Insulation Question - Ceiling Only?

[Bandelay1965]

I have a '98 Ford E-350 Club Wagon with windows all around, regular factory interior plastic walls, and an aftermarket fiberglass high top with a smooth ceiling (no ribs or furring strips).

I'm doing a budget/unskilled DIY build, and have a question about insulation. I'll be traveling with the weather mostly, but I want to be ready for the occasional cold days/nights.

My tentative plan is to insulate the ceiling only. And on cold days, I'd put fitted Reflectix screens in all the windows, hang thermal curtains from celiing to floor, then heat the space with a Mr. Buddy heater.

Does that plan seem viable?

If so, what to insulate with? I saw these half-inch 4'x8' styrofoam sheets with foil on one side at Lowes for $8 a panel. With these I could do the whole ceiling, with two layers for one-inch total, for under my $100 insulation budget. It also fits my space budget, as I only have about 1.5 inches of space that can be spent on ceiling insulation.

Is this product viable for van ceiling insulation?

If so, how do I install it? I'm guessing glue or double-sided tape. (If so, please tell me product names or types.) Do you glue down the foil side or the styrofoam side, or doesn't it matter? Finally, since there are no ribs on the ceiling, how do I then attach a "ceiling" under the insulation boards -- what material to use and how to apply it?

I do still have a couple rolls of Reflectix leftover that I used to make window screens. I considered taping that to the ceiling as insulation, but I've heard many people use Reflectix wrong, and since I have no clue how to use it correctly, I decided against. If there is a way to use Reflectix correctly on a ceiling, without needing ceiling ribs to screw aything to, let me know.

Or...if someone has other ideas for ceiling insulation that are cheap and easy enough for a novice (so no spray guns) on a budget (so no Thinsulate), I'd love to hear it. Thanks.

 

[highdesertranger]

Ensolite foam or similar followed by marine hull liner,

https://www.dltcorporation.com/category_s/343.htm

https://foamandupholstery.com/waterproof-foam/

note I only posted these sites for references.

highdesertranger

 

[jonyjoe303]

the 4x8 foam insulation is all I use. I have almost 6 layers of the 1/2 inch on my ceiling. The best way to install is to use hotglue. Cut the foam into small sections 1x1 foot and install that way like a jigsaw puzzle. The reason to do it this way is that the hotglue dries quickly, if you cut the sections too big it will dry before you put in the ceiling. I just eyeball the cuts, and installation goes quickly, and foam hotglues extremely well to other foam, you can add as many layers as you need. 

The reason to use hotglue is that it sticks too most surfaces, it has no fumes and dries quickly within 2 minutes, and its fairly cheap. You can buy a hotglue gun for 20 dollars, and I been using the generic gluesticks. The foam has been on my ceiling almost 6 years, never had any fall off. Just make sure wear gloves, hotglue can get hot. 

picture of my ceiling


hotglue gun I been using surebonder dt-360f, this one has 2 settings low and hi, the hi setting is good enough for foam without melting it. I run it off my 200 watt inverter. Before I was using a ryobi cordless hotglue gun, but that one was too hot, it was melting the foam. 

 

[maki2]

I would suggest that you adhere Landau foam to it. That makes a great ceiling insulation. It can easily be adhered with the Weldbond yellow contact cement, the original formula with VOCs in it. Landau foam comes in different thickness, it is an EVA closed cell foam that does not absorb moisture. It is used in the automotive industry.

 

[Bandelay1965]

Thanks for the ideas. I'll look into these and figure out the best combo for budget and doability.

 

[deadwood]

I have windows all around as well but still tried to do a good job insulating every little spot I could find. I'f I were to do it all again I think I would only do the ceiling as well and not worry about the rest. Having the ceiling insulated seems to go a long way in keeping the heat from radiating down in the van.

I have window covers as well and they do a decent job. I just think all the other insulation I did was not worth the effort I put into it. And if it is that hot out then I will definitely be parking in the shade so it won't matter much then at all.

 

[LoveCareThinkDo]

That sounds like a decent enough plan. There is no one correct answer.

However, as has been repeated here very often, you will likely find the Buddy heater to be overkill. Many of us, including Bob, just use a single burner camp stove has our heater. I never have to have mine turned up more than barely on when using it as a heater. Mostly because I refuse to stay in places that get below 40 degrees outside, preferably 50.

 

[B and C]

Having a heater is like having a dry place to stay out of the rain. I have stayed in great weather (low 40's overnight) and a cold front blows through for a couple of days reaching into the 20's at night. Then back to 40's overnight. Nice to be able to go out during the day then when it is about 50 or so and then step back into a warm van. Don't leave an open flame untended while you are out or awake. You don't want to burn your house down.

