failure to launch/failure to plan

[surfer]

Off Grid 24/7's post on the Judgements thread (as follows)...

" I think the blade cuts 2 ways here. If your choice is being homeless or living in a vehicle, then of course I would choose living in a vehicle.

HOWEVER, if you are choosing this as an alternative lifestyle, it only makes good sense to get your ducks in a row before jumping in with both feet. Too many people glamorize this lifestyle and advise others to just do it and sort everything out later, and they'll be glad they did. At the very least, someone should have their income figured out, and how they're going to deal with emergencies, breakdowns, the weather, meals, and bathroom issues.

This lifestyle can be gotten into cheaper than just the move in costs of a cheap apartment in many areas. BUT, this lifestyle is NOT appropriate or desirable for the vast majority of people. I see way too much encouragement to JUST DO IT, and not enough LOOK BEFORE YOU LEAP mentality online.

Over the last year and a half, I have been working with a lot of homeless people. A large portion of them started out living in vehicles before they lost them. The simple truth is that it costs money to live in a vehicle, without some means of financial support, you are doomed to failure, whether you're living in a vehicle, or living on the streets.

People need to be taught how to either get jobs, or make money for themselves, if they don't have some means of support. Life isn't free, even if you're boondocking.

This isn't intended to be any form of judgement, just common sense, which seems to be less and less common as time goes on..."  Any time you feel the need to say "this isn't a judgement" you can be 100% sure it is a judgement. I went through and deleted the most obnoxious forms of judgement from this quote from Off-grid. 

 ...reminded me of Bob advising how to deal with fear. In Bob's case he was addressing paralyzing fear & Off Grid 24/7 was addressing the opposite. I'm thinking it's two sides of the same coin. Bob recommended acknowledging and "literally thank it for its good service, tell it you’re glad it’s helping you stay safe. Then just keep reminding it over-and-over again that you have done everything you can to eliminate the risks". Off Grid 24/7 recommended acknowledging  that there are risks, dangers & hurdles that one should take responsibility for. On one side you've got the failure to plan and on the other you have the failure to launch; kind of like the fine line between genius and crazy? I think both advises are sound to the right audience. To that audience it helps to create balance. 

I think this site helps the 2 types of people that choose this lifestyle: the failure to launch/cowardly types by providing answers to ease their concerns as well as the failure to plan/foolhardy types to kick in their independent self preservation.

On the surface Off Grid 24/7's post sounds like he's talking to the foolhardy but I think I glimpse another level of info. Things like "lifestyle is NOT appropriate or desirable for the vast majority of people" could mean what besides lacking the nomad gene? Are there subgroups within the cowardly group that have the nomadic gene but yet it is not appropriate or desirable for them to live nomadicly? Does the 'throw caution to the wind & just do it' have a kind of desensitization effect to a subgroup of the foolhardy where they become bums? And I define bums as from http://knowledgenuts.com/2014/11/26/the-difference-between-hobos-tramps-and-bums/ "... a hobo is someone who travels from place to place looking for work, a tramp is someone who travels but avoids work whenever possible, and a bum doesn't care to work or travel."

Other thoughts?

 

[GotSmart]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I am a man of the road[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]A hobo by name[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]I don't seek entertainment[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]Just poultry and game[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]

[size=medium][font=Arial, sans-serif]It has taken a lot of planning and investment to be able to boondock.  [/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]When I was younger a sleeping bag and a bag of supplies was enough.  Now I need things like a bucket and solar power. My disability check is enough to survive on.  That took a lot of 90 hour work weeks (Not the time for that story.) [/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Making sure my 25 year old rig will make it down the road, insurance, At least a month worth of emergency food supplies, water and juice... Emergency parts. tools, [/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]The biggest incentive is not wanting to live with my kids the rest of my life.  [/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif] [/font]

 

[ahh_me2]

Having lived in my vans since last April, my own choice I might add, I have found there are many problems that are associated with this lifestyle.
I am fortunate in the sense that I have a full time job, my choice was simply to refuse to pay the exhorbitant rates for rent in my city.
Having lived for the past 16 years in a nice basement suite with a 2 car garage setup as a shop and paying a very low amount of rent made me rather spoiled!

