Buying Van with High Mileage

[JeriLynn]

I am wondering if anyone would like to comment on buying a Sprinter van with 250K miles.  It is selling for $7,500. I had hoped to get a van with under 100K, but have heard that Sprinters can easily get 500K miles.  Any thoughts or recommendations?
Thanks in Advance
JLS

 

[user 2252]

Hi JeriLynn. Any vehicle with 250K miles on it has seen most of its life as machines do eventually wear out. Take into consideration the maintenance during its lifetime (and this vehicle appears to be well maintained to hit 250K miles) how it was driven (highway miles or city stop and go) She will be needing a complete overhaul before too much longer to make your $7500 worthwhile and preserve your confidence in its dependability. I would put some extra thought into this purchase.

 

[JeriLynn]

Hi JeriLynn. Any vehicle with 250K miles on it has seen most of its life as machines do eventually wear out. Take into consideration the maintenance during its lifetime (and this vehicle appears to be well maintained to hit 250K miles) how it was driven (highway miles or city stop and go) She will be needing a complete overhaul before too much longer to make your $7500 worthwhile and preserve your confidence in its dependability. I would put some extra thought into this purchase.

I am also looking at a 89 Dodge for 4K with 150K which is still more miles than I had planned on. The Sprinters are just so appealing because of the height. Thanks for your input.

 

[eDJ_]

If you have time,  keep looking and you'll find deals.  The money can sit in the bank unharmed. LOL   But in time you will find loads of deals.

There are also Automobile Brokers who are in the business of finding "certain" vehicles or the best price on vehicles.  They will ask how far you are willing to travel to purchase.   (the radius from where you are)  These people have all kinds of specialized software that  helps them locate these deals,  and listings services which help them find rare vehicles for clients. 

You'll have to visit your local Public Library reference dept and ask if they can locate Automobile Brokers in your state for you. (or if you can find a older more experienced car salesman who is willing to tell you who a few of them are)   You could Google also.  

When a vehicle is located for you the agency who has the vehicle will include the Brokers fee in the selling price.
(then they send the Broker his fee)   But you have the vehicle...where ever it is....and can then fare it back to where you live.  (some will hire a wrecker if it isn't too far away, otherwise ship it on a truck back to where you live)

 

[DannyB1954]

I guess prior to 2008 they were pretty good. here is an article written by someone who had 47 of them. https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/fatal-flaw-mercedes-benz-sprinters-tom-robertson
I personally don't think the gamble on a high milage diesel is worth it. It could run great for a long time, but it also could cost you a fortune if it doesn't. Finding a shop that will work on them appears to be another issue. Let's say you are traveling through a small town and it breaks. You find a shop that will replace the engine and they say that will be $10,000. I know from personal experience the bill can be $8k, (that was back 10 years ago).
Read some reviews here : http://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/11225/dodge/sprinter/should-i-buy-a-dodge-sprinter Some of the stories lead me to believe it is not a vehicle that I would want.

 

[GrayWhale]

I am also looking at a 89 Dodge for 4K with 150K which is still more miles than I had planned on. The Sprinters are just so appealing because of the height. Thanks for your input.

How tall are you?  Like a 2000 or so Dodge V8 with a TV-Top should allow someone up to 5'6" or so to stand straight up. 5'4 would be nice and comfy. I can't stand up w/o bending my neck, but way better than the stock roof height.

Sprinters are sweeeet, but I bet the maintenance cost will be quite high when you need them, especially with that diesel motor.

Why look at such an old 89 Dodge at around $1000-2000, when you were willing to go $7500 for a Sprinter? $5000 will buy you a very nice V8 conversion van. $7500, than much better. At that range, I'd spend the $100-200 or so to get it inspected and have a mechanic go through it completely; before making a deal.

 

[Kroswind]

Since this threads about high mileage, I'm just going to ask this here instead of creating a new thread.

Has anyone ever had a high mileage engine rebuilt/replaced? My car is in the shop currently, and its about time to let it go. As much as I absolutely hate to admit it, its on its last legs. So I have been scrambling to find a van to replace it, and I absolutely cant find anything decent. I can find vans in great shape, with ridiculous mileage, or vans with really low miles, in horrible shape. There is no medium, there is no in between. Its one extreme or the other. I've been checking craigslist every single day for about a year now, and its been this way every day. I have no options here.

