there is unconventional wire joinery/splicing involved.

I used some high quality black bungee cord just to hold exterior wiring in place and act as strain relief for any cords plugged into the inverter or powerports.  Kind of halfassed but convenient and functional, if Kind of ugly.

The 400 watt pure sine wave inverter supported a 530 watt load for over 2 minutes before I ended the test.

I never got to test my friend's Vibralux tube amp on the inverter, but was using it to run my unloaded 5.5 amp angle grinder  or 6.5amp  Jigsaw, and a full size 20" box fan at high speed( 7.8 amps DC ) at  the same time.

If that Powerpack had 200 watts of MPPT solar  with a true battery monitor connected to it, it would be more capable than my Van's electrical system.

I'll be wiring up his two other vehicles with 6awg and mating connectors to utilize their alternators to recharge while underway, at some point in the near future.

I spliced this same connector into his jumper cables so He can use them normally , or just plug it into the powerpack and have the worlds best Jumperpack.  But at ~100 lbs, 'portable' is not a good adjective.

His jumpercables are not very impressive with 8awg wire, but when I brought up the possibility of making a set of 2awg jumper cables of any length he desired for use with the 500 amp winch connector, he started salivating.

His ARB fridge consumption averaged about 15 AH per 24 hours as I used it, so with total 125AH capacity available, and a multitude of charging sources available too. There is basically no danger of spoiled food, and no stinky cooler water to ever deal with again.

He and his daughter were quite excited with it, and I was honored to make it for them.

 

[Lafnbug]

Well, you just completely upended my electrical plans....

I may talk to you about version #2 at some point in the future. I love it.

 

[highdesertranger]

holy smokes bat man that is impressive. highdesertranger

 

[SternWake]

holy smokes bat man that is impressive.   highdesertranger

Thanks.  It was a fun build using those top quality components, even if a bit frustrating designing things to fit, and trying to curb my tendency to go well overboard.

I was thinking about a lesser more basic simple painted plywood model built around a cheaper flooded battery, MSW inverter, and lesser charger, with an incorporated venting tube.  Make it so it is lightweight enough to ship economically, and easy enough for the end user to acquire their own flooded group 24/27/31 battery and easily install it, and replace the battery once its cycle life is used up.

 

[akrvbob]

You could probably sell a bunch of them here!!

I'd advertise them on the website for you!
Bob

 

[SternWake]

Cool, I'll look into a more basic needs model as I am sure the 1300$ spent just on the parts/components for the original prototype would not appeal to most here. I'm not sure on the added labor costs until I build another replica.

A couple research questions.

How much inverter do most people want? Inverters are physically large and can greatly increase the size of the pack. The 400 watt PSW Inverter I used is physically small and was chosen for that reason, but it is a 125$ inverter. A group 31 battery cannot really support much more than 400 watts, not for very long anyway. At 10.5v that is 38 amps, at 12.2v that is 32.8 amps. I chose 400 watts not only for that reason but that 40 amps is all I want to pass though a modified wattmeter and 45 amps is the limit of the powerpoles unless I step up to a less convenient size.

Would most people want the incorporated plug in automatic charging source? The PD9245 is a bit overkill for a single flooded battery of 130Ah or less and is close to 200$. But its size is also agreeable.

How do people feel about a 1 stage charger on a timer instead? I could use a 36 amp Megawatt set for 14.XX volts, on a spring wound 4 hour timer for about 85$. I could add a finger twist 10 turn voltage adjusting potentiometer for another 25$ and then one could boost the battery to 15.5v when it is need of a EQ charge. The Megawatt is a 36 amp power supply whose voltage is adjustable via a tiny screw that requires a very fine touch and a jewelers screwdriver

How important are the amp meters to most? The watt meter has limitations and must be modified before it can handle 40 amps continuous without overheating.

The wiring of the unit to the alternator or engine battery is not something everybody would want to take on themselves. Most who could do it themselves, would not need me to build them the powerpack in the first place.

Is asking them to purchase this product separately and goto an automotive electrician or similar for wiring it up a deal breaker?

I'm not sure this can be made to work profitably for me, well, as or more profitably than my usual income source.

http://www.amazon.com/Keeper-KTA141...sim_263_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=147ND97WNXYBJX94R5M6

 

[Matlock]

To your point around who would purchase Vs DIY.
I would think the market is at least in two categories.
 
Those that cannot do it themselves.
Those that would rather pay someone to do it.

Personally I believe the hardest part is getting folks to understand the responsibilities and limits of a system.
And it's worth mentioning, I would try to avoid adding any user adjustable... anything. To me it's just a phone call waiting to happen.

That said, you could start with 4 options, (Battery not included);
1. Alternator charge package. (Check options)

    A) __ With user supplied AGM, w/130AH, $0.00  
    B) __ With user supplied GC pair, 200AH, $0.00
    C) Bells & Whistles...
          1A. __1 stage charger, $0.00
          2B. __3 stage charger, $0.00
          3C. __Timer, $0.00
          4D. __ Inverter size, Etc..

2. 120Vac and Alternator package.
     A) __ With user supplied AGM, w/130AH, $0.00  
     Etc...

3.120Vac and solar package.
     Etc...

3. 120Vac, Alternator and solar package.
     Etc...


Just my 2¢

 

[SternWake]

Thanks for the input Matlock.

I think perhaps the whole Idea would become a nightmare handholding people through the process of installing their own battery into it, and then having to explain to them that lead acid batteries cannot be drained to 10.5 volts or less dozens of times and still function.

I really do not have the temperament or patience to deal with the average modern consumer. There seems to be this assumption that the consumer can do no wrong, and the something for nothing crowd revels in their indignation when they can't get something for nothing when they themselves are the cause of failure.

If the inverter or charger fails, it would likely turn into a nightmare.

There is simply too much room for user error.
I'm not going to consider this any further.