I had hoarding tendencies, and I also realized I used very little of the available space I had, except for the shop, so for me to move into a vehicle made sense to me.
A standard van is not the best solution for me as I live in a cold climate and really need a functional house on wheels. I don't travel, I don't camp in the boonies, I simply need a decent livable space for outside of my work hours.

I have been living in my cube van for close to 3 weeks now while I do the build in it and that presents it's own set of challenges, but space wise I think I can make this work well for a number of years.

As for this site, what I like is the variety of people and their own unique situations that offer different perspectives on matters I may not have though about as well as seeing the various builds people have undertaken.

Vandwellers typically have to be creative in their use of space and amenities, and so a site that allows sharing of ideas and whatnot is rather invaluable. I know I am grateful to have this place to hang/browse/post even if my situation is vastly different than many here as there is still a common element of living in vehicles and the problem solving and solutions that go with it.

 

[Canine]

Great reality check for some potential van dwellers.I think most of the successful alternate lifestyle people have paid their dues and are receiving benefits from that.Whether SS.or some other form of income.If you are broke,money is not going to magically appear.You either have to work for it or have already worked (50 years in my case) for it.Stealing and begging only goes so far and would be a terrible lifestyle.

 

[akrvbob]

Off Grid 24/7's post on the Judgements thread (as follows)...

" I think the blade cuts 2 ways here. If your choice is being homeless or living in a vehicle, then of course I would choose living in a vehicle.

This isn't intended to be any form of judgement, just common sense, which seems to be less and less common as time goes on..." Any time you have to say "this isn't a judgement" you can be 100% sure it is a judgement. I went through and deleted the most obnoxious forms of judgement from this quote from Off-grid. 

 ...reminded me of Bob advising how to deal with fear. In Bob's case he was addressing paralyzing fear & Off Grid 24/7 was addressing the opposite. I'm thinking it's two sides of the same coin. Bob recommended acknowledging and "literally thank it for its good service, tell it you’re glad it’s helping you stay safe. Then just keep reminding it over-and-over again that you have done everything you can to eliminate the risks". Off Grid 24/7 recommended acknowledging  that there are risks, dangers & hurdles that one should take responsibility for. On one side you've got the failure to plan and on the other you have the failure to launch; kind of like the fine line between genius and crazy? I think both advises are sound to the right audience. To that audience it helps to create balance. 

I think this site helps the 2 types of people that choose this lifestyle: the failure to launch/cowardly types by providing answers to ease their concerns as well as the failure to plan/foolhardy types to kick in their independent self preservation.

On the surface Off Grid 24/7's post sounds like he's talking to the foolhardy but I think I glimpse another level of info. Things like "lifestyle is NOT appropriate or desirable for the vast majority of people" could mean what besides lacking the nomad gene? Are there subgroups within the cowardly group that have the nomadic gene but yet it is not appropriate or desirable for them to live nomadicly? Does the 'throw caution to the wind & just do it' have a kind of desensitization effect to a subgroup of the foolhardy where they become bums? And I define bums as from http://knowledgenuts.com/2014/11/26/the-difference-between-hobos-tramps-and-bums/ "... a hobo is someone who travels from place to place looking for work, a tramp is someone who travels but avoids work whenever possible, and a bum doesn't care to work or travel."

Other thoughts?

 

[surfer]

GotSmart 

"When I was younger a sleeping bag and a bag of supplies was enough."
There's a part of me that admires that. I was never that minimalistic. I've gone from quitting my job to live in my car and travel to thinking it is currently irresponsible and selfish for me, and am unable to do it again presently. I've gone from failure to plan to failure to launch. Thus the thread I guess. Look at what you've done! Maybe I can work this out.

"The biggest incentive is not wanting to live with my kids the rest of my life."
LOL! 

Nice poem, yours?