 

[Bandelay1965]

That sounds like a decent enough plan. There is no one correct answer.

However, as has been repeated here very often, you will likely find the Buddy heater to be overkill. Many of us, including Bob, just use a single burner camp stove has our heater. I never have to have mine turned up more than barely on when using it as a heater. Mostly because I refuse to stay in places that get below 40 degrees outside, preferably 50.

I've only noticed a few people say they use a camp stove as heater. I was under the impression a Buddy heater was safer and that most people used them for that reason...but if a lot of people just use a camp stove safely, I'll go with that too. I like that it'll save me the minor hassle of switching the propane hose from stove to heater. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Bandelay1965]

I have windows all around as well but still tried to do a good job insulating every little spot I could find. I'f I were to do it all again I think I would only do the ceiling as well and not worry about the rest. Having the ceiling insulated seems to go a long way in keeping the heat from radiating down in the van.

I have window covers as well and they do a decent job. I just think all the other insulation I did was not worth the effort I put into it. And if it is that hot out then I will definitely  be parking in the shade so it won't matter much then at all.

That's good to hear, thanks. I'm definitely doing the ceiling this week and skipping the walls, and we'll see how it goes.

 

[GypsyDogs]

I used this sort of thing in the curved bits of my trailer https://www.amazon.com/AMERIQUE-AMSLV3MM2R-200SQFT-Premium-Underlayment/dp/B07Q6JY7TH
Basically reflective mylar backed on Yoga mat... ish
then used that 1/2" puzzle mat over the top.. where I could..for more insulation

 

[Bandelay1965]

I used this sort of thing in the curved bits of my trailer  https://www.amazon.com/AMERIQUE-AMSLV3MM2R-200SQFT-Premium-Underlayment/dp/B07Q6JY7TH
Basically reflective mylar backed on Yoga mat... ish
then  used that 1/2" puzzle mat over the top.. where I could..for more insulation

That's interesting...$42 worth covers the ceiling with two 3mm layers.  I was leaning toward those half-inch 4x8 styrofoam boards, but this is cheaper and seems easier to work with. Would 6mm (1/4 inch) do a decent job retaining warmth, with just a tapestry under it? What do you use to adhere it? Does it matter which direction the foil side faces? Thanks.

 

[GypsyDogs]

I adhered mine with 3m double sided tape (the thick industrial one) seems to hold fine in the heat. Though it is also held with a layer of thin styro and ceiling boards riveted to the frame.. You may consider some sort of ribbing. Like thin narrow wood or metal strips going side to side, flexed up into place to help hold everything.
How are you planning on holding up the tapestry?

I do know that a layer or two of that floor stuff does wonders. Not as much as Inches of Polyiso, but it helps. I put mine shiny out, but it is loose-ish so barely contacts metal anywhere.

 

[Bandelay1965]

the 4x8 foam insulation is all I use. I have almost 6 layers of the 1/2 inch on my ceiling. The best way to install is to use hotglue. Cut the foam into small sections 1x1 foot and install that way like a jigsaw puzzle. The reason to do it this way is that the hotglue dries quickly, if you cut the sections too big it will dry before you put in the ceiling. I just eyeball the cuts, and installation goes quickly, and foam hotglues extremely well to other foam, you can add as many layers as you need. 

The reason to use hotglue is that it sticks too most surfaces, it has no fumes and dries quickly within 2 minutes, and its fairly cheap. You can buy a hotglue gun for 20 dollars, and I been using the generic gluesticks. The foam has been on my ceiling almost 6 years, never had any fall off. Just make sure wear gloves, hotglue can get hot. 

picture of my ceiling


hotglue gun I been using surebonder dt-360f, this one has 2 settings low and hi, the hi setting is good enough for foam without melting it. I run it off my 200 watt inverter. Before I was using a ryobi cordless hotglue gun, but that one was too hot, it was melting the foam. 

I got the 4x8 polyiso boards yesterday, but the guy at Lowes convinced me to use 3M 90 adhesive spray instead of a hot glue gun. About an hour after installing with the 3M, half the pieces popped off with minimal pressure. So I decided to pull them all off (too easy) and start again with some other adhesive.

For your van, did you hot-glue the polyiso pieces directly to a smooth fiberglass ceiling, without screwing into ribs to hold them up? If so, I'll go with the glue gun, final answer.

A few more questions if ya don't mind:

Does the foil side have to face up?

In your picture the pieces seem to overlap, so the entire face of each piece is not pressed to the ceiling. Am I seeing that correctly, and is that the ideal way to do it? I assumed the entire face of each piece needed to be flat on the surface.

Do you have to treat the ceiling first in any way besides cleaning/drying it, like scoring or sanding or anything?