Currently, there is an extended 2003 Chevy 2500 conversion van on my local craigslist. The body and interior look like they're in excellent shape, but the engine is pretty much shot. Its got 212k miles on it, and I definitely wouldnt trust something with that much wear and tear on it to get me very far. So I am wondering, if I can get the van cheap enough, would a engine/trans rebuild be feasible? What would it take to get things back in to reasonable enough shape to drive for long distances, for many years to come? Obviously, nothing is guaranteed, not even a new car, but I figure with at least a rebuild, it will come with some sort of warranty. Obviously other parts will also need replaced, but I figure if I can at least get the major stuff out of the way first, I could replace those other parts over time as the need arises. He is currently asking a lot for it (around 9k), and im thinking if I can haggle down to around at least 6k, would this be a reasonable route to go? I hate to take a chance on something with such high mileage, especially after my current vehicle, which is getting close to that much mileage. But it looks like I dont have any options left. Ill either have to do a ton of body work, or a ton of engine work. I'm going to discuss this with my mechanic today, but I wanted to get input here from other people who have had something like this done.

 

[ArtW]

as a former Taxi Company fleet mechanic, my employer always found it best to replace, rather than rebuild, an engine when one of our Taxis lost it's engine DUE TO DRIVER FAULT
I emphasize due to driver fault because I watched my boss buy rental cars with 60k already on them and run them up to in some cases 500k
you read that right, 500k
and then sell the car in fair condition
I myself bought one of these ex taxis with 300k on it and drove it cross country multiple times WITH NOT A SINGLE MECHANICAL ISSUE
the bottom line here, as i've tried to get across in other posts, is that MILEAGE has very little to do with vehicle condition, it's MAINTENANCE that matters, as well as how the vehicle was treated
IIRC the Chevy 2500 vans have a good rep for lasting, and if I found one with 200k on it and it ran well I would not hesitate to drive it cross country, and i would FOR SURE not pay some shop to rebuild or replace the motor if it ran well, if it ain't broke, don't fix it

heck, the rebuild might be shorter lived than the old motor (in fact that is very very likely, I've seen very few rebuilt motors that lasted long, so there's one Taxi Companies answer to the 'have you ever had an enguine rebuilt question; yes, and it rarely ended well)

please stop thinking a car has a built in time bomb in it that goes off at xxk miles, it's NOT TRUE
I have a 20 year old Ranger right now with god knows how many miles on it (odo broke at 130k) that I've driven cross country, too

 

[Kroswind]

Thanks for the input. I'll ask the mechanic about replacement rather than rebuild.

But I have to wonder, if all these 500k miracle-mile stories are true, why is it everyone starts to get rid of vehicles around the 200k mile range? If they're really that good and that reliable, why would everyone be trying to ditch them, generally, when they hit the 200k mark. I'm sure there are some vehicles out there that will run that long with some serious maintenance, but I have a hard time believing that most vehicles are capable of reliably reaching that many miles without some major repairs. I think if the average vehicle was truly capable of that, you'd see a lot more vehicles, especially vans, out there for sale with 4-500k on them. But im willing to bet most people are getting rid of them because the maintenance cost is going to outweigh the worth of the vehicle. I've done a lot of maintenance to my current car, even had to replace the transmission, but at 186k miles, the cars almost done. I've taken great care of it over the years, and for being almost 30 years old, its in great shape for its age. But its old, its used, and parts are worn out from all the miles. Despite great care, the cars just simply at the end of its life. Theres just too much wear and tear.

Sorry if I sound really pessimistic/argumentative, but I want to make sure all my ducks are in a row here if I go in on this vehicle. 6k is still a lot of money, and a lot of risk for something thats seen a lot of use. I do understand that good maintenance is still a big deal regardless of miles, but I dont think I'd discount the mileage either.

I do agree though, that if its not broke, dont fix it. If its still running well, then I'll obviously leave it alone. But with that many miles, it just seems like such a gamble. I'd like to make sure I have some kind of option if something blows up, because its usually sudden, and I'd hate to be out on the road somewhere and end up totally screwed. Or be in the middle of my build, and then end up having to find another vehicle, and start all over again.