 

[SoulRaven]

I guess if advising people to be prepared is a judgement, then I am gladly guilty. If explaining to them that living in a vehicle is not free, is a judgement, then once again I am gladly guilty.

Too many people read statements like "You can live on BLM land for FREE", or "You can live in the desert for FREE", or "You can live in your van for FREE", and when they connect the dots, they translate this into "I can quit my job, and move into a van, and live for FREE!".

I don't consider a reality check to be a judgement in any way. Anybody living this lifestyle can attest to the fact that it is not "FREE" in a monetary sense. At the very least you need money for food, gas, registration, insurance, and other essentials.

It has been said that "Failure to plan, is a plan for failure.", and "Successful planning will lead to future successes.", or maybe "Be prepared, or prepare for failure.". I am a believer in all of these.

On some forums such as this one and a few others, there are a lot of helpful people to offer helpful advice, and even people who will drive to you to lend a hand. But this isn't true everywhere. In many places if you have a problem, instead of help you will be ridiculed.

While we are "FREE" in the sense of travel, or paying rent or a mortgage, we are not free from potential problems, regular expenses, or emergency expenses. Many of us are older, and have a lifetime of experience to rely upon when those problems arise. Many people in the newer generation of van dwellers, are in their 20's or even teens, and don't have the problem solving skills we have developed. When we look back on all the struggles we had, we tend to trivialize them, and assume that if we could figure them out, others should be able to do the same. It's a different world today, except for a few preppers, people aren't being taught the survival skills that were more prevalent to the older generations. Most people no longer repair their own vehicles, many don't even know how to change a flat, or check their fluids, let alone getting themselves out of a predicament if they stuck out in the boonies, or break down, with no cell phone signal. If you toss a lack of funds into the equation, people can find themselves even in a life threatening situation. With no phone or internet, or some other form of communication, they can't even call out for help.

I see too many people, who on the advice of others, quit their job and spend their life savings or even go into debt, to outfit a van and move into it, and then have no idea where to go, how to get there, or how they plan to support themselves and their travels.

In my experience, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure, proper planning instead of figuring it out as you go, can save you from a lot of time, trouble, and expenses down the road. If someone can't resolve any of the issues or pitfalls of a mobile lifestyle in their own mind, before heading out, then perhaps they're not ready to head out yet, and I don't think they should be encouraged to do it before they decide for themselves that they're ready.

I love this lifestyle, but when somebody says "I'm just not sure...", and 10 people all jump in to tell them "Just do it, you'll never regret it", while never once addressing the other person's concerns, just who is making judgements... Aren't those 10 people making the judgement that their decision is better for a complete stranger, than the stranger's own indecision. We don't necessarily know ALL of the facts behind a stranger's indecision... We only know what they have chosen to tell us, which may not include their biggest problems or fears.

Is it being judgmental to feel that people's reservations should be addressed BEFORE they head out rather than after? Or maybe it's being judgmental to point out potential problems in someone's plans? I would call it being helpful, not judgmental.

 

[SoulRaven]

GotSmart 

"When I was younger a sleeping bag and a bag of supplies was enough."
There's a part of me that admires that. I was never that minimalistic. I've gone from quitting my job to live in my car and travel to thinking it is currently irresponsible and selfish for me, and am unable to do it again presently. I've gone from failure to plan to failure to launch. Thus the thread I guess. Look at what you've done! Maybe I can work this out.

"The biggest incentive is not wanting to live with my kids the rest of my life."
LOL! 

Nice poem, yours?

For what it's worth, I believe postponing launch until those issues can be resolved is a good choice.  Launching before resolving those issues could just exasperate them, and make you even more miserable.

I know if I had a feeling of being either irresponsible or selfish, it would cause me to lose a lot of sleep.  Unresolved issues have the potential of ruining what might be considered a good thing.

Is there some sort of a compromise that can make all sides happy?  The effort to find some middle ground, could be time well spent.

Good Luck!

