E350 460 transmission

[VanKitten]

When I went to take the beast to the tire place, it started acting like it was going to try to stall

It didn't stall

But, it would seem like it was starved for fuel.   The engine would go, then drop to idle, then go, then idle...cycling like that about every 5 seconds..on and off.    Barely able to struggle up a slight hill maxing out at 25 mph

Limped into the mechanic shop.

They called to say the transmission is shot.   After they drove it..brought it back and checked the transmission fluid....black and smelling burnt.    That was serviced just about 2000 miles ago...I know...I checked the fluids myself.    

Another guy was telling me ... no, it is probably fuel pump.  Another had the opinion it was something wrong with air intake.

I hate the idea of wiping out my savings buffer for a transmission.....but...I do what I must

Opinions?    I ask because, not all mechanics are honest.    Bummer if I pay for a transmission and it doesn't solve this.

 

[Gary68]

doest sound right to me,the engine not running right usually has something to do with the engine
any codes?

transmission guys LOVE to say bad trans,told my mom bad trans $4000+,i said b.s.,changed the fluid 4 times,a couple filters,cleaned the solenoids inside and i gave it some more aggressive driving,higher fluid pressure,and the trans works fine

 

[Dennis]

My first thought would be fuel filter or idle air control motor. IAC. Fuel pump I don't know. Fuel pump on an E-250 I had went out. Right then. Tried banging on the bottom of the gas tank to see if that would get some electricity flowing again. When it quit it quit so I would lean more towards one of the first two possibilities.

I don't want to sound like a mechanic because that is not my calling. Have dealt with mechanical issues over the years though.

 

[highdesertranger]

so the engine RPM would change without you moving the gas pedal? is that correct? is the trans fluid black? so 2,000 miles ago you had the trans serviced and you checked the fluid and it was fine? have you checked the trans fluid since then? highdesertranger

 

[VanKitten]

I don't know about RPMs .. no gauge. Engine was constantly changing without my changing any pressure on the gas. Kept cycling ever 5 seconds or so...running like an engine should, then like just dropping out and losing speed, then running again. Cycle was pretty quick....but never enough time of the engine going to get any speed before the engine would drop out again for a couple of seconds...just rolling, then engine back again...etc.

Yes, I personally checked all the fluids after service. I know the trans fluid was at the correct level and red after that service just 2000 miles ago. Had only checked the fluid levels (usual routine before driving it). Didn't take notice of any colo change...but..it didn't smell last time I drove it a couple of weeks ago

 

[Gary68]

and you havent driven much since the fluid change?

if it was just a drain and fill,you would need to do that like 4 times to get a full fluid fluid change,most of the fluid is in other parts of the trans not the pan

when it was running right did it shift nice and firm or did it slide into gear?

 

[VanKitten]

The beast has only been driven these last 10 months to be taken to various places for work on the body and interior. It went to a shop last March to have the truck electric wiring fixed. It went to get new tires. It went 3 times to the body shop. Stuff like that.

Each of those trips were about 70-100 miles. Drove fine. No engine issues at all. No mechanical issues since leaving N. Carolina last year. I didn't notice any slipping of the transmission.

This seemed like the engine was not working...starved for fuel. But, maybe it just seemed like it because the transmission had cut off for a couple seconds...so the gears were not actually doing any work

 

[Gary68]

i'm doubting it is the trans,i have had them fail and the engine ran just fine,if the torque converter went bad it would kill the engine at a stop

see if there are engine codes,could be many things like water in your gas

have a look at the trans fluid and see if there is a big difference from before but the symptoms of auto trans failure is loss of gears and no go
anywhere (engine rev just fine but will not move)and still then it could just be a gummed up valve body or clogged solenoid

 

[highdesertranger]

yes check the trans fluid. is it black and burnt like they say? usually it takes many thousands of miles for trans fluid to get black and burnt. you don't need a tach to tell RPM you can tell with your ear, like when you are sitting still with the trans in neutral and you rev the engine you can hear the difference in RPM. highdesertranger

 

[VanKitten]

Well, this is really ackward.

Guy at the garage responded to me. I suggested that the symptoms did not indicate transmission problems....at least not the engine problem I went there with. I said that a few people I spoke with suggested further diagnosis.

His response.....Well then take it to them

Let me explain, This is a lot like a small town. Few businesses, few options. (This place doesn't even have a Dunkin' Donuts!). Few places can work on a motor home...and most of those are servicing large trucks (think 18 wheelers). Before I ever went to this place (a couple months back) I checked out other places too. I found them charging $200 per hour for labor!!
The garage that has taken care of my car..and truck before that cannot put this into the bay..too tall. Guess I am saying I feel have no other options.

Guy actually suggest I get it towed to Denver or Salt Lake.
Basically, I was forced to back down and not press the issue.

 

[highdesertranger]

have you checked the fluid to confirm it's black and burnt? what year is your vehicle? what trans? highdesertranger

 

[Gary68]

i'm all for pressing the issue,this guy sounds like a dick

a bad mechanic say,trans fluid dark give me $3500
a good mechanic tells you the exact system that is bad,it's the clutches,valve body,shift solenoid etc. and gives you the option of just fixing the problem or rebuild or new

i'd really hate see you get a rebuilt trans just to have it do the same thing going home because the fuel pressure regulator or whatever is bad

so ask him,exactly whats wrong with my trans,if he says"we got to tear into it""the fluid is dark"he is just throwing darts

88 ford,should be a fairly common transmission with common known issues that you can find a used one on craigslist or salvage yard

 

[VanKitten]

I am driving over to this mechanic tomorrow. Friend of my daughter is coming with.