 

[ArtW]

the reason most people get rid of their cars at near 200k is partly marketing, partly tradition
back in the early days of the Automobile, they were very crude machines that really did need a major overhaul by 50k, if they made it that far, and people still have this 'it must be replaced at xxk' mindset due to that
and if you tell a dealer your car is 5 years old, he'll tell you 'better get rd of it now, it's about done' because he wants to sell you a car
Then of course there's the 'new' factor, where all those new cars just look so shiny and they have new gizmos yours doesn't have
Plus most people don't maintain their cars well, even those who think they do, because they do the maintenance at the 'normal use' mileage
Almost no one gives their car 'normal use' mileage, most cars are operated under 'severe duty' conditions, lots of stop n go, dust conditions, short trip, etc, and most folks are hard on their cars
One reason I like a tachometer is I can keep an aye on RPM; if you rev the engine on a regular car much past 2500 RPM regularly, you're pushing it, keeping the RPM below 2500 keeps it in light load conditions, and saves gas to boot
also not every car will go 500k, there are plenty of badly built cars by every manufacturer out there
Our Chevy Luminas were pretty good bets on hitting 500k, with a driver who didn't push them, and who got them in the shop for EVERY service ON TIME, the guys that wouldn't, well, their cars wouldn't go that far
The Crown Victorias were pretty good, except the sensors liked to die, and if you didn't use the right oil, the timing chains would go (I'm talking about the 4.6 here)
the Caravan with a 4 banger, not a chance it'd go 300k under Taxi service without needing a new driveline, in fact the transmissions were terrible, and the rebuilt ones we tried were even worse
this was the schedule my boss used for our taxis
Every 4k, oil a filter change (LOF)
every 2nd LOF, air filter change
every 3rd LOF, fuel filter change
'every 4th LOF, trans fluid change
Brakes, tires, and fluids checked / topped off every LOF
Also, keep in mind that not all mechanics have your best interests at heart, nor are they all competent, I've had guys with ASE patches ruin cars of mine, it's not just how often they're maintained, it's the quality of the maintenance
That's why I do most work myself
IIRC a chevy 2500 is a good bet to go a long way with proper maintenance, so 200k wouldn't scare me a bit

now when you test drive the van, DON'T be gentle, get away from the owner (or not) and drive the snot out of it, see what it does when you push it some
if all is good, get it, build it. never abuse it again, and maintain it, and put aside a 'rainy dasy' fund, because sooner or later, it will need repairs

 

[JeriLynn]

Since this threads about high mileage, I'm just going to ask this here instead of creating a new thread.

Has anyone ever had a high mileage engine rebuilt/replaced?  My car is in the shop currently, and its about time to let it go.  As much as I absolutely hate to admit it, its on its last legs.  So I have been scrambling to find a van to replace it, and I absolutely cant find anything decent.  I can find vans in great shape, with ridiculous mileage, or vans with really low miles, in horrible shape.  There is no medium, there is no in between.  Its one extreme or the other.  I've been checking craigslist every single day for about a year now, and its been this way every day.  I have no options here.

Currently, there is an extended 2003 Chevy 2500 conversion van on my local craigslist.  The body and interior look like they're in excellent shape, but the engine is pretty much shot.  Its got 212k miles on it, and I definitely wouldnt trust something with that much wear and tear on it to get me very far.  So I am wondering, if I can get the van cheap enough, would a engine/trans rebuild be feasible?  What would it take to get things back in to reasonable enough shape to drive for long distances, for many years to come?  Obviously, nothing is guaranteed, not even a new car, but I figure with at least a rebuild, it will come with some sort of warranty.  Obviously other parts will also need replaced, but I figure if I can at least get the major stuff out of the way first, I could replace those other parts over time as the need arises.  He is currently asking a lot for it (around 9k), and im thinking if I can haggle down to around at least 6k, would this be a reasonable route to go?  I hate to take a chance on something with such high mileage, especially after my current vehicle, which is getting close to that much mileage.  But it looks like I dont have any options left.  Ill either have to do a ton of body work, or a ton of engine work.  I'm going to discuss this with my mechanic today, but I wanted to get input here from other people who have had something like this done.

I do not have any experience with rebuilt engines, but I have been scouring sources for vans for the last 3 months. Did you check the guides for values on the van you are thinking about, because 9K seems awfully high. I have been looking all over state of CA and even Vegas for vans. In the LA area there are hundreds of van listings. You may want to broaden your search if you have not done so already.  Have you checked one of the other online sites for used vehicles such as Nada, Carfax, Autotrader etc.?