 

[GotSmart]

GotSmart 

"When I was younger a sleeping bag and a bag of supplies was enough."
There's a part of me that admires that. I was never that minimalistic. I've gone from quitting my job to live in my car and travel to thinking it is currently irresponsible and selfish for me, and am unable to do it again presently. I've gone from failure to plan to failure to launch. Thus the thread I guess. Look at what you've done! Maybe I can work this out.

"The biggest incentive is not wanting to live with my kids the rest of my life."
LOL! 

Nice poem, yours?

I would head out for the weekend, and I always had two jobs.  I bought my first van at 15. A 1963 Corvair Greenbriar!  After High School I traveled around a bit in my station wagon.  My then wife and I would travel to our property and camp out. In the 70's it was easier to get head.

Now after 40 years of double time, and 11 major incidents, (Automotive, industrial, bicycle, farming and surgeries)  A college degree in my 40's to motivate them~~~ The kids are grown and I am unsure how much time I have left.  Time to fly again.  It is ME time.   I want to see the country and be able to enjoy a sunset with my cat.  

[font=Roboto, arial, sans-serif]Leo Sayer - Long Tall Glasses [/font]
[font=Roboto, arial, sans-serif][font=Arial, sans-serif]I was travellin' down the road[/font]
[/font]
[font=Arial, sans-serif]Feelin' hungry and cold[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I saw a sign down the road sayin'[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Food and drinks for everyone[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]So naturally I thought[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I would take me a look inside[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I saw so much food[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]There was water coming from my eyes[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]Yeah there was ham and there was turkey[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]There was caviar[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]And long tall glasses[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]With wine up to why'are[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]And somebody grabbed me[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Threw me out on my chair[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Said before you can eat[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]You gotta dance like Fred Astaire[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]You know I can't dance you know I can't dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]You know I can't dance you know I can't dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can't dance[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]I am a man of the road[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]A hobo by name[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I don't seek entertainment[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Just poultry and game[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]But if it's all the same to you[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Then yes I will try my hand[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]If you were hungry as me[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Then I'm sure you will understand[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]Now wait a minute[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]Of course I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Of course I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I'm sure I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I'm sure I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I really hit the floor[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Ah it feels good[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Look at me dancing[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]I did a two-step quick-step and a bossa nova[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]A little Victor Sylvester and a Rudy Valentino[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]You should have seen me moving[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Right across the floor[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Hand me down my tuxedo[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Next week I'm coming back for more[/font]



[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Oh yes I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]Look at me dance on the floor moving[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I feel good[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]

[font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font]
[font=Roboto, arial, sans-serif][font=Arial, sans-serif]I can dance[/font][/font]

 

[surfer]

ahh_me2

"A standard van is not the best solution for me as I live in a cold climate and really need a functional house on wheels. I don't travel, I don't camp in the boonies, I simply need a decent livable space for outside of my work hours."

How does it help with the cold? Are you the guy who parks in Google's parking lot or do you have to be more crafty? He he. I would like to travel & boondock. Just hope I'm not decrepit before things unravel to do so.

I live/work where there are extremes, freezing cold & humid heat. The cold is solvable, but from what I understand humid heat requires the grid or being stationary. These guys have me hopeful: . 

 "...but space wise I think I can make this work well for a number of years.
I bet you can. A cube is a much more livable space. 

"...sharing of ideas and whatnot is rather invaluable."
Yes, 2 heads are better than 1. Seems to be a tangible solution for most everything.

Thanks

 

[ahh_me2]

ahh_me2

"A standard van is not the best solution for me as I live in a cold climate and really need a functional house on wheels. I don't travel, I don't camp in the boonies, I simply need a decent livable space for outside of my work hours."

How does it help with the cold? Are you the guy who parks in Google's parking lot or do you have to be more crafty? He he. I would like to travel & boondock. Just hope I'm not decrepit before things unravel to do so.

Haha, I wish on the Google part! lol I work for a very small company and we are in a single bay of a series of other bays, and I have owners permission to park out back and overnight, I also have keys to the place so that helps too.