I hate to say it...but all too often these mechanic take women for idiots that cannot understand so why bother explaining. I will check it for myself, and get answers...even though I will have to make it look like Eric is the one asking.

Thank. You all. Knowledge is half the battle

 

[VanKitten]

Ok.. so here is the full story.

The transmission fliud is black...and had silvers of metal you can feel in it. It smells bad...everyone says that smell is the burnt part they were telling me about. mechanic said that it is probably the clutch plates that started to grind either because the pads are shot or there is no longer consistent compression holding them, or both.

So..also, one of the exhaust manifold mounts is steered off. They will try to drill out the bolt, but they may not be able to. I guess they get so hard from heat and expansion that often there is no way to drill them out. I noticed that there seems to be no gasket on those where they mount to the heads. Seems odd to me...the other side didn't look like that. I wonder if I should ask them to take all the bolts off now and replace them all. I feel like it could be just a matter of time before another one does this. Maybe put gaskets on all of them then?

Also...they will now do a pressure test on both the fuel pumps.

So, I am not totally upset. I expected to replace the transmission in the next year or two. So, doing it now has the advantage that at least I am already here and do not have to worry so much about finding a place to stay for Smidge and myself This sort of wrecks my budget for now. Going to be pretty tight for a few months.

 

[blars]

The transmission on my MH went out this spring while heading north, wouldn't move out of a traffic lane. Towed around corner to tow truck lot. Adding 6 quarts of transmission fluid was enough to make it drivable, but still not sounding right. I wound up with a full rebuild and upgrade of some parts. (Compared to labor, upgrade parts were trivial.) 95 F530 chassis, uses same tranny as smaller vehicles and runs it harder. Apparently second rebuild in the 100k on the MH, since some parts were not stock. Didn't fit in the bay, was worked on in the parking lot.

 

[Gary68]

o.k. thats the positive i.d. we needed,think positive,you shouldn't have to worry about the transmission for years to come,ask about upgrades

on the manifold bolt/stud,it's fairly common to have them rust and break,it's not hard to drill them out but might be impossible to get to without pulling the head off,yes there should be a gasket there

 

[Gideon33w]

Probably a C6. Will be pricey to fix. Might have been caused by the servicing. A trans which never got proper care in its life and then is suddenly given fresh fluid can crap the bed. When you get her rebuilt go ahead and have them throw in a monster atf cooler.

If the exhaust manifold isn't leaking I'd probably leave it alone. Long in place exhaust manifold studs will break off even with lots of heat and penetrating oil. This means MANY more hours in the shop and dollars out of your pocket. Unless the mechanic wants to replace that one stud with the mani in place ... In which case ... He can have fun with that.

 

[frater secessus]

but all too often these mechanic take women for idiots that cannot understand so why bother explaining.

Perhaps a distinction without a difference, but:   mechanics/techs/support will treat anyone they think is uninformed like that.  Some of it is probably misogyny; most of the time I have heard it in technical contexts it's a form of self-preservation.  There are answers for the general public (ie, the clueless) and answers for the the clueful (you).  Giving clueful answers to the general public often results in long, pointless conversations that leave the tech frustrated and the customer confused/angry/suspicious.  No bueno.

Giving clueful answers to the clueful results in a quick, productive conversation about what needs to be done and what the options are.  It is usually informal-sounding because the tech can speak naturally in their own voice;  they are not concerned about their job being endangered by an angry "idiot" on a customer service rampage.


My approach to that second option is twofold:

1. Be clueful.  This can be pretty easy;  a look over a relevant wikipedia page about the topic at hand is enough.  We'll know the big picture, common issues, and the major parts.  If we are clueless we are at their mercy.  Hopefully we get an informed and well-intentioned tech that will take care of us.
2. Signal that cluefulness.  A solid followup question can establish you are clueful, gets them talking like they would to another tech, and shows you respect their professional opinion/experience.

Here are the kinds of questions I like to ask that demonstrate I have a clue but am talking to a professional/expert:

"In your experience, what causes this kind of failure?" <-- you already know some of the issues
"Do you see it more with this make|model?" <-- could be a known issue you have read about
"if it was yours how would you approach the problem?" <-- or "your mother's"

Now, some techs are just a-holes, and some don't know what they are doing. Hearing bad answers to good questions gives you a chance to pull the Eject button on the situation before it gets expensive.

I am sure it's unnecessary advice to the well-behaved folks here on the forum, but I would also warn that challenging the tech or acting like a know-it-all. Beligerent claims like "I [fill in the blank] for thirty years!!!!] will often shut down the interaction and mark the boaster as clueless again. In my experience when the customer storms off after that exchange the tech will turn to the others and say: "If he knows so *!!#$ much why doesn't he fix it?"

Back to your normally scheduled thread.

 

[jimindenver]

Trannys got issues for sure but is it causing the engine trouble is the question. A friend had his Tioga start stalling every time he climbed a hill or was accelerating. He would pull over for a few seconds and the engine would run fine for a while until we started climbing again.

What had happened was he replaced the fuel pump with one that was not up to the demands of his 460 so when it called for more fuel the engine acted starved.

 

[RenataAllison]

I have the same engine and trans as you. Just curious what the final out come was and how many miles on your vehicle.