Can you describe exactly how to put the glue on the pieces? Is it just a few dots, or should the whole thing be covered?

What do you use to cut the boards, and what is the technique? I tried a serrated kitchen knife and utility knife and every cut was very crumby.

Did you make a finished-looking ceiling under the boards, and if so, with what material and how did you attach it?

Thanks a lot.

 

[mcorrothers]

I have a '98 Ford E-350 Club Wagon with windows all around, regular factory interior plastic walls, and an aftermarket fiberglass high top with a smooth ceiling (no ribs or furring strips).

I'm doing a budget/unskilled DIY build, and have a question about insulation. I'll be traveling with the weather mostly, but I want to be ready for the occasional cold days/nights.

My tentative plan is to insulate the ceiling only. And on cold days, I'd put fitted Reflectix screens in all the windows, hang thermal curtains from celiing to floor, then heat the space with a Mr. Buddy heater.

Does that plan seem viable?

If so, what to insulate with? I saw these half-inch 4'x8' styrofoam sheets with foil on one side at Lowes for $8 a panel. With these I could do the whole ceiling, with two layers for one-inch total, for under my $100 insulation budget. It also fits my space budget, as I only have about 1.5 inches of space that can be spent on ceiling insulation.

Is this product viable for van ceiling insulation?

If so, how do I install it? I'm guessing glue or double-sided tape. (If so, please tell me product names or types.) Do you glue down the foil side or the styrofoam side, or doesn't it matter? Finally, since there are no ribs on the ceiling, how do I then attach a "ceiling" under the insulation boards -- what material to use and how to apply it?

I do still have a couple rolls of Reflectix leftover that I used to make window screens. I considered taping that to the ceiling as insulation, but I've heard many people use Reflectix wrong, and since I have no clue how to use it correctly, I decided against. If there is a way to use Reflectix correctly on a ceiling, without needing ceiling ribs to screw aything to, let me know.

Or...if someone has other ideas for ceiling insulation that are cheap and easy enough for a novice (so no spray guns) on a budget (so no Thinsulate), I'd love to hear it. Thanks.


I think your idea of layering $8 1/2 polyiso is a great idea for your van ceiling I have Polyiso in my Transit van ceiling I used two 1 inch thick peaces with another 1/2 inch on top of that. where ever I could not put polyiso. I used spray foam called Gaps and Cracks available at Home Depot and Lowes. In my walls I used sheep wool from a company called Havelock located in Reno, NV. There are many ways to insulate some safer than other. I do not recommend thinsolate because it is very thin, and can hold moisture. and grow mold. Sheeps Wool doesn't do that. Your definitely on the right track...  

 

[Bandelay1965]

Follow-up with pics.

Materials used:

-Polyiso boards. Use half-inch boards if your ceiling is shaped/molded; thicker boards won't bend.

-Polyiso crumbs. Keep all the little cuts and shavings as you cut the larger pieces, and press them into the gaps between bigger pieces once the entire ceiling is covered.

-Electric carving knife to cut the polyiso boards. I first tried scissors and a utility knife...both were difficult and messy; the carving knife worked perfectly, and every thrift store has them.

-Double-sided carpet tape.

-Tyvek house-wrap tape to tape all seams. Once all the cuts are in place and all the crumbs are stuffed into all the seams, tape over all the seams.

 

[Bandelay1965]

Images didn't upload above. Trying a link:  

 

[Bandelay1965]

Next step ... cover the insulation with something to prevent ripping it, and to have a more a finished look.

Whatever I use will have to mount/stick to the polyiso and seam tape, since there is nothing in the ceiling to screw into.

One thought was to do a collage with laminated cardboard posters or something. Anyone do a collage ceiling that worked?

Another good option is the hull liner suggested by highdesertranger.

I welcome any other ideas.

 

[maki2]

I used this sort of thing in the curved bits of my trailer  https://www.amazon.com/AMERIQUE-AMSLV3MM2R-200SQFT-Premium-Underlayment/dp/B07Q6JY7TH
Basically reflective mylar backed on Yoga mat... ish
then  used that 1/2" puzzle mat over the top.. where I could..for more insulation

Sorry Gypsy but you got that install a bit backwards. The reflective surface adds no benefit at all if it is covered over with more foam matts. That should be the layer that is facing the open air inside of the van so it can directly reflect the radiant heat back down at the person in the van. So puzzle mats glued to the van walls then the last layer to go up is the reflective yoga mat with the shiny side exposed.

 

[Bandelay1965]

maki2 - I put up the polyiso boards with the foil side facing the ceiling. Are you saying that's wrong? It it useless? Like, should I tear it down and re-do it with foil side facing down?
Note: I didn't use foam matts or anything else -- just one sheet of polyiso on the fiberglass ceiling, foil side up.