Since last April I have been sleeping in my well insulated POC Ford van, it was insulated for winter living but the extra insulation eats up a lot of space, so it is too small to cook and stuff, but really awesome for a good night's sleep.
That is why I went in search of a cube van as I really need a functional kitchen, sleeping setup and shower as well as a real heat source that I can leave on all day and night and maintain room temps or a bit lower.
I found I simply couldn't do it with vans I had and the budget I had, otherwise a brand new extended Sprinter would have come to mind...

I live/work where there are extremes, freezing cold & humid heat. The cold is solvable, but from what I understand humid heat requires the grid or being stationary. These guys have me hopeful: .
"...but space wise I think I can make this work well for a number of years.
I bet you can. A cube is a much more livable space.

I solved the cold issue in my Ford, but I had problems this past summer with heat and humidity, and as a result I had to live in my non insulated, metal shell Dodge van.
I expect to solve the heat and humidity issue in the cube van with a window shaker AC unit next summer. Bearing in mind that I am parked at work most of the day and most of the night, I have shore power handy to run the AC

 

[offroad]

Very fascinating discussion. Hope young ambitious folks read it.

 

[surfer]

Bob Dickerson
Great reality check for some potential van dwellers.I think most of the successful alternate lifestyle people have paid their dues and are receiving benefits from that.Whether SS.or some other form of income.If you are broke,money is not going to magically appear.You either have to work for it or have already worked (50 years in my case) for it.Stealing and begging only goes so far and would be a terrible lifestyle.

One of my top priorities in life has always been financial independence. Even when I quit my job to travel I lived on savings saved for this. I loved it, nothing has compared since. I wanted it to last. But because I could not see any other way, I've lived in the capitalist system and therefore stationary & have had to accept help from friends, family & the system. 

Questions I wrestle with are: Why is it OK to accept this help while trying to live in sticks and bricks yet not OK trying to live nomadic while in the working age group? Is it because living nomadic put us at risk of being thieves and beggars? Is it because many stationary people deep down feel envious of those who live nomadic? What about those who have paid their dues but find that they cannot financially or physically reap the benefits?

I'm awed at the problem solving abilities some have! I'm also envious of those that have faith in the universe like PEACE PILGRIM http://www.peacepilgrim.com/htmfiles/freebook.htm & just do it.  Is it wrong to find this aspiring? I was not the kid when asked 'what do you want to be when you grow up' that answered with things like doctor, fireman, president, mechanic, rancher... I want to find a balance between responsible and freedom, between selfish and selflessness that I can be content with. I don't want to be like some deadbeats in my life who held me back from my aspirations nor hold others back.

 

[surfer]

akrvbob

You put the fear of God in me with your post. It made me feel ashamed as though I had done something wrong to the community or had offended you. It made me think I should not respond to those who responded to me, that I should just let it have a silent death. 

I found that in my first reply to GotSmart that I have lived both sides of the same coin, failure to plan and failure to launch. Funny how I knew this but I didn't know this. Funny how your advice and Off Grid 24/7's advice struck a chord in me to to start this thread to explore this seemingly dichotomy to find this out.

Then my screen refreshed when I responded to GotSmart and I seen my thread to include big bold red words that I did not write. This heightened my fear. Are others going to think that I said this? Was this done to stop people from conversing with me for being a bad person? ......

Maybe it's just a technical glitch?

 

[Almost There]

akrvbob

You put the fear of God in me with your post. It made me feel ashamed as though I had done something wrong to the community or had offended you. It made me think I should not respond to those who responded to me, that I should just let it have a silent death. 

I found that in my first reply to GotSmart that I have lived both sides of the same coin, failure to plan and failure to launch. Funny how I knew this but I didn't know this. Funny how your advice and Off Grid 24/7's advice struck a chord in me to to start this thread to explore this seemingly dichotomy to find this out.

Then my screen refreshed when I responded to GotSmart and I seen my thread to include big bold red words that I did not write. This heightened my fear. Are others going to think that I said this? Was this done to stop people from conversing with me for being a bad person? ......

Maybe it's just a technical glitch?

Not a technical glitch and you did nothing wrong.

