minimalist refrigeration system for medicines

[Qxxx]

There are some people who are contemplating getting into van life, and have minimal resources, but need to keep some medicines refrigerated. So I am wondering what would be the most minimal way to set up some kind of refrigeration system.

a. one can use a cooler and replenish ice every couple of days, but that's best a temporary solution.

b. one can put in a solar system and refrigerator, but this has several downsides for a person with minimal resources and who needs to buy a van to start with, and who possibly has limited technical knowledge to boot. 

100-200W of solar will cost roughly $300-600, and a high performance frig will cost another $400-800. Plus there is the problem of mechanically installing solar panels, and wiring the system, which can be a problem for someone with limited technical knowledge.

c. so I am wondering whether there is a way to do at least minimal refrigeration using something like the Jackery power systems which are fairly popular and would be easy to use, but have only minimal energy reserves, on the order of 20-40 AH batteries.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07D29QNMJ
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07SM5HBK1

Any ideas?

 

[Elbear1]

The smallest 12v fridge you can find plugged into cig port and run the engine 3 hrs a day.

A 50-100ah lithium battery, a 1200w-2000w generator, and 20-50A converter charger.

Solar doesnt cost $600 anymore. Used panels go for $50 per 250w and controllers can be had for under $150-200.

If you try to use cheap flooded lead acid batteries be prepared for huge solar arrays and a generator with large charger or buy a new set every 1-3 years. Cheaper to just go with a lifepo4 upfront. Look for used ones.

With 100ah lifepo4, a $100 inverter, and a single $125 panel you can run a $50 dorm fridge.

Again lithium batteries may seem expensive but theyre actually cheaper than standard batteries when you understand what it takes to keep them charged properly....even when solar is $.10 a watt.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

 . . . 
If you try to use cheap flooded lead acid batteries be prepared for huge solar arrays and a generator with large charger or buy a new set every 1-3 years. Cheaper to just go with a lifepo4 upfront. Look for used ones.
 . . .
Again lithium batteries may seem expensive but theyre actually cheaper than standard batteries when you understand what it takes to keep them charged properly....even when solar is $.10 a watt.

?????

I have two GC2s, 208AH ($186) still going strong after 6 years of use.
Charged by two 100W Renogy panels; keeps batteries above 80% most of the time.
A 1000W inverter/generator and 35W three stage charger for bad weather.

This runs a 2 cu. ft. refrigerator, cell booster, LED lights, MaxxFan and charges phone, laptop, satellite communicator, GPS and other miscellaneous stuff.

LiFePO4 has a lot of advantages over LA but cost is not one of them (even when you build your own).

 

[highdesertranger]

yeah my marine Lead Acid(LA) batteries will get replaced this year with golf cart batteries. in 2 months my batteries will be 7 years old, they cost under 200 bucks for both. I have run them all this time off of 180 watts of solar that I bought back when solar was way expensive.

with Lead Acid it all depends on how you treat your batteries, if you abuse them they will not last very long.

highdesertranger

 

[Qxxx]

It seems everyone so far is using the "usual" solar arrangement which entails: solar panel, solar charger, batteries, possibly 120VAC inverters, non-trivial mechanical installations and professional wiring.

Is item "c." from my original post even possible?

 

[rokguy]

Yep, agree on the Lead acid batteries.
Been using them for years in various forms of living off grid. Old truck/motorhome had 12 years on a bank of 4, 150amph 11 platers.
Its all in how you treat and maintain them.

Jackery.......Item C.  I had to google as I never heard that term used down here. Like AC,  refrigeration requires quite a few amps  (hard start) to initially cycle.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

It seems everyone so far is using the "usual" solar arrangement which entails: solar panel, solar charger, batteries, possibly 120VAC inverters, non-trivial mechanical installations and professional wiring.

Is item "c." from my original post even possible?

12V refrigerators will consume ~ 25 - 35AH a day @ 70º Ambient.  The Jackery will only power about half of this.

The Jackery Portable Power Station 240 is basically a battery, 14.4V, 16.8AH, =240W
You still will need something to cool your medications and something(s) to recharge the Jackery.
For important medications i would have two ways to charge and if the meds are expensive, three.

Portable solar panels with built in controller and supplied wiring only requires hooking up to the battery and setting out in the sun, no 'non-trivial' installation required.