 

[DannyB1954]

You see a lot of vehicles for sale with 200k. You don't see many for sale with 260k. The vehicle is more than an engine. Transmissions, differentials, suspension parts, brakes, steering gear boxes, they all wear. If you are capable of doing the work yourself, buying something mostly worn out isn't a bad way to go especially if the body and interior are nice.
But if you are paying $100 an hour for labor, and you spend $9k on buying the vehicle, $3k on engine, (if it is a diesel, at least double that), $3k on a transmission, $1k on a rear end, $1k on front suspension, $800 on brakes, drums, disks, lines, master cylinder, calipers, wheel cylinders, probably another $1k for truck tires, etc. you have more into the vehicle than it is worth. You have about $20k tied up in a vehicle that is worth $3k.

It is not likely that all of these things will go bad at the same time, but eventually you can have more money into it than a newer low mileage vehicle would have cost you. Then when something breaks, do you put more money into it, or cut your losses and start over?

If the vehicle gets wrecked, the insurance is going to give you blue book or less. They really don't care what it cost you to keep it running. For $9k, I think you could get a nice lower mileage vehicle.

 

[bobmirko]

With proper maintenance a Sprinter with a 2.7 Diesel engine will easily do 500k. Look if there is RSN on transmission and find a mechanic to do a compression test at the 5 cylinders to be sure all is good and there is pressure to the rings. Also a good idea to test the turbo and ask the invoice of maintenance for the oil, injectors and transmission fluid change.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I agree with ArtW.  If a vehicle is well maintained, there's no reason it can't go 200 to 300k.

Problem is, it's extremely rare for the owner to hand you a thick folder of work orders and receipts showing it was, in fact, maintained.

Without that, you're buying a pig in a poke.

For that reason, I bought a late model with only 40k on it, and I will religiously have the maintenance done.  I expect to get 300k or more from it, and I expect it to be mostly trouble free miles.

Of course, not everyone can afford to go that route.

 

[highdesertranger]

this is not meant for everybody but for me, mileage doesn't matter age does. I want an older vehicle, I don't want a computer, I don't want a bunch electronic sensors, I don't want electronic doo dads. I want a chevy 1 ton 4x4 from the late 70's. I would then take it and rebuild it front to rear. the total price of this would be under 10k including the price of the truck. I would then have a truck that would go for about 15 years with no problems, at which time I would rebuild it all over again. of course I don't have to do this because I have already done it and am in the middle of the second rebuild now. the only reason I am only on my second rebuild is because my former truck was T-Boned in 1996 doing significant damage, although I could have fixed it I wanted a 1 ton. highdesertranger

 

[Kroswind]

DannyB1954

You see a lot of vehicles for sale with 200k. You don't see many for sale with 260k.  The vehicle is more than an engine. Transmissions, differentials, suspension parts, brakes, steering gear boxes, they all wear. If you are capable of doing the work yourself, buying something mostly worn out isn't a bad way to go especially if the body and interior are nice.
But if you are paying $100 an hour for labor, and you spend $9k on buying the vehicle, $3k on engine, (if it is a diesel, at least double that), $3k on a transmission, $1k on a rear end, $1k on front suspension, $800 on brakes, drums, disks, lines, master cylinder, calipers, wheel cylinders, probably another $1k for truck tires, etc. you have more into the vehicle than it is worth. You have about $20k tied up in a vehicle that is worth $3k.

It is not likely that all of these things will go bad at the same time, but eventually you can have more money into it than a newer low mileage vehicle would have cost you. Then when something breaks, do you put more money into it, or cut your losses and start over?

If the vehicle gets wrecked, the insurance is going to give you blue book or less. They really don't care what it cost you to keep it running. For $9k, I think you could get a nice lower mileage vehicle.

This is really the point I've been trying to drive home too.  High mileage is still high mileage.  With that much use, all kinds of parts are worn out.  Mileage definitely matters.

However, after looking at a van today, I am starting to see both sides of the coin.  I looked at a 98 e150 conversion van with 84k miles on it for $5,000, and after seeing it in person, I'd take my chances with the 9k 200k mile vehicle.  Why?  The condition of the van seemed pretty poor.  The running boards were completely shot.  The paint was completely wore off, and there was a lot of rust.  The underside of the vehicle didnt look too much better either.  The paint was peeling on the passengers side, the clear coat was wore out, the stripes were completely gone in some places, and the high top probably leaked.  This thing had definitely been sitting for a long time, and outside to boot.  So even with low mileage, the fact that its been sitting for so long probably means that its parts are in just as bad condition.  