No one is likely to think that the big red words are yours. Bob edited Off-Grids post because he felt that there was some judgmental opinions that required censoring. That's why it's in big bold red lettering so that it's clear that Bob had a hand in it.

You're not the one who offered those opinions but when you quoted his post they were included in your post so when he had to edit Off-Grids post he also had to go in to yours to remove what you had quoted.

Relax, if you were going to be censored, you'd know about it...

 

[flying kurbmaster]

I guess if advising people to be prepared is a judgement, then I am gladly guilty.  If explaining to them that living in a vehicle is not free, is a judgement, then once again I am gladly guilty.

Too many people read statements like "You can live on BLM land for FREE", or "You can live in the desert for FREE", or "You can live in your van for FREE", and when they connect the dots, they translate this into "I can quit my job, and move into a van, and live for FREE!".

I don't consider a reality check to be a judgement in any way.  Anybody living this lifestyle can attest to the fact that it is not "FREE" in a monetary sense.  At the very least you need money for food, gas, registration, insurance, and other essentials.

There are many forms of living in a van you seem to address one, the type that you jump in a van and drive off into the sunset, camp along river banks and loon lakes with a fishing rod and a billy on the fire. In that case you are probably right it is best to have some kind of income because after your tank runs low or when the fish are not bitting, you are going to have needs.
However there are many other ways of vandwelling that would not be a stretch, to what most people, have to do whether they live in a van, an apartment, a room or a house or for that matter if they are homeless, If you were to keep your job, live around your circle of support, living in van doesn't change much, and can be done with a bucket, filled with a bit of camping equipment, it is not a mysterious voodoo thing that only retired SS recipients can achieve.

 

[GotSmart]

Not a technical glitch and you did nothing wrong.

No one is likely to think that the big red words are yours. Bob edited Off-Grids post because he felt that there was some judgmental opinions that required censoring. That's why it's in big bold red lettering so that it's clear that Bob had a hand in it.

You're not the one who offered those opinions but when you quoted his post they were included in your post so when he had to edit Off-Grids post he also had to go in to yours to remove what you had quoted.

Relax, if you were going to be censored, you'd know about it...

We could have had fun with Surfer! (Until bob caught us! )   The red letter thing !!! :dodgy:

Vandwelling is not for everyone.  Neither is marriage, owning a cat, or babysitting on a message board.  Of those four, I still am doing two.  

Every time I am ready to leave the S&B, I feel nervous.  Usually there is something I have not completed, and have to finish later.  Last time it was my solar.  This time it will be my freezer.  I will  make do until I feel comfortable spending the money.  I will have the van 100% safe and legal.  New tires, steering completed, even the hammock is ready.  I have food, drink, and a bucket, bags and wipes.  I can go at any time.  Everything else is a detail. 

This time my doctors are pushing me to hit the road.  The stress of my (adult) children is aging me rapidly.  My blood sugar is getting under control, and Pain Management is next week.  The second day on the road is when it will be breath easy time.  

Surfer.  Think, plan, follow through, but at some point you must just go.  Many of the dwellers work at different seasonal jobs.  They have no reason to feel guilty at leaving society and the "requirements" of the establishment behind.  They are productive members of society on their own terms.  

Look for posts from members such as Cindy, who regularly lists job openings.  Work is there for those that can do it.  This is life on your terms if you can do it.  

Best of luck!

 

[akrvbob]

Surfer, I apologize for not being clearer and scaring you. I edited Off-Grid 24/7 post but had no problem with yours at all.

I should have made that clearer, I'm sorry I left you worried, that was wrong of me.
Bob

 

[buckwilk]

What an interesting thread, almost every facet of living in a van and the reasons for it were touched. Life is a series of judgement's there's no escaping that. There's nothing wrong with being judgmental of anyone or anything. It crosses into wrong when that judgement is used to negatively attack a person for their decisions or beliefs. It's a slippery slope we've all been down. Individuals benefit from encouragement whether they act on it or not. I would much rather hear " you can do it, go for it " than " it's not possible, you'll never get there."

 

[FALCON]

In the 70's it was easier to get head.

ahhh those were the days...