 

[Elbear1]

How you treat them = charging fully everyday = overcoming exponential resistance = time x current

Its calles physics. Youre not charging over 250ah at C/25 pulling 50+ amps a day with 3-4hrs of sun half the year. You might as well claim you figured out cold fusion.

https://www.solarpaneltalk.com/foru.../351396-are-you-killing-your-batteries-part-2

Reality - 250ah needs C/10 + load = 30A/600w + 2-8hrs extra sunlight to finish charge or sulfation occurs. Period.

FLA has a base ~30% charge ineffficiency that increases with age and sulfation. Youre not getting around this.

Lithium has 99% charge efficiency, does not significantly increase resistence, does not need to be topped off, can be cycled 80%, and does not sulfate requiring significantly less solar, smaller controllers, and lasts multiple factors longer. Not mention sheds 100lbs off youre already heavily loaded, if not over-weight, vehicle.

Used 140ah lithiums go for under $500 and 195ah new for under $600. https://blslifepo4battery.com/produ...fAI4oBI1OkCF9PhBrL0vf9TX4dnPAzH0aAtvrEALw_wcB

Theyre cheaper in every way.

 

[Elbear1]

When youre full-time 200w is good for at most a single group 24. It aint sheet. Big difference when youre pulling loads 24/7 non-stop.

Also lithium doesnt need a generator or converter/charger. What $400-1200 savings.

Conversely you dont actually need solar for lithium. Capable of C/1+ a 100 amp converter on a 3kw generator for an hour gets you youre daily electrons.

 

[Elbear1]

So after some thought and re-reading op heres what i would do. A used valance lithium (7x bigger than jackery). Yes its $450 but you can run it about 3 days before recharge and not hurt it. Cant do that with lead batteries.

Then get an alternator relay and use that to charge with driving. Probably need 3hrs of running time (1hr a day) for that though. Then as funds get better start with a simple 100w amazon panel and controller. Can always expand that as money allows.

That way you have 2 charge sources just in case you get a bunch of cloudy days or something. And if you breakdown due to an alternator failure you can limp the vehicle to town by running off the lithium battery.

 

[Cajunwolf]

Here's my 2CentsWorth for what it's worth. I'm an old sailor, and we use 12v refrigerators and freezers on boats that are way more efficient than those used in the RV industry, but the initial cost is more. Typically and small cooling plate, panel, and compressor package will run about $750 for up to 2.0 cu ft, but you have to build them. It's easy to do. Buy the insolated panel material, comes in 4x4 sheets, about 1.7 inches thick, and glass it together in any shape you want. Here's a tip. We always build or buy top load units because your cold stays in and doesn't tumble out like when you use a vertical door in the side. This way, the compressor rarely ever kicks in, and you save on battery.

 

[Cajunwolf]

Bob did a review of his new trucker refrigerator recently, and it would be a great solution here. I found the two-year-old 12v fridge review, but it's dated. I had saved it, I thought, but can't find it. Does anyone have a link? It's a new one, the one where everybody in the comments section made a big deal because he had the box upside down, how petty.

 

[maki2]

So lets talk cheap for a 12v compressor fridge. Yes there are some that have come onto the market in recent years. One of that class that has proven to be popular is on Amazon. It is the Alipcool C15.  Not a large fridge but certainly large enough for your medicine and even some food items as well. It is priced at less than $200.00 with free shipping. You will need a house battery to keep it going when the sun goes down even if you have a solar panel. But many times when the weather is cooler at night they can hold a safe cold temperature through the night when turned off. Do get a fridge thermometer to put inside it, you need to get an exact reading rather than relying on the display on a fridge.


I am not part of the HOWA board so I am not fully informed about their process or the application form; so consider the following to be just a suggestion for you to consider looking at, do remember that I can't speak for them:     If you are strained for finances you could consider applying to HOWA, a non profit that is associated with this group. A medical necessity of having solar and a fridge could be a possibility they might consider assisting with if you meet their qualifications and if they have the funds to help or items that have been donated by others to HOWA. There is a link to HOWA in this forum's categories. 

There may  also be a few van dwellers who have Alpicools that want to upgrade to a larger unit. So possibly you could get a lightly used one for less than the cost of new. The same thing is true of solar panels and batteries. Such things sometimes do change hands at the RTR and at van builds.  Sometimes you also see them posted in this forum in the sales area.