I dont want a high mileage vehicle, but I dont have a choice.  I have to replace my car NOW, and after literally YEARS of searching craigslist, there is just nothing in my area.  I'm stuck in ohio where everyones an entitled prick who thinks their shit doesnt stink and their garbage is worth gold.  All I ever see for sale is high mileage vehicles for new vehicle prices.  Thats not even an exaggeration.  People here seem to price based on year, and not use/condition.  I'll never understand it.  I have broadened my search to indiana/kentucky, and the prospects there dont seem too much better.  I'm not gonna drive all up and down the coast trying to find a van, because I just dont have the time for that.  I've checked various other sites, and I dont see much else.  In a real place, I could get a low mileage van for a good price.  In ohio?  Not a chance in hell.  If I go newer with low miles, I'm then looking at vans in the $20-40k range, and thats outrageous.  I cant see how anyone in their right mind could justify spending that much money on a vehicle.  Especially something thats already USED!

I definitely wont pay 9k for something with 200k miles.  I am going to go take a look at this van at some point and see just what kind of condition its in.  If its in decent shape and runs ok, I'm prepared to offer 5-6k, but no more than that.  I dont mind sinking a little money into it if it will make it last for a while.  I'm thinking what ill do at this point is, hope it lasts just long enough to get me the hell out of here, to some place with way more options for realistic prices, and ill trade it out for something lower miles there.  The only real appeal for this van at this point is the fact that its a high top, and its an extended van.  I'll take all the space I can get.

 

[moorejames]

I just bought a 2002 Dodge with 98k for $2,800 in Ohio. It's got some issues, but what vehicle for $2,800 doesn't? They're out there. There's some rust ( what older vehicle in Ohio doesn't have some rust?) but it's solid mechanically.

 

[akrvbob]

Personally, I wouldn't consider a van with 200 k on it. Like Optimistic Paranoid said, no one has every handed me a stack of maintenance records and until someone does I simply will not buy a van with over 200K

It's fine for all you guys who can and do your on work, I also would buy something old or with high mileage if I could. But I don't do my own work and lots of other people here don't do their own work.

For us, don't buy a vehicle with over 200K on it.
Bob

 

[TrainChaser]

You have to remember that the asking price and the selling price are not the same thing.  The seller can ask anything he wants, but what he actually gets for it is a different story. 

If you see something you like that has a higher price on it, make an offer.  Consider it an experiment.  If the seller says NO, what have you lost?  NOTHING.  

OTOH, your offer may be the best one he's gotten, and he may jump at it.

Another possible source is your own trusted mechanic, if you have one. My friend's husband (down in SoCal) had been considering buying some kind of car, and quizzed his mechanic on it. In for routine maintenance several months later, his mechanic asked if he had gotten the kind of car he had been asking about, because he knew one that was available. He had done the maintenance since the owner bought it new, and said the car was in great shape. M's hubby ended up buying the car, and has been thrilled with it.

As some people say: Sometimes it's not WHAT you know, it's WHO you know.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Hi Beenthere, This weekend I am driving 120 miles to look at E350 high top van with 148K. The engine is 6.9 liter International Harvester Diesel. The body looks ok in the pictures and anyway I am not so concerned about how a vehicle looks just so it works well. The asking price is $5,300. You did not mention the 350s. Do you have any experience with them or know about them?  I will not have access to a mechanic so I will be buying it on how it seems driving. Do you have any suggestions or advice?  Of course anyone else who reads this is welcome to reply. I currently have a 2003 Ford Windstar from an estate that has less than 30K miles on it and I do not want to sell a good vehicle for a bad one.

You didn't say what year it is, but the 6.9 was used from 83 to 94, so we are talking about an old truck

Two comments:

Sometimes on older trucks you can't always get new factory parts when something breaks.  If I recall, the factories are required to keep parts in stock for 10 years after they stop making them.  So even if it's the 94, Ford might have stopped carrying some parts for it in 2004.  There may be very little still available now in 2016.

I seem to recall that there were transmission issues on these early diesels.  Ford tried to use the same trannies that they used for their gas motors, and they really couldn't stand up to the extra torque a diesel puts out.  For a while back then, there was a whole sub-specialty of upgrading those trannies with tougher aftermarket parts.  I think for those years they were still using the C-6 tranny, and I don't know if those aftermarket parts are still available after all this time.

That's off the top of my head, and I'm really not a expert on these diesels, so I could be wrong.  Let's see what some of the other, savvier guys here say.

Personally, I know just enough about diesels that I won't touch one.  But then, I have immense respect for HighDesertRanger, and he thinks the old diesels are wonderful.  So take my comments with a large grain of salt.

Good Luck.