 

[rokguy]

Here's my 2CentsWorth for what it's worth. I'm an old sailor, and we use 12v refrigerators and freezers on boats that are way more efficient than those used in the RV industry
We always build or buy top load units because your cold stays in and doesn't tumble out like when you use a vertical door in the side. This way, the compressor rarely ever kicks in, and you save on battery.

yep Danfoss and plate yacht refrigeration is the most efficient system there is and as you said top loading is the way to go in a small application. The beauty of refrigeration on a boat compared to land vehicles.
 
  It's usually a cooler ambient temp close to the sea.

 Your boat is surrounded by cooler water than land which helps.

 Besides solar most yachts have the advantage of a coastal breeze in harbour or strong winds at sea so its a given, using wind power along with stern trialling gensets when underway under sail.

 Quiet water muffled aux. generators usually can be used in the marina.

I guess now your coming into winter a simple plug in 12v car cooler chest could be a temporary fix, giving you more time to work out your power requirements.

 

[Qxxx]

Thanks for all the different ideas, guys and gal. I was mainly asking because certain people have mentioned the issue of refrigerated meds in other threads and I hadn't found a previous thread on the matter. Luckily I can keep my own meds in a shoe box under the bed where the mouse sleeps.

 

[Cajunwolf]

Thanks for all the different ideas, guys and gal. I was mainly asking because certain people have mentioned the issue of refrigerated meds in other threads and I hadn't found a previous thread on the matter. Luckily I can keep my own meds in a shoe box under the bed where the mouse sleeps.

I agree. There are a lot of folks who need to keep insulin chilled besides other medications. I have family members who have diabetes. This thread should be stickied somewhere. Kudos Qxxx!  :thumbsup:

 

[Qxxx]

Sofi, that SP video is a good find. The amazon page indicates the Alpicool 20 draws 45W, and people were saying the compressor runs at typical 20% duty cycle when set to 35F or so, eg 3 minutes on, 20 minutes off. I little calculation indicates about 18-24 AH draw over 24 hours (may not be what Slim computed). The Alpicool sales guy on the amazon page indicated a Yeti 400 can run the frig, and the Jackery is a similar power source.

 

[maki2]

I found a used Engel (branded Norcold) that holds 17 liters in my community for $300.00. It is a community with thousands of boats. My neighbor who repairs boats for a living had it. He does upgrades for customers so they give him such things. Then he sells them to add some extra funds into his pocket.

Just saying sometimes persons who do misc work on boats might have what you need, a fully functional 12V portable fridge for far less than the cost of buying new.

But since you don't really need one for your meds as you you don't have meds that need refrigeration.. do remember it takes people time to create postings so it is better to have a real need for the information when you ask versus just a speculative question based on knowing a person who lives in a sticks and bricks and has the power supply it takes to run a fridge full time. Some of the people who responded might be using up their precious band width to reply thinking that you are going to be unable to get on the road without their assistance. I would hope that people who post questions could bear that in mind and not ask random question they really don't need an answer to.

 

[Qxxx]

Well, I made it very clear from the get go that I was posting this thread on behalf of "other" people who had expressed a need for refrigerating "their" meds, and who were basically just starting out and gathering info about the problems involved.

Noobies tend to see a wall of problems to learn about. As their posts were made on general threads, I saw this issue as important enough to warrant its own thread. So ... do the math.

 

[jacqueg]

So after some thought and re-reading op heres what i would do. A used valance lithium (7x bigger than jackery). Yes its $450 but you can run it about 3 days before recharge and not hurt it. Cant do that with lead batteries.

Then get an alternator relay and use that to charge with driving. Probably need 3hrs of running time (1hr a day) for that though. Then as funds get better start with a simple 100w amazon panel and controller. Can always expand that as money allows.

That way you have 2 charge sources just in case you get a bunch of cloudy days or something. And if you breakdown due to an alternator failure you can limp the vehicle to town by running off the lithium battery.

OK, related question - when you buy a used lithium battery, how do you determine what condition it is in? 
Keep in mind that I just barely understood what you are saying! Every time I think I understand this battery stuff, someone says something I can't even begin to follow...